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Are you serious? I didn't know this for sure. That is absolutely ridiculous. Like I said in my previous post on this topic, server hopping is not an issue for me, combat logging is. But I also dislike the way that the vanilla DayZ mod handles combat logging. I like the way Epoch does it. Anytime you want to abort, you get a 10 second timer, unless you are actually in combat (or in a safe zone or something). It works really well and is way better than the vanilla mod, like I said. The standalone really needs to get something like this and they should just get rid of the stupid 99 second timer once and for all. Server hopping is no big deal. Ghosting might be an issue for some people, but I think we can all agree that combat logging is the bigger issue.

Ghosting wasnt really a huve problem until they decided to remove log-in sounds. Why they did that im not too sure.

As of right now in dayz sa current state, I vote no for safe zones. I think the devs are working on base building, were a large say for example a "Hero" clan could set up decent base if they worked to together to hold off hostiles to help "Bambis" or survivors/ With that said this will have to be revisited in later builds. The reason I say this is we currently have no idea what the zombie situation will look like until will really play with the build and know what the final product to look like. So really I will have to see it for my self the decide So I have changed to lets wait and see, then decide if they are needed. One thing I have learned from this thread and playing dayz for 100s of hours is the fact we need to address the "Ghosting" issue one way or the other, in order for bases to even mean anything. Currently pn a high pop currently a base would last as long as player could hold it, then there own team mates would start dieing. Then enemy clans could simply spawn in one there location when they are weak and destroy or take over the base. This needs to be looked into.

OOOOK im going to correct this right now as a lot of this is misleading. DayZ is like you describe it a survival game where your objective is to survive. When people die most of the time that is because they took a risk. There are many risks in the game. Most people who die constantly are the people who just got the game and go into the world thinking they can be careful in a city or airfield and get away unscathed. As a veteran I can play DayZ and survive for days at a time. Dayz also has the biggest learning curve of any other game. It takes a huge amount of time to be as good as the other players who have been with the game longer. People who also come into the game also need to know that DayZ and Arma have a fiercely dedicated fan base, whom have played countless hours and have been here since the mod and know what they're doing really well. As for the people who have the well I'm gonna die anyways mindset, that is how you ruin the game for yourself. When you die a lot of the time you died deciding to take a risk. This game is fiercely pvp and people don't take chances. So running into Berezino or an airfield thinking that people won't be there is how you die. I always keep in mind that chances are Berezino is filled with people, NE Airfield will have someone looting it, and that all the snipers will be set up all around these hot spots. I still die but I die and keep going. As for why People server hop you are completely wrong in explaining that. When people server hopped in the mod, they did do that to get geared fast and it was annoying. But to understand server hopping you have to understand how loot spawning works. When you go to an area on the mod; say the NE airfield and loot the whole place, after you leave loot respawns after a while and if another play comes to that location say 10-15 minutes later (maybe less) loot will respawns. This balances the game. Now the reason everyone server hops on standalone is because if the fact they haven't implemented a loot respawn system yet. Meaning if you come back later the same loot you didn't pick up or dropped will still be there. The only way loot respawns in SA is if the server restarts which most servers to help this issue have shortened restarts to 30 minutes to an hour or two. This is why many people server hop. So they can pick up gear without walking across Chernarus. Hopping is still a bad thing, but people have a reason for doing it. As for you blaming the hive and the game for ghosting and hopping that is really ignorant. Every time you open DayZ a message comes up telling you it is early access. This means your playing on a game that is being developed. They're making the game while your playing it. As it very clear to everyone it's not complete. This means servers, game play, the map, bugs everywhere, and more. The hive is a very basic system at the moment and even when it is done it doesn't need anything to punish players for server hopping and ghosting. Because when devs trying do stuff like that, the innocent players ALWAYS get caught in the middle. This sounds very confusing and it is. But these are facts. And all my statements are backed up with 300+ hours on dayz mod and standalone combined. Side note: sorry for the long essay, with all the grammar errors as there is always a grammar nazi on the forums. I wrote this at 4 on the morning and on a phone. That means small keyboard and auto correct

