Beta in Q2?

[S3V3N 1402]

What I really don't get is that the devs announced the Beta for Q2/2016. Maybe someone should tell them that's next month. And then two more months, if they want to squeeze it in at the very end of Q2. They were pretty adamant about being on schedule with maybe a few weeks +/-

BUT - at the current pace of development that's not gonna happen. Unless they have internal builds pre-loaded and ready for testing, after 0.60 is released there is no way in hell they will even release anytime soon. Beta in August or September by my schedule. The Beta-release should depend on the features of the game, not on a fixed date - I agree with that. But the devs wrote that they will continue working on new features during the Beta phase - which makes the distinction Alpha/Beta near pointless. 

So, disregarding the facts and announcements - what will the Beta really be? Just a way to slap a new pricetag onto Dayz SA, or will it actually mean that we'll see a working product with most of its features intact? I wonder if they stick to the plan of releasing in Q2. 

Edited March 9, 2016 by S3V3N

[stinkenheim 249]

I see this game's beta beginning when the new engine segments are all implemented (not fully iterated but all initially implemented).

After that I think it'll be big additions like base building and flying vehicles which will be the features added.

[Etherious 907]

The game already works fine, and who cares if it takes more time to finish it. It's not like the earth is explode or something. Also, I am more than sure they will push back the date for beta.

[Deathlove 2286]

57 minutes ago, DJ SGTHornet said:

It's not like the earth is explode or something.

 

[igor-vk 909]

I dont give a frag when gets Beta as long as they give us monthly updates with new content!

Ups, we have 3 months between updates?

Shit!

[S3V3N 1402]

7 hours ago, DJ SGTHornet said:

The game already works fine, and who cares if it takes more time to finish it. It's not like the earth is explode or something. Also, I am more than sure they will push back the date for beta.

That is not the point at all. The point here is that the devs made an announcement, which I expect them to keep this one time. Because they were pretty clear about being able to make it. We had to listen to so much shit last year about how they are on time with the main features and everything is more or less on schedule. Nobody ever apologized for cocking up one update after the next. And the game runs on minimal features at the moment. No true infected numbers of AI, no final AI, old character controller, not nearly enough (buggy) vehicles, no weather, no base-building, etc. It's maybe 50% feature complete when all is added, but what we see (ingame) is about 15%.         

Add to that all the ingame stuff that is missing. They have to release the mod tools soon (they were supposed to be out around now), then they have to deal with a singleplayer version and the console version at some later point. When is this going to happen? What's the final release date for the full product? I can't see it anywhere before the end of 2017; and that's optimistic.

So how about Beta in Q2? Since Hicks was so clear about making it this time, I am almost looking forward to the foolhardy reasoning they will come up with for yet another delay. There are small teams that work hard and deserve praise. I just have the feeling these devs aren't like that. I really want to give them that praise for a partially great game, but they are simply too slow. Eight hours of work a day is not enough when you have a Beta release coming up. Start working on your promises, devs. And get it done.  

Edited March 10, 2016 by S3V3N

[Tigermonk 140]

2 hours ago, igor-vk said:

4 minutes ago, S3V3N said:

That is not the point at all. The point here is that the devs made an announcement, which I expect them to keep this one time. Because they were pretty clear about being able to make it. We had to listen to so much shit last year about how they are on time with the main features and everything is more or less on schedule. Nobody ever apologized for cocking up one update after the next. And the game runs on minimal features at the moment. No true infected numbers of AI, no final AI, old character controller, not nearly enough (buggy) vehicles, no weather, no base-building, etc. It's maybe 50% feature complete when all is added, but what we see (ingame) is about 15%.         

Add to that all the ingame stuff that is missing. They have to release the mod tools soon (they were supposed to be out around now), then they have to deal with a singleplayer version and the console version at some later point. When is this going to happen? What's the final release date for the full product? I can't see it anywhere before the end of 2017; and that's optimistic.

So how about Beta in Q2? Since Hicks was so clear about making it this time, I am almost looking forward to the foolhardy reasoning they will come up with for yet another delay. There are small teams that work hard and deserve praise. I just have the feeling these devs aren't like that. Eight hours of work a day is not enough when you have a Beta release coming up. Start working on your promises, devs. And get it done.  

