Some questions to the devs regarding the content shown in the stream

[exwoll 255]

I posted this first on reddit, forgot about the forum, sorry -.-

First let me say that I'm very excited about the new update and the upcoming changes (all the whole lote of them :D), and that I'm very happy that the devs finally took a more transparent and visual approach to showing the new stuff.

That being said, a couple of things worried me about what I had seen:

• Movement/animations Speed - I don't know if it's only me, or the characters movements was too "arcadey". Like the movements/animations were too fast, and that the game is leaning now more towards the arcade side, and emulating stuff from other BR titles. I know that these things in those games are great, however, Dayz is cool because it's different to them, I don't think that emulating them is a good idea, and I hope that if they're doing it, this will be moddable. Making a separate mention, or question about the jogging speed, 20km/h is quite fast and I remember that the idea was to gradually decrease it, was that canceled and will the speed remain the same?
• Light - Everything looked so.... bright, and....plastic???... I don't know, there was a LOT of light EVERYWHERE, with bloom all over the place, which seemed kinda of low quality/cheap to me...
• There was no sign of the characters being tired after running - No strong breath, no slowing down, no "please I need a rest after that 1km jog at full speed" moment, was really arcadey and rust-like.
• Where is the recoil? - They shoot quite a lot of stuff in the game, and there was virtually NO RECOIL at all!!! I mean, look at the recoil of 9mm and 0.45ACP rounds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmBu0Q9nH0k , Dayz is supposed to be "realistic"??? (or was supposed??). Another arcadey change?
• Time amounts to do stuff - How is that cutting down a thick tree takes 4 times less than drinking a bottle of water?
• FALLING - I didn't understood if the character will still receive damage and fractures after falling from considerable height? Because in the stream they jumped from the roof of a building with only a slight leg injury as result (????), I personally have seen people braking legs/arms/face jumping from that height IRL. I'm really worried about this one, since this is one of the main attributes of ARCADEY titles, just jump from whenever you are, nothing will happen......
• There was no inertia - Or it was virtually no noticeable at all (?)
• Where is Brian? - And last but not least,He's been missing in the last reports, as well as from the last appearances (he wasnt in Gamescom nor appeared in other videos, he was absent from the last SR's, and now he is missing from like the main introduction to 0.63)????? Is he still working with you guys? And does his absence has something to do with the points I mentioned, and the change of direction of the game design towards the arcadey style?

I fully understand that what was shown was "work in progress" and that some stuff wasnt present due to reasons. But I would like to know what are the devs plans for these points, since some of them are really significant in the current and past Dayz experience, I'm really hope to get relieved of these worries as just temporary alpha issues :)

Thanks in advance for the reply!

Edited March 15, 2018 by exwoll

[Buakaw 274]

I share your opinion on the visuals. It looked very plastic. So much fog, bloom and it was very saturated. I dont think it looked very realistic.

As for the rest, just wait for now.

[THEGordonFreeman 664]

5 hours ago, Buakaw said:

I share your opinion on the visuals. It looked very plastic. So much fog, bloom and it was very saturated. I dont think it looked very realistic.

As for the rest, just wait for now.

How about... just wait for Beta that's when the majority of what you are looking at will be fixed.

[cirkular 178]

10 hours ago, exwoll said:

-snip-

On all those accounts (except Brian lol) a lot of it will be tweaked, you're right. Well that's what they've stated and I'm sure we are not wrong if we expect it from them. Are you afraid they will turn Dayz into Quake suddenly or something? :)

[degoe 20]

Hi I'd like to use this topic to post my feedback on the Dev stream,
I didn't have time to watch the whole stream so this is based on the overview here

 

To comment on OP's points I agree with the following;

• There was no sign of the characters being tired after running -
• Where is the recoil?
• Time amounts to do stuff -

 

My observations from the stream:

This looks great, I think the ideas mentioned in the status reports have been implemented very nicely and that 0.63 will be the patch that will bring me back to playing more!

