Brainstorm a DAYZ TvT idea with me (originally BrianStorm)

[OrLoK 16182]

Hello there

 

Ive been thinking about an idea for a gamemode for DAYZ recently to give the game more purpose.

 

Help me flesh it out.

 

Here's the basic premise, but I have many other ideas etc.

 

2 player teams.

 

A. Player controlled Survivors

 

B. Player controlled Infected Masters

 

The infected Masters differ from the normal infected as hey are left with more intelligence than the regular "zed" plus the have the ability to  summon  over a distance other AI infected via a "howl"

 

They are less susceptible to damage than a normal player but are susceptible to being K.O.'d/limb damage but will also have some regenerative powers when  close to another Master. Think of Arma 2 resuscitation  etc.

 

As to a Survivor player goal, it will be to collect a set amount of supplies as well as getting a heli up and running. This means that although one may get a heli up  one will still need to collect a set number of items (say for example info on the infected/ exit flight codes from helicrashes to avoid being shot down by those keeping the island under quarantine).

 

Zombie goal will be to eliminate all survivors.

 

Survivors have a set number of lives depending on player numbers per "round" up to a maximum of the player slots available. So 1 player on a 32 player server gets 32 lives and 32 players would get 1 life until they are used up. First come first served.

 

Id like the Infected Masters to be able to detect recent player activity, possibly by some distance based glow on moved items/doors etc (but not on the players themselves) perhaps representing scent left by exploring Survivors.

 

This keeps the survivors moving to a degree as their "tracks" (not all but some) will be detectable. Also perhaps some psychic link tween the AI infected and the Masters when many AI are killed. A disturbance in the Infected "force" if you will.

 

The reasoning behind this idea is that game modes like wasteland etc are very popular and for those not satisfied with the sandboxyness of the game will have a direction to go  and a "point" to the game.

 

Im not imagining these rounds to be quick like KotH or Battle Royale but not as long as a normal DAYZ successful character either.

 

I know there are logic holes and flaws in this brief summation, lets think how to overcome them.

 

Thoughts? Ideas? 

 

Rgds

 

LoK

Edited January 8, 2016 by orlok

[WilliamTheConqueror 81]

I think this is an idea that while benifit from a smaller map han what we have at the moment.

Edited January 8, 2016 by WilliamTheConqueror

[blackberrygoo 1416]

If there were some type of Resident Evil flaire where everyone started in police stations and had to get off Chernarus before the whole continent got firebombed , I would totally play this game mode .... Maybe someone can make an "Arma 3 mission" for dayz sa that would be a totally different game mode as opposed to a linear misson , possibly with modding. Someone please make a Resident Evil Z!

[WilliamTheConqueror 81]

Also, an idea for you're lives system. How about a limited number of lives per team, instead of a limited amount per player. Say, there are 40 lives for 32 players, that number would go down, until less and less people are able to respawn. Basically, people have a chance the first time they die, as long as they die when there are still extra lives.

Alternatively, have an unlimited amount of respawns for a limited amount of time. After a timer goes down, the max amount of players possible goes down, and when people die, they are out, but when the new number has been reached, the remaining respawns again. This would have to be a fast timer, or just go down in large increments, to keep the difficulty.

[XibaRootS 40]

Let this for when mods comes out, we don't want to see "our" game development delayed anymore then it already has.

[Rags! 1966]

Brianstorm. 

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

-snip- Resident EvilZ! *fixed

 

I've thought about how you could mod DayZ to play like RE and I think it would be pretty simple actually.

 

All you need to do is set up invisible barriers that funnel you from town to town and create map checkpoints, kill total goals to activate checkpoints, and items acquisition goals to activate checkpoints.

 

Once you have a path around/through the map, you would mostly just need to add in the values for infected and items along the way.

 

Maybe you would spawn up north and work your way to a boat on the coast...

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

MrLok, I like your OP, it's definitely a good idea for a mission mode.

 

The infected AI coding alone seems like a lot to this laymen.

 

I do get the impression that modders are going to go wild with DayZ so I guess willing and talented coders should be available....

