Ammo Calibration : Poll & Discussion

[kichilron 8550]

Yup. This just shows along with many of the other gameplay decisions that standalone is not like the mod.

Casual unrealistic console garbage.

 

 

You seem to hate the SA a lot. Where is this coming from? You should know that it's not finished yet and should give it a bit more time. Anything else would be unfair, considering you have been warned it is an Alpha.

[ImageCtrl 719]

"Those of us who are real gun nuts would revolt (but I have a feeling the wider community dosn't give a crap as long as it looks cool" - Chris Torchia.

 

:emptycan: :emptycan: :emptycan:

[rickyspanish 158]

You seem to hate the SA a lot. Where is this coming from? You should know that it's not finished yet and should give it a bit more time. Anything else would be unfair, considering you have been warned it is an Alpha.

 

Well as somebody who loves the Standalone and has put a lot of time into it, I would be very sad and disappointed to see it go the complete opposite way I want it to go. Can we not discuss our opinions on the direction the game is heading without being warned its an alpha? We know its an alpha and we are not complaining about the state the game is in but the future and direction it is heading. 

 

Sure the game will change a lot but I'm personally unsure whether they are going for realistic shooting mechanics or dodgy this butt stock does +10 accuracy rubbish, and haven't had any feedback whether they plan to change this or stick with it.

 

What's the point in needing specific magazine types if we can put NATO 5.56 calibre round in a AK74 magazine and fire them just fine, could I do this in a real life situation? Hell No. (Love the magazine system btw I'm not hating on it, but why go all out on one thing and theN half ass the next).

Edited May 30, 2014 by Ricky Spanish

[gibonez 3633]

You seem to hate the SA a lot. Where is this coming from? You should know that it's not finished yet and should give it a bit more time. Anything else would be unfair, considering you have been warned it is an Alpha.

Dont hate dayz heck I have been playing it since the first week the mod was out.

It is just that a lot of the old fans fears are coming true. With widespread success dayz is seeing mainstreaming and streamlining and Imo I feel the game is going to become a turd because of it.

[nikom7 19]

If the devs are so lazy about the ammunition types, why didn't they let the AKM fire 7.62x51s? Btw I've seen on the Wiki that the 7.62x54R is confirmed

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Yup. This just shows along with many of the other gameplay decisions that standalone is not like the mod.

Casual unrealistic console garbage.

Yep, so now even the lack of them adding one specific thing is making the SA 'Casual, unrealistic, console garbage'. I guess the game has to be exactly like Gibonez' wants it to, or the SA will be the worst thing that exists, at all.

 

Their decision not to include a specific caliber isn't unrealistic, as they are not making any mistakes by refusing to add it. Making an AK-74 fire 5.56x45mm is unrealistic, but that hasn't actually happened. Also, where did 'console' come from? The only major difference between PC-based games and console-based games is that PC-games tend to be played with a keyboard whereas console games are played with a controller/gamepad. Even then, not all consoles have to technically be played using controllers/gamepads and there are plenty of controllers & gamepads for PCs. The fact that one is (mainly) dedicated towards video games whilst the other is intended for a variety of uses has no actual effect on the kind of game and amount of realism or design decisions made for said game (save for hardware, but that's a different issue entirely)

Edited May 30, 2014 by Chaingunfighter

[Katana67 2907]

Well as somebody who loves the Standalone and has put a lot of time into it, I would be very sad and disappointed to see it go the complete opposite way I want it to go. Can we not discuss our opinions on the direction the game is heading without being warned its an alpha? We know its an alpha and we are not complaining about the state the game is in but the future and direction it is heading. 

 

One inclusion does not equal a trend, or a "direction."

 

Think of all the nuanced things they've added, and things that they have yet to add, which are/will be far more complex than the mod. Just look at the fireplaces, as an example. Not everything is getting "streamlined", to the contrary, there are things which are being made more complex.

 

Either way, spewing out bile about how the game is now "consoley" or "arcadey" is not the way to express disagreement. Especially when those terms are meaningless.

Edited May 30, 2014 by Katana67

[The Aquatic Land Walrus 565]

I know right?? and I am old enough to have contributed many many many quarters to assist in the effort to make gaming mainstream.... how real was pong? man that shit was crazy real.

God, I miss the era.

