90% of players are unimaginitive simpletons

[nl 986]

Been playing exp. for a few hours and met I guess 10 players, only 1 actually interacted with me and the rest just try to beat you to death the moment they see you. I know, nothing new but it is just off putting sometimes. Such a shame so many players really have no idea what the potential of this platform is and why it can be so much more rewarding to make an effort to interact with each other.

[Parazight 1599]

And so the answer to the experiment is revealed.  

It's going to get worse before it gets better.  It will get better and then worse again when 1.0 arrives.    A social experiment tainted by a sea of other titles where you're expected to just KoS.

Maybe when the game is not super fresh again it will shift back to having a larger percentage of players in the know.  For now, people with 2 posts creating epic whine threads, murder at every street corner, and massive failure to understand.  The saving grace for now; 1PP and private servers.

Godspeed, nl.

[Just Caused 423]

Suprisingly, for me the situation was very diffrent. I've met around 4-6 people so far, both inland a bit and also on the coast. They were all friendly. Well, except this one guy. He got rata-ta-ta-ta'ed with my AKM in Vybor military base.

[creature 1189]

Right, because everyone should play how YOU want in a sandbox environment. While KOS isn't MY play style, I'm smart enough to know that a game with weapons and and no real punishment are what breeds it. This IS a griefers playground. Don't expect much of other players.

Also, trying to "shame" people into playing how you want makes you look foolish and weak. "unimaginative simpletons"? So sad.

[Parazight 1599]

Just now, creature said:

Right, because everyone should play how YOU want in a sandbox environment. While KOS isn't MY play style, I'm smart enough to know that a game with weapons and and no real punishment are what breeds it. This IS a griefers playground. Don't expect much of other players.

Also, trying to "shame" people into playing how you want makes you look foolish and weak. "unimaginative simpletons"? So sad.

It's not black or white at all.  For example,  I adore the brutal KoS scene.  I'm more than happy to be a target for plebs who want to only shoot at people.  Adopting the KoS mentality and engaging others who want the same is exhilarating.  All to often, this is all you find, and it's a shame.  There are far more facets to the game and navigating the difference is where it's at.  Meeting and expecting others that want more interaction than KoS is an incredible experience.  

I think this is in line to what nl is saying.  He's not telling you how to play at all.

[comikz 218]

2 hours ago, creature said:

Right, because everyone should play how YOU want in a sandbox environment. While KOS isn't MY play style, I'm smart enough to know that a game with weapons and and no real punishment are what breeds it. This IS a griefers playground. Don't expect much of other players.

Also, trying to "shame" people into playing how you want makes you look foolish and weak. "unimaginative simpletons"? So sad.

You triggered, or nah?

No where did he say, "Play like this!!!", he merely voiced his opinion, on how people could get so much more out of this game, if they would do more then KoS.

[Solopopo 330]

It's not their fault. There is little to do in 0.63 at the moment. What is the point of teaming up? So you can roam around and kill other players as a team as oppose to solo? There is no base building, no storage items, no vehicles, and therefore no endgame to speak of. There are also limited survival features, crafting, and less of a variety of items spawning. 0.63 isn't a game yet. It's unreasonable to expect players to not KOS under these circumstances. 0.63 is like two steps forward and one backward. There is nothing to do but KOS or kill zombies. I'm currently fully geared at Tisy and bored out of my mind. I really wish they hadn't released 0.63 in it's current state. 0.62 is more of a game at the moment. 0.63 is just a demonstration of the new player controller, which is fantastic by the way. Notwithstanding, there has been no effort yet made to structure .63 into a fun gaming experience. This was of course acceptable for a stress test. I don't think it really fits on experimental. They just ported the stress test directly over with no changes. Hopefully over time, as they continue to do this, 0.63 will begin to resemble a game. We aren't there yet though. 

Ironically, I have had some of the most friendly DayZ sessions I've had in at least a year. What servers are you playing on? The north east us servers have been pretty friendly so far. 