 

Edited March 10, 2016 by Tigermonk

[Tigermonk 140]

like s3v3n said in the above post I quoted: the devs are making remark after remark about 'we'll finish it on time, we're ON schedule' but TBH their not.. I posted a ton of info in another topic

- what have they roughly made
80.000.000 on sales alone (average price of 25 bucks)
- what have they spend?
40.000.000 (dev. salary's/going places for promo's/giving dean his cut etc. etc. etc.
- how much time has passed
as of today (10th of march 2016) 3 years and 3 months (December 16th, 2013 (early alpha)
- what have they done so far
30ish (full) patches
- how many patches are given out in current time span
dayz started with patch v0.28.113734 (16 Dec 2013)
Current build:                v0.59.131908 (04 Mar 2016)
38 patches in total (including hotfixes) since early alpha release december 16th 2013
- how many patches in how many months? 
at current pace: 1 every 3 months
4 (FULL) patches a year (not hotfixes)
- est. time until full release at current speed
7 years +/- (1 patch every 3 months equals 4 patches per year) 0.60-1.0 (give/take) 25-30 patch versions
4x7=28 patches at current working speed.

lets say bohemia wakes up and tells them to 'step it up' work time might be reduces to half so 3.5 years..
adding that to the already elapsed time: 3.5+3.3=6.8 years.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Tigermonk

[igor-vk 909]

You dont have to explain things to me. I follow development of this "game" since mid 2013. There were hundreds of delays. I was disapointed numerous times. 

[OrLoK 16182]

2 hours ago, Tigermonk said:

<snip>

Extrapolation. doesnt work in real word.

40 minutes ago, igor-vk said:

You dont have to explain things to me. I follow development of this "game" since mid 2013. There were hundreds of delays. I was disapointed numerous times. 

Hundreds of delays? Poppycock.

L

Edited March 10, 2016 by OrLoK

[igor-vk 909]

3 minutes ago, OrLoK said:

Hundreds of delays? Poppycock.

OK, 5 dozen then

[S3V3N 1402]

I wish I had no reason to complain. This is a patient community and yes, Dayz is a difficult game and harder to develop than, let's say - the much smaller scale "Escape from Tarkov". It's also a different concept without mission structure or traditional multiplayer gameplay. We see aspects of Dayz in other games, but they have different features and goals. I'm fine with what the game is supposed to be and that it takes its time. I'm just critical of the way we receive information and with the way the devs handle reality.

It's been announced that we'll see videos from the devs - that's okay. It's just that things take a long time to happen. But realistically that's one more task for the devs (=more work) and I don't think these videos will reflect problems critically, but rather introduce us to the team and the work they do. We're almost two weeks into March. To be honest, I was expecting the new renderer sometime back in early December. Then it was hopefully announced for February, which didn't work out and not really much info on it, since. It's simply not enough to always say: "it'll be done when it's done". Even with a margin it should be possible to give us a better estimate than "somewhen within this month, or maybe not". This is the side of public information that I find lacking.

The other side of these delays is that I keep thinking they are still adding more stuff to the release. While that would be impressive, it's unnecessary. At this point, I'd rather have more releases and smaller ones. I'm still hoping this will happen after 0.60 and things will speed up. Dayz would be an awesome game, if the updates came in more often and if they were a bit more practical (e.g. how about a car-jack model or a tow rope -> useful). They have so much left to do, from invisible things like collisions, to major map changes/additions and changes to the controls, etc. And on top of that come singleplayer campaign, modding tools and at some later point the console development. Even without console development that's a big checklist of things that need work. And I don't see, how this goes with a reality, where we see an update ever 3-4 months and get fed information only when it seems too late. Why not inform us earlier, if they see things aren't working out? 

Really, I have big respect for the creators of this game and ideally, we'd all get the time we need to make something perfect. But in this case, perfection or rather - choice - will come after modding. My biggest hope is that after the 0.60 update EnFusion will be a stable and reliable development tool for the devs. Enabling them to quickly get their systems to work. It's sad it takes this long and I really hope the time spent will show in the upgrade, but it can't be helped from our side anyway. Just please, please devs: give us more updates after 0.60. I don't want to end the year on version 0.63 or 0.64 - technically it may get called Beta 1.0, but we'll know better ;) 

Edited March 10, 2016 by S3V3N

[[DGN] Johnny 115]

Until this game strongly curves the amount of hackers and duplicators, Beta is a hollow title anyways. I enjoy the hell out of DayZ, but let's be serious. You can't have a survival game, or even an FPS game, with hacks like teleporting, wall walking, duplicating, and ESP being as easily available as it is.  I mean, you have 13 year olds duplicating equipment. You have PVP that is often ended not by scarcity or skill, but because of invisible players coming up behind you and shooting you in the head.