[PhillyT 554]

Guys, come on, think of all the money the free mod brought in!  Guys like Gibonez are not only ballistic experts, they are business geniuses who understand the complicated dance that is game development in a niche category.

[The Aquatic Land Walrus 565]

Thats not a "good scenario". You are implying that there is a round similar to .22 that is "2 nanometers too big". There is no such round. You are also implying I want several thousand ammo types that are not usable. This is not the argument.

#Lrn2sarcasm!

Jesus. Are metaphors illegal here?

[rickyspanish 158]

One inclusion does not equal a trend, or a "direction."

 

Think of all the nuanced things they've added, and things that they have yet to add, which are/will be far more complex than the mod. Just look at the fireplaces, as an example. Not everything is getting "streamlined", to the contrary, there are things which are being made more complex.

 

Either way, spewing out bile about how the game is now "consoley" or "arcadey" is not the way to express disagreement. Especially when those terms are meaningless.

 

I never used those words dude I love the SA don't get me wrong. I'm just worried that the changes they have made to shooting mechanics in general aren't going to be fixed or become worse because the majority of players either don't care or prefer a more casual, easier to understand system. One inclusion? Everything about the shooting mechanics and weapon attachment system I hate right now to the point of going back to the mod. Combat in this game is an important feature and compared to the mod is really bad in so many ways, and now I hear they have decided to take short cuts on ammo types because you know, who really cares.

 

I understand everything in this department can change for the best and I hope it does. Until then I will voice my opinions on it. 

[taco86 156]

Well this is extremely disappointing....

[Katana67 2907]

I never used those words dude I love the SA don't get me wrong. I'm just worried that the changes they have made to shooting mechanics in general aren't going to be fixed or become worse because the majority of players either don't care or prefer a more casual, easier to understand system. One inclusion? Everything about the shooting mechanics and weapon attachment system I hate right now to the point of going back to the mod. Combat in this game is an important feature and compared to the mod is really bad in so many ways, and now I hear they have decided to take short cuts on ammo types because you know, who really cares.

 

I understand everything in this department can change for the best and I hope it does. Until then I will voice my opinions on it. 

 

Right, because you disagree with its execution. Not because it's objectively "bad", "casual", or "consoley."

 

Which is totally fine. But the broader an indictment you make on the "direction" or "the experience," the less likely your grievances are to be taken seriously and the less relevant your opinion becomes to actually getting things the way you want.

 

The same applies to Gibonez. The more you inject unnecessary vitriol and loaded statements, the less likely you are to effectively voice your disagreement.

 

Let's stick with the subject at hand, and solutions. Rather than making sweeping generalizations and patting each other on the back because you hate the same things.

Edited May 30, 2014 by Katana67

[Daemonkid 493]

Guys, come on, think of all the money the free mod brought in!  Guys like Gibonez are not only ballistic experts, they are business geniuses who understand the complicated dance that is game development in a niche category.

They have everyone's money already. They need to stick to the vision of what DayZ was supposed to be, also it's obvious the game isn't a niche market anymore. You may be cool with the gimmicky systems they have now, but the majority of us are not, then you have the people who don't care either way. The people who don't care, their opinions don't really matter because "They don't care either way" they'll still continue to play the game.

Then you have the people who want an easymode experience. Those people are a scourge. The game was never supposed to be easy, or accessible. It's supposed to be realistic to a point, gunplay is a big thing, and the current system is nothing like the combat from the mod. Fire-fights in the mod were dangerous exciting and fun and took skill to use the weapon correctly.

Now, it's a dice roll everytime you fire a weapon, no skill or practice involved.  

Like I said they have everyone's money, no one is getting a refund. Stick to the fucking vision of what DayZ was supposed to be. Thus far, it really does seem like they're trying to cater to the lowest common denominator, and I don't see why. Make the game a fucking challenge. I want to actually have a difficult time in DayZ. Death should sting, it should be bitter it should incite emotions. When I die ingame I respawn and go back to what I was doing prior, albiet with less equipment.

[PhillyT 554]

What gimmick system?  And you have absolutely no right to claim that we were promised anything.  

 

As much as people love to ignore the alpha status or the warnings that were given before purchase, the game is not promised to be anything and can be altered at will and for whatever reason the developers deem best.  

 

Your idea of what the game "should be" isn't the same as mine.  We both paid the same amount.  It is whatever it will be.

