Players dwindling

[OrLoK 16182]

That might be true - but it does not help the fact that the game "burns out" without even seeing beta.

The novelty is gone - what will they do to incite players to come back when it is done?

 

From a finacial point of view it does not make sense to put any more effort in a product when the return is questionable.

Basically - money from alpha is spent - not many people still interested in the game - all further money spend is equivalent to burning the money - so they just stop.

 

Not that I not got my money's worth out of DayZ (on the contrary) but it feels like a kickstarter followed by a beta may have been better in hindsight.

Btw. People that use a existing engine do not just "drop" assets and are done with it...

 

 

 

Also everybody should stop to underestimate/belittle the time and skill modders put into their creations.

hello there

 

if you take another look at my post you will see the caveats I gave about "dropping" stuff on to existing engines and I didnt belittle modders either.

 

Im a modder, I have used the unreal engine in anger. I know the work that goes into even my small works with it, but its still using an existing framework on which to "drop" or add my content on to with a little scripting. I never said it was "easy" and didnt take skill, but it isnt as hard as building the engine "as well" as adding ones own content (be it assets or code)

 

As to burning out, well perhaps you have, I certainly haven't. Nor are many others with far more time ingame than I. Ive said before the numbers most likely will not get to the viral stage we had, but that's just fine.

 

As to your "money all gone/spent/no more money to be made" vs bothering to make the game, well that's not how things work. The expectation of the gaming community as well as the press is still there, It wouldnt look good for BI *not* to finish the game, not that im implying thats the only reason why, rather im stating that you are being a little too simplistic with your analysis.

 

if we really want to boil things down one could say "all games are simply points of light that are displayed when certain conditions are met, why would anyone pay for that?". it may be "true" but it's not the whole of it.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[jefc_uk 26]

After getting on for 3000 hours in game over the past 18 months, I'm very sorry to say that things are looking really bad. I have absolutely no desire to play any more

That's 22.83% of your time, or nearly 6 hours a day, every day. Basically a full working week.

 

Is it so surprising you have no desire to play anymore? Maybe your fault for burning out?

[Mookie (original) 799]

That's 22.83% of your time, or nearly 6 hours a day, every day. Basically a full working week.

 

Is it so surprising you have no desire to play anymore? Maybe your fault for burning out?

 

Don't get me wrong - I have absolutely got my money's worth from the game. I think it's a fantastic idea. As to whether it's my own fault - well...the numbers solidly support the fact that I am not alone.

 

This thread seems to be loving away from the OP's point about the issue of the dwindling playerbase (which I assume is a serious issue, especially if you're talking about alpha testers), to the same old thread we've all read a thousand times. The operational point is that the number of active players has been dwindling for a year or so, and now stands at its lowest point. How low does it have to get for development to essentially stop being EA in all but name?

 

I don't think the reasons why people have stopped playing are really, in the long term, about FO4, other distractions, etc. They're about the same old problems with the game (especially lag and desync) simply not being solved.

At this point everyone will pipe up and say 'that is solved in beta, not alpha'. Perhaps rightly so. But at this rate of decline the playerbase will be well under 3,000 active players on stable at any one time. How low does that number have to get? Or is it completely incidental in the light of Orlok's (helpful) assurances??

[Tiger205 48]

 

At this point everyone will pipe up and say 'that is solved in beta, not alpha'. 

 

And then what? The bad taste will stay regardless and I don't think any new people will but this considering all the reviews up till that point. And I couldn't blame them because the game has been almost the same for over a year with even ridiculous changes like actually removing content so there's that.

 

That's even assuming that BI will finally keep up with their promises and get into ACTUAL beta, instead of something that's essentially still alpha but renamed beta just to please people, before their deadline.

[Deathlove 2280]

It's only being played by testers and people who can't read right now..

If ppl were not able to read they wouldn't be able to respond to these types of post period. lol

[sneakydudes 278]

Hello there

 

Mod hat off

 

Mod hat on

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

i like what you posted. Well said, people don't understand a ground up game.

