loot farming with infecteds and boats

[kopo79 426]

4 hours ago, ImpulZ said:

Hi guys,

to quickly catch up on what has been said:

1. Yes, we are aware of this issue.
2. The economy is in fact very complex, because it is not the "CLE", it is just the "Central Economy", managing hundreds of different loot items across many thousands of spawn points across our giant map. Also including infected spawn, animals and dynamic events. Every new item needs to be included and balanced correctly. (we talked more about it in our Status Report from June 2018)
3. If you uncover reliable routes where loot immediately respawns, please report them to our Feedback Tracker. Server IP, time and server pop when joining is also useful information.

I read that and didnt understand anything.?...but on official servers and dayz village server with 30 people i can force new items to spawn to just walk sone amount away from examble house.

It works everytime same...

Find boat...take coca colas...run away and return to boat...new item has spawned

[green_mtn_grandbob 594]

if loot didn't re spawn then the next guy who came along would get no loot. that's the point of the loot economy.

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

2 hours ago, green_mtn_grandbob said:

if loot didn't re spawn then the next guy who came along would get no loot. that's the point of the loot economy.

We know how it works, we're not suggesting 'no respawn until the restart' or something. But I think you shouldn't be able to station near Berezhki and simply thrive on the local civilian gear.

Show me a player who struggles with food and I'll show you someone who didn't figure out DayZ mechanics yet.

[green_mtn_grandbob 594]

well it's up to the player how he plays the game, after all it's a sandbox game . to rag on how a player plays the game just because you think it's wrong or not your bag.

[Guy Smiley 534]

13 minutes ago, green_mtn_grandbob said:

well it's up to the player how he plays the game, after all it's a sandbox game . to rag on how a player plays the game just because you think it's wrong or not your bag.

Just like when gamma exploiting was a thing right?  It's up to the player how they wanna play, right?  Exploiting is how they wanna play, right?

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

9 hours ago, green_mtn_grandbob said:

well it's up to the player how he plays the game, after all it's a sandbox game . to rag on how a player plays the game just because you think it's wrong or not your bag.

You actually dragged the issue of sandbox gameplay into this...?

The problem with the current loot boom is not that DayZ doesn't work like I want, but that it doesn't work as marketed. At the moment, DayZ is about as much a gritty survival post-apoc experience as Texas Hold'em.

Imagine giving every player an invulnerability code and then saying "you don't have to use it, you know". Think about why would you have any problem with that.

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

19 hours ago, eno said:

So... I'm just another guy... but I do recommend you come back and give official public servers a try. Tinker with base building on a small scale and leave the mods alone for a bit.

 

Thanks for the tip, I'll definitely consider it. The reports here are mixed - do we even have the diseases in? A couple of weeks ago I tried to test the health system, but couldn't harm my toon in any way, either through temperature or food intake. Still, I see people complaining about the cold. So is it in or not?

And I do want to check the new areas like Zvir, that's for sure.

[eno 1049]

@Kirov (DayZ) Those elements are generally not in... colds yes. 

They’re probably a mini patch from being implemented... and may just be bugged so I’ve been playing it safe with clean water and cooked meat. I wear boots and take my multivits... but I do see people just eating and drinking whatever walking around barefoot. 

Choose your own adventure... and take things as far as you want. Enjoy the ability to cut the corners a little if you desire but know it could change and you could develop bad habits. 

[digitalv0id 10]

I'm kind of jumping in this half way and only read a handful of posts but maybe people just need to consider changing the way you play. If all you are doing is loot cycling an area, I'm not so sure you are going to have the best experience. Also, keep in mind that not a lot of people are playing Official servers, so that means mods. Mods with increased loot, decreased re-spawn rates, etc, etc. I don't personally loot cycle. I loot a town, find what I find and move on. Onto the next town and hopefully it has the loot I want. My only real complaint about the game is that it has turned into a loot based game. This meant to be a survival game. Stop loot cycling. Get out and play the game; have interactions with people, tie someone up, make them your slave, run to the airfield or another military base to get the gear you need to survive. 

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

1 hour ago, eno said:

@Kirov (DayZ) Those elements are generally not in... colds yes.

Choose your own adventure... and take things as far as you want. Enjoy the ability to cut the corners a little if you desire but know it could change and you could develop bad habits. 

It's the contrary, what I'd like to do is the research on all the survival elements that will obviously come in over... *must... resist... an obvious... joke...* some time in the future. We need to get to work on our wiki *cough* as soon as *cough* reasonably possible *cough*. So there is that.