[stielhandgranate 480]

"Those of us who are real gun nuts would revolt (but I have a feeling the wider community dosn't give a crap as long as it looks cool" - Chris Torchia.

 

:emptycan: :emptycan: :emptycan:

 

Sorry, the noguns crowd is the minority here.

 

 

If the devs are so lazy about the ammunition types, why didn't they let the AKM fire 7.62x51s? Btw I've seen on the Wiki that the 7.62x54R is confirmed

 

I may be mistaken but the the wiki may have speculated.

[hells high 676]

This was never an issue in the mod, because you'd just pick up "CZ550 ammo". Yet everyone seems to think that DayZ needs to follow the amazingly realistic lineage that is ARMA and the mod (which aren't realistic, sorry gibonez.)

Edited May 31, 2014 by Hells High

[Daemonkid 493]

What gimmick system?  And you have absolutely no right to claim that we were promised anything.  

 

As much as people love to ignore the alpha status or the warnings that were given before purchase, the game is not promised to be anything and can be altered at will and for whatever reason the developers deem best.  

 

Your idea of what the game "should be" isn't the same as mine.  We both paid the same amount.  It is whatever it will be.

Yes, we were promised an authentic, gritty zombie survival game. What part of magpul stock = +10 accuracy boost is authentic in the least? But continue making yourself look like a fool. Please, it's entertaining.

[pycco 38]

God damn. Some of these replies. Smh. Gibonez, our crusade is for naught, for all these lames are are more vocal...

i really hope this game does not become a TDM

 

Except if you try to fire the wrong ammunition in the weapon that is supposed to take 54r. The weapon has a high chance of blowing up in your face.

LMAO

 

Yup. This just shows along with many of the other gameplay decisions that standalone is not like the mod.

Casual unrealistic console garbage.

Right, because you disagree with its execution. Not because it's objectively "bad", "casual", or "consoley."

 

Which is totally fine. But the broader an indictment you make on the "direction" or "the experience," the less likely your grievances are to be taken seriously and the less relevant your opinion becomes to actually getting things the way you want.

 

The same applies to Gibonez. The more you inject unnecessary vitriol and loaded statements, the less likely you are to effectively voice your disagreement.

 

Let's stick with the subject at hand, and solutions. Rather than making sweeping generalizations and patting each other on the back because you hate the same things.

the game is being dumb-ed down a lot from the mod, and made to accommodate 13 year old's even though there is an age verification. 

 

They have everyone's money already. They need to stick to the vision of what DayZ was supposed to be, also it's obvious the game isn't a niche market anymore. You may be cool with the gimmicky systems they have now, but the majority of us are not, then you have the people who don't care either way. The people who don't care, their opinions don't really matter because "They don't care either way" they'll still continue to play the game.

Then you have the people who want an easymode experience. Those people are a scourge. The game was never supposed to be easy, or accessible. It's supposed to be realistic to a point, gunplay is a big thing, and the current system is nothing like the combat from the mod. Fire-fights in the mod were dangerous exciting and fun and took skill to use the weapon correctly.

Now, it's a dice roll everytime you fire a weapon, no skill or practice involved.  

Like I said they have everyone's money, no one is getting a refund. Stick to the fucking vision of what DayZ was supposed to be. Thus far, it really does seem like they're trying to cater to the lowest common denominator, and I don't see why. Make the game a fucking challenge. I want to actually have a difficult time in DayZ. Death should sting, it should be bitter it should incite emotions. When I die ingame I respawn and go back to what I was doing prior, albiet with less equipment.

this pretty much what im thinking, if they introduce a pay to win aspect i will uninstall nuf said.

[PhillyT 554]

Yes, we were promised an authentic, gritty zombie survival game. What part of magpul stock = +10 accuracy boost is authentic in the least? But continue making yourself look like a fool. Please, it's entertaining.

 

If looking at DayZ as a game in development makes me a fool, then so be it.  I think rampant nerd rage is silly and somewhat pathetic, but highly entertaining.  SO the forum continues to be a source of enjoyment for me.

[stielhandgranate 480]

Come to think of it his gab at gun owners is pretty insulting. Its along the lines of "well they may not like it, but most people don't care anyway". Just add the ammo. You have 7.62x54R for Mosin Nagants and SVDs, and 7.62x51 for the Blaze 95 and what ever western battle rifles are in development. How game breaking will this be? "Oh no, I now have to look a bit harder for ammo". Boo hoo its a survival game.

