I wish we were forced to interact with others to survive...

[Grimey Rick 3417]

I read a lot of posts/threads on these boards pertaining to "I watch them to assess the threat", or "Until I know what they're up to, I hang back", or "I'm so scared of dying myself that I'll kill anyone I come across", etc. At the end of the day, we don't need anyone else to survive, and that makes me a sad panda. I don't need to assess anyone; if I feel like killing someone, I'll waste them. If I feel like helping someone, I'll risk it all.

 

But why?

 

For the sake of interaction? For a ten second high as I shoot someone who, in most cases, doesn't even know I'm there? I want to have to risk interacting with people I run into. I want to have to trade with people to survive. At any given point (even on a full server) you'll never run out of food if you keep heading inland to the less populated areas.

 

To get to the point, why are people so cautious? You can gear up in an hour or so. At this point, there's really not a lot of point to playing like a secret agent skulking about in the shadows unless you're up to no good. I know this game is a sandbox, but give us some incentive to work together. Some may say, "Wait for base building! The game will be forever fixed!" I doubt it. I doubt anything but zombies en masse will bring players together.

 

Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoy killing people in multi-player games. This mindset also applies to the lone bandit; "I really need what they have. If I don't get it, I will die." At this point you'd really have to consider the risk of engagement. You might die holding them up. Someone might hear you and shoot you both. There are so many possibilities, all because you were forced into taking a risk, as it should be. I really enjoy DayZ. I just want to know that these "risks" everyone talks about actually include some ramifications. The "risk" is death. But so what? Currently, 9 times out of 10 you'll spawn near Berezino or Svetlojarsk. Run in, grab a gun and some food, and bam, you're back in the game, ready to take some more "risks".

 

At the end of the day we don't need anyone else in this zombie survival game. Other players are the only enemy, even to the point of never trusting anyone. I'd like to think that as social creatures, we'd all band together in an apocalyptic situation and help each other. Certainly you'd have your token miscreants and psychopaths, but not like we're seeing now. I want to have to rely on others to live. If I can't find or form a group, I want to be overwhelmed by the environment. That's what DayZ is advertised as: a brutal, unforgiving "authentic" zombie survival game. I mean c'mon, they're labeling DayZ as an MMO! Where's the M? And the other M? All we have is the O! As it stands, this game could just as easily be single-player.

 

Anyway, what are your thoughts on this? I know this is still an alpha, but what do you think it would take to really bring people together and/or add some risk? We don't want another slaughter-fest like the mod, do we? Are other players going to be our only end-game opponent?

 

TL;DR:

• We need a common enemy. Will we see one?
• We need to have to interact with others. Will this ever come to pass?
• When we attempt to communicate with others, there needs to be an actual risk in so doing. Will said risk ever really be relevant?
• Where is the relentless, unforgiving environment of DayZ? Is it coming? Or will it become another watered-down arena in which people shoot each other?

EDIT: Removed snarky remark.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Grimey Rick

[Golden Child 73]

This was actually a good thread to read, I agree with basically everything you said. Although still have no ideas that will 100% fix the issues you have stated.

[Katana67 2907]

As a solo player, I don't think anyone should be outright forced to interact with others.

 

However, it should be much harder to go it alone than in a group. In terms of managing the zombie threat at the very least.

 

Which I think may answer your first and second points.

 

To the third, unless they actually address the detriments of third-party comms programs, no. There will never be risk in communicating with others, outside of the current risks of face-to-face communication (which are undercut as well by third-party programs).

 

To the fourth, yes it's coming.

 

EDIT - Plus, I just don't even encounter players frequently enough to warrant interaction in the first place. I suspect this may change with 100 player servers, but so long as there's a million servers with 3/40 players on them, rather than a few with 99/100 players, this will always be the case. That and this is an issue intensely wrapped up in server hopping, whereby empty servers are attractive to those who wish to exploit the persistent player location saving to gain undue access to loot.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Katana67

[creature 1189]

I'm sorry to be the one to break it to you after all the time you've put into this but, Dayz is about the choices you make, not about what the game makes you do.

 

The day I'm made to do something (other than maintain my characters health) by the game is the day it gets deleted from my PC.

[hannibaldaplaya 1095]

I personally believe the game needs to up the difficulty of surviving alone.

 

I am currently energized up north west, with enough food to get myself back to energized whenever it goes down, with enough ammunition to supply many men, and enough pistols to arm a group of three.

 

The big problem here is that the only thing I worry about is getting shot by another player, but if I do, who cares? I'm only cautious due to my engraved 1911 and even if I do die, I can gear up with normal stuff rather easily.

 

There are advantages to group play, don't get me wrong, but you can do fine without a group.

