July Round-up: "I want the alpha" < "I want the alpha to be good"

[Julia_Shafer 18]

Also a valid reason to not release the game in it's current state is you gotta know that some people that are screaming to release it NOW would be those same exact people who say it's total shit when it gets released. Almost reminds me of the Duke Nukem Forever release. People over hyped it and were disappointing with the release because they had over hyped it.

[nebelwerfer (DayZ) 14]

Most people watched E3 and thought Fuck me if you go on one more time about fucking idiotic Motor bike Helmets Rocket you will be choked to death. Next we get Matt posting ( guess you gotta give him something to do ) about getting people to create Radio Stations.....ohhhhh dear.

People get misinformation and are confused about what is and what isnt true . WHY ??? Because Rocket chooses to use Reddit and Twitter to Post every thought that comes into his head and rarely if ever now Posts in the Forum, hence people getting confused with news and information.

Rocket said himself just recently he's probably not the best person to be leading the Development of this Game , and I agree with him. Get someone to run Production and Development that has the necessary qualifications and allow Rocket to experiment and test his Ideas.

This Game isnt going to be out until the end of the Year from what I can see, so get used to it fellas. Expect the same as you've got from day one sketchy , random and irregular information. Dont bother answering here I'm with the others on Reddit blurting out every thought I have in my head and debating everyone that disagrees with me , no hang on thats not me thats Rocket :D

Edit : Note I'm quite happy with the development time, just disapointed with the lack of information that was promised

this

[nebelwerfer (DayZ) 14]

Also a valid reason to not release the game in it's current state is you gotta know that some people that are screaming to release it NOW would be those same exact people who say it's total shit when it gets released. Almost reminds me of the Duke Nukem Forever release. People over hyped it and were disappointing with the release because they had over hyped it.

well people were disappointed because the company delayed the game again and again and again for too long. Always claiming they wanted to make it as good as it can get. And of course people increased their expectations because of it : "well its gotta be REALLY good if they take so long for itright ?"

By the time they rolled it out it was not even possible anymore to fullfill these expectations. Especially if its a game thats in production for too long: a lot of times these everlast-to-develope Titles take so long because they run into to trouble and problems, causing the final product to be mediocre

Edited July 10, 2013 by nebelwerfer

[mick17 93]

People who have no clue how game development works make me laugh... I get you're impatient. I want it to release like everybody else. It's just not something that you can just go and spend a day on and then, 'oh guyzez its in alphaz now.' It doesn't work like that. It takes allot of work and know how to do this. I've attempted to write code before and allot pf it goes way over my head. So I admire the developers who rewrote the engine and stuff in 6 months! That was an incredible feat if you ask me.

[Dr. Goner 661]

I hate hearing stuff from PR managers. I have no interest in making this game if I had to deal with a PR manager and some kind of PR strategy. Neither does bohemia.

I'm sure there are plenty of companies that would be glad to cater for you what you seem to want, but I am certainly not one of those people - for better or worse.

It's all good. I definitely understand your sentiment. I'm no fan of PR / marketing managers myself. But in this case, it might have been nice to have the correct tool for the job.

A good PR rep wouldn't actually be breathing down your neck. The task of a PR manager is to let operations proceed unhindered by the public relations needs of a company. Rocket, whether you like it or not, you are the PR manager. You set the PR strategy. Your Reddit posts, info here, and tweets are BIS's PR for DayZ.

[Wayze 549]

It's all good. I definitely understand your sentiment. I'm no fan of PR / marketing managers myself. But in this case, it might have been nice to have the correct tool for the job.

A good PR rep wouldn't actually be breathing down your neck. The task of a PR manager is to let operations proceed unhindered by the public relations needs of a company. Rocket, whether you like it or not, you are the PR manager. You set the PR strategy. Your Reddit posts, info here, and tweets are BIS's PR for DayZ.

I hate it when people try to make games to science. Games are art and Dean definitly knows his talent. If you have a good game you don't need PR, best example is the DayZ mod. Do you think Dean was thinking about what he wrote back then? He is not doing it now and hell who cares if he ever will. We just want a good game.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Wayze

[Hosty 647]

You are hard to impress. How about this?

Name now

[Rick bon Dock 5]

They have been updating http://steamdb.info/app/221100/#section_history a lot recently.

[Dr. Goner 661]

I hate it when people try to make games to science. Games are art and Dean definitly knows his talent. If you have a good game you don't need PR, best example is the DayZ mod. Do you think Dean was thinking about what he wrote back then? He is not doing it now and hell who cares if he ever will. We just want a good game.