Also, you can't really blame people for wanting to practice the new combat mechanics. All I did for my first 5 lives on .63 is melee fight randoms. I recall they were all eager to participate. Since then I have had more friendly encounters than ever. This is only near the coast though. As soon as you make it to Grishino and beyond it's KOS territory. That's typically where the endgame would happen but it doesn't exist.

 

 

Edited June 16, 2018 by Solopopo

[Lexman61 78]

The KoS debate has been going on for a long time and, frankly speaking, has become rather stale and boring.

If you really want to do away with the so-called "KoS problem" there is a simple and fool proof way; eliminate all weapons from DayZ and turn the game into a post-apocalyptic farming/hunter simulator where the main scope and objective of the game is for the survivors to group together and form small communities. To survive they would need to engage in some serious farming, craft tools and simple machines, breed animals, hunt and defend themselves from hoards of infected (stones and stick the only weapons allowed). Plenty of time to sit around campfires and socialize without fear of getting killed by callous and asocial murderers.

To add further "immersion" to the game, female characters would have the possibility of getting pregnant and give birth so as to create a new generation of survivors (details and game mechanics for this option to be discussed with the devs).  Blood shedding would be reduced to a minimum through ritual warfare among different and hostile communities (more or less a lot of shouting and screaming between two groups confronting each other with a few spears and stones thrown).

KoS problem solved and great possibilities for the hardcore survivalist who yearn for some more involving human interaction and soft skills specializations. We'll need carpenters, hunters, doctors, competent farmers and many more professions to your heart's content!

There is, and never was, a right or a wrong way to play DayZ in spite of what some forum commentators assert, complain about and want to impose as a "standard"

Regards

 

 

 

 

[Guy Smiley 534]

Well, if the survival aspect of the game is done properly, it should quell a good chunk of the pure pvp crowd due not being able to just run to military zones for hot lootz.  Most will get turned off, we'll see a few rage posts at how this game sucks until someone posts them a link to a mod that is the style of DayZ they want.

[-Gews- 7443]

So much more rewarding... to who? The imaginative geniuses? If they would find more fun exchanging backstories and going on an adventure, they probably wouldn't have attacked you in the first place.

Some years back complaints and arguments about KoS got to the point where this forum had a KoS master thread to contain them, and other posts complaining about KoS would be sent to the 'graveyard'...

http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/154460-so-kos-official-sa-kos-discussion-topic/

Always been a thing, always gonna be a thing, so I guess any disappointment depends on your expectations.

 

2 hours ago, Lexman61 said:

If you really want to do away with the so-called "KoS problem" there is a simple and fool proof way; eliminate all weapons from DayZ and turn the game into a post-apocalyptic farming/hunter simulator where the main scope and objective of the game is for the survivors to group together and form small communities.

It's been suggested.
 

 

[odin_lowe 3686]

Hmm, so far the comments are mostly focused on "guns" and "kos", but what the main complaint was is that players right now on experimental are not interacting other than punching or attacking others every time they encounter someone.

I understand that all debate on KOS and whatnot, been here long enough for that, but what I see here is just a genuine complaint about the current "experimental" branch compared to what previous experiences were.

To be fair I haven't joined the new experimental branch yet, as I don't see the point since the stress tests are still going, and they should be the main focus. I love experimental, and it's been like that since the very first one. Many of my memorable interactions and encounters were on experimental, and I met players that became friends and that I still play with today, but the current experimental is different, and quite frankly unnecessary.

Once the stress tests are shut down and focus gets directed towards bugs finding on new features on Experimental Branch, than I'll consider it "real" experimental, and we'll see how interactions goes from then on.

KOS have been part of the game since day 1, but "freshspawncrazypunchoutpartyallthetime" is no fun, not KOS in my book, and not in any way how interactions should be limited with. 

