Impression of Standalone (from a DayZ Mod Veteran)

[chrismgtis (DayZ) 35]

The question has been asked (it's even a sticky) "Is the game worth purchasing"? The game is absolutely not worth buying yet. Especially if you have access DayZ Mod already by owning Arma 2.

 

Keep in my mind that a lot of my gripe with this "alpha" is that I know without a doubt that very little progress will be made. We're about 2 years in since Dayz Mod became a success and SA is a major step backwards. I could accept progress in the future and expecting changes to be made, for the game to be moved into a beta stage and later on, better things toward "completion". But that will not ever be the case. We know the development team, who is now changing and the progress they have (not) made and now it's being handed over to another team who I have absolutely no faith in either.

 

We were told that this was a standalone version and would have lots of improvements and it was hyped up to be this great thing. It's not. What they essentially did was include the necessary Arma 2 assets to make the game playable as standalone and then removed 90% of the features and content that were available in DayZ Mod by either removing them entirely or turning them off. That includes things like vehicles, loot spawns which are down to about 5% available locations from DayZ Mod, etc. Sure, it's "alpha" but that label is an excuse and there just is not a legitimate reason for removing so much "content" (meaning what we had in DayZ Mod).

 

Make no mistake, BA was aware that they would make money on this (twice!) and that's why it is in our hands and I believe it was misrepresented.

 

Every bug and issue inherent with the Arma 2 engine remains present, including some new ones. We were made to believe that standalone would be this great new engine where all these issues wouldn't be a problem anymore. Just hours ago I was thrown off the edge of a building with my hands off the keyboard by the "running inertia" bug that forces you to continue running sometimes. That includes the insurmountable performance issues with the engine even with many high end systems (that we all know plague so many people in the Arma engines), bugs like zombies walking through walls and under the floor. Now there are new issues where for example you can't run fast enough with any item in your hand to get away from a zombie. So if you run out of ammo you're in big trouble, because you won't be able to run fast enough unless you have time to put away the item first.

 

Basically you just farm about 2 locations in the game and then you have absolutely nothing to do, other than camp those areas and kill other players. Absolutely nothing to do. SA has been absolutely stripped down to bare bones. The current loot system expects you to basically farm on 20 servers for hours, skipping around until you actually find a weapon and ammo that works with it. Ok, yes, it's alpha, but again, it's an excuse and the current system encourages ridiculous meta.

 

That may be what you assume to be expected of an "alpha", but in my opinion and MANY others, the standalone was nothing more than a cash grab scam. A way to get people to give BA more money (a second time) and to attract "new players" with promises and hype when very very little work has actually been done whatsoever in this alpha standalone to date. You are welcome to label standalone as an alpha because as per the claim this is where the real work would start in making the game what it was desired for it to be, but not for any technical reasons. That won't fly, because as I said, what they essentially did is simply include the necessary Arma assets to make the game playable without owning Arma 2. Regardless of what they tell you it wasn't much more difficult than that to make it work. At least very little additional work was necessary. 

 

Now Dean is leaving and from what I hear development is being handed off to some team that no one has ever heard of. Dean leaving can only be a good thing though. I don't want to talk down about the guy, because the original idea was a good one and he made DayZ Mod happen, but nothing fruitful has happened with it (DayZ Mod) in an extremely long time. Almost no work has been done all the way up to now in the standalone and that is with the support of BA and additional team members supposedly working. Though how additional people assisting can manage to do so little work, so slow, with so little progress in the time they've had is beyond me. 

 

Ask yourself if you played DayZ Mod, "What has actually happened that any of us can consider a move forward"? Nothing. Nothing at all. Very little progress whatsoever in almost 2 years.

 

Honestly I knew to expect very little, but I didn't expect the game to be stripped down to about 5% of what it once was with the excuse "It's alpha". Others may be that gullible, but I'm not buying the excuse.

Edited April 14, 2014 by chrismgtis

[HIHBGaming 14]

Heh, a post of misinformation or just a very uninformed first post. Well done!

[guppy22143 1081]

Allow me to address this hole-filled series of butthurt ranting.

