Basebuilding

[Buakaw 274]

 

If people can just plunder and demolish everything you built (edit: with ease, as in just walk in) when you are offline, what is the point of camps such as this?

If there are actually layers of security against offline raiding, how will you be able to overcome them? By gathering explosives such as grenades and blowing into them?

Also, don't public hives render camps entirely useless anyway (assuming they have some sort of security to begin with), assuming the login mechanism will remain as it is?

 

I really wonder how this whole thing is gonna get handled, does anyone have any more insights?

Personally, just gonna use basebuilding to fortify a watchtower on the airfield or something and resort to hidden stashes and barrels for loot storage.

 

 

Edited January 11, 2018 by Buakaw

[Conrad_The_Comrade 577]

The issue of being raided while offline is always going to be an issue in any survival game, not much you can do about it than set up really good walls and hope to god no one stumbles upon your camp. As for the Public Hive thing, the problem is playing on Public Hive in the first place. People can always just server hop, go inside the walls, and swap back so they're inside. Public hive is honestly just terrible imo. Server hopping for loot is rampant, it's much harder to keep a solid player base or community, and with the addition of basebuilding, there's even more reasons never to use Public. (On this note, I'd suggest checking out DayZ Underground, they're a pretty solid Private community, that's easy to get into, and has pretty active servers day in and day out)

[exacomvm 101]

Imo each Public server should have separate character or atleast same character but if joined to a new server it gets coast spawn+all the rest servers ( bambis will get more chances for instant decent loot too ) and for the base building i think the base should be non-destroyable and only the owner can destroy/edit it or someone else who already have been inside ( based on Steam account ).
There could be exceptions, like it could be destroyable with an RPG and the RPG itself pretty rare.

Edited January 10, 2018 by exacomvm

[Buakaw 274]

12 hours ago, Conrad_The_Comrade said:

The issue of being raided while offline is always going to be an issue in any survival game, not much you can do about it than set up really good walls and hope to god no one stumbles upon your camp.

I see no issue with offline raiding at all.

 

7 minutes ago, exacomvm said:

Imo each Public server should have separate character and for the base building i think the base should be non-destroyable and only the owner can destroy/edit it or someone else who already have been inside ( based on Steam account ).
There could be exceptions, like it could be destroyable with an RPG and the RPG itself pretty rare.

I dont think bases should be untouchable in this game to be honest.

But what will the dynamic be I wonder? Will bases be accessible by anyone and have to be guarded at all times? Or will they introduce a new ressource like explosives for raiding? How will access to bases be handled? With keys or something?

Edited January 10, 2018 by Buakaw

[exacomvm 101]

23 minutes ago, Buakaw said:

I see no issue with offline raiding at all. You cant expect to be untouched. But what will the dynamic be in dayz? I doubt its going to be sulfur farming and crafting c4 like Rust to raid bases, so thats why I ask.

 

I dont think bases should be untouchable in this game, there always needs to be a danger, but I wonder how its going to be handled to gain access to a base if you are not the owner? Are they gonna implement a new ressource in the shape of explosives to raid? Or are bases simply going to be accessible by anyone and will have to be guarded at all times?

Well, open gate/door -> let person in -> he grants ability to edit the base. ( so the trust plays a role here ).
Example scenario: Bambi comes and asks to let him in, he grants some privilegies, then he calls his team, bambi opens the door and like fkn 20 ppl goes in and shoots everyone and then the previous owner(s) loses access ( simple script for that would be if an A owner kills B owner, the B owner loses the base access but if the owner dies from a zombie,falling, random player he maintains the base ).
If the bases gonna be "touchable" easily then not sure if im going to build anything, i just gonna raid some bases and overtake it.

There's just countless ways of making it fair for both raider and owner.
I would just prefer making it hard to raid the base ( as hard as crafting 2-3 full ghillie suits ).

Another suggestion how it could work:
All you need is crowbar, but when breaking the crowbar has like only 10% chance of breaking the door/gate, so if it breaks the crowbar is ruined and u need new one to try again. ( same if success )
Offline raiding: When trying to break in there could be message "Owner(s) are offline.". 
Also there could be variable chance: If lets say there's 1 owner only, the chance is like 70%, if there's 2 owners the chance is like 50%, if there's like 10 owners/members the chance is 10%. Basically the bigger community in that base the harder to break in.

Edited January 10, 2018 by exacomvm

[Dancing.Russian.Man 1631]

It's relatively simple to check if a player would spawn near any player-based objects like walls and gates, and their spawn location could then be adjusted to be a certain distance away from those structures, and I *think* this was mentioned by the devs, but don't quote me on that yet because I'm too tired to go find it.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Dancing.Russian.Man

[exacomvm 101]

1 hour ago, Dancing.Russian.Man said:

It's relatively simple to check if a player would spawn near any player-based objects like walls and gates, and their spawn location could then be adjusted to be a certain distance away from those structures, and I *think* this was mentioned by the devs, but don't quote me on that yet because I'm too tired to go find it.