 

I agree with someone else when they said that the size of Chernarus is a bit much for this idea.

 

Otherwise, you may NEED to have some kind of waypoint marker over the player bubble when the "psychic connection" or "disturbance in the force" with AI infected was triggered.

 

Having scent markers just wouldn't be enough.

 

You could have the waypoint marker lead the master to within maybe 500-800 meters before the marker dissolves, so you would still have to search a decently large area before you found the survivors.

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

Brian Storm. 

 

Cousin of Byron Hix.

[OrLoK 16182]

Let this for when mods comes out, we don't want to see "our" game development delayed anymore then it already has.

Hello There

 

Dont be a negative Nancy. How is this going to delay development?

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[OrLoK 16182]

I think this is an idea that while benifit from a smaller map han what we have at the moment.

Hello there

 

NOPE! :) No problems only opportunities! Its always easy to find a problem but much more satisfying to come up with a solution!

 

A solution to large Map size this is letting the Infected Masters be able to track (not too closely) the movements of Survivors, so no matter how huge the map there's always some impetus to be on the move to a degree or if one has a "base" then not to perform certain actions which will attract Masters or signal their location.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[cash81 506]

This reminds me of Left For Dead 2 (never played 1 or 3 or anything). But in that you could play as survivor trying to get from point A to B. But your opponent is playing as zombie type creatures trying to eliminate you before you reach point B. You play rounds in different maps. Each round you try to get as far as possible as survivors then its you opponents turn and they try to do the same. Whoever gets furthest/lasts longest wins the round.

[boneboys 7988]

Drianstorm. 

Fixed...

[XibaRootS 40]

Hi,

 

Im not being negative, don't get me wrong. What i meant is... we've seen Hick's on preview interviews answering to people that was asking him if some features were going to be introduced and he said that they have to focus on their prioritys now and get all things that they already want and have planned to be done in due time or asap, and provide a stable experience to players on each new update that they bring to us. And from my point of view this idea that you suggested could delay development if they decide that is better to do it now before other more important things, like bug fixing or performance issues on both server and client side's these are just some examples, Im sure there's a lot more to be done in order for this game to achieve its max pottential. Im a great fan of dayz since i first played it on Arma 2 many years ago, and i have to be honest... sometimes i lost faith on this team of dev's, but then i take some break for 3 or more months and wait for more updates and everytime i come back i get my hope restored and then i recognize that they're doing their best and making the right decisions after all. (I just wish it was a faster process, but thats just the way it is and i accepted it by now.)

 

Also, they've always said that the great triumph of dayz is the fact that it is a game where you don't have a single purpose once you spawn, you can call surviving a purpose if you want but i think its just an instinct of human nature, what you decide to do in this game is up to you in the end. Creating something like what you suggested could twist the whole "franchise". Thats why i think things like that should be left for mod creators.

 

Again, im not being negative and you don't need to be so hostile at me. I think that your idea is good and could give a different experience to the people that want it,  personally i would try it yes. I just dont want to see "our" game taking two years more to have bases, cars, bikes and a solid sync along with solid frames everywhere in the map.

 

Sorry if the english was bad in anyway, not an expert.

 

:thumbsup:

[igor-vk 909]

I don't like the idea of master zombies. Maybe if there is just increasing numbers along with game time. Maybe other team should be different faction, cannibals or something else.

I really hate decision that there won't be AI in game. Maybe some kind of bounty hunters or quarantine teams could hurry players to get of the map.

[OrLoK 16182]

Hi,

 

Im not being negative, don't get me wrong. What i meant is... we've seen Hick's on preview interviews answering to people that was asking him if some features were going to be introduced and he said that they have to focus on their prioritys now and get all things that they already want and have planned to be done in due time or asap, and provide a stable experience to players on each new update that they bring to us. And from my point of view this idea that you suggested could delay development if they decide that is better to do it now before other more important things, like bug fixing or performance issues on both server and client side's these are just some examples, Im sure there's a lot more to be done in order for this game to achieve its max pottential. Im a great fan of dayz since i first played it on Arma 2 many years ago, and i have to be honest... sometimes i lost faith on this team of dev's, but then i take some break for 3 or more months and wait for more updates and everytime i come back i get my hope restored and then i recognize that they're doing their best and making the right decisions after all. (I just wish it was a faster process, but thats just the way it is and i accepted it by now.)