I feel the fill bottle animation @6:06 is not yet optimized, it looks outdated compared to the other animations; the character should hold his bottle under the tap and move the crank, visible water should pour into the bottle.

The melee combat @8:40 looks a bit hit and miss, It would be nice if the was an ability to keep guiding the character during the swing; currently it looks like an fixed animation in an fixed direction is used when a punch is initiated.

Eugen looks like a focused guy!

 

PS. If any of the Devs read this could you please share your thoughts on the mentioned points.

Edited March 15, 2018 by degoe

[The Ghost of Hoik 92]

If you look closely at this segment of the video (after they stop running) you will see both character's heavy breathing.

 

Edited March 15, 2018 by The Ghost of Hoik

[exwoll 255]

Now about the recoil....

For a more visual idea of what I mean:

Real 0.45ACP recoil

0.61 FNX recoil

 

0.63 Stream FNX recoil

 

 

As you can clearly see, in the last video is virtually inexistent, which is quite annoying if you ask me. 

Even Doom has more realistic recoil than that lol

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by exwoll

[The Ghost of Hoik 92]

Yes, there is a clear reduction in recoil in the beta footage which seems less in line with the real world footage - I agree,  there should be more recoil!

Edited March 16, 2018 by The Ghost of Hoik

[Mantasisg 172]

The stream was really disappointing to me. The game and stream itself. All this time, and same story all the time. I can't feel the progress, perhaps even regress. Ever since 0.6 came out, I thought thats it, now it is going to be rocket. But happened the other way. Now had similar hopes for 0.63, but I can already see how it will be. I also can't feel the devs, no charisma which you'd expect from someone who is in love and crazy about. Obviously how can you be if you aren't really good at it, and possibly don't even believe yourself, faking everything. Game has ended, the directions were absurd. I feel that this project felt into wrong hands unfortunately. 

Bohemia, thanks for giving (actually thanks to Dean), and then thanks for taking it away, slowly and painfully. I don't know how could you mess up such a gold mine game, but you did it, and it is amazing. 



 

[The Ghost of Hoik 92]

I thought there was heaps of enthusiasm on display during the stream - also I don't think its fair to make such personal criticism of the devs. They are hard working people who wouldn't be doing what they are doing if they weren't passionate and committed to the project, not to mention being thick skinned... 

Edited March 16, 2018 by The Ghost of Hoik

[VVarhead 185]

I agree with all your points.

I believe recoil is getting a re-work though. I don't believe that the current state of recoil in the stream is the finalized state. 

Edited March 16, 2018 by VVarhead

[exwoll 255]

3 hours ago, Mantasisg said:

The stream was really disappointing to me. The game and stream itself. All this time, and same story all the time. I can't feel the progress, perhaps even regress. Ever since 0.6 came out, I thought thats it, now it is going to be rocket. But happened the other way. Now had similar hopes for 0.63, but I can already see how it will be. I also can't feel the devs, no charisma which you'd expect from someone who is in love and crazy about. Obviously how can you be if you aren't really good at it, and possibly don't even believe yourself, faking everything. Game has ended, the directions were absurd. I feel that this project felt into wrong hands unfortunately. 

Bohemia, thanks for giving (actually thanks to Dean), and then thanks for taking it away, slowly and painfully. I don't know how could you mess up such a gold mine game, but you did it, and it is amazing. 



 

Oh common. The devs are doing as much as they can (and more) to deliver a good game and in an active way. 

First of all they aren't actors nor showpeople, they're regular people with a programming background (which mostly is filled by introvert people) and doing what they're doing is quite of both their confort zone and obligations/profession, so say thanks to them for doing a good social and transparent endeavor with all of this :). 

And second, the guy with the main vision isnt there anymore. Even if Dean left them a detailed plan and they all are on the same page, it's quite difficult to move like that. In any project there are problems that can only be successfully solved by the guy with the vision, because he's the only one with the long term view and the whole thing working in his head, he's the only one that can predict how any decision will affect the whole project and will keep the steer wheel in the correct path to achieve what he has in his head, even if he has to change some of the things that he had planned before to do that (a thing that others can't do because they have their own personal visions and the only thing they got from the original one were the initial ideas).

