Debate on hit markers

[Astalonte 48]

I m gonna leave a post here I saw somewhere in Reddit.  It express exactly what I think in this issue.

Honestly I m not the kind complaining in twitter all the time but in this ocassion....

Very strongly disagree with the directional hit indicator. We have our eyes and ears for that. Even if it doesn't work perfectly, it's still more skill based as well as weighs heavily on each players situational awareness. You guys don't hold players hands, why start doing that now? This is a step in the wrong direction. EVERYTHING else in this patch is awesome and great job, but this particular thing isn't the way to go about this topic, it's too much like an arcade game. Adding an onscreen bleed effect around the perimeter of the screen is a good idea, I play without HUD and would love this.

 

It need to be removed completely

[William Sternritter 449]

From this video, so I'm looking forward to more and have my own experience as well, it looks more like an indicator where the hit is landing. Name of the item in patch notes is "UI indicator when being hit". That by itself to me is redundant. We already have audio and visual indicators that we're being hit. Furthermore, directional audio works in this game and to this day it never seemed to be an issue locating where hits are coming from. Spotting the assailant, if it is a ranged attack, is another topic entirely.   

In my opinion, this adds nothing to enhance the experience. On the contrary it clutters the screen with an awful effect, which looks like straight from early 2000's game. I sincerely believe that in combination with screen blackouts that we already have when getting hit, this will further reduce players ability to respond to ongoing attacks effectively. 

[Artyom Kalinin 15]

Agree with you. It looks not only silly, but also bad.
Game becoming more easier and friendlier to casuals. It seems like dev team want to transform DayZ into COD-Fortnite-*shittygametitle* with zombies or smth like this.

[p4nnus 42]

On 11/5/2021 at 3:31 PM, William Sternritter said:

From this video, so I'm looking forward to more and have my own experience as well, it looks more like an indicator where the hit is landing. Name of the item in patch notes is "UI indicator when being hit". That by itself to me is redundant. We already have audio and visual indicators that we're being hit. Furthermore, directional audio works in this game and to this day it never seemed to be an issue locating where hits are coming from. Spotting the assailant, if it is a ranged attack, is another topic entirely.   

In my opinion, this adds nothing to enhance the experience. On the contrary it clutters the screen with an awful effect, which looks like straight from early 2000's game. I sincerely believe that in combination with screen blackouts that we already have when getting hit, this will further reduce players ability to respond to ongoing attacks effectively. 

This is not the case tho. Its indicating the direction, as for example WOBO has shown in his video. This means that in situations where the player doesnt know the direction, he will gain this information on a silver platter. Its total and utter BS.

On 11/5/2021 at 3:18 PM, Astalonte said:

Very strongly disagree with the directional hit indicator. We have our eyes and ears for that. Even if it doesn't work perfectly, it's still more skill based as well as weighs heavily on each players situational awareness. You guys don't hold players hands, why start doing that now? This is a step in the wrong direction.

I agree with you. Its ridiculously tone deaf from BI to even think of this. They are clearly looking for a more casual audience, probably mostly on consoles. Im gonna refund the game if this happens, its not a HC survival game anymore if this sort of feature is added.

Edited November 8, 2021 by p4nnus

[-Gews- 7443]

I just want server owners to have the option to disable the directional indicator. Not even the hit indicator entirely, just the directional part. And I'd choose to play on those community servers.

[Derleth 1357]

I am fairly okay with the basic idea - if I get hit I will know where I got hit - but the current implementation in experimental is awful. Three things:

1. First of all it needs to change so it doesn't show the direction to the source of the damage but to where you were actually hit. This is so obvious I couldn't believe it when I saw the ricochet footage in Wobo's video. This is must be a mistake?
2. The blood splotches are ugly, invasive and really should not be implemented in the current expy version. There's already too much stuff on the screen as is. If possible, you should instead work with the vignette flash and make it slightly more intense in the direction of the hit. No need for extra splotches.
3. If implemented to stable, there must be a server side toggle to disable it - and this should be default, at least on "hardcore" servers.

[Shift 25]

Yeah i dont like it either.

[green_mtn_grandbob 594]

If every one used  a bow, then the arrow sticking in your body would show the direction it came from.  LOL

Maybe Dean would lone BI his animator to do the bow for us. LOL

Edited November 9, 2021 by green_mtn_grandbob

[nemorus 258]

What's there to debate? The update clearly shows that this game is getting scraps and not real attention it deserves after all this time. It's stalling - not making progress.

[EzyStriderPS4 191]

Yeah that is aweful in the video. I have never had an issue with hearing the general direction shots are coming from. No one needs this in a hardcore title. Really watering things down, first with shock, now this garbage.

