How to Fix the Fashion Issue

[Jex 1104]

The complaint is that everyone wears all gorka stuff - well duh, it's waterproof!

 

So how about making more of the clothes in game waterproof?

 

The hunting jacket for one

 

How about the hiking jacket - is that waterproof?

 

Did you know that "WOOL" as in a wool jacket keeps it's thermic properties meaning when wet, it will still keep you warm? Ever hear of a poncho you can wear over your clothes?

 

What other items are in game that need to be weatherproof that aren't?

 

It's ridiculous - give us a millions clothes to wear most of which a re useless in a game where it rains 70% of the time lol :)

[GaryWalnuts 1680]

Gorka's are just water resistant now, they're not fully waterproof anymore.

Firefighter's jacket and pants are waterproof with good insulation too, you can swim all day and they won't a damp status  :thumbsup:

 

edit:  if you want to go to the next level, get wellies, a motorcycle helmet and a gasmask.  you can play in the rain all day long and not get wet or cold.  the trick is that you cant wear a vest of any sort or gloves as they will absorb water.

 

I'd also like to see more variety in waterproof clothing, as mentioned before gloves and a vest or maybe a poncho that you can keep in your inventory for bad weather

Edited October 8, 2015 by GaryWalnuts

[IgnobleBasterd 161]

Gorka's are just water resistant now, they're not fully waterproof anymore.

F

Really? I haven't gotten wet in gorka ever.

[GaryWalnuts 1680]

Really? I haven't gotten wet in gorka ever.

Yeah there's not that many clothing items that have 0% absorption, gorka is very close though at 5%, so it's *almost* waterproof but technically just water resistant 

If you go for a swim in gorkas you will see that they get a damp status, which will eventually lead to a cold status (edit: if you don't warm up by sprinting or fire). Firefighters outfit won't get a damp status.

Edited October 8, 2015 by GaryWalnuts

[Jex 1104]

Really? I haven't gotten wet in gorka ever.

 

 

Yeah there's not that many clothing items that have 0% absorption, gorka is very close though at 5%, so it's *almost* waterproof but technically just water resistant 

If you go for a swim in gorkas you will see that they get a damp status, which will eventually lead to a cold status (edit: if you don't warm up by sprinting or fire). Firefighters outfit won't get a damp status.

 

Weird - we swam to the prison island for the first time and we had gorka clothing and got drenched.

[q.S Sachiel 470]

or you could introduce water proof spray like someone suggested in another thread and then everything can be waterproof.

 

/cue opera meme

 

what i'd really like to do is kill goats for lanolin (because as dean would say 'I AINT SHEARING NOTHING!') or melt down some cows for tallow.. something other than just picking up can A and applying to coat.

Edited October 8, 2015 by q.S Sachiel

[St. Jimmy 1631]

One "fashion fix" would be even the slots that different clothes have. But I believe this won't happen and many people would be against it. Other way would be just make better inventory system that doesn't rely on simple tetris.

 

Also the wet system is so simple and the status changes so quick that fixing that would fix partially this. Shower rain and rain are so different types of rain. In showers you can get wet very quickly because it rains like from a bucket but even rain might not get you wet quickly and you need to be a lot longer in the rain to get soaked through (sometimes it's so weak that doesn't even happen).

In DayZ it's always like the heaviest shower rain you can imagine instantly when it rains. Usually heavy shower rain doesn't start from nothing and there's always some mild shower that isn't too bad.

Edited October 8, 2015 by St. Jimmy

[GaryWalnuts 1680]

Weird - we swam to the prison island for the first time and we had gorka clothing and got drenched.

Yeah I should have clarified, by damp status I meant that gorka does absorb water.

[B4GEL 175]

How about instead of making more clothing waterproof, make the 100% waterproof clothing less so?

It's not realistic or a good game mechanic to have clothing that completely negates the effect of rain. You should still get wet and cold from standing around in the rain whatever you're wearing, getting wet should be something you inevitably have to deal with not something you never think about again once you find a raincoat or gorka. 