You don't happen to know how the cold can be caught? I was freezing my ass off naked in the sea for some 20 minutes, to no avail.

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

1 hour ago, digitalv0id said:

I'm kind of jumping in this half way and only read a handful of posts but maybe people just need to consider changing the way you play. If all you are doing is loot cycling an area, I'm not so sure you are going to have the best experience. Also, keep in mind that not a lot of people are playing Official servers, so that means mods. Mods with increased loot, decreased re-spawn rates, etc, etc. I don't personally loot cycle. I loot a town, find what I find and move on. Onto the next town and hopefully it has the loot I want. My only real complaint about the game is that it has turned into a loot based game. This meant to be a survival game. Stop loot cycling. Get out and play the game; have interactions with people, tie someone up, make them your slave, run to the airfield or another military base to get the gear you need to survive. 

Yeah, it seems that you missed half the posts and the entire point. "Just don't do it" is not a proper response to obviously bad mechanics. Some people will always abuse it and gain an upper hand, so @Guy Smiley is right, it's kinda like with the gamma thing. Fortunately, as @ImpulZsays, the dev team sees this issue, too, so there you go.

[pilgrim* 3514]

On 1/16/2019 at 4:45 PM, aaronlands said:

To me the perfect balance with respect to the zombie loot can be met by reducing the respawn rate of zombies.

To me the perfect balance with respect to the zombie loot :

1 ) randomize loot carried by zombies so plenty don't have any at all (..or e.g.  zombies never carry food.. or occasionally carry raw meat because they only eat players )
2 ) Introduce zombie variation (like the old mil pilot zombies from wayback) so one zombie in 5 is a mean MoFo who fights hard, doesn't care if you hack their arm off, takes 3 bullets to the chest and keeps coming, and will tear the door down if you try to hide in a house.

??

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

On 12/18/2018 at 8:41 AM, kopo79 said:

sorry about the title...im not sure if its right phrase but...
infecteds are just now so bad that you can make "loot farming" with them...
i mean...go in town....best towns are just maybe 5 houses with infecteds.
kill them all(its easy) and take loot from their pockets.
usually you find food and duct tape and other small things.
food is most common now.

when you have killed them all,run away from town about 200 meters.wait a little and go back in town.
there is new infecteds now...kill and take loot.
when you have backpack full of food,you are good to go.
sometimes i also have seen chickens spawn within them.
kill,skin and eat raw

so now i just wonder that is it same for normal loot in houses?
what about military areas?...can i do "loot farming" in military areas?
 

This isn't exactly loot farming although there are overtones of loot farming present.

Loot farming is removing items from their spawn to an area away (with distances varying between Mod vs SA vs different builds of SA) about 30 feet and dropping them. A countdown starts then new stuff spawns in. What you're describing isn't loot farming. You could say the same thing about every player you kill, kill a new player and get loot...thats not farming. Not all infected spawn with items either, there is a floating variable in the code.

The current settings in game files like Types.XML and etc are placeholder. Admins can make adjustements to all of these parameters to a more desired number. The functionaility is there.

On 1/16/2019 at 6:18 AM, kopo79 said:

MY SUPERMARKET IS OPEEEENNNN!!!its a black friday in chernarus....every items are free for everyone!
just loot farmed police station,one car and one house.


this was in experimental...
is this that what game description says:
Persistent servers with complex loot economy, and the ability to build improvised bases.

maybe community servers this cant be done or high populated servers...i dont know....how is it?

This is loot farming and a game-breaking exploit that hurts everybody on the server. My project uses very high values for specific loot to respawn (military loot mostly). The caveat is the higher the number, the lower the loot for others so there needs to be a nice balance there. Our values are still WIP, but players are not able to successfully loot farm. The timers are high for desirable loot and undesirable loot will spawn in their stead.

CLE is robust. You're merely ignorant to its functionality. Remember, this isn't a real 1.0...DayZ is really in BETA right now.

On 1/29/2019 at 9:22 AM, kopo79 said:

first was infinite apples and infinite stamina...now....infinite loot

it has bugged me that can i loot farm on community servers so i decided to go one of the best server...
dayz village.after 30 minutes or something i managed to get gun,food,knife, some weapon attachments,water bootles,plums keep spawning three times row under tree.


this is from dayz steam page...
"Persistent servers with complex loot economy, and the ability to build improvised bases."

so is this central loot economy final?...devs say that this is complex system?...run between houses and get so much stuff that apocalypse just feels joke.
in last status report,there was nothing abou this?
is there community server where i cant do this?