[Parazight 1599]

On 11/8/2021 at 7:37 PM, -Gews- said:

I just want server owners to have the option to disable the directional indicator. Not even the hit indicator entirely, just the directional part. And I'd choose to play on those community servers.

This is what I want, too.

I'm not sure how well a simulator can mimic real life combat when it comes to hit indicators.  I've never been shot in real life but I imagine that your adrenaline level would play a significant role in hit detection.  But sometimes you have adrenaline and sometimes you don't.

Maybe have the indicator flash in one spot on the screen to indicate that you've just taken a bullet and are hemorrhaging blood.  This is a fair thing for a game to have.  And for designers to want in their game, right?

 

[-Gews- 7443]

3 hours ago, Parazight said:

Maybe have the indicator flash in one spot on the screen to indicate that you've just taken a bullet and are hemorrhaging blood.  This is a fair thing for a game to have.  And for designers to want in their game, right?

Nothing unrealistic about a hit indicator, in general. Usually the hit itself has been pretty obvious in DayZ. Unrealistic is when a player with a minor cut could bleed half to death without noticing it because the game only gave a tiny chevron to inform him.

[DefectiveWater 536]

1 hour ago, -Gews- said:

Unrealistic is when a player with a minor cut could bleed half to death without noticing it because the game only gave a tiny chevron to inform him.

Not to mention that you bleed at the same speed from a .308, .22, an axe and a zombie attack

Edited November 10, 2021 by DefectiveWater

[THEGordonFreeman 664]

17 hours ago, nemorus said:

What's there to debate? The update clearly shows that this game is getting scraps and not real attention it deserves after all this time. It's stalling - not making progress.

It's not stalling exactly, it's catering to the Console Plebes, this has been BI's goal all along.  The console guys can't figure out where they are hit from so, BI's answer is to make it like Fortnite.   Keeps people complaining about something else other than their failures to make vehicles something worth using in the game.  If they had kept Survivor Games and let a modder do all this stuff specifically for that game mode, then they might could have pulled off some kind of low key hardcore competitive shooter.... but they didn't, instead they've just unleashed this vomit no one asked for onto the dwindling player base in order to keep everyone from focusing on real issues.  Remember, the engine switch was to get this game onto consoles, not to actually make the game better, while some things are better, there are so many real problems, they have just decided it's best if we all ignore it and look at this new mechanic that they know will piss off half of the community, namely the PC half.  If they were actually interested in making the game better, cars would have been a priority.  Or how about a little bit better job at alerting the player he is bleeding than a small icon, I mean, that is actually something that would improve things.

[DayzDayzFanboy 1280]

19 minutes ago, THEGordonFreeman said:

It's not stalling exactly, it's catering to the Console Plebes, this has been BI's goal all along.  The console guys can't figure out where they are hit from so, BI's answer is to make it like Fortnite.   Keeps people complaining about something else other than their failures to make vehicles something worth using in the game.  If they had kept Survivor Games and let a modder do all this stuff specifically for that game mode, then they might could have pulled off some kind of low key hardcore competitive shooter.... but they didn't, instead they've just unleashed this vomit no one asked for onto the dwindling player base in order to keep everyone from focusing on real issues.  Remember, the engine switch was to get this game onto consoles, not to actually make the game better, while some things are better, there are so many real problems, they have just decided it's best if we all ignore it and look at this new mechanic that they know will piss off half of the community, namely the PC half.  If they were actually interested in making the game better, cars would have been a priority.  Or how about a little bit better job at alerting the player he is bleeding than a small icon, I mean, that is actually something that would improve things.

Sorry, but I disagree. As a console player I certainly don't want hit markers. Your comment is shallow and unfounded. 

[Just Caused 423]

4 hours ago, THEGordonFreeman said:

It's not stalling exactly, it's catering to the Console Plebes, this has been BI's goal all along.  The console guys can't figure out where they are hit from so, BI's answer is to make it like Fortnite.   Keeps people complaining about something else other than their failures to make vehicles something worth using in the game.  If they had kept Survivor Games and let a modder do all this stuff specifically for that game mode, then they might could have pulled off some kind of low key hardcore competitive shooter.... but they didn't, instead they've just unleashed this vomit no one asked for onto the dwindling player base in order to keep everyone from focusing on real issues.  Remember, the engine switch was to get this game onto consoles, not to actually make the game better, while some things are better, there are so many real problems, they have just decided it's best if we all ignore it and look at this new mechanic that they know will piss off half of the community, namely the PC half.  If they were actually interested in making the game better, cars would have been a priority.  Or how about a little bit better job at alerting the player he is bleeding than a small icon, I mean, that is actually something that would improve things.