 

[cirkular 178]

Good find @-Gews- some of those responses are hilarious :D

10 hours ago, nl said:

Such a shame so many players really have no idea what the potential of this platform is and why it can be so much more rewarding to make an effort to interact with each other.

But, isn't the rarity of friendly encounters exactly why it is so rewarding, for you that want interactions? :)

But here's the thing. I think Dayz does it good. It's up to us what we'll do, not just "me". KOS is like some sad facts of life are. KOS in Dayz happens with any weapon or even without any, it happens anytime and anywhere, close combat or long range. I think that no one would be more friendlier with anything like removing weapons from the game, just even more frustrated. From the KOS guy's point of view, I'd say it's something like "I've eliminated a potential threat and if there's good loot to grab, great". On the other hand, the thing with "mindless attacking and killing" or any other risky action in game is because it's a game. The more realistic details you want in a game, the harder it gets to balance it. No one feels the real risk for loosing their life as they are able to respawn rather quickly, the only punishment is starting all over, with nothing, who knows where next. In the same way, what you can do to help prevent getting KOSed is very logical: Stay vigilant :D avoid the roads, keep it low, sneak around, loot at night, take cover, make sure you're not easily spotted and followed etc.

Now, for me personally, it's not far off as it is currently, but I'd like to see guns somewhat rarer, or at least mostly worn and damaged. The condition of the barrel should affect the weapon's accuracy somewhat, but we don't have that in so much detail really, so should be just a condition of the whole weapon. The weapon cleaning kits would be very rare too. Pristine and unused weapons as well as ammo would be really hard to find due to all the bad things that happened in Chernarus. Logical exceptions are some military areas (not every one of them should have usable loot). And then, there are chopper crashes. All of this is already the case pretty much.

More importantly, since melee is the only alternative of combat, I'm not really happy how it has been resolved so far in Dayz. It's hard to make it properly and interesting in a game, I understand that. Of course, situations like finding a friendly player who's up for a journey through the map, or persuading some unknown guy with a weapon to help you take out other hostile players are the jewels of Dayz. Again, logically this is less likely to happen. Put yourself in the Chernarus. The situation is grim. :]

The problem I see with the ideas like making the weapons rarer or similar, is that the weapon could have an even bigger value among players. That means more fear for loosing the gear, more focus on it, and consequently even less interaction. That also means almost inescapable death when attacked by the infected. But I guess it's worth testing it one day.

If there was a way to set the loot distribution for a particular game style when you set up your server, you could have different crowds on different servers. Possibly that could cover a wider array of particular game styles. Or even if you feel like you'd want one day to play like this, and the other day like that...

[cirkular 178]

Another thing is that the setting and the timeline of the game is stuck. And combined with the base building aspect, you only have a choice to make some kinds of fortifications and improvise somewhat. The Chernarus is hell itself as it's always repeating for a player :) That world is not to evolve or rather revolve back to a civilized setting, pre-virus time.

Let's say your party of friends eliminates all the infected on the server (like it could happen). You cannot rebuild. This is before that. It's the ongoing struggle for power among factions, and who will be in charge after everything is done, so that's why the focus is on combat and consequently KOS.

[Red_Ensign 990]

yeah lots of players aren't much more than more zombies to deal with - they grunt and run at you flailing like they have rabies.  even the ones that call themselves bandits aren't much more than that.  it's disappointing.

[bfisher 561]

I've said this before, but I feel like DayZ is closer to that movie The Crazies than a traditional zombie film.   What I mean is that all the other human players are really the ones infected by the virus and it's turned them all into homicidal lunatics.

[ServiusAU 9]

At the end of the day you can't tell people how to use a product they payed for or tell them how to use the tools in the sandbox to do whatever they want unless it's cheating. There is no right and wrong way to play DayZ and PvP and the threat of it makes the sandbox a lot better and more engaging and having the threat of people who kill on sight keeps you on your toes. Because it's a game people are also going to be far more likely to treat it as such, there is nothing you can do about it unless you play on Roleplay servers which there are none for .63 yet. There are a good chunk of players who will team up with you given the chance, personally so far in experimental the 4 people I've run into have all been friendly and I even did a few trades.