Better would be just inability to interact with anything in the base, cause if the player spawns out of the base trying to server hop, some people may still find some glitches how to get in e.g. using zombies or connecting exactly where the walls middle is etc etc. Something like privilege or ownership system could be great.

Well but maybe dayz team has better ideas.

Edited January 10, 2018 by exacomvm

[Dancing.Russian.Man 1631]

58 minutes ago, exacomvm said:

Better would be just inability to interact with anything in the base, cause if the player spawns out of the base trying to server hop, some people may still find some glitches how to get in e.g. using zombies or connecting exactly where the walls middle is etc etc. Something like privilege or ownership system could be great.

Well but maybe dayz team has better ideas.

That's probably not happening, the devs have said (again, don't quote me on this yet, I should already be in bed but I came back to check the forum) that they're against complete security. Locks? Sure, but there will be ways through them. Even if I'm making this all up, this is probably the best I would hope for.

[Sqeezorz 839]

B.Hicks wrote in a statement about the basebuilding (it's been a while ... could be in time for the image of the OP). Bases will never be completely safe. Who does not agree with the point in Vanilla, no problem, E_Script will allow mods with "Ford Knox" Bases.

[DannyDog 532]

I can imagine very fast iterations of different base building mechanics happening as it seems there isn't a solid design yet the devs have spoken about. Who knows they might even decide later that "complete security" is the only way to make it engaging and worthwhile.

I'll be most eager to see what they come up with.

[Guy Smiley 534]

I'm pretty sure people are confusing base building with barricading.  I don't think there's going to be resource gathering involved where people are going to be able to build their own structures/housing.  You're either going to setup tents or barricade/fortify existing buildings in game.

[Dancing.Russian.Man 1631]

11 hours ago, DannyDog said:

Who knows they might even decide later that "complete security" is the only way to make it engaging and worthwhile.

Yes.

9 hours ago, Guy Smiley said:

I'm pretty sure people are confusing base building with barricading.  I don't think there's going to be resource gathering involved where people are going to be able to build their own structures/housing.  You're either going to setup tents or barricade/fortify existing buildings in game.

In this SR they said "barricading is too risky for beta" along other things and expanded more on that right after in the same SR.
In this SR they said "we had to choose which to support first, and we chose base building."

You can find both parts very quickly if you search for "barricading."

[Buakaw 274]

16 hours ago, Sqeezorz said:

B.Hicks wrote in a statement about the basebuilding (it's been a while ... could be in time for the image of the OP). Bases will never be completely safe. Who does not agree with the point in Vanilla, no problem, E_Script will allow mods with "Ford Knox" Bases.

We were already aware of that. The point of the discussion is, will you be able to walk into anyones camp or will there be some kind of layers of security?

Its not the easiest thing to handle with realism and "hardcore" survival in mind. Because realistically, nothing would stop me from hopping over those fences or use a beamcutter.

 

13 hours ago, DannyDog said:

I can imagine very fast iterations of different base building mechanics happening as it seems there isn't a solid design yet the devs have spoken about. Who knows they might even decide later that "complete security" is the only way to make it engaging and worthwhile.

I'll be most eager to see what they come up with.

Same!
Especially as I personally fail to see a solution that would be rewarding and interesting for raiders and basebuilders alike and still be somewhat realistic.

[pilgrim* 3514]

In the REAL world, there is no base or construction of any kind that can  "stop"  the entry of anyone - if they have access to the same or similar tech equipment as the builders - except if that location is under real-time manned surveillance when the outsiders try to enter.  This is just a rock bottom real-world security fact. 

So are we looking for fantasy indestructible bases with a magic doorkey that cannot be take off the dead body of a player ?

 

Edited January 11, 2018 by pilgrim*

[sneakydude 480]

Yeah many of us have talked about this sine 2015, The idea that i thought up in the other base building concepts was if your close to a base and logged off, was to have you port over 500m away from the initial point so no hoping was allowed to port you into a base. The 2nd idea was to remove Public hives. Since private can do their own rules.

 

The point of being able to build a base is to protect your wares, and build a community of sorts. If it is simply what we have seen since Dayz SA was nothing but grieving tactics or Cheating tools then it is hopeless. Walling up an existing building would be best suited. Arma 3 Exile would run scripts to kick a person back or announce to the devs who was trying to peek even through. Good script at the time, needed some work but it is very possible to record the persons name, UID etc... of any exploits. The cheats on the other hand need to be under control otherwise public servers are useless.

[Buakaw 274]

playing private hives solves both the cheating and hopping issue, so im not overly concerned. interested in what the solution for that will be tho.