Whatever server you go an and are able to loot farm in that short of time, the admin simply hasn't adjusted the value from stock or the values they've chosen are clearly too low and can be exploited. Reiterating, it takes a lot of work to find balanced values. It's not enough to get feedback and feedback is tainted quite a bit. Again, the Loot Economy CAN BE complex, but the stock values are not.

On 1/29/2019 at 3:53 PM, kopo79 said:

I read that and didnt understand anything.?...but on official servers and dayz village server with 30 people i can force new items to spawn to just walk sone amount away from examble house.

It works everytime same...

Find boat...take coca colas...run away and return to boat...new item has spawned

When ImpulZ say's If you uncover reliable routes where loot immediately respawns you have to take that statement literally and not misinterpret it.

If loot IMMEDIATELY respawns, thats not in the code and should be reported. There is a timer and the timer is short as a placeholder. You are experiencing a timer, it's short but it's there and working. If you pick up something and something spawns in with ZERO DELAY, report it.

Hopefully this clears things up for you.

Edited January 31, 2019 by Weyland Yutani (DayZ)

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

Thanks for an informative post, good read. Two things that come to my mind here:

9 hours ago, Weyland Yutani (DayZ) said:

This isn't exactly loot farming although there are overtones of loot farming present.

Whatever you call it, for me some kind of loot farming is related to what @pilgrim* touches upon - the strength and loot of zeds. I'm quite sure that on official servers you can largely consider the infected walking food banks. They tend to drop useful basic stuff (mostly cans) and I'm always happy to see them coming. Part of it comes from how melee works. I don't have high expectations of decent melee and if it was only as good as the chainsaw fight in the original Doom, I'd be completely fine. In many games, melee combat is just button mashing. But melee in DayZ is probably the worst I've ever seen in my life, starting with games from late 80s. "Take a sidestep - mash buttons - something happens - hopefully take loot if a glitch didn't kill you". What I'm saying is, the zeds are only dangerous when they have glitches on their side.

9 hours ago, Weyland Yutani (DayZ) said:

Remember, this isn't a real 1.0...DayZ is really in BETA right now.

I understand what you're trying to say here, but I'm afraid the devs can't have their cake and eat it, too. This is 1.0, they were very clear about it. Whether it's the worst 1.0 since Fallout 76 or since Atari's E.T., it depends on how mean you're feeling today.

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

8 hours ago, Kirov (DayZ) said:

I understand what you're trying to say here, but I'm afraid the devs can't have their cake and eat it, too. This is 1.0, they were very clear about it. Whether it's the worst 1.0 since Fallout 76 or since Atari's E.T., it depends on how mean you're feeling today.

Regardless of them redefining several industry terms and lets be honest man...it's not the devs, it's the brass and the brass is Marek Spanel. Marek tells them what to do and they do it. For whatever reasons, Marek wanted this out officially in 2019 and I'm sure over time the real reasons will be public. My guess is it's financially related/motivated. With all of that said, the current state and developmenet of DayZ is in Beta. They're crushing the hell out of bugs and adding a small amount of new (or readding) features, thats what Beta is.

My guess based on past development, we'll get a real 1.0 by Q4 2019. My biggest gripes atm are BEC crashing and Persistence.

Edited January 31, 2019 by Weyland Yutani (DayZ)

[INomadZ 211]

"..just don't do it" approach is ok if you're on a PVE server, but it doesn't work well, if you play on PVP servers. Players who "loot cycle" have more chances to survive fights.

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

On 1/31/2019 at 7:39 PM, Weyland Yutani (DayZ) said:

Regardless of them redefining several industry terms and lets be honest man...it's not the devs, it's the brass and the brass is Marek Spanel. Marek tells them what to do and they do it. For whatever reasons, Marek wanted this out officially in 2019 and I'm sure over time the real reasons will be public. My guess is it's financially related/motivated. With all of that said, the current state and developmenet of DayZ is in Beta. They're crushing the hell out of bugs and adding a small amount of new (or readding) features, thats what Beta is.

My guess based on past development, we'll get a real 1.0 by Q4 2019. My biggest gripes atm are BEC crashing and Persistence.

Much as I've always had problems with buying the 'they took our money' story, the overall issues seemed to amount to much more than just fumbling deadlines. So you're saying that basically what we're experiencing is 1) executive meddling, 2)  'redefining industry terms'? Whatever the latter means, of course.

[Parazight 1599]

1 hour ago, Kirov (DayZ) said:

Much as I've always had problems with buying the 'they took our money' story, the overall issues seemed to amount to much more than just fumbling deadlines. So you're saying that basically what we're experiencing is 1) executive meddling, 2)  'redefining industry terms'? Whatever the latter means, of course.