[Mantasisg 172]

You don't need creative people to spend their HOURS runing from house to house. Creative people will not stand that.

Another point is that DayZ still lives on its past glory, lots of people couldn't afford it in the past, or couldn't afford to buy good hardware. So, I believe, quite a lot of fresh people keeps coming in just to find out that they can't play it, don't know how, don't like it and so on.

It is not a new thing, creativity of players has been decreasing for a couple of years. There is nothing strange about that. There is one more thing influencing that besides how gameplay goes - the game is also ageing, creative folks don't grind they keeps moving on. Which is a bit sad to me too, I wish to play DayZ to its full potential too, but what can we do....

Edited June 17, 2018 by Mantasisg

[creature 1189]

16 hours ago, comikz said:

You triggered, or nah?

No where did he say, "Play like this!!!", he merely voiced his opinion, on how people could get so much more out of this game, if they would do more then KoS.

Triggered are the people crying about KOS in this game. We call them snowflakes. The fact that you came running to defend it, shows you fit the bill too. Good day.

[cirkular 178]

8 hours ago, bfisher said:

I've said this before, but I feel like DayZ is closer to that movie The Crazies than a traditional zombie film.   What I mean is that all the other human players are really the ones infected by the virus and it's turned them all into homicidal lunatics.

That's an interesting thought :) But I couldn't say it's the virus. It's the original human nature. Or rather a nature of any living being in the ecosystem and the ultimate goal is security, and if that means domination too, fine. Because there's hunger, thirst and fear and everyone is succumbed to it. You couldn't believe what a human is capable for when surviving? Now you can have a glimpse of it. For humans, it's things like hope and the resource-securing civilized life that put a curtain on all of that. But it's still only a curtain and Dayz simply takes it down in my opinion. The complaints about other players' play style is something I feel hasn't got to do with Dayz itself. The more extreme example for this is "hey, I've been in war and people shot at me!" And these play styles are not really subject to change. I'd rather complain about what we can't do in the game or how are we doing it, compared to real life. :)

In one view, there is less work for developers when creating a world open such as this, but in the other, they have to build all these mechanics instead that you didn't have in other FPS or other genre games. There are far less rules, except survival, and the easiest choice for players is to decide to survive by any means. And then you get "bandits". The others pursue some kind of hope and want to give hope to others, so we have "heroes". Some players gravitate between both, in the grey areas. Everyone is still driven by hunger, thirst and fear. So I think it's all good. :)

[nl 986]

42 minutes ago, creature said:

Triggered are the people crying about KOS in this game. We call them snowflakes. The fact that you came running to defend it, shows you fit the bill too. Good day.

What I am "crying" about is the boring behavior many players show. Explain to me where the fun is in spawning in, finding another player and start a fist fight? It will be over in one minute and you gain nothing with it except potentially ruining the fun for another player who tried to interact, help even. For example: I was trying to make my way to Balota to see the re-designed airstrip, I encounter a fresh spawn, ask him if he needed food and dropped an opened can for him, result - fist fight.... Another example: I have basic gear and swam to Balisti Island. I encounter two freshies, I wave in greeting from a distance. They ask me where they are and I tell them. I ask if they need food and again one behind me starts stabbing me with a knife. I have many of those examples. They have no repertoire except killing other players. They have no idea what else to do when there is exploring, experimenting, interacting. It indeed is unimaginative, selfish behavior and I am sure they are the same people coming to this forum complaining there is nothing to do in the game because they lack any form of imagination or are simply afraid to risk interaction.

And to you sir I say, "if the shoe fits..."

[Sqeezorz 839]

So far I only had positive experiences with player contacts during the stress test. Maybe it's because I only play at 1pp.