[Pandema 352]

This was never an issue in the mod, because you'd just pick up "CZ550 ammo". Yet everyone seems to think that DayZ needs to follow the amazingly realistic lineage that is ARMA and the mod (which aren't realistic, sorry gibonez.)

Ammo in ArmA 2 had the mag names, and then below that it listed the ammo caliber.

 

I put a 30rnd AK mag in my AK74, and in that AK mag was 5.45 and in my 30rd STANAG mag was 5.56

 

I didn't grab a box of 5.56 and shove it in my AK magazine and then fire off the whole damn thing with nothing bad happening.

[rickyspanish 158]

Right, because you disagree with its execution. Not because it's objectively "bad", "casual", or "consoley."

 

Which is totally fine. But the broader an indictment you make on the "direction" or "the experience," the less likely your grievances are to be taken seriously and the less relevant your opinion becomes to actually getting things the way you want.

 

The same applies to Gibonez. The more you inject unnecessary vitriol and loaded statements, the less likely you are to effectively voice your disagreement.

 

Let's stick with the subject at hand, and solutions. Rather than making sweeping generalizations and patting each other on the back because you hate the same things.

 

I have not made any vitriol or loaded statements though. Not to my knowledge anyway, I've merely discussed my fears that the game is heading the wrong direction from what it once was and what I enjoyed. Its the quote about the wider community not giving a crap as long as it looks good that worries me. Does this mean they are catering to the masses now? We already have the daft attachment effects and ridiculous bullet dispersion and now we might be seeing NATO 5.56 rounds fired from an AK74. TBH I wouldn't be that fussed about the ammo types if the rest of the shooting mechanics were good or at least decent. But I'm seeing a trend develop faster than the actual game here. As long as the keep Eastern Guns firing Eastern ammo and NATO guns firing NATO ammo I'm happy, the attachment system needs a complete overhaul which I'm hopeful they know. 

[Katana67 2907]

I have not made any vitriol or loaded statements though. Not to my knowledge anyway, I've merely discussed my fears that the game is heading the wrong direction from what it once was and what I enjoyed. Its the quote about the wider community not giving a crap as long as it looks good that worries me. Does this mean they are catering to the masses now? We already have the daft attachment effects and ridiculous bullet dispersion and now we might be seeing NATO 5.56 rounds fired from an AK74. TBH I wouldn't be that fussed about the ammo types if the rest of the shooting mechanics were good or at least decent. But I'm seeing a trend develop faster than the actual game here. As long as the keep Eastern Guns firing Eastern ammo and NATO guns firing NATO ammo I'm happy, the attachment system needs a complete overhaul which I'm hopeful they know. 

 

Yeah, it wasn't an indictment of you personally. You were defending Gibonez's remarks, that is the context in which I was making my post.

 

And, if you feel something is wrong, try and get it fixed. Advocate for it, or against it. Don't just repeat platitudes about how the game is going in a "bad direction."

 

Be specific, make solid recommendations, hell... even do it over and over again. But the second it bleeds into vagueness, vitriol, or a sweeping indictment of the "direction" of the game then you've already lost. Even though you might get a bunch of beans from like-minded folks who already believe what you do.

 

If you want the X fixed, outline how you think that should be done, how it'd be beneficial to the development of DayZ, and weigh the pros and cons. Make your case.

[Hikurac 115]

I always kind of thought DayZ, the "anti-game", was supposed to be as challenging and realistic as possible. If anything, that is supposed to be the fun part about it. It's not meant to be "streamlined" or easy. The idea is that surviving is a overbearing and cumbersome challenge which makes staying alive all the more rewarding. If your worrying about calibers then perhaps this isn't something you should be playing. I can't imagine how you will react when you have trouble just staying alive and fending for yourself, let alone streamlining bullets.

 

This is exactly what I am afraid of. Almost every hardcore/realism based game or simulator out there gets ruined because the developers half ass the realism due to complaints by the community. This is counter-productive and actually makes the simulator much less interesting, typically causing the fans to leave, dissatisfied with the results. All of that because the community fails to see the big picture, or they become too impatient to care about the end result of development.

 

Stop dumbing down DayZ every time somebody complains about it being too hard or inconvenient.

Edited May 31, 2014 by Hikurac