When that guy leaves the team, the rest are like a group of good soldiers left in the battlefield without a captain: they will defend themselves well, will effectively combat the enemy, but they will have a very hard time moving towards longterm victory. 

 Guys are doing great and what they can to bring the game all of us love to life :). 

My post wast just to make them notice a couple of moments I disliked. 

Edited March 16, 2018 by exwoll

[Irish. 4886]

What they showed us, is clearly unfinished in many, many ways. <-- that answers the majority of your questions.

Run speed is buffed, until further options are put into game.. they said that they would do this.

Damage was turned off, or was bugged during the stream.. there was confirmation of this.

They mentioned where Brian is.. recently.

 

 

[Irish. 4886]

41 minutes ago, exwoll said:

My post wast just to make them notice a couple of moments I disliked. 

You do realize how that sounds... right?

[Dancing.Russian.Man 1631]

3 hours ago, Irish. said:

You do realize how that sounds... right?

Early feedback? That's fine. Some of the things mentioned in OP have an explanation, the rest are opinions.

By the way, @exwoll, have a listen to what Eugen says about balance.
There is inertia, sort of. You can read about it here. (Near the bottom of Peter's section.)

Edited March 16, 2018 by Dancing.Russian.Man

[exwoll 255]

3 hours ago, Irish. said:

You do realize how that sounds... right?

.

.

They mentioned where Brian is.. recently.

how? literally early feedback. When a project advances sometimes the devs want to make 2 different things, one of the ideas win, even if not everyone is sure about it, and if no one says nothing about it early things get implemented in the end. Early feedback can at least make them think twice, or give the proponents of the other solution some ground to implement their version (if such exists). 

I lose nothing by trying to point out things that I personally feel aren't right. Maybe someone else agrees? :P

They have been "mentioning" where Brian is since August last year. It still doesn't explain the patron.....

59 minutes ago, Dancing.Russian.Man said:

Early feedback? That's fine. Some of the things mentioned in OP have an explanation, the rest are opinions.

By the way, @exwoll, have a listen to what Eugen says about balance.
There is inertia, sort of. You can read about it here. (Near the bottom of Peter's section.)

Thanks! Yeah, thats what I had in mind when I noted at the end of the post that I totally realize its unfinished work, but was just worried about the directions where this things were pointing, and had to ask about it. 

Also part of my question, or actually a hope for the reply was for something like "yeah, some of these things gonna go that way, but hey, you will be able to tune all of that with modding", so I get a little mad and start researching about how to create my own mod, gonna be called "Definitely Non-Enjoyable Realistic Mod", with realistic recoil, whores and casinos  XD

 

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by exwoll

[libertine 351]

Take all this with a grain of salt, i know a lot of stuff is in the middle of being changed. Also, contrary to what someone else wanted, "enthusiasm", i disagree and i don't want the devs made to feel like they must put on a show. So thanks to all the devs for just being who you are.

Now: Whiny child mode, engaged:

I hope the devs understand that the enjoyment of the base game is going to have to DRAMATICALLY increase for the average player to occasionally tolerate walking across Chernarus slowly with a limp.

That lack of recoil is disturbing. People can sorta control guns that well when they get better at it, but the lack of screen shake and animation alone makes it look like a 1990s game. I don't understand why they aren't BUILDING OFF OF the SUCCESSFUL GAME DAYZ MOD. They seem to be remaking it for a different audience, changing everything to their particular tastes. I thought we'd have Battlefield level animations applied to DayZ actions. Anyway, thats my reaction to what i saw in the overview video. The fist fighting looks ridiculous.