Sorry, no offense,but what do you think Dean is doing when he posts on Reddit, Tweets about the game, or does a dev blog here? Think before you write please. Read my post carefully, make a logical unbiased conclusion, and then write a response. I understand you are attached to the game and its success, as am I, but please try to keep your wits about you and avoid being so defensive.

[Wayze 549]

Sorry, no offense,but what do you think Dean is doing when he posts on Reddit, Tweets about the game, or does a dev blog here? Think before you write please. Read my post carefully, make a logical unbiased conclusion, and then write a response. I understand you are attached to the game and its success, as am I, but please try to keep your wits about you and avoid being so defensive.

No offense, but read my post again. I don't like when people make games to science. PR? Like I said who cares about PR? If the game is good nobody will give a sh*t about what he wrote, said or did. Dean is able to make a good game and in the end everyone here will play it anyway even if they say "Oh I hate this won't play this game after he said that".

It is not about me attached to a game, it is about me hating people who think you could make a game with statistics, mathematical formulars and PR. It is about the vision Dean has and the talent to get the vision on screen. In that respect he is a genius.

So now Dean is supposed to pay for a PR manager even if it is obvious that he does not need one? Waste of money.

I understand that you think PR is important for DayZ, but at this point it is simply not.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Wayze

[Dr. Goner 661]

No offense, but read my post again. I don't like when people make games to science. PR? Like I said who cares about PR? If the game is good nobody will give a sh*t about what he wrote, said or did. Dean is able to make a good game and in the end everyone here will play it anyway even if they say "Oh I hate this won't play this game after he said that".

It is not about me attached to a game, it is about me hating people who think you could make a game with statistics, mathematical formulars and PR. It is about the vision Dean has and the talent to get the vision on screen. In that respect he is a genius.

So now Dean is supposed to pay for a PR manager even if it is obvious that he does not need one? Waste of money.

I understand that you think PR is important for DayZ, but at this point it is simply not.

Two things: 1. We'll have to agree to disagree that he could have benefited from a PR person. I would argue that he could have spent more time developing and the game might already be done if he had help on that end.

2. I don't think that PR is any more of a "science" than programming a game is. It stands for Public Relations just to make sure we are both talking about the same thing. A PR person would simply be in charge of doling out info to the public, addressing their concerns, and making sure the customer base is happy and informed.

Here's an example of how it's done really well. http://www.rockstargames.com/

Here's an example of how it's done well on a very small "indy" scale:http://projectzomboid.com/

[Wayze 549]

Two things: 1. We'll have to agree to disagree that he could have benefited from a PR person. I would argue that he could have spent more time developing and the game might already be done if he had help on that end.

2. I don't think that PR is any more of a "science" than programming a game is. It stands for Public Relations just to make sure we are both talking about the same thing. A PR person would simply be in charge of doling out info to the public, addressing their concerns, and making sure the customer base is happy and informed.

What benefit exactly? I like to hear Dean not some guy who does not even know what the hell DayZ is about. Also Dean shows that he is concerned about the community. A PR person? That's like saying "F*ck this shit I will pay for a guy who will get these freaks off my nerves.".

Here's an example of how it's done really well. http://www.rockstargames.com/

Here's an example of how it's done well on a very small "indy" scale:http://projectzomboid.com/

Rockstar one of the most greedy developers ever (bringing GTA5 to old gen consoles what the f*ck?) and some freaking indy game that nobody plays? These games need the PR. Maybe Rockstar does not need it, but they are greedy so they do it anyway.

Project zomboid definitly needs PR because it is not as good as DayZ (or maybe not as popular without marketing, I dont know the word). The guys from project zomboid actually want to make some money.

Dean is almost like a patriot for us. He is doing his PR on his way, he is making the game his way and he does not care if the game will be played just by hardcore players, because he actually cares about the hardcore players. Same reason why a PR manager (at this point) would be senseless. Why does he need a PR manager if he does not want to get the game played by everyone. He does it his style, he stays in direct contact with the community. Man, do you even know how rare this is? Probably in a year or two he won't talk with us either, then he will have his PR manager etc.

I really hope this won't happen, but money is changing people and it will maybe change Dean Hall too.

Believe me, if the time comes where Dean Hall gets his money, his PR manager etc you will tell everyone what an honor it was to talk with him, because now he is too big to have conversations with some players he does not need to care about.