[calabacin2 11]

On 10/1/2018 at 1:23 PM, exacomvm said:

Well, open gate/door -> let person in -> he grants ability to edit the base. ( so the trust plays a role here ).
Example scenario: Bambi comes and asks to let him in, he grants some privilegies, then he calls his team, bambi opens the door and like fkn 20 ppl goes in and shoots everyone and then the previous owner(s) loses access ( simple script for that would be if an A owner kills B owner, the B owner loses the base access but if the owner dies from a zombie,falling, random player he maintains the base ).
If the bases gonna be "touchable" easily then not sure if im going to build anything, i just gonna raid some bases and overtake it.

There's just countless ways of making it fair for both raider and owner.
I would just prefer making it hard to raid the base ( as hard as crafting 2-3 full ghillie suits ).

Another suggestion how it could work:
All you need is crowbar, but when breaking the crowbar has like only 10% chance of breaking the door/gate, so if it breaks the crowbar is ruined and u need new one to try again. ( same if success )
Offline raiding: When trying to break in there could be message "Owner(s) are offline.". 
Also there could be variable chance: If lets say there's 1 owner only, the chance is like 70%, if there's 2 owners the chance is like 50%, if there's like 10 owners/members the chance is 10%. Basically the bigger community in that base the harder to break in.

your arcade ideas are terrible, this is not dayz mod

[Guy Smiley 534]

9 hours ago, Dancing.Russian.Man said:

Yes.

In this SR they said "barricading is too risky for beta" along other things and expanded more on that right after in the same SR.
In this SR they said "we had to choose which to support first, and we chose base building."

You can find both parts very quickly if you search for "barricading."

It's still vague about the base building.  Are we going Rust style base building(hope not) or the ability to just setup a bunch of tents and place them how we want?

[Dancing.Russian.Man 1631]

5 minutes ago, Guy Smiley said:

It's still vague about the base building.  Are we going Rust style base building(hope not) or the ability to just setup a bunch of tents and place them how we want?

I haven't touched Rust since it was a browser game, but the picture in the main post is official concept art shown at RTX 2015.

Hesco bags, fences, gates, watch towers (pre-built), etc.

[Guy Smiley 534]

12 minutes ago, Dancing.Russian.Man said:

I haven't touched Rust since it was a browser game, but the picture in the main post is official concept art shown at RTX 2015.

Hesco bags, fences, gates, watch towers (pre-built), etc.

That at least somewhat more realistic.  I was getting worried that they were heading in the direction of building sky towers/fortresses and such.

[Gobbokirk 546]

1 hour ago, Guy Smiley said:

That at least somewhat more realistic.  I was getting worried that they were heading in the direction of building sky towers/fortresses and such.

Think one of the few things we actually know for sure is that it won't be Epoch/Rust bases :)

[DannyDog 532]

I really wish environmental assets like furniture were individual objects in-game because it'll be super awesome to be able to take furniture out from houses and place them in your base. AFAIK they aren't objects that can individually be spawned in and are part of the structures they belong to which is why they cannot do randomizing building interiors. q_q

[r8gato 46]

I have to believe part of the building and home env art upgrades coming in Beta+ will be the removal of 'baked in' static furniture and set dressing. Replaced by individual assets that can be hand placed per structure to look and feel more random by the artists. Whether the furniture/set dressing assets are converted to dynamic props, allowing them to be manipulated by the player...not so sure, but that would be fantastic though.

[robbyj 77]

Most Dayz servers run twenty-four hours a day, seven days a week. Which means, unless you play twenty-four hours a day seven days a week, inevitably, there will be change to the server that you can not control. Before building a base, one must consider the location, to determine how likely it is for players to come into contact with the base, and if enough supplies have been obtained to finish construction in one sitting so loot may be safely stored inside. The Dayz map is large, and there is plenty of good hiding spots for a base. When the time comes, if you believe there aren't proper tools for you to protect your base with while offline, then don't build one. To answer your question regarding public hive, public hive is bad. As far as I can remember, no one asked for public hive. As you may know, the Dayz community was built on indy server providers and loosely connected developers who  built a brand with their individual servers. That was part of the fun. You could find a niche server to call home. The public hive ruins all of that, and introduces other, much harder issues to the game. 

[comikz 218]

The idea of base building or having large camps such as the one depicted in the picture, is interesting.

I'm just hoping no abusive admins or alike, are going to put things in place to safeguard their camps, besides that, having structures and such as the ones in the picture, are going to make these a lot easier to spot while going through the woods and thus, easier to, "Raid". Hopefully there will be defenses put in place to help against off-line raiding, such as barbed wire/turrets/pit falls/mines ect. Because if you're just going to be able to go up to a wall and break it down with an axe or something, it kinda makes these pointless outside of the aesthetic reasons.