It's pretty hard to believe that the developers, the guys that work under the hood, are people that don't really care about the quality and the job that they're doing.  These devs are probably hard working people that aren't lazy slobs who sit around the office, trolling people on the internet and sharing pics of their golden yachts all day.  It's easily understandable that the people who dish out the money (executives) have to answer to other higher powers, deadlines, and people that don't comprehend the entire scope of things that are.  

It's unreasonable to believe that these devs, who actually work on the game, decided to push the product, as-is, out to 1.0 knowing full-well the logical backlash that would happen. Likely, (Spanel) decided to redefine expectations by pushing something out and declaring it 'finished', simply (probably) because they agreed to a timeline in a deal they made to Microsoft (dayz going to xbox) while having no clue that creating a game via a roadmap is ridiculous to begin with.  A roadmap, a line resembling linear progression is the worst possible way to define a schedule for a product such as this.  It's like creating a painting by starting at the left side of the canvas and working to the right, and not approaching the development as a whole.

It would be extremely satisfying to see BI executives engage on the forums regarding their reasoning, but we know that will never happen.  So, the devs have to be the ones to take the bullet.

Edited February 2, 2019 by Parazight

[pilgrim* 3514]

3 hours ago, Kirov (DayZ) said:

1) executive meddling,

..hmm..  In a Privately Owned Company the executive with final say is the Boss who owns the company -  All other company staff are hired to do what the Boss wants them to do.  They are not hired by the Owner for any reason except to ensure the function & continuation of the Company. Private Companies exist to make a profit or at least to break even after taxes and expenses. I don't think you can call this system the owners  "meddling" with the workers - unless you want to challenge the basic, very standard, structure of Western Capitalist Democracy.

But if you do - that's fine by me.

 

Edited February 2, 2019 by pilgrim*

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

On 2/2/2019 at 7:51 AM, Kirov (DayZ) said:

Much as I've always had problems with buying the 'they took our money' story, the overall issues seemed to amount to much more than just fumbling deadlines. So you're saying that basically what we're experiencing is 1) executive meddling, 2)  'redefining industry terms'? Whatever the latter means, of course.

They took our money

Sure, they took our money and reinvested into one of the best games ever made. DayZ spawned PUBG which in turn spawned Fornite. No DayZ, no PUBG and Fortnite. I hate those games, but they've had a massive impact on the industry. I know we're all frustrated but look at how many hours you've spent in-game, how much RL money you're spent on gear, etc. So many people come through our doors and remark at how they only play DayZ and simply can't play anything else.

Executive Meddling

This is absolutely the case. Somebody has to run the company right? One man and one man alone calls the shots and that's Marek. Show me one person who says otherwise. I'm sure there are a lot of things going on behind the scenes which probably explains why he pushed to 1.0.

Redefining Industry Terms

They had a Beta Strike Team 1 & 2 which was to break up Beta into two phases. They mentioned this way back and then never brought it up again. A lot of people don't even know what I'm talking about it was so far back. They just mentioned something about another strike team recently, TFL to look for a source. This Beta was not a Beta at all, if anything it was a mere formality. We are experiencing Beta right now, yet DayZ is 1.0.

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

On 2/4/2019 at 7:59 PM, Weyland Yutani (DayZ) said:

They took our money

Sure, they took our money and reinvested into one of the best games ever made. DayZ spawned PUBG which in turn spawned Fornite. No DayZ, no PUBG and Fortnite. I hate those games, but they've had a massive impact on the industry. I know we're all frustrated but look at how many hours you've spent in-game, how much RL money you're spent on gear, etc. So many people come through our doors and remark at how they only play DayZ and simply can't play anything else.

 

Sounds like you are or have been a team member? I wasn't aware of that.

Yeah, I can't say I can play only DayZ, but with 1800 hrs under my belt it sure quickly jumped to my personal second place (after Sid Meyer's Alpha Centauri, an entirely different cup of tea). I came to DayZ from the Fallout franchise (dating back to F1) and I rarely look back. But when we talk about the massive impact on the industry, it's hard not to mention the reputation of DayZ, e.g. how 1.0 press announcements in December sounded like somebody resurrected a freakin' mammoth. "2013, when was that". The way this whole situation looks, it's almost impossible to defend.

Since you sound like you're in the know - do you know if they still have that separate team from another game just for animal AI and hunting features? I read about it somewhere in 2015 and since then - can't find a word and obviously so many things are more pressing now. So was the whole idea scrapped or not?