There is lot's of ways to avoid getting too wet, it doesn't have to mean sitting in a house until the rain stops: heatpacks and improvised heatpacks made by warming an object in a fire, traveling using tree cover, traveling using building cover, sprinting to stay warm, campfires and probably more. All these mechanics are ignored due to the abundance of waterproof clothing, exacerbating this problem is a bad idea.   

A more granular approach to water resistant clothing could solve the fashion issue and encourage tactical decision making, more waterproof clothes would make rain irrelevant. 

[IgnobleBasterd 161]

Yeah there's not that many clothing items that have 0% absorption, gorka is very close though at 5%, so it's *almost* waterproof but technically just water resistant 

If you go for a swim in gorkas you will see that they get a damp status, which will eventually lead to a cold status (edit: if you don't warm up by sprinting or fire). Firefighters outfit won't get a damp status.

Oh. I haven't actually submerged myself, I was just referring to me running around in heavy rain.

[Martmital 436]

I refuse to wear anything other then a full leisure suit.  Not fussy on the colour, but it has to be pristine!

[Funkmaster Rick 373]

The fashion issue results because many clothing articles haven't been implemented, balancing has been minimal, and the game is incomplete. Any changes will simply shift the meta, making some other piece of clothing the 'endgame' item for its slot. It's definitely not just the waterproofing: carrying capacity is king; water resistance is important while the rain is as common as it currently is, which is for testing purposes I suspect; damage absorption is important too, but will be turned on its head for a while if they release a new damage system.

 

Hell, as character speed is progressively decreased to realistic levels (which it will be, as has been stated in the developer blogs) and the weight/fatigue system comes into play, I suspect players will radically reconsider whether its worth sprinting through the rain for maximum-overdrive lootruns, which will have a further impact on the fashion trends of post-apocalyptic Chernarus.

 

Indeed, I think it's far too early to worry so much about everyone wearing similar clothing. That's just the metagame at the moment. Frankly, there are other systems I'd prefer the developers continue to work on rather than delay to address this.

[klesh 2423]

Am I the only one perfectly content to run around Chernarus in an outfit that I would typically actually have personal access to irl?

 

I dont want to be waterproof.  I dont want to carry a tent's worth of supplies on my back.  I want to have to make difficult choices as to what few supplies I can carry with me.  I don't care if I am visible or not; shit my favorite jacket is the orange or yellow quilted.  My starting jeans are just fine.  A pair of hiking boots makes sense. 

 

64+ items slot capacity with an automatic gun, 300+ rounds and camo everything thats waterproof just seems to negate much of the challenge the game presents at present.  Dare I say, easymode?

[Funkmaster Rick 373]

With persistent bases still being iffy and inventory space still at a somewhat unrealistic premium, I think aiming for a high capacity loadout is still a necessity; as long as there are items I will use rarely but would rather have (I'm looking at you, bulky and largely useless wilderness survival gear), I'm gonna need somewhere to keep it safe. At the moment, on my person is the only safe place for such things. Persistence items are difficult to hide, except for backpacks, which need to be checked daily, thus limiting their usefulness unless I restrict myself to a relatively small portion of the map to operate on, which seems not fun.

[PrincessRobotBubblegum 27]

A more granular approach to water resistant clothing could solve the fashion issue and encourage tactical decision making, more waterproof clothes would make rain irrelevant.

^ this. Making the current clothing options anymore more waterproof would make rain/getting wet/coldness effects in-game irrelevant. Yes, there are articles of clothing in the game that *should* have more realistic features to be waterproof or keep you warm that don't, but would make this virtual survival easier if they were. If anything, if they would make a way for us to create an improvised raincoat to use over non-waterproof clothing, but didn't keep you as warm, i'd go for that.

[Herkyl Puuro 52]

There have been waterproof spray for clothing in the market for years, this could be a cool add on in the game too. While those are far from being the perfect solution against the rain and they wear off after a while, they still work and with spray in the game you could make your personal favorite clothing somewhat water resistant. The devs could use the graphics of disinfectant spray or spray paint, just change the color and label.

 

What I'd like to see for example are rain ponchos, disposable rain jackets, plastic leggings etc. stuff which you could wear on your other clothing. These would take less inventory space and you wouldn't need to empty your coat to change a rain coat on.

[Bororm 1156]

They could also stand to make the military clothing just more rare.