The question has been asked (it's even a sticky) "Is the game worth purchasing"? The game is absolutely not worth buying yet. Especially if you have access DayZ Mod already by owning Arma 2.

 

Keep in my mind that a lot of my gripe with this "alpha" is that I know without a doubt that very little progress will be made. We're about 2 years in since Dayz Mod became a success and SA is a major step backwards. I could accept progress in the future and expecting changes to be made, for the game to be moved into a beta stage and later on, better things toward "completion". But that will not ever be the case. We know the development team, who is now changing and the progress they have (not) made and now it's being handed over to another team who I have absolutely no faith in either.

 

We were told that this was a standalone version and would have lots of improvements and it was hyped up to be this great thing. It's not. What they essentially did was include the necessary Arma 2 assets to make the game playable as standalone and then removed 90% of the features and content that were available in DayZ Mod by either removing them entirely or turning them off. That includes things like vehicles, loot spawns which are down to about 5% available locations from DayZ Mod, etc. Sure, it's "alpha" but that label is an excuse and there just is not a legitimate reason for removing so much "content" (meaning what we had in DayZ Mod).

 

Make no mistake, BA was aware that they would make money on this (twice!) and that's why it is in our hands and I believe it was misrepresented.

 

Every bug and issue inherent with the Arma 2 engine remains present, including some new ones. We were made to believe that standalone would be this great new engine where all these issues wouldn't be a problem anymore. Just hours ago I was thrown off the edge of a building with my hands off the keyboard by the "running inertia" bug that forces you to continue running sometimes. That includes the insurmountable performance issues with the engine even with many high end systems (that we all know plague so many people in the Arma engines), bugs like zombies walking through walls and under the floor. Now there are new issues where for example you can't run fast enough with any item in your hand to get away from a zombie. So if you run out of ammo you're in big trouble, because you won't be able to run fast enough unless you have time to put away the item first.

 

Basically you just farm about 2 locations in the game and then you have absolutely nothing to do, other than camp those areas and kill other players. Absolutely nothing to do. SA has been absolutely stripped down to bare bones. The current loot system expects you to basically farm on 20 servers for hours, skipping around until you actually find a weapon and ammo that works with it. Ok, yes, it's alpha, but again, it's an excuse and the current system encourages ridiculous meta.

 

That may be what you assume to be expected of an "alpha", but in my opinion and MANY others, the standalone was nothing more than a cash grab scam. A way to get people to give BA more money (a second time) and to attract "new players" with promises and hype when very very little work has actually been done whatsoever in this alpha standalone to date. You are welcome to label standalone as an alpha because as per the claim this is where the real work would start in making the game what it was desired for it to be, but not for any technical reasons. That won't fly, because as I said, what they essentially did is simply include the necessary Arma assets to make the game playable without owning Arma 2. Regardless of what they tell you it wasn't much more difficult than that to make it work. At least very little additional work was necessary. 

 

Now Dean is leaving and from what I hear development is being handed off to some team that no one has ever heard of. Dean leaving can only be a good thing though. I don't want to talk down about the guy, because the original idea was a good one and he made DayZ Mod happen, but nothing fruitful has happened with it (DayZ Mod) in an extremely long time. Almost no work has been done all the way up to now in the standalone and that is with the support of BA and additional team members supposedly working. Though how additional people assisting can manage to do so little work, so slow, with so little progress in the time they've had is beyond me. 

 

Ask yourself if you played DayZ Mod, "What has actually happened that any of us can consider a move forward"? Nothing. Nothing at all. Very little progress whatsoever in almost 2 years.

 

Honestly I knew to expect very little, but I didn't expect the game to be stripped down to about 5% of what it once was with the excuse "It's alpha". Others may be that gullible, but I'm not buying the excuse.

1. They have a plan set out for Beta in about a year. This game is only 20% finished, they are still making progress.

2.This isn't the ArmA 2 engine, this is a modified version of "Take On Helicopters'" engine. This is being built FROM THE GROUND UP. Nothing has been "removed or turned off". There are no bugs from ArmA's engine because this simply isn't arma's engine.