[jeffroland 26]

Hello there

 

Mod hat off

 

Unfortunately, the issue isn't that "the game shouldn't have been released in Alpha" or "person/s X or Y messed up and Rocket was optimazing" it's that people, yes many of the general public, simply don't realise how long making a full game takes.

 

I'm not talking about dropping stuff onto Unreal or Crytek or Unity, Im talking about really making a game *and* re engineering the "engine"

 

 

 

You've certainly got a point that most people don't realize how long it takes to make a full game. However, back when DayZ Alpha first went public I don't think that anyone thought that the entire game engine would be re-engineered. I think most of us thought, and were originally led to believe by the developers at the time, that the game would be enhanced or elements added to the current engine at that time. Obviously decisions were made after this which altered the scope of project significantly. I think many of the DayZ team wasn't even hired yet when the Alpha was first launched. New team members and the decision to re-engineer the game engine has pushed things way back (for the good), but people will have to be patient.

[Bororm 1156]

We'll see a spike on release (maybe beta too) and then a rapid dwindling once again, since the game isn't going to change drastically between now and then.  It's one of the drawbacks of early access, that you have time to get burnt out on a game before it's finished.

 

People will come and go periodically as their interest ebbs and flows but the game isn't going to sustain its popularity as it has in the past.  Many of us have been playing for 3+ years now (the sa is not drastically different from the mod in terms of gameplay), that's a lot for any game.  It's natural to lose interest.

 

Try reinvigorating any 4 year old game and see how long the interest maintains.  The best you can hope for is temporary spikes.

Edited November 19, 2015 by Bororm

[Grumpy Cat 12]

Totally OK with fewer players. I enjoy solo farmer play style anyway. Fewer KoSers the better. Nothing worse than trying to loot a small town on a server with 5 players and have someone shoot you for no reason while you're minding your own business.

[Killawife 599]

Press the 1m button and theres no decline. Its quite natural that people will buy a game and try it and then stop when they dont like it. When the game is finished we'll see what happens, til then theres no need to bother.

[Konfucious K 183]

I hold the devs to a high standard but don't think that they or BI are infallible.

 

 

Woah, woah, woah... woah, hold up there, they're not? That's it, rage quit!

 

On a side-note, if I ever play 3000 hours of a game I get pretty burned out. At least for a little while, but to play so much time in a game is a rarity and generally falls into the top-5 games of all time that I played category.

Edited November 19, 2015 by Konfucious K

[Rauchsauger 94]

[...]

Im a modder, I have used the unreal engine in anger. I know the work that goes into even my small works with it, but its still using an existing framework on which to "drop" or add my content on to with a little scripting. I never said it was "easy" and didnt take skill, but it isnt as hard as building the engine "as well" as adding ones own content (be it assets or code)

 

As to burning out, well perhaps you have, I certainly haven't. Nor are many others with far more time ingame than I. Ive said before the numbers most likely will not get to the viral stage we had, but that's just fine.

 

As to your "money all gone/spent/no more money to be made" vs bothering to make the game, well that's not how things work. The expectation of the gaming community as well as the press is still there, It wouldnt look good for BI *not* to finish the game, not that im implying thats the only reason why, rather im stating that you are being a little too simplistic with your analysis.

 

if we really want to boil things down one could say "all games are simply points of light that are displayed when certain conditions are met, why would anyone pay for that?". it may be "true" but it's not the whole of it.

[...]

 

Hello,

 

sure it is harder to create the engine (although in this case they modify a existing engine) but that does not factor into game design as I see it. That is application development, I realise that it might be needed for them to realize their vision of the game but it just is another good point to have never started the early access - that early.

 

The player count statistics do speak volumes. Maybe you and others have not burned out but 4/5 did. And since it is a multiplayer game it needs players to work,

That bothers me because I would like DayZ to continue beyond being finished.

 

BI is a company and if the whole thing becomes a (potential) moneysink they have to shut it down.

Yes it might not look good but it can not be helped if you want to run a business. (also the current state of the gaming industry has made people numb to such things sadly)

 

If you want to put it like that games are:

Points of light that are displayed when certain condsitions are met and when processed in sequence by a human mind create an experience (for better or worse).