I mean until that's fixed, everything else becomes irrelevant. And your honest players become your penalized players. That's kind of a huge sign of an issue, that is by all definition a game breaking alpha issue.

 

Edited March 10, 2016 by [DGN] Johnny

[Razgries 25]

  They probably expected the transition to the new engine to go smoother then it has or something. To be honest though, in my humble opinion, if they can run around Chernarus and pick up stuff, then that is good enough for me... I've already played with 0 Infected pretty much from day 1 when I got the game. I don't even know what the standard DayZ is supposed to be I never played the mod... It CAN'T be much worse then that! I could get on and play now with some but the unstable FPS around any towns on my AMD FX-8320 just got to be too much for me. Seems like every time I get shot at and prepare to defend myself... The moment I aim the micro pausing kicks in and I just get shot. It's such a pain trying to time my attacks to be right after one and constantly being forced to start over and have to hike miles back to where I was, only to get shot on the way because I am forced back to Murder Town on the coast and in to big of a hurry to get back North West... I love Clock Tower, It's an amazing area one of the best slide shows I have seen in DayZ. ;o

 Well, I did see Infected when they over did it and they would trap you in a building and just zerg you to death, probably the best day I had in-game, ever... Yeah shoot at me now! *sits and watches them swarm the building they hid inside* Sweet Zombie Justice...

 But I see what you mean, sadly it looks like they will probably miss beta at the start of Q2. But I have faith in the guys behind the scene, this is still going to be a great year for DayZ. Once they have there new engine in and all the custom scripting tools are in place things will probably hit a nice pace. And I'm sure a dev-kit deal similar to Eden will soon follow and the community can begin contributing in earnest.

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

1 hour ago, [DGN] Johnny said:

Until this game strongly curves -snip-

 

The word you are looking for is curbs, not curves.

Also, you must not realize the extensive and long standing anti-cheat measures that are in place here.

Hackers are allowed to accumulate over a period and then are wiped en mass.

Once wiped from the player base the preventative measure is put in place and we move on.

Edited March 10, 2016 by ☣BioHaze☣

[Tigermonk 140]

4 hours ago, OrLoK said:

Extrapolation. doesnt work in real word.

Hundreds of delays? Poppycock.

L

and ONCE again the forum mods prove my point :D priceless :D

[Tigermonk 140]

2 hours ago, Razgries said:

  They probably expected the transition to the new engine to go smoother then it has or something. To be honest though, in my humble opinion, if they can run around Chernarus and pick up stuff, then that is good enough for me... I've already played with 0 Infected pretty much from day 1 when I got the game. I don't even know what the standard DayZ is supposed to be I never played the mod... It CAN'T be much worse then that! I could get on and play now with some but the unstable FPS around any towns on my AMD FX-8320 just got to be too much for me. Seems like every time I get shot at and prepare to defend myself... The moment I aim the micro pausing kicks in and I just get shot. It's such a pain trying to time my attacks to be right after one and constantly being forced to start over and have to hike miles back to where I was, only to get shot on the way because I am forced back to Murder Town on the coast and in to big of a hurry to get back North West... I love Clock Tower, It's an amazing area one of the best slide shows I have seen in DayZ. ;o

 Well, I did see Infected when they over did it and they would trap you in a building and just zerg you to death, probably the best day I had in-game, ever... Yeah shoot at me now! *sits and watches them swarm the building they hid inside* Sweet Zombie Justice...

 But I see what you mean, sadly it looks like they will probably miss beta at the start of Q2. But I have faith in the guys behind the scene, this is still going to be a great year for DayZ. Once they have there new engine in and all the custom scripting tools are in place things will probably hit a nice pace. And I'm sure a dev-kit deal similar to Eden will soon follow and the community can begin contributing in earnest.