I like how you wrote this post, stating facts instead of bitching about it. But I do think there was one thing you didn't think about when you wrote this: the fact that it is early access and they're working on it. Yes ghosting and server hopping is really annoying but security placements will be placed to help stop it. As for Killing on Sight. The community started that and it has been there since the birth of the mod. Although it has gotten worse in SA, but that is due to the fact bandits have gone from traditional KOS bad guy to holding people up, yelling friendly and then turning on the player, and "torture". People don't trust people especially when in a high risk zone (Airfields and Cities) because they've worked so hard for their gear. Even fresh spawns run up to geared players and knock them out and take their gear and then killing them. That's been DayZ for a while ever since it went mainstream. And for everyone who complains that Early Access is not an excuse for all the problems, DayZ was released for public early access play as soon as it was actually functional to play in. They are building the game basically in front of your eyes. When making the game, the developers and Dean in particular don't look at what the players are currently complaining about like ghosting and server hopping. They're looking at the game as a whole. If they didn't do that then DayZ would never be done or would crumble. So everyone needs to keep this in mind when playing DayZ. That this game is being built right in front of you and they're more worried about the game as a whole rather than certain problems. I think we're lucky to being playing it as early as we got to. They took a huge risk doing that.

But that's what clans are for, they each have there own rules which is player created and that they as a group decide to live by. It is not shoved down our throats by a game mechanic. That's how I want it to stay. I complete game play freedom. For the same reason I don't want a safe zone as a game mechanic. Just give us players tools what we need for base building and baracading and they can be responsible for there bases. I'm sorry but I really don't understand the concept of no zombie spawn areas. Really they only spawn in what once was populated areas......Right? So you could set up an area outside of town in the forest or something. ...or even inside a tech building or apartment above zombie agro. But I really think the thing that sets DayZ apart from other games, is the fact that there is no score cards or vary vary limited rules if any and its the players that make DayZ what it is. I hope it it dosn't lose that. I 100% agree with both of you ghosting is highly exploited in DayZ and there should be anti ghosting in place. That is one concern we can all agree on. Maybe later servers could have more settings other then hard core are regular. Were the person hosting could set how many zombies spawn, and different levels on different things. Not everyone likes to play the same way.

Ghosting is something that is an issue so agreed on that. They should fix or combat it more........What is a zombie no spawn area? You want no zombies move a away from populated areas, so it already exists....Not sure what you meant by that. Its an a game about apocalypes DayZ should be dangerous every where, if you want safety get a group and hold down an area. There's no ethics mechanics in game. So really you survive one encounter at a time, one moment at a time and every one you deal with is different. Otherwise you just end up being one of those "Heros" who is all on his high horse, yet shots anyone he thinks is a bandit (which much of the time he dosn't even really know for sure) and then gets killed by the vary people hes trying to help LOL Same thing with ass hat bandits too preying on new spawns and new players, because its easy. Its a hypocracy and it limits the game. These terms are just spill off from the MOD were players really did get labels and a score card. But in the SA it doesn't exist. So I don't categorize random people I don't know and really cant tell other then what actions I see. If they decide to put it in the game then I will. Unless they clearly are in a clan that makes it really clear what they do. Edited

There's a problem with your logic here -- if I build a whole city that's fenced in, the only way for zombies and players to 'get in' is to come through the fence, right? Wrong. Players can ghost in from other servers, and zombies can spawn wherever they please (based on the game devs). I would be OK with safe zones being player created -- but the mechanics aren't there and from everything I've heard they aren't even planned. There are two major ideas that would need to be implemented 1) anti ghosting and 2) zombie no-spawn areas. Personally, I would also want these areas to generate NPCs based on the size and number of buildings... but I already talked about that somewhere in this thread. As for labelling people heroes and bandits... well bro, if you rob people for supplies, you're a bandit, plain and simple (whether you murder them or not). If you try to protect people by taking out bandits, you're coined a hero. If you try to avoid all those crazy people in general, we call you a survivor... and if you kill people just for the fun of it, I will call you a psychopath. You might not like labels, but they have roots. You can start calling a car a jellarophantoluge all you want... but it's still a car to everyone else.