I'm sure that with the upcoming game content, KoS will be harder to make easy looting, because dead players can transmit diseases/infects or the loot gets very damaged (if you do not need anything, just kill it, you will not stop it, but that's DayZ).

It may also be very difficult to loot a military base, because very strong / fast infected people make it nearly impossible on your own, then you will do it with somebody, and the fight for the loot will take place after leaving the base. But at least that's how you had an experience.

[Guy Smiley 534]

Well, I did a kos last night in electro.  I was in the fire hall going up the stairs and I didn't hear the other player coming down.  He scared the living crap out of me plus he did have a firemans axe in hand so I just started swinging my pipe wildly and took him out.   Not my style but I panicked.  Plus I was starving to death anyway and he did end up having a can of beans on him

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

On 6/16/2018 at 4:34 PM, Lexman61 said:

eliminate all weapons from DayZ and turn the game into a post-apocalyptic farming/hunter simulator

Nobody wants this, or the pregnancy thing, for fucks sake man.

Your statements are ridiculous to the extreme here.

Can't you simply accept that there might be a middle ground?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

That old KoS thread brings back memories! Look at all those dedicated "hardcore" fans who.... completely abandoned the project! What incredible fortitude, passion, and resilience, they must have to have stuck with the project so long! /close sarcasm.

To many people, DayZ is a Rambo simulator, a phallic measuring tool, sadly drawn down into the ranks of the typical FPS "gamers" mentality.

Then there's this - "Someone betrayed me and now I KoS everyone." Way to stick by your principles! How about you try changing how you engage players before you simply give in to the lowest common denominator?

DayZ can offer you a weapon for protection or predation, the choice is yours.

I don't ever expect or want KoS to go away altogether as it's part of the horror of DayZ but I do expect THE GAMES DESIGN to heavily impact the choices one makes about when to engage with firearms and when not to.

I had 3 encounters in experimental this week and I had not realized my mic wasn't plugged in so I accidentally gave them all the silent treatment.

First player, I was a fresh spawn in a town full of infected. The player pointed his gun at me but did not fire (probably to avoid aggro). Second player said hello and I couldn't answer, so he simply left. Third player completely got the drop on me and spoke a little before verbally declaring his intention to fight. He raised his fists, I took out my knife. He said, "oh shit, you've got a knife!", and ran off. Hardly the random punch fest I expected.

More and more design implementations will make people think twice about firing and more and more options besides a firefight will open up to them as these are put in place.

Most DayZ players cannot see past the current iteration or even care to try to think about how the game will play once feature complete. They just exploit what they can and go looking for a death match. When they burn out or the reality of DayZ development sets in, the cycle of the revolving door of FPS people continues on.

Edited June 17, 2018 by ☣BioHaze☣

[pilgrim* 3514]

                                                                 do what you feel

 

                                                                                *

say - why are folk looking for an endgame? Is that where the game ends?

Is there an endgame thing in Minecaft ?  (is it capture the flag, or last man standing?)
                              or do you .. get an Achievement Medal ?

- just wondering -

[GaryWalnuts 1680]

We all know we're playing an incomplete game at the moment, so it's a bit early to get all worked up over the subject but Devs have the task of trying to acheive some balance for the final release - and that's still a long ways off.  

I'm hoping they add some mechanisms that favor player cooperation, ones that might pass the KOS cost-benefit analysis and offer significant rewards for cooperation.  Because not KOS'ing needs to have a substantial benefit or it will remain a preferred choice.   imho any sort of 'punishment' for KOS would be a mistake but there should be potential advantages if you take the greater risk of approaching other players and offering or accepting cooperation.  Players want appealing alternatives that primarily favor their own survival or progress but there really aren't any tangible advantages to trusting strangers in the game yet.  It's the devs job build those mechanisms and various choices into the game.  It's a game after all (and an incomplete one) and since no one's going to tell us how to enjoy our own time gaming - it's really got to be built-in.