IT'S ALPHA, NOT AN EXCUSE, A FACT.

This game is only 20% done and progress WILL BE SLOW. Do you have any idea how long it takes to program a game?

 

Please, know what you are talking about before making a steaming rant on this forum and cutting down the developers and all the work they've put into this game.

[triage 117]

I will agree with him on once asset though. At this exact moment the Dayz Mod, Epoch, Origins,etc. All these Mods of the Dayz Mod currently have more content and more stuff for you to do. So at this POINT IN TIME. The Dayz mod is the best way to go in my honest opinion. 

[guppy22143 1081]

I will agree with him on once asset though. At this exact moment the Dayz Mod, Epoch, Origins,etc. All these Mods of the Dayz Mod currently have more content and more stuff for you to do. So at this POINT IN TIME. The Dayz mod is the best way to go in my honest opinion. 

Yeah, but as far as the engine goes; comparing the two is like comparing a ferarri to a helicopter.

[triage 117]

Yeah, but as far as the engine goes; comparing the two is like comparing a ferarri to a helicopter.

 

I agree, but the two engines do have some similarities. Take on helicopters was built of the Arma engine. I do see what you're saying though. 

[Jock McScottish 216]

A very heartfelt first post there, and I read it right through. I hear you on some things like its crap at the moment compared to the mod, cos I have went back to the mod, and wont play SA probably for at least another 6 months. However, I cant agree that SA is a con job, look at all the buildings you can enter. Imagine how great the mod would be with all those open buildings to explore. No sidechat on SA? Music to my ears and eyes. Makes immersion much better. Don't need to read or hear people talking absolute shit all the time.

 

Gearing up is amazing too. Choices of outfits and stuff, I love being able dress my guy the way I would. Once again, better immersion. Its strange defending a game Im not going to go back to for 6 months, but I see the progress, and its all good. Patience is the key my good man, what Rocket is trying to create has never been done in a game before, we are in uncharted territory so give him time, thats what I preach!

Edited April 15, 2014 by Jock McScottish

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

Make no mistake, BA was aware.

 

A way to get people to give BA more money

 

and that is with the support of BA 

Who or what is BA?

[odin_lowe 3686]

The mod will probably still be in alpha stage when the Stand Alone reaches "completion". (after the full release we'll still have updates, addons, and most notably mods.) I love both the different mods and the Stand Alone, but from my perspective the SA gets updated at a faster rate than the original "vanilla" mod of DayZ. I've started playing the mod around September 2012 and since then the mod has changed a lot, but from experience there's a huge difference in using a "construction set" to create a mod for an existing game and creating a game from an engine already in place. Yes the map is the "same" but the modifications to the engine itself and the creation from scratch to more than 80% of the game is huge thing and it's going pretty well in my opinion. At a faster rate than the mod also.

 

I love them both, but I'm already sold to the concept, the engine, and video games in general so I'm biased on this one. I respect them a lot for the courage they show with the unhealthy pressure releasing for a few an Alpha stage software to the public. :thumbsup:

 

They have my support.

[guppy22143 1081]

Who or what is BA?

Bohemia Interactive

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

Bohemia Interactive

 

Wouldn't that be, BI?

[chrismgtis (DayZ) 35]

Allow me to address this hole-filled series of butthurt ranting.

1. They have a plan set out for Beta in about a year. This game is only 20% finished, they are still making progress.

2.This isn't the ArmA 2 engine, this is a modified version of "Take On Helicopters'" engine. This is being built FROM THE GROUND UP. Nothing has been "removed or turned off". There are no bugs from ArmA's engine because this simply isn't arma's engine.

IT'S ALPHA, NOT AN EXCUSE, A FACT.

This game is only 20% done and progress WILL BE SLOW. Do you have any idea how long it takes to program a game?

 

Please, know what you are talking about before making a steaming rant on this forum and cutting down the developers and all the work they've put into this game.

 

 

I'm literally laughing my butt off right now. You're as clueless as you can possibly get and basking in the lies. The game DOES suffer from those same bugs. You might want to actually have experience with these engines before you make an absurd claim like that.