 

Also, they've always said that the great triumph of dayz is the fact that it is a game where you don't have a single purpose once you spawn, you can call surviving a purpose if you want but i think its just an instinct of human nature, what you decide to do in this game is up to you in the end. Creating something like what you suggested could twist the whole "franchise". Thats why i think things like that should be left for mod creators.

 

Again, im not being negative and you don't need to be so hostile at me. I think that your idea is good and could give a different experience to the people that want it,  personally i would try it yes. I just dont want to see "our" game taking two years more to have bases, cars, bikes and a solid sync along with solid frames everywhere in the map.

 

Sorry if the english was bad in anyway, not an expert.

 

:thumbsup:

Hello there

 

Honestly, Im not being hostile, I promise! Let's put it down to the language barrier.

 

But even if I came up with idea X or Y the devs are unlikely at this stage to alter their projected path. Business just doesn't work like that (on the whole).

 

But we cannot stop all art and ideas in case the dev's get sidetracked, it's simply unworkable! We'd have to lock the devs away 24/7/365 in a cupboard.

 

Hmmm, perhaps that's not a bad idea...

 

Really, dont worry about this thread delaying the devs.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[ColdAtrophy 1850]

Left4Dead: Chernarussian Edition will require a smaller map or some special zombie powers like the ability to sniff out survivors. Otherwise, I will hang out in Belaya Polana and troll the server by keeping myself out of harm's way and not following the goals of the gamemode. Three days later, when a single zombie finally finds me, I will shoot it and then move to Black Lake. See what I'm getting at here?

 

Also, I have to point out that if the goal here is to make the survivors work together, that's not going to happen. The survivors will kill each other. Guaranteed. It even happens in games like Halo where some idiot will get annoyed that you picked up the sniper rifle and kill you to get it. That principle applies to the power of 1000 for this game. 

Edited January 8, 2016 by ColdAtrophy

[Espa 711]

I'd rather like the Master Infected to also be implemented in the real game as well. A chance when attacked by Infected to receive the Infection (Already in game files) - But if they die with that disease, there screen goes red instead of black with a message *RAAAAAAGH!*

 

I think it would deeply enhance the game to have certain players playing this role in the sandbox version, albeit there would be no timer or goal other than the natural game mode *Survive*. However, this would create a 'Juggernaut' enemy that could bring players together in wishes to hunt it down, or simply to survive it.

 

Also, the Infected Master would give the Infection on a much higher percentage when striking players.

 

Perhaps limit the Masters to about 5-10 maximum on a server.

[q.S Sachiel 470]

Hello there

 

NOPE! :) No problems only opportunities! Its always easy to find a problem but much more satisfying to come up with a solution!

 

A solution to large Map size this is letting the Infected Masters be able to track (not too closely) the movements of Survivors, so no matter how huge the map there's always some impetus to be on the move to a degree or if one has a "base" then not to perform certain actions which will attract Masters or signal their location.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

The immediate issue that came to mind with a smaller map was 'why have lives then'?  If it's something like being forced to barriacade in an industrial complex or something, once the zombies get in or the master messes you up (presumably inside) then you're just going to get farmed until your lives run out.

 

Lol @ Master Infected in real game though...  That would be quite the experience, having some GoT white walker moving about, throwing wave upon wave of zombies at Berezino.

 

Are you planning on having it almost like an RPG/RPGFPS for the master (and maybe the Humans) kind of like 'perks' or special skills?  For humans, a direct example of what i mean would be KF/TF2, with different loadouts, special abilities and strongpoints.  For the zombie master, perhaps some special abilities (other than howl) like 'Dying Light' or 'Savage'.  Devour your zombie underlings for a little bit more HP but you are immobile for a period of time, and also become more obvious/identifyable as the Master, assuming you're not distinguishing them on player model for a more insidious and stealth style behaviour.