 

I just hope that they have a plan to bring players back and get new players interested so DayZ continues and maybe we get other games of that scale.

(Perhaps they could streamline the usability of the engine and then license it to other developers)

 

Regards

Edited November 20, 2015 by Rauchsauger

[jefc_uk 26]

It's quite common to only play a given game for a certain amount of time I think. You can call it 'burning out' or 'getting bored of it' etc. I think alpha (and beta) testers have to accept that they may 'burn out' before the game is finished. If they don't accept this then they will end up resenting the game for failing to achieve it's potential during the time that they were enjoying playing it. As previously mentioned - I bought GTA V and 'burnt out' in 2 weeks (although partly because I wanted to get back to DayZ to be fair). Half-life was a revelation to me (and many others of course). But I doubt I ever played thousands of hours in it - I moved on to other things.

 

I think that the fact a game is in alpha or beta or whatever is irrelevant in some discussions. Think of other forms of entertainment; you don't get to the end of a film or a gig and be all like 'I want more from this' (well you might, but you get the point I expect). Any game has limited content (arguably untrue in multiplayer games, though then the infinite 'content' is up to the players to generate) and once a player has consumed that content to their own limits then that's that - they have finished the game, just like when a film ends.

 

There's a small part of me that thinks "I could have waited until DayZ was finished and then it would all be fresh and new all at once and wouldn;t that be sweet" but now is now and now is when I want to play DayZ. I accept that I will lack that excitement factor when it is released because it was my choice to give it up. Also it's interesting being a (tiny) part of the development process.

[OrLoK 16182]

Hello,

 

sure it is harder to create the engine (although in this case they modify a existing engine) but that does not factor into game design as I see it. That is application development, I realise that it might be needed for them to realize their vision of the game but it just is another good point to have never started the early access - that early.

 

The player count statistics do speak volumes. Maybe you and others have not burned out but 4/5 did. And since it is a multiplayer game it needs players to work,

That bothers me because I would like DayZ to continue beyond being finished.

 

BI is a company and if the whole thing becomes a (potential) moneysink they have to shut it down.

Yes it might not look good but it can not be helped if you want to run a business. (also the current state of the gaming industry has made people numb to such things sadly)

 

If you want to put it like that games are:

Points of light that are displayed when certain condsitions are met and when processed in sequence by a human mind create an experience (for better or worse).

 

I just hope that they have a plan to bring players back and get new players interested so DayZ continues and maybe we get other games of that scale.

(Perhaps they could streamline the usability of the engine and then license it to other developers)

 

Regards

Hello there

 

You seem to keep coming back to this monetary "if they dont sell xx donughts a day they cant operate as a business." argument.

 

This would be correct if it were a simple retail outlet. But that's not how game dev works.

 

There are multiple revenue streams, not only for "just" the existing game.

 

Let's be hypothetical here. Just say the devs don't finish the game, what would the effect be on BI as a business? Have a think about that. Or, if for example, a third of gamers are burned out, how many does that leave?

 

DAYZ *will* be finished. It would be such a faux pas for BI not to finish it, even if its only you, me and BI's pet goldfish still playing.

 

BI are not daft. They know player trends, they've worked with them before. This isnt just 4 guys in a bedroom. Do you not think they've conducted risk analysis and future projections for 3,5,7 year plans etc etc?

 

I completely understand your point, but its the wrong argument and not applicable in this case although it's one that's easy to grasp onto. Its similar to "everyone who's ever eaten bread has die therefore bread is a killer", obviously not as absurd but just as incomparable.

 

Also, its not "simply" a modification of the engine and the changes are a HUGE part of the project. Wait until you have your hands on the new controller etc.

 

TBH I'll never convince you.

 

Time will prove one of us right but I will be literally flabberghasted if DAYZ ceased development due to player numbers.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[Rauchsauger 94]

[...]

Time will prove one of us right but I will be literally flabberghasted if DAYZ ceased development due to player numbers.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

 

 

I don't want to be proven right. I sincerely hope that the game will finish and have a big enough playerbase to support players worldwide.