[pilgrim* 3514]

23 hours ago, Kirov (DayZ) said:

You honestly thought you can lecture me from Margaret Thather's Economics 101 brochure, grandpa? LOL. You really need to stop inserting in every post how old you are, it's painfully obvious that you're past your prime days. Everyone else was smart enough to figure out that I was talking about this kind of meddling: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ExecutiveMeddling

I'd like you to knock off this patronizing style, I find it annoying and dumb.

The owner of the means of production is able to claim the right to surplus value because the owner is legally protected by the ruling regime through property rights and the legally established distribution of shares which are by law only to be distributed to company owners and their board members. [ Margaret Thather's Economics 101 brochure ? ]  -LOL- it's Marx, dude <good grief>.

*

OK, no sense of humor, no sense of camaraderie

go = = = = yourself

I said earlier in the thread,  if you do - that's fine by me.

xxp

Edited February 8, 2019 by pilgrim*
~

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

5 hours ago, Kirov (DayZ) said:

 

Sounds like you are or have been a team member? I wasn't aware of that.

Yeah, I can't say I can play only DayZ, but with 1800 hrs under my belt it sure quickly jumped to my personal second place (after Sid Meyer's Alpha Centauri, an entirely different cup of tea). I came to DayZ from the Fallout franchise (dating back to F1) and I rarely look back. But when we talk about the massive impact on the industry, it's hard not to mention the reputation of DayZ, e.g. how 1.0 press announcements in December sounded like somebody resurrected a freakin' mammoth. "2013, when was that". The way this whole situation looks, it's almost impossible to defend.

Since you sound like you're in the know - do you know if they still have that separate team from another game just for animal AI and hunting features? I read about it somewhere in 2015 and since then - can't find a word and obviously so many things are more pressing now. So was the whole idea scrapped or not?

When I say our doors, I mean my personal project. I don't work for BI, I just pay attention to what's going on. I'm definitely not in the know. Well, I guess it all depends on how you quantify being in the know I guess.

They definitely still have the Cabela team as the dev roster is in the 80's now as compared to the original team which was like ~15 or so (headcount the video below minus the one guy who leaves early)?

Look at the FRIDGE at 9:25. LET'S GO TEAM =P!

When BI bought Cauldron they got 25 devs on the DayZ team.

Sources:

https://www.pcgamer.com/dayz-developer-acquires-new-studio-to-work-on-standalone-version/

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-03-28-dayz-sales-figures-new-studio-acquisition-revealed

Quote

"They attempted outsourcing part of the project to a BI subsidiary in Thailand instead of hiring internally. Language barriers, lack of skills by the Thai development team, and the physical distance added to the overall dysfunction of the team."

-Chris Torchia

Black Element Software I think ended up in Thailand?

They bought Atlar Games, but that was before DayZ (look at their logo...you should recognize it from the Bar in-game) and the also bought Centauri Production but again before DayZ. Below are all BI subsidiary's that I know of. Then there is IDEA Games that BI is in. It's pretty confusing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altar_Games

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centauri_Production

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Element_Software

https://www.dayztv.com/pic/dayz-possibly-upcoming-dayz-items/

Quote

 

Question: Is there any team restructuring going on after the 1.0 release? Are DayZ developers going to be assigned to other teams at Bohemia?

Eugen Harton: No, we are keeping the same resources as we had this year for the year ahead. To be precise, it's 86 people working on DayZ right now.

 

Source: https://dayz.com/article/status-report/status-report-6-november-2018

I'm not sure how they count developers, if they're officially on the DayZ team (is there an official team at all?) or through one or several of their subsidiaries but I know for a fact as seen ^ they got 86 on right now. It does appear devs moonlight on the project from the subsidiaries though. Black Element is confirmed, Altar is kinda confirmed by their signs in-game and I think the Centauri might be in there too...I would have to check. 

Edited February 7, 2019 by Weyland Yutani (DayZ)
_

[pilgrim* 3514]

3 hours ago, Weyland Yutani (DayZ) said:

They definitely still have ...

" BI - Number of employees  346 (2018) " -  mainly technical staff. Info updated Dec 2018.
[original source quoted (2016) : https://games.tiscali.cz/oznameni/bohemia-interactive-spousti-incubator-nabizi-zdarma-prototypy-her-aby-otestovala-jejich-potencial-288199 ]

plenty links : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemia_Interactive#cite_note-2

Edited February 7, 2019 by pilgrim*

[Buakaw 274]

 "is it gonna be changed?" 😴 😴

yes, its very much work in progress. the whole "1.0" thing was just political if I am not mistaken.

Edited February 7, 2019 by Buakaw