We've got bright colored child backpacks and one type of civilian backpack and a military backpack that looks like im wearing an elephant. Have the devs seen all the cool looking Russian backpacks i've seen just on Ebay? Like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Russian-army-spetsnaz-SSO-SPOSN-Leshy-45L-patrol-hunting-hiking-rugged-backpack/272723892358?hash=item3f7f9c5886:g:q8oAAOSwwvZZRoUK

The gun sounds just makes me shake my head they're so underwhelming. Haven't these devs ever watched movies with bad ass gun sounds in them? Die Hard? Babylon A.D., that i just watched again yesterday had awesome gun sounds.

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by libertine

[exwoll 255]

1 hour ago, libertine said:

Take all this with a grain of salt, i know a lot of stuff is in the middle of being changed. Also, contrary to what someone else wanted, "enthusiasm", i disagree and i don't want the devs made to feel like they must put on a show. So thanks to all the devs for just being who you are.

Now: Whiny child mode, engaged:

I hope the devs understand that the enjoyment of the base game is going to have to DRAMATICALLY increase for the average player to occasionally tolerate walking across Chernarus slowly with a limp.

That lack of recoil is disturbing. People can sorta control guns that well when they get better at it, but the lack of screen shake and animation alone makes it look like a 1990s game. I don't understand why they aren't BUILDING OFF OF the SUCCESSFUL GAME DAYZ MOD. They seem to be remaking it for a different audience, changing everything to their particular tastes. I thought we'd have Battlefield level animations applied to DayZ actions. Anyway, thats my reaction to what i saw in the overview video. The fist fighting looks ridiculous.

We've got bright colored child backpacks and one type of civilian backpack and a military backpack that looks like im wearing an elephant. Have the devs seen all the cool looking Russian backpacks i've seen just on Ebay? Like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Russian-army-spetsnaz-SSO-SPOSN-Leshy-45L-patrol-hunting-hiking-rugged-backpack/272723892358?hash=item3f7f9c5886:g:q8oAAOSwwvZZRoUK

The gun sounds just makes me shake my head they're so underwhelming. Haven't these devs ever watched movies with bad ass gun sounds in them? Die Hard? Babylon A.D., that i just watched again yesterday had awesome gun sounds.

 

Actually yeah, now that you said it, the sound of the shots was quite muffled :/

[Mantasisg 172]

8 hours ago, The Ghost of Hoik said:

I thought there was heaps of enthusiasm on display during the stream - also I don't think its fair to make such personal criticism of the devs. They are hard working people who wouldn't be doing what they are doing if they weren't passionate and committed to the project, not to mention being thick skinned... 

Yes, perhaps there is a bit of enthusiasm, but not much. Most of it probably is because finally the day is comming when you will not have to work on this same DayZ stuff over and over again. Perhaps finally will be able to do something entirelly different, or just quit this sinking ship. And how it can be personal, is their team a person ? 

I just was expecting a game, not a we redid this, we redone that. It is great personal achievements I believe, congrats, hard work kool. But why I should be happy if I hardly see anything significantly better, if better. And how it should make me happy if I see none of the stuff being addressed to gameplay. I don't care what has been done if nothing seems to add up to gameplay, I think we should be glad if it doesn't take away by this point. 

Seems to me like DayZ is more like a sandbox for developers, not a meant to play sandbox game. If not its past greatness, NO ONE would care already. Because they just aren't making anything to contribute for actual gameplay. 

I haven't seen anything in a stream what is not in now. Just redone stuff.

Organise a stream with a proper gameplay in a full 100+ people server, with vehicles, zombies, predators, night and rain and more.... Play something like a survivor games or something.... Invite some streamers like Puhdado, Patriot, Dimitri, Moon, Kiwo, Lirik, Runningman, and more Do Not invite TopeREKT... 

Make it all natural unscripted with real fights and converstions, real struggle. Show what DayZ is about. But what I see is air punching, rolling on the ground forever, struggling to shoot down a hen, aiming for headshot for a minute and not making it, randomly running like it shows anything. And I am not surprised that at the end the game has no play. 