Off-topic, but I just have to say that I find it funny that every single one of your posts is about the cars.

 

Also, big middle finger to all DayZ veterans by adding this feature. Majority of player base want it removed.

Edited November 10, 2021 by Just Caused

[Derleth 1357]

On 11/10/2021 at 6:43 AM, Parazight said:

This is what I want, too.

I'm not sure how well a simulator can mimic real life combat when it comes to hit indicators.  I've never been shot in real life but I imagine that your adrenaline level would play a significant role in hit detection.  But sometimes you have adrenaline and sometimes you don't.

Maybe have the indicator flash in one spot on the screen to indicate that you've just taken a bullet and are hemorrhaging blood.  This is a fair thing for a game to have.  And for designers to want in their game, right?

 

I've never been shot in real life (other than paintballs and air gun pellets and that doesn't really count, does it...) but I have a couple times been unexpectedly and violently struck by other things. And when it happens and you lie stunned on the ground watching little birds flying around in circles as in a bloody cartoon, you simply don't have any idea where it came from. You're hurting, you're out of breath, you're confused. Once you've recovered from that initial stun you can sometimes process what happened and figure out the whats and wherefroms of it, but not always. And with a bullet wound I can only imagine it would be a million times more difficult, and that's not considering the physical trauma. Most importantly it is not something that you would know instantly just from the hit itself - so the way the game worked before does the job well. You have sound, you have the flashing "I got hit" vignette, the player grunts in pain, I think the stagger animation can even tip off general direction. That's enough. A big ugly red splotch on the screen is uncalled for and just not DayZ.

So again - if added to stable, a server side toggle option is an absolute MUST. And have it off by default, at the very least on 1PP ("hardcore") servers.

For on screen feedback that you are bleeding, the sVisual mod does it very well, I like that effect. Looking at similar games Scum does it by having blood drops running across the screen, that looks a bit silly to me so I hope they don't go that way.

Edited November 11, 2021 by Derleth

[THEGordonFreeman 664]

16 hours ago, Just Caused said:

Off-topic, but I just have to say that I find it funny that every single one of your posts is about the cars.

Also, big middle finger to all DayZ veterans by adding this feature. Majority of player base want it removed.

There is a very good reason I have focused on vehicles.  I have been buying and playing BI games since Operation Flashpoint.  BI is NOTORIOUS for half-finishing games, and even more notorious for introducing big mechanics into a game and just abandoning them, never truly fixing the issues that keep it from becoming good.   I suspected the moment they changed vehicles and made them server side that it was a candidate for abandonment, and thus far, they have proven me right.  Arma 3 is the only exception... it has one or two game mechanics that they actually did fix, after nearly 7 years, but they did fix them, so they get some props, but overall, we are still in "D-" territory if they had to be graded, and it's always the same.  Start the smoke and mirrors with something new and shiny nobody really wants to get people to look away from the real issues within the game.   And speaking of Arma 3, vehicles work amazingly well.  So for them to go from great to utter and complete garbage shows just how inept their thought processes are.  Just like this hitmarker stuff.  In spite of the plebes stating I've hurt their feelings, there is no other reason to put in hit markers in a survival game.  You just tell the player he has been hit or in shock.  Also, why go through all the trouble of simulating bullet direction, sound, ricochet and all of that if you are just going to hand hold the baby and show the direction of the bullet on screen.  Seems like you are wasting a ton of resources to simulate all of that only to throw a graphic up on screen telling the player where to look. 

It should be evident that DayZ Standalone was never meant for console.  BI saw a money grab opportunity and needed to test their new "engine" on console for Arma 4 or whatever they plan to do next.  So the game we all love got new guts that aren't working all that great and will likely never be fixed, or at least they won't be fixed until the game is irrelevant.  I applaud BI for continuing to work on Arma 3, but the game is only relevant to a handful of people at this point compared to other titles.  The same thing is happening to DayZ Standalone.  It sucks, our zombie survival game is STILL the best game that defines this genre IN SPITE of how bad BI treats it.  It almost seems like in their mind that just putting a handful of people on a game for 10 years is sufficient and they measure their success in keeping a couple of thousand players interested in their game for a decade or more.  I don't entirely follow that logic.  But again, the top company brass thinks Ylands is the best thing since sliced bread, and puts a ton of resources into it, and NOBODY plays that game.

[Derleth 1357]

Server side toggle and configuration options added today, many thanks for quick response to community concerns.

[Tiago Schauble 0]

there's a million mods for that, don't destroy vannila's immersion

what would be the next step to remove the night? make night vision useless too? like they did with suppressor.