 

As far as 'detecting' players go, i'd like to see something a little more abstract.  Like a feint glow perhaps, or feint strobe, that becomes more intense as the evidence becomes more intense.  So, not that you trace footprints or 'stink lines', but that sound and smell are portrayed somehow but in a 'soft' and indirect method.  More work yes, but i never did like following breadcrumbs of the witcher and such.  Zombie lore is that they're generally quite blind, but their hearing and then scent are very important senses.

 

I'm at a loss to think of immediate 'victory conditions' or goals though.  Obviously the master is there to exterminate or 'conscript' the humans (ala 'Infection' mode in AVP2) but what else?  Does the zombie acchieve victory when it has amassed an army of a given value?  When it controls a region for so long, counting down 'tickets' representing non-interactable civilian population that it and it's minions are slaughtering as they hold the point(s), similar to CQ in BF?  The latter suggestion could also provide a 'swing' scenario, where it's not directly the Humans who are being hunted, but perhaps fighting for control,protection/consumption of a township.

 

The humans?  Are they aiming to escape like L4D?  Do they need to exterminate all the zombies, or kill the Master, like some kind of Vampire movie - he is the key to the infection? Does killing a 'Leftenant' distribute power/control to the others, who then become stronger or have new skills unlocked, signalling one's death, but also benefiting zombies directly?  That a 'zombie officer' killing is not a direct advantage in terms of winning the fight...  Must the humans uncover a vaccine by going house to house accumulating equipment, break into key locations and interact with a vaccine synthesizer or schematic similar to I am Legend?  There are multiple opportunities for either one-sided goals, or assymetric victory conditions. 

 

Even then, you could prolong the game even further perhaps, that once victory conditions have been 'met' and one team has 'won' then an epilogue round begins (continuous from the same game).  Humans must escape, now that they have lost, the countryside devoured and the populace turned; or the Master must find a crypt to hide in, or infect a high-value-target NPC of some kind so as to pass on the king-strain, so as to either force a draw, or for 'bragging points'.

 

I will agree though, that perhaps the mode would benefit from being slightly smaller than the entirety of Chernarus +.  I think you could get away with it quite well at 1/4 the map size, depending on how many players you want.  If it is something like 100players total, that issue may just disappear i suppose.

 

 

Also, what's the Goss?  Are you planning on working on something Lok?  Comissioning a work of art?  Hinting at something in the pipes, or just having a bit of imaginative fun?

 

 

 

We'd have to lock the devs away 24/7/365 in a cupboard.

 

Hmmm, perhaps that's not a bad idea...

Edited January 8, 2016 by q.S Sachiel

[emuthreat 2837]

I would love to see a game mode focus on containment of the outbreak, crowd-control, and evacuation of VIPs.  Perhaps instead of having to get a helicopter running and stocked with supplies, the survivor team should have the goal of extracting VIP NPCs.  This means having to get the helicopter running, set up a safety perimeter, organize rescue missions, ferry back survivors, keep them safe and out of trouble, all while defending the helicopter and survivors from the infected.

 

I'll link to my previous post on this subject.  Thanks for the beans.

 

I also like Biohaze's suggestion of spawning survivors inland, and having it be a race to the coast to evacuate.

 

edit: State of Decay did many things right, regarding gameplay elements.  Lifeline and Breakdown both seem like good things to try and replicate with DayZ.  If they had a multiplayer mode in SoD, there is a good chance that I would not have tried DayZ yet.

Edited January 9, 2016 by emuthreat

[OrLoK 16182]

Left4Dead: Chernarussian Edition will require a smaller map or some special zombie powers like the ability to sniff out survivors. Otherwise, I will hang out in Belaya Polana and troll the server by keeping myself out of harm's way and not following the goals of the gamemode. Three days later, when a single zombie finally finds me, I will shoot it and then move to Black Lake. See what I'm getting at here?