Weeeeeeeeeellllllll, that could be because the game defines itself as, and I quote, "Welcome to the world of DayZ- a gritty, authentic, open-world survival horror hybrid-MMO game, in which players follow a single goal: to survive in the harsh post-apocalyptic landscape as long as they can." There are games where you can get to respawn literally hundreds of times a night. One wonders if those might better fit your idea of success. ;) PVP is a portion of DayZ, it isn't the all inclusive point. ;) I have NO problem being shot, it's part of the game. But when players play the game with the minset that they are going to die in 10 minutes anyway so they might as well charge around punching people from the start it loses some of it's "sandbox" nature. Nope! Incorrect!. Even in the mod people would hop servers to find loot. Here is why. When you loot an are you pick up everything good and leave the trash. You circle around and come back after a respawn, most of the time the trash is still there so only the places that spawned good things the first time around could spawn something new. Until everyone clears out of the area for a significant amount of time or someone moves the trash nothing good will spawn in that area. So people hop to another server and clear that out until only trash is filling the loot spawn spots then move on again. The HIVE is to blame for this and ghosting. If they would come up with a better hive system or one that doesn't reward you for changing servers, that would resolve the issue. I'll just drop this here again: "DAYZ is a gritty, authentic, open-world survival horror hybrid-MMO game, in which players follow a single goal: to survive in the harsh post-apocalyptic landscape as long as they can."

First off, good post! You have my beans. Now.... I totally disagree with your definition of 'succeed'. You seem to define success based on not dying in game. I, on the other hand, define success quite differently. I consider it a success if I can log in and engage in player versus player interaction. I might die, you might die, we both may die, it's all the same to me. In my opinion, not dying for several days or more is a failure and a ruined experience. Success, to me, is participating in combat (or friendly negotiations) of some kind. Running around for months, not seeing anyone, not dying, and just looting is a ruined experience. Success is getting to respawn at least three times in one sitting. See, what I don't understand is why people get so upset at getting shot. You bought into a game that provides a huge sandbox, other people, and weapons. Dying is what you are supposed to do! You really have nothing to lose! Gear is totally trivial. You can acquire everything you need within an hour or two to maximize the game's intentions: player versus player combat. While I respect your opinion, I wholeheartedly disagree. Let's move on to your points: Ghosting: Nobody is for ghosting. Telling the devs to fix ghosting is just preaching to the choir. Devs know what it is and do not encourage or try to make it advantageous. I believe avoiding being "ghosted" only requires a change in your decision making. You should prepare yourself better. Pick a server wisely. Decide where you log out. Accept the mechanics. Server Hopping: Server hopping seems to be a result of the game not being finished. I believe that once item respawns happen this 'problem' will diminish significantly. Additionally, I'm not bothered by it. People who server hop usually have better gear when I loot them. Rampant KOSing: I have over 600 hours logged and I don't perceive a problem with KOSing at all. It should be expected. Again, you're playing a sandbox mmo that provides you with a playground and weapons. If you don't expect to die then you're playing the wrong game. I joyfully respect your opinion and empathize with you that you're not having the fun you hoped for. TLDR: "success" isn't necessarily not dying, rather, enjoying the combat that the game provides.

Well, to really fulfil the term "ghosting", the opposing player needs to be aware of you and your position. That is exactly what i try to avoid. I am actively looking for players, but i dont make contact. I stalk them. Just looking, i have no interest in killing anyone. As loot is spawned right now, i have no problems with food and water anyway. If that player gets attacked i might help him ( I wanted to roleplay a medic, but paranoya made me hiding :) ) Guns and Ammo should be much more rare tho. The ability to shoot anything without consequences on survival is what forces PVP in a game with a still underdeveloped AI-environment. When it comes to cheating / exploiting etc i have a really strict point of view. Caught cheaters / hackers should be banned with their steam accounts. Theres no bigger crime in online gaming than cheating and thus ruining the game for everyone else playing it. If you cheat, you're shit, go buy all your games again if you wanna try again.

That's a cool way to play. Unfortunately, as things stand now, when and if you ever decide to go to an objective to gather supplies the tactics you employ in doing so are rendered meaningless by ghosting and server hopping. At best, it comes down to dumb luck whether or not someone spawns right on top of you and kills you without warning. At worst, someone will actively exploit the spawn mechanic to ghost into a room you just cleared and kill you without warning. In my opinion, because of these abused game mechanics there just isn't enough risk involved in getting into a gunfight. Where there should be tense player interaction there is instead "poof (an enemy appears) and you're dead". All in all, I just want to feel like my actions and tactics matter and aren't rendered almost completely meaningless by the spawning mechanics.