  They probably expected the transition to the new engine to go smoother then it has or something. To be honest though, in my humble opinion, if they can run around Chernarus and pick up stuff, then that is good enough for me... I've already played with 0 Infected pretty much from day 1 when I got the game. I don't even know what the standard DayZ is supposed to be I never played the mod... <-- found your problem mate... you have NO idea how the MOD is.. then you have NO idea what DayZ is... playing without zombies isn't something that belongs in DayZ standalone in the first place.. it should be zombie INFESTED... literally 1000's of them... but the engine can't handle 50 players + gear yet so let alone 1000's of extra zombies/wild life etc.

[Girth Brooks 568]

I'm a big believer of the only thing early-access does well is breed a whole generation of whiners. 

[rafap 9]

I am sure beta not in Q2. First if you read posts from 2013 about DayZ. Bohemia Says they want guns and ammo will be very rare in game what is now? Is Still Survival? I dont think so is that typical Action game sorry because is not survival game when you are full armored in few minutes. I remember what they planning. And change mind in 2014. I dony feel in survival game for me is game when first thing is take gun and shot that all now. Not feel survival not feel zombies sorry but this map is from ARMA II! say me what they doing in 2 years and 3 months in development? When they have ready map!. Think how much will be done if DayZ team will must make new map? Game will be now 0.50 because map will be not ready. Working about game going very slow and not much improved sorry but new version only what give? new ammo, guns and etc. Not repair all main problems. In my opinion is Action game now not Survival...

[Razgries 25]

46 minutes ago, Tigermonk said:

  They probably expected the transition to the new engine to go smoother then it has or something. To be honest though, in my humble opinion, if they can run around Chernarus and pick up stuff, then that is good enough for me... I've already played with 0 Infected pretty much from day 1 when I got the game. I don't even know what the standard DayZ is supposed to be I never played the mod... <-- found your problem mate... you have NO idea how the MOD is.. then you have NO idea what DayZ is... playing without zombies isn't something that belongs in DayZ standalone in the first place.. it should be zombie INFESTED... literally 1000's of them... but the engine can't handle 50 players + gear yet so let alone 1000's of extra zombies/wild life etc.

 Well it aint my fault they took them out. And I never said I had "no idea" that was you... I have an idea, I could imagine a nice spread of Infected all over instead of just in towns... I've played Breaking Point, and I saw when they had too many Infected and they swarmed, I've played some indie titles on Steam and still pick up State of Decay from time to time. Why so condescending with your reply m8? And in regards to that big ol post you made of "Why my game should be done now"...

The Elder Scrolls series- 4 years

Fallout series- 4 years

Guild Wars 2- 6 years

GTA V- 4 years

Deus-Ex- 11 years

Diablo 3- 7+ years

I could keep looking up more of these fat numbers and adding to the list but I'll stop there... And trust me there are more, even some really bad games that took much longer then this would IF your estimated development time was accurate. like Duke Nukem...

 

 Pretty much that way with everything, some games have taken even longer then most like Diablo 3 which should have been a no-brainer to produce, but still took 11 years because...reasons... Most of the games that took 4 years had over 100+ people working on them. We are just now heading into the 4 year mark with huge changes just ahead, literally getting videos where Hicks is saying "This is going to change everything there will be perf gains" and you're like "This is taking to long my information says you have made enough money should be done by now"? Early Access is a new thing and while it has a lot of potential for "extra" play testers it also has to deal with a ton of negatives that to be honest I don't think is worth it. Like clueless ninnies giving them bad reviews on Steam, and impatient folks going all J.G Wentworth every time something gets shown but they don't get it like next week...

 

 

[Tigermonk 140]

1 hour ago, Razgries said:

 Well it aint my fault they took them out. And I never said I had "no idea" that was you... I have an idea, I could imagine a nice spread of Infected all over instead of just in towns... I've played Breaking Point, and I saw when they had too many Infected and they swarmed, I've played some indie titles on Steam and still pick up State of Decay from time to time. Why so condescending with your reply m8? And in regards to that big ol post you made of "Why my game should be done now"...