 

With a group, you have more then one player, you have safety in numbers, coordination, and someone to talk to. With yourself, you have you, your adrenaline, and your nerves, and in some moments your nerves can kill you.

 

Right now groups are only safety nets- They provide you safety in numbers when it comes to other players, not zombies, not starvation, not anything.

 

DayZ needs to have a threatening enviroment.

 

I want disease.

 

I want to fight starvation.

 

I want to have so few rounds I feel like I'm playing No More Room in Hell with an 11 year old who hoards all the bullets.

 

I want to be so scared of dying of cholera or something else I have a reason to carry more then just bandages.

 

I want to be afraid of approaching an area, player or not, I want to fear what may lie inside.

 

I want to be forced to hunt, when they do add hunting, instead of just doing it for fun.

 

I want to despise the enviroment for how harsh it is on me.

 

Right now, none of these things I want are in game. All my worries are centered are on other players. We need reasons to group together, and what reasons can we have?

 

- Make backpacks carry a lot less. You can carry so many magazines, so many rounds, so many cans of food, so many medical supplies, all with one backpack. Make us be forced to switch out certain things for other things. Make things bigger, make bags smaller.

 

- Add diseases, and add LOTS of diseases, and make them hard to diagnose. Make it so the symptoms are hard to determine what you have, other then diseases which are easy to determine, such as cholera, or dysentery, make it so that you have to be sure you have the disease you're going to treat before popping some antibiotic pills. Make it so self diagnosis can kill you or save you.

 

- Fix the zombies, if possible, and up the numbers, but make sure that you fix them so they are not just annoying little flies like they are now. Make the melee better, implement stealth, and up their damage and their numbers, but only after they are fixed.

 

- Make it so that a lot of things can be done with groups, make it so other players can help you in times of need. Make it so if only one of your legs are broken, one or two of your friends can be your crutches, practically. Add crutches, too, allow players with broken legs to hobble around with the assistance of crutches.

 

- Make it so medical treatment is hard to administer onto yourself. Add amputation, add infection (actual infections, not zombie disease or whatever), and force friends to consult Civil War medical techniques such as chopping off wounded limbs. Make gunshot wounds, slash wounds, and any open gash have a chance to be infected. Make it so that a shot to the arm can force you to be a one-armer.

 

- Etc.

[Deathlove 2286]

 

• We need to have to interact with others. Will this ever come to pass?
• We need a common enemy. Will we see one?
• When we attempt to communicate with others, there needs to be an actual risk in so doing. Will said risk ever really be relevant?
• Where is the relentless, unforgiving environment of DayZ? Is it coming? Or will it become another watered-down arena in which people shoot each other?

 

 1.  This will happen but everything will need an extreme overhaul otherwise no matter what they add in things will always be the same.

 2. Im assuming you mean the zombies. As of right now theres just so much that needs to be done with them even with the supposed "overhaul" who knows if it will be enough for ppl to want to band together rather than alone.

 3. This again will go back to my first one but without heavy real world dangers we will never see this. The kids will continue to KOS and run around COD style.

 4. As of right now "the relentless, unforgiving environment of DayZ" Is fighting every kid up to around high school with a mentality for Frag Fest action. It will always be a watered down arena game unless supplies get EXTREMELY rare as in more valuable than gold kind of stuff.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Deathlove

[SGT. Kalme 106]

I am still hoping the zombie hordes will come eventually. Zombies have to be a threat, to any player single or grouped.

 

I don't think interaction should be forced. What is wrong with keeping an eye on someone before rushing into contact? That yolo-attitude is all nice and such but it isn't very effective if we measure effectiveness in hours lived. For me, survival is the main goal of this game and while I don't avoid people at all costs, I don't seek for death either.

 

People play how people want.

 

Zombies should still be hell of a strong and in many numbers at once.

Edited May 3, 2014 by SGT. Kalme

[Electi 149]

Well i understood you, but...while reading that i wanted to kill some ppl on sight instead of talk, because if i will need to talk with some morons i meet 90% of time, well, that's shit i do not want to handle.In real life i really preferred be forever alone or with ppl i know then meet some strangers and trust them(because i do not trust ppl in real life, because it's me).
Just make dayz more dark game, where every day is struggle, every move for you decide your life and in God's sake - make life in dayz valuable, so ppl did not wanted to loose char.

UPD.1. More desises, lethal zombies, more zombies, more action and more fear, make health system so realistic so ppl would do not give a fuck about in 90% so medics who know everything would be valuable allies, make shooting more comlicated so ppl thought 10times more before do a shot.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Electi

[Irish. 4886]

story

inb4 my topic gets deleted, as 75% of them seem to <3

Rick, its simple:

 

Stop eating food on your own, and only allow yourself to be fed by others. This is your new RP position. You can say.. "my arms dont work, can you please feed me?"