I understand that KOS is a valid game tactic and I'm not suggesting bandits be eliminated or removed from the game. What I would like to see is for being a bandit to require some measure of risk vs. reward. As it stands now, being a bandit is the only viable choice for long term survival due to the high occurrence of ghosting and server hopping.

The OP actually boils down to something i have to fully agree to: Mechanics against abusive playstyles ( if you want to call hopping and ghosting a playstyle at all ) need to be a high priority on the roadmap. While it's true that every player can play DayZ SA the way he wants, it is counter-productive not to do something about those people who use the game in a way that only means to destroy other players gaming experience. A group of 3 hoppers / ghosters can spoil the fun for many people who just leave for other games eventually if noone takes care about lame gaming. I've experienced this in the late days of my favourite Unreal Tournament mod ( which was in late 2012, so the game did it for 13 years ) - in the end, only the lamers were around because they could win through their exploiting of the game's mechanics. Skilled players simply left and found other games bcs they were tired that laming can beat skill in such an easy manner. At the moment the lamers outnumbered the serious players, it was like "either you lame too, or you'll loose". TL;DR: Dear dev's: Before you add vehicles, tents, a lapdance-scrollwheel-option for female characters, at least give us a sign that abusive gameplay is something you are aware of and put it as high on your list as you deem necessary.

Actually, while you're not 100% incorrect, the term Ghosting refers to a player who sees another player then logs out of that server, hops into another server, moves to a more advantageous location to kill said player, then logs back into the original server to commit said act. What you've described here is just the intended spawn mechanic. I do not see this changing, so if you keep spawning in front of others and getting killed, you might want to try logging out in less populated/high traffic areas.

I agree with most of your points. Server Hopping and Ghosting have been the cause of all but one of my deaths to date and it does feel cheap. I actually watched a guy log in and out twice at the big inland airfield control tower. (The things you can see when you just sit and watch with bino's for ages.)

As a new player who has about 50 hours of playtime in the game, I'd like to summarize three of the main issues that completely ruin this otherwise enjoyable game. DayZ purports itself to be a brutally realistic survival horror game that requires its players to employ cautious tactics and intelligent strategy to succeed in the game. Unfortunately, there are a few problems inherent to the game's design that prevent the game from achieving what it wants to be: Ghosting, Server Hopping and rampant kill-on-sight player killing. Each of these issues is a serious problem on its own, but all three problems in combination make the game broken beyond enjoyment. For those unfamiliar with the terms, Ghosting is what happens when a player joins a server and spawns back into the location they were in when they left the server the last time they played. While this persistent location feature is a great for exploring the vast and richly detailed map, it also causes some significant problems since players joining a server can spawn in close proximity to other players already on the server. Server hopping is the act of joining a server, looting everything in an area, then leaving the server to join another server and immediately loot the same location all over again. After playing DayZ for about 50 hours or so I have come to the conclusion that my tactics and strategies are irrelevant in the game. I can be as smart and cautious as possible and it doesn't mean anything. I can carefully approach an objective moving slowly from cover to cover to avoid being seen and use binoculars to scout the area out for several minutes carefully checking for bandits and snipers before moving into the area and carefully clear every room of a building before opening my inventory and managing my loot. However, at any time a player can spawn behind me in a room with no other entrances that I just cleared without any warning and kill me on sight and take all my loot. In a game where enemy players can appear out of nowhere at anytime nothing I do really matters and its all just a matter of dumb luck. There are some things the game designers could do to mitigate theses problems and make the game more enjoyable. 1. Make it so that a newly spawned player cannot kill other players or be killed by other players for about ten minutes. This helps alleviate the ghosting issues. 2. Give every item a timer that starts to count down from about twenty minutes as soon as you pick it up. Whenever you spawn on a new server, automatically remove all items in the inventory with a timer that hasn't counted down to zero. This would help alleviate server hopping. 3. Mitigate the rampant kill on sight player killing by making combat more realistic and riskier. Right now, there is little or no player interaction in the game. Typically, one player will happen on another player and kill them before that player even knows another player is present. Because of the way server lag works, a player can queue up so much damage that by the time the targeted player receives the first hit they are already dead before they can even react. I would rather see the player v player combat system continue to be lethal, but also far more risky for both parties. In real life, a person can suffer multiple mortal wounds yet continue fighting until their body completely shuts down due to loss of blood or oxygen. Weapons in DayZ should cause more bleeding and energy damage and less health damage. Taking a gunshot in the game should still be quite lethal, but less instantly so. Just as in real life, players would be more cautious of engaging in KOS behavior if they ran the risk of themselves being seriously wounded by a player that they have mortally wounded. In conclusion, I hold out hope that the designers can address the above listed problems and greatly improve the DayZ game experience so that the game can actually become what it sets out to be: A realistically brutal post-apocalyptic survival game that requires players to use cautious tactics and intelligent strategies in order to succeed.