 

It's also just hilarious how developers can simply call their product an alpha or a beta and people like you that have no idea what is going on, bite the bait, line and sinker. So many companies are doing this and simply continuing to call their product an alpha/beta a year-two down the road well until what is full release (and many of them never drop it and people continue to defend these products claiming they are alpha/beta). DayZ players clearly fall into that crowd of gullible players. This will, I promise you, be the case for quite a long time with DayZ. If you seriously think that shifting the development to some no-name developers now that Dean is "leaving" is going to change anything, I feel sorry for you.

Edited April 15, 2014 by chrismgtis

[-Gews- 7443]

It's also just hilarious how developers can simply call their product an alpha or a beta and people like you that have no idea what is going on, bite the bait, line and sinker.

They only released it because everyone was continuously screaming for them to do so. Rocket himself said it was not nearly finished and many people would be better off not buying it. And they put a huge warning on the game's Steam page:

"WARNING: THIS GAME IS EARLY ACCESS ALPHA. PLEASE DO NOT PURCHASE IT UNLESS YOU WANT TO ACTIVELY SUPPORT DEVELOPMENT OF THE GAME AND ARE PREPARED TO HANDLE WITH SERIOUS ISSUES AND POSSIBLE INTERRUPTIONS OF GAME FUNCTIONING."

Whoever reads that, buys the game anyways, and then complains about the bugs is a fool.They made themselves quite clear, you could have kept your money in your wallet if you wished to do so. Sorry, as of yet there is no false advertising, no scam.

[Mullraugh 1151]

The game is amazing. I love it.

 

You expect too much.

Edited April 15, 2014 by mullraugh

[Weyland Yutani (DayZ) 1159]

Shifting the development to some no-name developers now that Dean is "leaving" is going to change anything.

 

You've said this several x, I haven't heard anything about that. What no-name devs are you referring to?

 

So your saying the team in this video below are being replaced?

 

[DickSharpe 23]

Did you not read the warnings telling you not to buy this game because it is not finished, is full of bugs and missing a lot of content?

 

Whats worse is that you feel the need to blame the devs both current and new (who have not even started working on or have done very little work on the game yet) for the fact that you did not read the warnings.  

 

How many times did you burn your hand before you learned that the stove is hot? 

 

PS: I'll agree with OP on one point. As far as content and stuff to do go, the mod is more fun. However you don't play the SA for fun, you play to test, fun is often a side effect of this testing.

Edited April 15, 2014 by DickSharpe

[Nails 150]

With so much exaggeration it's hard to take OP seriously.

[Nekosan 20]

With so much exaggeration it's hard to take OP seriously.

 

 

He's not exaggerating at all.

 

* This is a zombie game without zombies

* the base mechanics, especially the shooting, are DRAMATICALLY WORSE than in Arma. The gunplay resembles something from a bad halflife mod in the early 2000's.

* even basic mouse movement is worse than in any other game release within the last decade

* the ai is WORSE than what they had 2 weeks into mod release, zombies are basicallly the hostages from counterstrike... they chase the path you ran and hit you... it's TERRIBLE. Why does the highest profile zombie game ever made have the worst zombies?

 

Any hint of charm that was present in the early mod release is gone and what's left of the community seems to be latecomers who have been blinded by "oh my god we can play dressup Barbie".

 

None of the actual important features have seen any forward progress, it has all been backwards. "It's an alpha" is a bullshit excuse when you've already made tens of millions of dollars and you're just conducting bullshit busy work that has no bearing on the actual game.

 

 

 

So far DayZ is shaping up as the biggest waste of a chance that the game industry has ever seen, they're not making any progress and with games like The Division and H1Z1 on the radar they're not going to get a second chance.

Edited April 15, 2014 by Nekosan

[Nails 150]

He's not exaggerating at all.

 

* This is a zombie game without zombies

* the base mechanics, especially the shooting, are DRAMATICALLY WORSE than in Arma. The gunplay resembles something from a bad halflife mod in the early 2000's.