[Martmital 436]

I can carry everything I'll ever need with a full tracksuit and a crafted bag.  What the hell are you guys carrying around?

[Herkyl Puuro 52]

I can carry everything I'll ever need with a full tracksuit and a crafted bag.  What the hell are you guys carrying around?

 

Usually: 3-4 canteens or water bottles, 4-6 cans of food, 2 sets of rags, a pistol, a smg/sawed off shotgun, a splint/morphine (if possible 2 morphines), a compass, a sewing kit, a leather kit, a can opener, a knife, cooking equipment, matches, ammunition for weapons I own

 

Sometimes: a melee weapon or two, fishing equipment, binoculars or a scope if gun has not, stuff to get a truck going, vitamins, heat packs, paint, attachments for weapons I might find, ammunition for weapons I might find

[FrigginTommyNoble 61]

Here's my main question: Are the "heat retention" and "water resistance" parameters configurable per piece of clothing?

 

If I were writing the clothing system, I would have an AbstractClothing class. This would provide the blueprint for how clothing works at the highest level. I would make different clothing types which inherit and/or override that functionality, and take arguments that would live in a config file (that could be changed quickly and easily for tuning). Basically:

 

AbstractJacket implements AbstractClothing

 

Ex:

 

in the config:

hikingJacket.properties.absorption = 0.1

hikingJacket.properties.heatRetention = 25

hikingJacket.properties.itemSlots = 4

hikingJacket.properties.<other props>

...

 

in the item class:

hikingJacket = new AbstractJacket(hikingJacket.properties)

 

AbstractJacket delegates its values to AbstractClothing, which contains the common, shared implementation for how clothing properties are calculated, aggregated, and hooked into the game systems.

 

This way, it would be utterly trivial to tune each clothing type by simply changing a line of config.

 

Also, if there needed to be broad, sweeping changes in how jackets work, you would only only have to make it in one place (AbstractJacket). If there were big changes needed for how clothing works in general, you would only make that in one place (AbstractClothing).

 

I have to believe BI knows this, and has done something similar. After all, this is a very basic OO design concept. So my real question is, how hard could it possibly be to simply tune the values of different clothing types, unless every clothing type has its implementation hand-cranked somehow, and any changes would break stuff? If it's easy, why doesn't a dev take 5 minutes and do it?

 

There may be excellent answers to these questions, so if you have any ideas, please let me know, I'm genuinely curious.

Edited October 9, 2015 by FrigginTommyNoble

[GaryWalnuts 1680]

Here's my main question: Are the "heat retention" and "water resistance" parameters configurable per piece of clothing?

-snip-

If it's easy, why doesn't a dev take 5 minutes and do it?

 

There may be excellent answers to these questions, so if you have any ideas, please let me know, I'm genuinely curious.

 

I don't know the first thing about coding but generally speaking: 

Each article of clothing has the properties

Absorption, Insulation, Biological, Ballistic, Bleed (and other stuff like size, weight, slots/capacity etc)

 

And the devs have made adjustments in the past, Gorka Jacket for example was 0% absorption (waterproof) a few patches ago, then it went to 20% iirc, and now it's 5%.  

It seems that they can tune it at will (with each new patch/update).  The properties are in the game files, client side, so I don't think they can adjust it "on the fly" like the CLE.

[OrLoK 16185]

Hello there

 

id like to wear *my* clothes in game.

 

Dark Brown Leather Greatcoat.

Biker Jacket

Black Jumper

Black Combat Trousers/Black waxed Jeans

Black combat boots

Optional: Black Fingerless Leather gloves.

 

I Like the colour black btw.

 

waterproofing and slots are not really a concern for me personally.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

[Jex 1104]

Am I the only one perfectly content to run around Chernarus in an outfit that I would typically actually have personal access to irl?

 

I dont want to be waterproof.  I dont want to carry a tent's worth of supplies on my back.  I want to have to make difficult choices as to what few supplies I can carry with me.  I don't care if I am visible or not; shit my favorite jacket is the orange or yellow quilted.  My starting jeans are just fine.  A pair of hiking boots makes sense. 

 

64+ items slot capacity with an automatic gun, 300+ rounds and camo everything thats waterproof just seems to negate much of the challenge the game presents at present.  Dare I say, easymode?