Private hives would instantly solve ghosting and server hopping IMO... but apparently there are an overwhelming number of people who don't like this idea.

Absolutely the most bull I have ever seen in a server. The admins abuse their powers and ban people for no reason. Did not play for a month or two and go to play again and get a message saying ive been banned for server rules. So in order to try to straighten things out I get on teamspeak to talk to them. This is the team speak log: <20:44:59> Trying to resolve hostname Talonite.Typefrag.com <20:44:59> Trying to connect to server on Talonite.Typefrag.com:9785<20:45:00> Welcome to the TypeFrag.com network.<20:45:00> Welcome to Smoking Ash Gaming! DayZ Server IP 162.248.89.229:2302 Respect others, no excessive cursing, NO GHOSTING Warthog, Phantum Ranger, and Mjolnir are Teamspeak Admins. Have fun!<20:45:00> Connected to Server: "Smoking Ash Gaming"<20:45:00> The icon for channel "DayZ" (1789) was not found.<20:45:01> The icon for server group "Guest" was not found.<20:45:01> The icon for server group "Elevated Admin" was not found.<20:45:01> The icon for server group "Pothead" was not found.<20:45:01> The icon for server group "Marine" was not found.<20:45:14> You poked "[sA] PHANTUM RANGER" with message: confusion<20:45:15> "snipes" switched from channel "Lobby (Poke admin for help)" to "Overpoch Bravo"<20:45:15> Channel group "Guest" was assigned to "snipes" by "Smoking Ash Gaming".<20:48:22> You switched from channel "Lobby (Poke admin for help)" to "Overpoch Alpha"<20:48:22> Channel group "Guest" was assigned to "XimmortalkillaX" by "Smoking Ash Gaming".<20:49:32> You were banned permanently from the server by "[sA] PHANTUM RANGER" (JERK)<20:49:32> Disconnected from server

Vanguard, I know tools to monitor this aren't really available to provide much detail, but you had a hacker on your server last night; ghosting, teleporting the works. Real shame but it's still happening. I think a few people may have video evidence but I'm not sure at this stage. Will keep you posted. Cheers

So, if my favorite server goes down for maintenance, I have to start over on another server? Let me help you search for this: search ghosting

This would indeed prevent ghosting, but it would also make it a giant hassle for friends to play on the same server, since they need to log out more then 100m away from each other. Tbh its a bad idea, which comes with far more downsides then upsides.

I like the idea with the safe zone around players. It makes playing with friends a little bit more complicated as you have to regroup even if you logged out together but thats actually a good thing overall. The radius prevents both intentional and accidental logging in next to an "enemy" as well as instant reinforcements for a group that is camping inside a buildung. For flanking, repositioning etc. its would be enough to also add a significant server switch time (right now its 100 seconds which is way too short) but there is no reason to add this for simple spawning. Still this short timer plus your body staying there for another 30s made ghosting much riskier and probably reduced the number of serverA->serverB->serverA ghosters but it doesn't do much against serverB->serverA ghosting reinforcements.

That would mean clan members cannot log off and log in at the same time/place anymore. So I don't think many will like this. Besides that, 100m is to less to be effective for flanking measures and will only help for ghosting in buildings. The timer of 250 seconds (or something like that) is more than enough I think? I haven't seen anyone ghosting me as far as I know.

Well, just think about it. Server Restarts and you were in the middle of Electro or some other high value place. You thought you were alone and try logging in. You can't so you know there's someone nearby, so when you finally can log in you start looking for whoever it was. That in and of itself would be a form of ghosting wouldn't it? *EDIT* or even if you were with your friends and one of them crashes, now the party has to run 100m away and not get lost so their friend can join back in.