 

You can force yourself to do whatever you wish. Why force others to do what you want?

Edited May 3, 2014 by lrish

[Whyherro123 2283]

-snip-

But there lies the rub. How do you make character's more valuable? Beards? Haha no.

I believe that the only way you can make a character's life more valuable is through the addition of skills, both "born-in" skills, and skills that can be taught. If you spawn in, and you find out you have the "First Aid Skill", where you can apply bandages faster and lessen the chance of infection, your character has value. Therefore, bandit clans could recruit you to take care of their combatants. Or, you could be a "Mechanic", be able to fix vehicles faster or more effectively, etc.

Then, there are skills that are learned, and can be taught. Firebuilding could be one, firearm usage could be another. With firearm usage, you improve the handling and accuracy of a weapon, UP TO THE WEAPONS LIMIT. For example, look at the World of Tanks MMO. Your starting crew usually starts at 50% efficiency, meaning your tank performs at 50% of the listed stats (accuracy, reload speed, accuracy, acceleration, etc). As you improve, your crew can get "better" (62%, 75%, etc.), until eventually your crew is at 100% efficiency, meaning they can use the full values of the tank characteristics. So, with an M4, you could start out with horrible rifle sway and range (emulating a lack of experience with the weapon), the progressing through use and experience to the weapon's baseline range and MOA. No sniper-rifle M4's, just the weapon performing as it was designed.

 

Both of these skill-sets can in turn be taught to other players, giving them value and ensuring the skills will survive when the character dies. For example, a character with the "Surgery" talent (allowing them to set broken bones, stitch up wounds, prescribe drugs, etc. Just pulling stuff off the top of my head here. Maybe "Surgeon" should be an 'end-game" talent?) takes another survivor under his wing as an apprentice. By lending the Surgeon assistance, the apprentice slowly gains skill in the "Surgery skill", so that way when the Surgeon shits the bed for whatever reason, the community isn't entirely SOL. Then, bandit groups could raid communities for these "living commodities", they can be traded in between survivor colonies, etc.

Anything that adds real value to a character is awesome. Anything that adds fake value, like beards, is not. 

A side note: why do you think people wouldn't shave? Being dirty all the time is a prime way to invite parasites to live on your body, a big no-no in long-term survival.

discuss

Edited May 3, 2014 by Whyherro123

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Agreed -- giving characters a randomly selected skill would greatly increase the value of one's life.

[BrainlessZombie 190]

I don't like you, but you've got a point, i agree.

[gibonez 3633]

Agreed -- giving characters a randomly selected skill would greatly increase the value of one's life.

 

Skills ..... yea thats exactly what this game needs less realism and more arcade bullshit.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Skills ..... yea thats exactly what this game needs less realism and more arcade bullshit.

 

Only make believe people have skills? Or did I miss something about reality? I'm not saying you have a skill you'd level up, just maybe expertise in a field before everything went to shit. Something to actually give someone's life meaning. That's the only way you're going to make this game something besides a 225km² killing arena.

 

Everything else they want to add is just going to enable people to kill others faster and with greater ease.

[Irish. 4886]

I want each player to have a randomly generated note on them when they spawn fresh that says something like:

 

I am Paul. I lived in Zelenogorsk. I was a Farmer. 

 

Simple. Gives a small reason to care when you spawn, something to attach to.. and something to carry with you as you meet other players. 

[gibonez 3633]

Only make believe people have skills? Or did I miss something about reality? I'm not saying you have a skill you'd level up, just maybe expertise in a field before everything went to shit. Something to actually give someone's life meaning. That's the only way you're going to make this game something besides a 225km² killing arena.

 

Everything else they want to add is just going to enable people to kill others faster and with greater ease.

 

No they do but within the context of the game having a skill would be an artificial crutch a player has that would prevent him from doing something.

 

It is a sandbox let people do what they want if they want to kill others faster so be it.

[St. Jimmy 1631]

When the game makes me to survive against environment and zombies and not those bored KoSers then I'm happy. Environment and zombies need to be hard enough, then we can focus on KoS.

 

Killing could be discouraged with high penalty for example if you've killed 3 people in 1 death you would be banned for 2 days when you die next. Some people say this would take out the sandbox, I say it won't because you could still kill as much as you like. You still have a choice to do what you want just take the consequences.

Just like in Elder Scroll games for example, if you murder someone you'll be chased by guards and put in the jail if they catch you. If you're clever and avoid those guards from that point onward you could live pretty freely. You have the choice to do that but it might not be the most rewarding way.