 

In RL you would want to be waterproof. Do you walk outside and get soaking wet in your normal clothes?

 

To the people that say you have nothing 100% waterproof but you can have 99.99% against rain and gortex is your friend ;)

 

I don't need loads of slots - I do want protection from the weather though. I'd like the option to wear normal clothes to run around in. My mate and I run all over the map. We just made our way from the NWAF down to Kamenka and across to the prison island and back again (after I rolled our truck by the base near Mishkino lol). In the MOD we ran everywhere. Having more clothing options only work when you have protection from the elements as well.

 

Some changes I'd like to see as other have posted;

 

1) Inventory system rework. A stone doesn't need to be 4 friggin slots. A pen or one piece of paper are half the size of a canteen or pair of binoculars? Have you seen how much crap you can fit into a large backpack? Stamina and weight are much better as well as speed reduction for heavy loadouts please.

 

2) Different seasons, different temperatures. There's not way I should be able to run around wearing clothes for the winter when it's summer without over heating. Different seasons should bring hotter and colder weather.

 

3) Make more of the jackets waterproof, add a poncho that can also be converted to a temporary tent. The hunting Jacket needs to be waterproof along with a lot more things.

 

4) No piece of clothing should be "end game" it's a piece of clothing. More clothing options would diminish this stupid "end game" mentality. There is no "End Game" in a survival game - it "ends" when you lose the game and "die" - End Game should be focused around survival elements like a hoe or a shovel rather than a gun and a jacket. Being able to make a camp that stores your water, tools and food is far more important than what you wear.

 

You leave things at your camp, and take with you what you need. Going to the NWAF? 1 canteen, some food weapon and ammo leaving as much room for collecting gear as possible. Going hunting, Weapon and some food and water plus a knife.

 

Survival is what we should be concentrating on not gear. How is it that gear became "end game" over the premise of the game which is survival. End game gear should really be an Axe, some form of fire lighter, a knife, sewing kits and medical supplies but then if you're only here to pewpew, you won't understand that.

[Tatanko 5591]

It's not realistic or a good game mechanic to have clothing that completely negates the effect of rain. You should still get wet and cold from standing around in the rain whatever you're wearing, getting wet should be something you inevitably have to deal with not something you never think about again once you find a raincoat or gorka.

I don't agree. I think it's entirely realistic for me to shove a raincoat into my backpack and put it on when it starts raining. That's exactly what I used to do as a boy scout when we were on long hikes. Perhaps make it 99% waterproof and make them harder to find, but it should still be an easy means of allowing me to operate in the rain with drastically minimized negative effects.

 

Besides, adventures like this one wouldn't be possible otherwise: http://imgur.com/a/feGuA. That night was SO MUCH FUN.

 

Oh. I haven't actually submerged myself, I was just referring to me running around in heavy rain.

Protecting yourself in the rain is significantly easier than staying dry during a swim, but I'm sure you know that  :P

 

If anything, if they would make a way for us to create an improvised raincoat to use over non-waterproof clothing, but didn't keep you as warm, i'd go for that.

I don't see a need for improvised rain gear unless they make raincoats harder to find. As it is, they take up very little inventory space and can be put on at a moment's notice.

 

Here's my main question: Are the "heat retention" and "water resistance" parameters configurable per piece of clothing?

Each article of clothing has the properties

Absorption, Insulation, Biological, Ballistic, Bleed (and other stuff like size, weight, slots/capacity etc)

As Gary said, each item of clothing has a few given properties including insulation and absorption. Studying those values in the files is exactly what led us to choosing a particular loadout for our swim to Debug Island -- maximizing insulation and completely eliminating absorption.

[Jex 1104]

Hello there

 

id like to wear *my* clothes in game.

 

Dark Brown Leather Greatcoat.

Biker Jacket

Black Jumper

Black Combat Trousers/Black waxed Jeans

Black combat boots

Optional: Black Fingerless Leather gloves.

 

I Like the colour black btw.

 

waterproofing and slots are not really a concern for me personally.

 

Rdgs

 

LoK

 

 

You're wearing that in RL right now??? :o

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:P :D