* even basic mouse movement is worse than in any other game release within the last decade

* the ai is WORSE than what they had 2 weeks into mod release, zombies are basicallly the hostages from counterstrike... they chase the path you ran and hit you... it's TERRIBLE. Why does the highest profile zombie game ever made have the worst zombies?

 

Any hint of charm that was present in the early mod release is gone and what's left of the community seems to be latecomers who have been blinded by "oh my god we can play dressup Barbie".

 

None of the actual important features have seen any forward progress, it has all been backwards. "It's an alpha" is a bullshit excuse when you've already made tens of millions of dollars and you're just conducting bullshit busy work that has no bearing on the actual game.

 

 

 

So far DayZ is shaping up as the biggest waste of a chance that the game industry has ever seen, they're not making any progress and with games like The Division and H1Z1 on the radar they're not going to get a second chance.

 

And you're too hyperbolic to take seriously. I don't really care what the early mod was like. Build a time machine and go be happy.

[umberfive 89]

There seem to be many developers here. In a game as complex as DayZ, there have to be considered many things and sometimes if you fix one thing, another breaks. That happens. It is bad, yeah. But that is also, why the game needs to be tested. We all volunteered to do so. We should be constructive and report errors. I can understand, that some people are disappointed when they die due to a glitch, considering they needed so much time to gear up. I cannot understand that many people are angry about the fact that they paid for an incomplete product. You knew better before purchasing. Yet the server-structure has to be maintained and that costs. It would cost much less if there were only a few tester. It is true that many whined and wanted early access. I also expected much from what I read and heard, but I knew that it was still in development. What I am looking for, is a more constructive discussion about errors, glitches and wanted features, not this kindergarden thing here.

[doctorbadsign 645]

I would have much preferred it if they did not release DayZ in Early Access.

 

It should have been a paid alpha via Kickstarter that is expensive enough that only a few thousand dedicated people would have bought it, and those people would no doubt understand and agree to be a part of testing. That way we wouldn't have hundreds of these topics a week. People would play the mod still or forget that it exists and then one day we get a finished DayZ standalone on Steam---which is either good or it isn't.

 

Right now it's so ambiguous. I don't even know if DayZ is going to be good, I don't know what features will remain at the end of it all, which bugs will remain. I don't know if the finished product will be the game I wanted when I paid for it. With a finished game you know that it is either shit or not. You know immediately whether you've wasted your money.

 

DayZ Alpha is like one long torturous wait to find out whether I just wasted £19.99.

Edited April 15, 2014 by DoctorBadSign

[Nails 150]

It's just a bad time right now for these boards due to the lack of a recent update. I think once the survival patch goes live there will be more constructive conversation.

 

As far as the people saying it's torture to wait to see if they wasted their money, I only have one question: Is it really that worth it to put yourself through that much anger over such a small amount? It costs more to take two people to the movies, or paying the months gas bill. I took it as a gamble, and the price will be low if Bohemia pulls this game off. If they don't, it's on us for paying early. Which is a debatable topic, but what's done is done.

[doctorbadsign 645]

It's just a bad time right now for these boards due to the lack of a recent update. I think once the survival patch goes live there will be more constructive conversation.

 

As far as the people saying it's torture to wait to see if they wasted their money, I only have one question: Is it really that worth it to put yourself through that much anger over such a small amount? It costs more to take two people to the movies, or paying the months gas bill. I took it as a gamble, and the price will be low if Bohemia pulls this game off. If they don't, it's on us for paying early. Which is a debatable topic, but what's done is done.

 

I'm not particularly angry, just trying to emphasize the fact that it is impossible to tell whether this game will be good at the end of all this.

[Nails 150]

I'm not particularly angry, just trying to emphasize the fact that it is impossible to tell whether this game will be good at the end of all this.

 

Agreed.

[Feuerbart 14]

Never played the Mod, liked SA from the first minute on.

It's alpha, with a lot more features to come, knocking down that deathmatch gameplay in Elektro/Berezino as it is now (which I dislike).

 

Stay calm, have some beans!