Edited May 3, 2014 by St. Jimmy

[gibonez 3633]

When the game makes me to survive against environment and zombies and not those bored KoSers then I'm happy. Environment and zombies need to be hard enough, then we can focus on KoS.

 

Killing could be discouraged with high penalty for example if you've killed 3 people in 1 death you would be banned for 2 days when you die next. Some people say this would take out the sandbox, I say it won't because you could still kill as much as you like. You still have a choice to do what you want just take the consequences.

Just like in Elder Scroll games for example, if you murder someone you'll be chased by guards and put in the jail if they catch you. If you're clever and avoid those guards from that point onward you could live pretty freely. You have the choice to do that but it might not be the most rewarding way.

 

WTF kind of logic is this ?

 

Again this is a sandbox punishing a playstyle just so you can have fun role playing is idiotic.

 

Only solution to your problems is to open up a PVE server or joining a PVE community once private hives come out.

[St. Jimmy 1631]

WTF kind of logic is this ?

 

Again this is a sandbox punishing a playstyle just so you can have fun role playing is idiotic.

 

Only solution to your problems is to open up a PVE server or joining a PVE community once private hives come out.

It's punishing because if people would really do that in the rate what is happening now there wouldn't be people left in the world. It's very logical. It wouldn't still take out killing so sandbox remains.

[gibonez 3633]

It's punishing because if people would really do that in the rate what is happening now there wouldn't be people left in the world. It's very logical. It wouldn't still take out killing so sandbox remains.

 

There wouldn't be any people left in the world ? and ?

 

It doesn't matter if you take out killing or not the simple fact is you are proposing a punishment for a very valid and very popular playstyle.

 

This does not conform to what a sandbox is.

[St. Jimmy 1631]

There wouldn't be any people left in the world ? and ?

 

It doesn't matter if you take out killing or not the simple fact is you are proposing a punishment for a very valid and very popular playstyle.

 

This does not conform to what a sandbox is.

And precisely DayZ isn't really a sandbox. And this is what DayZ Steam page says:

 

 

 

DayZ is a gritty, authentic, open-world survival horror hybrid-MMO game

It's just an open world survival game.

Edited May 3, 2014 by St. Jimmy

[Grimey Rick 3417]

The reason why people love zombie films and the zombie genre in general is the idea that everything you know could turn upside down in the freakiest and most terrifying way possible. This isn't a super volcano or a meteor. It's people killing people with the savagery of wild animals.

 

People watch the movies to try to identify with the characters and experience it themselves. Or I do, anyway. I don't have any attachment to my character at all. I don't care if I die because I can just spawn again and start rackin' up the frags. That, to me, is "arcade-y bullshit". To make this game authentic, our deaths need to mean something. We need a reason to spare others. We need a reason to not just run around Chernarus by ourselves playing a slow version of Counter-Strike.

 

If we can't simulate the main consequence of the game, then what's the point of simulating anything else?

[gibonez 3633]

And precisely DayZ isn't really a sandbox. And this is what DayZ Steam page says:

 

 

 

It's just an open world survival game.

 

Open world and sandbox can be used interchangeably

[xalienax 621]

I would like more things to increase the meta.

 

Things that increase the Incentive to work together in a meaningful way:

• More then baracading, full construction ala Epoch- but minus the permanent indestructable safe and AI trader which sort of break the gameplay balances. Bases that if you can devote hundreds of man hours to crafting and construction become veritable fortresses to both player and zed alike!
• Farming/Primitive agriculture. Perhaps the only sustainable way to "cut ties to big cities". will require such effort and time investement to maintain that it basicly mandates large clan/squad play.
• Increased zombie population, But only once they "play by the rules" anything solid for me must be solid for them. a leap must alway be a leap. players need to be able to anticipate and dodge leaps and escape aggro. this will not work with the current proximit zed respawn mechanic at all.
• Higher value assets Like urals and even a heli or APC style transport (without guns) that require an enormous team effort to repair and operate!

With all of that said- i am 100% AGAINST anything that EVER FORCES YOU TO PLAY A CERTAIN WAY or kills-off a certain play-style.

[Deathlove 2286]

WTF kind of logic is this ?

 

Again this is a sandbox punishing a playstyle just so you can have fun role playing is idiotic.

 

Only solution to your problems is to open up a PVE server or joining a PVE community once private hives come out.

LOL i wouldnt take it to that extreme ether but with faction systems like they have set up with ARMA 3s  Breaking Point, we could have a system set up that would deduct points and what not if you kill the wrong faction. Eventually making you a traitor and changing your skin slightly to tell whos who to watch out for.