The Elder Scrolls series- 4 years

Fallout series- 4 years

Guild Wars 2- 6 years

GTA V- 4 years

Deus-Ex- 11 years

Diablo 3- 7+ years

I could keep looking up more of these fat numbers and adding to the list but I'll stop there... And trust me there are more, even some really bad games that took much longer then this would IF your estimated development time was accurate. like Duke Nukem...

 

 Pretty much that way with everything, some games have taken even longer then most like Diablo 3 which should have been a no-brainer to produce, but still took 11 years because...reasons... Most of the games that took 4 years had over 100+ people working on them. We are just now heading into the 4 year mark with huge changes just ahead, literally getting videos where Hicks is saying "This is going to change everything there will be perf gains" and you're like "This is taking to long my information says you have made enough money should be done by now"? Early Access is a new thing and while it has a lot of potential for "extra" play testers it also has to deal with a ton of negatives that to be honest I don't think is worth it. Like clueless ninnies giving them bad reviews on Steam, and impatient folks going all J.G Wentworth every time something gets shown but they don't get it like next week...

 

 

all these games were NOT launched in 'alpha' and the people who made these games didn't go to every game show on the globe.. while having list upon list of 'we hope to finish etc. etc. in 2015'

I guess you want more proof of that... coming right up :)

I'd like to point out ahead of time: THIS was intended for 2015!! not 2016

proof: https://dayz.com/blog/dayz-moving-into-2015

further more... how many of those games are as over hyped and shown in trailer as DayZ.


Apart from GTA V (please note my comment above DayZ has been in dev. since december 16th 2013! 2013!) 
so thats 2 years and 3 months.. (leaves them with 1 year and 8 months to complete the full game.)

Elder scroll (SERIES) so not just one game!

Fall Out Series (so not just one game!)

guild wars.. ok legit nr 2.

Diablo 3 (nobody expected another installment after 2 since 3 just sucks compared to the brilliance of 2. 

Deus-Ex (never even heard of that until it hit the shelf so please forgive me for not giving a shit about those 11+ years)


and as for you saying Duke Nukem was a 'bad game' matter of opinion.. I enjoyed duke nuken 3D for a long time.. along with the doom games and quake games..

you're welcome 

Edited March 10, 2016 by Tigermonk

[[DGN] Johnny 115]

4 hours ago, ☣BioHaze☣ said:

The word you are looking for is curbs, not curves.

Also, you must not realize the extensive and long standing anti-cheat measures that are in place here.

Hackers are allowed to accumulate over a period and then are wiped en mass.

Once wiped from the player base the preventative measure is put in place and we move on.

Curves, as in a graphical representation. Regardless it's irrelevant to the topic at hand.

Anyways, yes I understand they clean hackers in waves. That's swell. Dosent change that a game with such huge and widespread hacker issues, especially surrounding it's core content, is stuck in Alpha until they get those security issues fixed. Regardless what stage of development they call it.

 

 

[Deathlove 2286]

2 hours ago, Tigermonk said:

Diablo 3 (nobody expected another installment after 2 since 3 just sucks compared to the brilliance of 2. 

When it first launched this was the case. But have you played it within the last year or two? Its a hell of a lot better than when it first launched. Right up there with 2 in depth and what not.

[Thurman Merman 726]

3 hours ago, rafap said:

 is not survival game when you are full armored in few minutes. 

It's also not survival when it's nearly impossible to die of malnutrition, infected, hypothermia, fauna, etc.  Heck, about the only way the "environment" kills you now is lag/desync while changing altitude.  This game needs strong infected back in force in a bad way - they never (?) damage your gear anymore, they rarely make you bleed, and there are never more than a handful milling around.  Heck, I miss the infected that ran through walls - at least there were a lot of them and they were dangerous.

[Deathlove 2286]

2 minutes ago, Thurman Merman said:

It's also not survival when it's nearly impossible to die of malnutrition, infected, hypothermia, fauna, etc.  Heck, about the only way the "environment" kills you now is lag/desync while changing altitude.  This game needs strong infected back in force in a bad way - they never (?) damage your gear anymore, they rarely make you bleed, and there are never more than a handful milling around.  Heck, I miss the infected that ran through walls - at least there were a lot of them and they were dangerous.

Fuck i wouldn't mind if they added ones that could spit acid, have larger ones that could pick up cars and throw them at you or just simply have military ones with grenades strapped to there bodies when there running at you.