After all the great stuff, all epic teasers such as planes, helicopters, bikes, for example.... We see weird melee fight, some new animations, climbing the ladders masterpiece, new UI once again, modified controller - which you can't really show, just try. And nothing else. 

How should I feel after all the wait, and teasers ? :) 

Oh well it all will come in a rate of DAYS after 0.63 will hit stable, and yes it has to hit stable at first, I don't believe it hits stable this year. Years of majorly disappointing game will turn into something everyone believed in a few months. Yes sure. 




 

[The Ghost of Hoik 92]

Firstly, I'm glad that people are expressing themselves - I wouldn't want anyone feeling dissatisfied or concerned with development shot down or dismissed.

@Mantasisg, I can see you are clearly quite cynical about the devs. You are probably right that they are feeling excited about seeing things coming together and the end being in sight, but this is only natural after working on something for so long and not at all a detriment to them. Also, you make it personal when you say thing like:  "I also can't feel the devs, no charisma which you'd expect from someone who is in love and crazy about. Obviously how can you be if you aren't really good at it, and possibly don't even believe yourself, faking everything." 

The rest of your observations and/or comments indicate to me that you have expectations that haven't been met - the stream was showing what the team have completed in the lead up to beta and you were expecting a full showcase of polished features... when your expectations don't line up with reality it can be very disappointing - this is something that we all have to learn to deal with. I know you probably don't want to hear it (and it will tickle every cynical bone in your body) but the game is still in alpha and this should be taken into account when you are forming your expectations. If the devs claimed to be coming to the end of Beta and on the verge of full release, then I would be in full agreement with you.

All I can say is hang in there. The journey ain't over yet!

Edited March 16, 2018 by The Ghost of Hoik

[emuthreat 2837]

12 hours ago, Mantasisg said:

The stream was really disappointing to me. The game and stream itself. All this time, and same story all the time. I can't feel the progress, perhaps even regress. Ever since 0.6 came out, I thought thats it, now it is going to be rocket. But happened the other way. Now had similar hopes for 0.63, but I can already see how it will be. I also can't feel the devs, no charisma which you'd expect from someone who is in love and crazy about. Obviously how can you be if you aren't really good at it, and possibly don't even believe yourself, faking everything. Game has ended, the directions were absurd. I feel that this project felt into wrong hands unfortunately. 

Bohemia, thanks for giving (actually thanks to Dean), and then thanks for taking it away, slowly and painfully. I don't know how could you mess up such a gold mine game, but you did it, and it is amazing. 

How much are EA and Activision paying you?

[Lexman61 78]

6 hours ago, emuthreat said:

How much are EA and Activision paying you?

Probably the same as what you get from Bohemia.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                       Regards

[exwoll 255]

17 hours ago, emuthreat said:

How much are EA and Activision paying you?

 

11 hours ago, Lexman61 said:

Probably the same as what you get from Bohemia.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                       Regards

I wanna get paid to shill too, pls tell me where to apply XD

[calabacin2 11]

Agree.

Running speed is really high.

The game is too bright.

Falling is a joke as they showed it. That will encourage players to jump from every roof like pubg.

The game is not finished yet so I can't complain much :)

[cirkular 178]

Well, I wouldn't believe after all of this gun sway and recoil tweaked up to the current version, they'd leave it like this for beta and final version, with barely any of it. I think it's obvious that much of what we've seen needs tweaking and it WAS stated it will be, so maybe going too deep and even personal with commenting is too much. On another side, it's a good idea to just plainly point out what you think might be wrong.

@exwoll As far as the gun sounds, I think the problem is that it's not a good idea to compare them with badass movies :) except for making badass games, so maybe a balance would do.

But for example, at the shooting range for practice, you'd wear ear muffs for hearing protection. Without those, you are risking hearing damage. After the first shot, your hearing would indeed be muffled for a split second at least, followed with some ear ringing probably. Like, you'd just hear the beginning of that loud shot and then barely anything, not like in the movies. Of course, being inside a room or outside when shooting matters too. Maybe our weapons expert @-Gews- could add something there :)