 

Also, I have to point out that if the goal here is to make the survivors work together, that's not going to happen. The survivors will kill each other. Guaranteed. It even happens in games like Halo where some idiot will get annoyed that you picked up the sniper rifle and kill you to get it. That principle applies to the power of 1000 for this game. 

Hello there

 

There are very simple ways to avoid most team kills, its a low priority issue IMHO. As to trolls, well there's always going to be a way to be a dick if one wants to be but thats not an issue im concerned about at this stage.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[ColdAtrophy 1850]

Hello there

 

There are very simple ways to avoid most team kills, its a low priority issue IMHO. As to trolls, well there's always going to be a way to be a dick if one wants to be but thats not an issue im concerned about at this stage.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

 

If you don't design for such an obvious flaw from the ground up, the game mode will fail. No offense.

 

Also, even if outright team kills are disallowed, there are innumerable ways to be a dick to other players in a sandbox like this. I can't think of a single coop experience that isn't plagued by a small, but potent minority of griefing players and those are in games that don't have 225 square kilometers of map and mechanics to go apeshit with.

Edited January 9, 2016 by ColdAtrophy

[OrLoK 16182]

If you don't design for such an obvious flaw from the ground up, the game mode will fail. No offense.

 

Also, even if outright team kills are disallowed, there are innumerable ways to be a dick to other players in a sandbox like this. I can't think of a single coop experience that isn't plagued by a small, but potent minority of griefing players and those are in games that don't have 225 square kilometers of map and mechanics to go apeshit with.

Hello there

 

As I said this isnt an issue as of yet. No problems only opportunities.

 

L

[Espa 711]

I actually think the ability to Team-Kill is rather realistic. It's an unfortunate occurrence, but if we put friendly fire on in a game mode, it would only serve to make the game feel cartoony (To me, at least)

 

As for more thoughts on the TvT Game Mode - Or simply uploading the Infected Masters to the base game - I'm very hopeful that this could be done well with a humongous amount of possibilities.

 

Infected Ideas:

 

First of all, I imagine that the Infected Masters would have a unique character model (Or a few - Guy/Gal) - or simply be an addition to a player model. Perhaps they're. . purplely grey? 

 

Second of all, to truly make these baddies a true scare - allow them to have twice the amount of stamina as normal players, allow their movement speed to be something like 50% faster, and of course increase their durability to around 3X the amount of a normal players. -Also their melee attack ought to be pretty devastating, around the damage of a small firearm.

-These guys ought to be a sight that you see and go, "OH SHIT!" - And attempt to hide, run away, or go guns blazing.

 

Third of all, allow the Infected Masters to continue to respawn without any set number of lives. - This could be transmitted to dead survivors so that their next life would be a Infected Master rather than a Survivor - But this would also provide the Infected Masters' death to return to a fresh Survivor (Albeit eating up a set Survivor life-line)

 

Fourth of all, in a population of 50 players, allow there to be 5-10 Infected Masters at any given time. (Or 10/20% of current population)

 

Survivor Ideas:

 

-Allow the player to start at one of the most northern towns.

 

-Give the player slightly enhanced inventory than the base game - Such as a flashlight, knife, rags, battery, upgraded radio (So players can communicate), and small backpack.

 

Game Goals!

 

Survivor Win: The players have marched down to Cherno and have fixed the radio beacons at the top of the school, industry, and police station - and have called the U.N. Relief Boat to the dock.

OR have fixed up the cargo plane at the Berezino Airfield and taken off.

 

Infected Win: The Infected have overrun the Survivors! All Life-Lines have been murdered. (Probably set at 100 to allow a 50 population server a technical 2 lives for each survivor.) OR have held off the Survivors from fixing the Radio Beacons for 3 hours, causing the U.N. Relief Boat to pass.

 

 

---

 

Of course, I still believe that these guys could be placed into the base game without the Game Goals at all. Simply an addition to fear - and an incredibly dangerous player-controlled monster.

 

Criticism?

Edited January 10, 2016 by Espa