Edit:

Ah and I forgot. Not the programming is making a game, it is the designing. Designing a game is an art, the programming is just the science you use to get the art on screen. But there are many people who think that designing a game is a science too. Look at all of the Call of Duty clones, they are exisiting because the developer, or most likely the publisher thinks that you can put a design in statistics. If everyone would design games by statistics and science there wouldn't be DayZ. Because DayZ is actually an art. In a designing perspective (if you take it by statisitcs and science) it is paradox that DayZ even got popular because statistics say that people don't want to play hard, frustrating games. As you see, these statistics are just stupid sh*t. You can't put the human joy in a statistic. But almost EVERY single publisher does exactly this. That's why the developer are not allowed to publish games which are special. The publisher are afraid they could be a fail. Better making a CoD Clon which will garantee you some sells, than making a game like DayZ which could be a total flop, but also a huge success.

"Programming a game is science" is like saying "using a pencil to make a straight line is science", but what has this to do with the picture (game).

Edited July 10, 2013 by Wayze

[fluxley 2228]

Name now

Prepare yourself https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=scarlett+johansson&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=XXHdUYvYEYOL0AXuooCoDw&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=1920&bih=993

[Dr. Goner 661]

Name now

Cannot... stop... looking...

[Dr. Goner 661]

Rockstar one of the most greedy developers ever (bringing GTA5 to old gen consoles what the f*ck?) and some freaking indy game that nobody plays? These games need the PR. Maybe Rockstar does not need it, but they are greedy so they do it anyway.

Project zomboid definitly needs PR because it is not as good as DayZ (or maybe not as popular without marketing, I dont know the word). The guys from project zomboid actually want to make some money.

Like I said we'll have to agree to disagree. I understand you love this game and feel extremely connected to it. But, I cannot abide the dissing of Project Zomboid. I learned about that game from Dean Hall. And also, Rockstar makes AMAZING games.

If you hate Rockstar because "they're greedy" maybe this example will impress you, though I doubt anything will impress you at this point.

http://tomclancy-the...home/index.aspx

Edited July 10, 2013 by DrGonzo

[Wayze 549]

Like I said we'll have to agree to disagree. I understand you love this game and feel extremely connected to it. But, I cannot abide the dissing of Project Zomboid. I learned about that game from Dean Hall. And also, Rockstar makes AMAZING games.

Did I diss Project Zomboid or the games Rockstar is making? Just saying the developers or Project Zomboid want money and Rockstar is really greedy (like I said why the f*ck are they bringing GTA5 to current gen consoles with mostly 20FPS? Money)

If you hate Rockstar because "they're greedy" maybe this is example will impress you, though I doubt anything will impress you at this point.

http://tomclancy-the...home/index.aspx

What has the division to do with Rockstar? Dude, I don't hate Rockstar and never said so. They are greedy, so the do PR. Project Zomboid wants money, so they use PR. Dean Hall wants a stable alpha with hardcore players so what does he need? I don't know, but no PR that's for sure.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Wayze

[OrLoK 16182]

Hello there

Firstly the lady in the pics has fat lips and saggy boobs, please try harder in future.

Secondly, it's been mentioned before that Dean reddits and tweets often as they are far simpler and faster means of communication in comparison to the forum.

To write on the forum and engage with multiple threads and users takes quite a bit of time unless one just wants a statement with no interaction, and thats not what the forums are for.

As for Dean going beyond our reach in terms of personality, well I dont exactly talk to him regularly, the last time we had any direct communication is when i tweeted him about descending Everest and that was via my real name rather than my forum identity.

I even doubt he is really aware of my existence as a mod (apart possibly from the couple of times where I have cocked up severely)

The point being, I dont think dean will become more aloof with the success of the SA any more than he is now.

He will still have a presence within the community as he currently does.

As to PR one could say he already has PR guys in the form of Matt and Smash.

Good PR management is a great thing to have, it doesnt mean that one has sold out or gone commercial.

Rgds

LoK

[Dr. Goner 661]

Did I diss Project Zomboid or the games Rockstar is making? Just saying the developers or Project Zomboid want money and Rockstar is really greedy (like I said why the f*ck are they bringing GTA5 to current gen consoles with mostly 20FPS? Money)

What has the division to do with Rockstar? Dude, I don't hate Rockstar and never said so. They are greedy, so the do PR. Project Zomboid wants money, so they use PR. Dean Hall wants a stable alpha with hardcore players so what does he need? I don't know, but no PR that's for sure.