(So every continental region has a fair amount of players and servers)

 

Maybe they should make a second early access for beta? I would buy again just to support it.

 

Regards

[OrLoK 16182]

I don't want to be proven right. I sincerely hope that the game will finish and have a big enough playerbase to support players worldwide.

(So every continental region has a fair amount of players and servers)

 

Maybe they should make a second early access for beta? I would buy again just to support it.

 

Regards

Hello there

 

Please dont think im having a go at you, rather im tackling a common misconception!

 

I dont think another EA would be the solution , however there are marketing techniques that could easily be used to increase the player base.

 

Also, note how much BI marketing there has been about DAYZ to date. Almost none.

 

We really are early days yet (no pun intended).

 

I expect player numbers to jump up, not to the "viral" levels but still to increase at certain points.

 

Also, TBH other "popular" MP games I play dont appear to have great player numbers either but they are still going strong.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[blackberrygoo 1416]

This game is popping right now . Why don't you guys go ahead and check some other games steam charts i play and report back to me if standalones numbers are low:

Mortal online : http://steamcharts.com/app/287920

Nosgoth: http://steamcharts.com/app/200110

The second game has only been around for about a year and a half so that can't attest to how long low population games can survive for but the first one is the real gem , Mortal Online came out in 2009 with an alpha version , it is now SIX years into its life , on the same buggy old engine with relatively the same small amount of players . Yeah dayz is doing fine lol , and to see so many people swearing it will die soon is so funny to me , you guys really have no sense of the future or an intuitive sense of potential , because this game is the only alpha game I've ever know to keep people playing for thousands of hours IN AN ALPHA DEVELOPMENT !! That's an achievement , now how do you think it will be when 1.0 comes out? We've had the chance to mold dayz because of this early access , and the game came to us much quicker because of that (on top of that we the community can crush more bugs before 1.0 release than the devs alone).

Overall I know it must be super duper hard to play an awesome video game and have to wait for it to get better , but bare with us here , if you already have more than 500 hours then you already play this game more than the average AAA title that costs you $60 , And there's more to come and all you have to do is report bugs and wait , so yA let population decline when new games come out and stable patches are stale , but we all know damn well as soon as .59 hits stable , all those that are so incredibly disappointed , will be playing again non-stop.

Almost 4k players on during a Friday morning , yea this game is soooo dead XD !

Edited November 20, 2015 by Grapefruit kush

[Rauchsauger 94]

This game is popping right now . Why don't you guys go ahead and check some other games steam charts i play and report back to me if standalones numbers are low:

Mortal online : http://steamcharts.com/app/287920

Nosgoth: http://steamcharts.com/app/200110

The second game has only been around for about a year and a half so that can't attest to how long low population games can survive for but the first one is the real gem , Mortal Online came out in 2009 with an alpha version , it is now SIX years into its life , on the same buggy old engine with relatively the same small amount of players . Yeah dayz is doing fine lol , and to see so many people swearing it will die soon is so funny to me , you guys really have no sense of the future or an intuitive sense of potential , because this game is the only alpha game I've ever know to keep people playing for thousands of hours IN AN ALPHA DEVELOPMENT !! That's an achievement , now how do you think it will be when 1.0 comes out? We've had the chance to mold dayz because of this early access , and the game came to us much quicker because of that (on top of that we the community can crush more bugs before 1.0 release than the devs alone).

Overall I know it must be super duper hard to play an awesome video game and have to wait for it to get better , but bare with us here , if you already have more than 500 hours then you already play this game more than the average AAA title that costs you $60 , And there's more to come and all you have to do is report bugs and wait , so yA let population decline when new games come out and stable patches are stale , but we all know damn well as soon as .59 hits stable , all those that are so incredibly disappointed , will be playing again non-stop.

Almost 4k players on during a Friday morning , yea this game is soooo dead XD !

 

I think that 5k players is not that much for a game like DayZ (even H1Z1 has around 13k) and it is not about the number it is about the decline.

Nosgoth is "free to play" so there are microtransaction that is putting it on another playing field.

 

Lets just hope it does not drop any more and the new renderer brings back alot of folks.

[sneakydudes 278]

Welp either way, i think they are doing a great job getting our base building stuff done, and working on the other stuff.

 

If i am the very last person to be running through cherno, then i guess

 

I survived!

 

But mark my words once the numbers go back up, glitches fixed someone will come out and say Oh i don't like the color on new vehicles.

[Grumpy Cat 12]

Considering how many millions of people bought the game (2 or 3 mil?), getting excitied over 5000 people online is...well... not great.

[sneakydudes 278]

I also cant wait for when it goes modding!!! Wanna see how many play that?

 

and my first script, map group markers. (for my mates and I)

and my 2nd script, Base camp spawn location.

 

and my 3rd script.....

well you get the point

[Killawife 599]

Considering how many millions of people bought the game (2 or 3 mil?), getting excitied over 5000 people online is...well... not great.

Its kinda strange that they sold 3 million copies when the maximum amount of players playing has never been over 46 thousand. So over two and a half million people bought it and NEVER played it?

 

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/01/23/dayz-standalone-reaches-3m-copies-sold

[Mullraugh 1151]

Fallout 4.

Edited November 20, 2015 by mullraugh

[IrishSniper 1]

Sorry for taking so long to get back to this, I've read all of your guys comments.

 

Thanks orlok for your input on the situation, I agree with what you are saying. But wouldn't it be a lot better to have those 15-20k players that we had before?

 

Sure, some of us are burned out from it because of its lacking content now, but the main cause of the players being 1/5 that it used to be in my own opinion, is the amount of big twitch streamers being so frustrated, like the rest of us are about desync primarily. Don't underestimate the influence twitch streamers have on the popularity of this game, they have always been the biggest marketing "also free" for dayz, and when their own marketing team if you want to call it gets pissed off and stops playing, you see the results with your own eyes, the games playerbase says enough too.

 

Now I mentioned desync being the primary reason for twitch streamers leaving the game, I'll explain why. Dayz is a game where it can take you HOURS of your actual day to get what you want, maybe you have a certain look you want to complete, a certain weapon too, maybe a vehicle "Lol goodluck with getting that mate, I'll stop in to see how lucky you have been next week", so clearly it takes a lot of time to get items you want, and that's okay "besides the stupid rarity of vehicles and parts" however lets look at the reasons one loses said items, legitimate death? such as accidentally killing yourself from falling and such, or being killed by another player because they were in that situation more skillful and accurate than you and luck was not on your side, you get the picture. Or illegitimate death such as you putting 30 rounds into a player as you used skill to catch him on his flank, to then be shot and killed because the character you were shooting at was a complete illusion created by desync from a location that illusion was previously at 2-4 seconds ago. That and stairs killing you, and lets not forget the high chance of being knocked out by a player with a melee weapon or fists even though you are armed to the teeth because desync will allow the player to strike you without you even seeing them in your local vicinity. Yes, dayz is a game you can put a lot of hours into and lose everything in a second, not for legitimate reasons but reasons that are so frustrating words cannot describe. So the reason players are ditching this currently sorry excuse of a game is because it's just not worth it anymore, it's not worth the time investment to be taken away by desync, or a hacker. So why in the world hasn't desync been tackled by now? Like I said earlier, 20k players is better than 4. At what stage do they actually do something? It's already been left too long and has clearly caused serious damage to the player base. 

 

To be clear, dayz is an amazing game, crippled severely by DESYNC, if desync is under control and barely noticeable during the end of this year, dayz will gain popularity again, I guarantee it. Patience is more easily forthcoming when certain basic necessities are met in game. The renderer and everything else can wait until its made to perfection once desync is removed from the game like the cancer it is. 

Edited November 21, 2015 by IrishSniper

[derLoko 30]

Its kinda strange that they sold 3 million copies when the maximum amount of players playing has never been over 46 thousand. So over two and a half million people bought it and NEVER played it?

 

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/01/23/dayz-standalone-reaches-3m-copies-sold

 

It's the number of people logged in and playing the game at that point.