I posted The Division development site as an example of good PR. Nothing more, nothing less. Also, I think Orlok summed it up well. PR is happening now regardless of whether the team wants it or not. I think Dean, Matt, and Smash are doing the best they can with what they've got and it's admirable. But my original comment "this is turning into a shit show" was, and still is, me expressing my personal opinion that the DayZ development team and BIS could benefit from someone with an in depth understanding of PR.

The company I work for has been looking for a PR/Marketing manager for over a year. There aren't a lot of great candidates out there and it is an extremely difficult position to fill, but most of the people I work with are programmers and designers. We aren't inherently social people, hence our career choice. We enjoy solitary work. Nothing makes most of us happier than 8-12 hours with our noses stuck against a monitor. This is why we want someone whose job is dealing with PR issues. Like I said the search has been tough, but we will eventually find the right person that understands what "voice" we want to use with the public.

If you think of DayZ as a company like any other (which it is because by definition a company is simply a group of people working together. It could be two it could be twenty thousand). As companies grow, roles are created and need to be filled. This is just a reality. Companies that don't understand their needs and think that a select few can do everything, fail 99% of the time, this is the truth.

[joe_mcentire 2073]

Two things: 1. We'll have to agree to disagree that he could have benefited from a PR person. I would argue that he could have spent more time developing and the game might already be done if he had help on that end.

2. I don't think that PR is any more of a "science" than programming a game is. It stands for Public Relations just to make sure we are both talking about the same thing. A PR person would simply be in charge of doling out info to the public, addressing their concerns, and making sure the customer base is happy and informed.

Here's an example of how it's done really well. http://www.rockstargames.com/

Here's an example of how it's done well on a very small "indy" scale:http://projectzomboid.com/

i guess you could explain dayz and its community and all around that with facebook:

DayZ is like a party you post on facebook. You invite 20 people to your house and end up with 2000 around your house.

Now imagine Dean and his devs as hosts....

[HardlyThoughtOf 8]

"The Alpha needs to be Good and not rushed." This is true, you'll loose mass numbers if its bad and rushed. But yet again you might not.

[nebelwerfer (DayZ) 14]

i am seriously doubting that. its an alpha and , as many people here already said, dayZ is for hardcore players anyway. most of these players played the mod and are used to laggy glitching bug infested versions of DayZ. Im not even saying it will be less successful if pushed back. I just think the dev process will actually speed up if released sooner. Simply because they will have a lot more feedback data on how well the game scales on different systems, how well the game mechanics work etc. Without damaging reputation or anything since its just an ALPHA.

tldr: Release the Alpha SOONER, and speed up the DEV Process in the long run.

It sure worked fine on the mod did it ? and with a reasonable price it will also on the SA in my eyes.

Edited July 10, 2013 by nebelwerfer

[nebelwerfer (DayZ) 14]

Not sure if this is valid - found it on reddit.

Edited July 10, 2013 by nebelwerfer

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

i am seriously doubting that. its an alpha and , as many people here already said, dayZ is for hardcore players anyway. most of these players played the mod and are used to laggy glitching bug infested versions of DayZ. Im not even saying it will be less successful if pushed back. I just think the dev process will actually speed up if released sooner. Simply because they will have a lot more feedback data on how well the game scales on different systems, how well the game mechanics work etc. Without damaging reputation or anything since its just an ALPHA.

tldr: Release the Alpha SOONER, and speed up the DEV Process in the long run.

It sure worked fine on the mod did it ? and with a reasonable price it will also on the SA in my eyes.

The fundamental difference between the mod and the SA is that people will be paying money for the SA, with that comes certain expectations and consumer rights.

People are/were happy (mostly) to accept the flaws of the mod because it's a free mod and most understand the limitations modding entails. Even if they weren't happy with it they had no path of recourse and Dean could just say "deal with it, I owe you nothing, take it or leave it." When you're dealing with paying customers that is not the case.

Anyhoo, as stated frequently by Dean himself, he's not making us wait due to a sadistic nature, he's clearly said he wants it released for public feedback ASAP but the fact remains certain things have to be taken care of and put in place first, that's just how it is. If that's not done we'll literally have nothing to play or offer our feedback on.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Fraggle

[Ombra 17]

This may seem ridiculous, but an Alpha pre-order during the SSS would be nice. Just so I can be sure as to how much I need to put away.

[Dekkymane 145]

I want the alpha <> I want the alpha to be good. There.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Dekkymane