Realism Vs Enjoyment

[Count_Grishnackh 65]

Have said this numerous times in discussion with my dayz buddies.

Some things on their (Bohemia's) realism scale are way too reslistic while others aren't very realistic ... theres no harmony... no balance.

The trick is trying to get all of these factors within the same area on the realism scale.... Im all for hardcore realism if its done right

 

Prefect example... currently the food situation:

Sure go ahead, make food really scarce... but then to counter that, make us not get hungry/thirsty every 2 mins

OR

Have food abundant and easy to find so we have to eat every 2 mins

[TheScruffyBandit 382]

It's a game about zombies.... how much realism could there be?? I play games to take a break from reality.

The game is about infected and deranged humans with an incurable rabies like virus, Zeds in DayZ are not the undead.

 

Edited April 9, 2015 by TheScruffyBandit

[Reg Park 160]

Having zombies or really anything else means squat when it comes to how realistic the game wants or intends to be.

 

If you play games to take a break from reality then perhaps Bohemia Interactive games are not up your alley, realism is the one thing they are known for.

perhaps you're right, been playing h1z1 lately. id say it's enjoyable but not quite as much adrenaline rush in comparison.

but i do have GTA 5 already preloaded on steam so that's ready to go. we'll see.

[Reg Park 160]

The game is about infected and deranged humans with an incurable rabies like virus, Zeds in DayZ are not the undead.

 

whaa, okay im sorry.

[rybec 339]

I'd have an issue with the realism vs enjoyment if it meant changing how well a weapon performs for "balance".

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

"Just how hard is DayZ supposed to be? What is the targeted experience here? How valuable should items, and thus what I carry be to me as a player?
I like to think we're pretty up front about exactly what DayZ is and is supposed to be, and as we move closer to 1.0 more and more of this will begin to take shape. 
Once, when asked how valuable tools and resources should be to a player - on a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is finding everything you need without issue, and 10 is elation over finding a can of beans (I'm paraphrasing here) Dean was quoted saying an emphatic "10"."

 

http://forums.dayzga...port-08-apr-15/

 

Spamming QQ threads on the forum is not going to change anything.

 

If what you are experiencing in DayZ is currently not enjoyable, you need to take a break and check back with the progress later.

 

I took 6 months off when I found DayZ wasn't enjoyable.

 

This also avoids getting burnt out on the game and really shows the amount of work that gets done in that time when you rejoin.

 

If vanilla DayZ turns out to be not to your liking, then you may find a mod that suits your taste.

[pauldog 18]

Authentic and realistic is not the same thing.  Dayz is not designed to be realistic.

Are you saying it is authentic? Because there have been so many Zombie apocalypse that we know how to make an authentic game about them!? It can be neither authentic nor realistic but it can be fun to play.

[pauldog 18]

How far is it..? 30kms..? I will just sprint there carrying all my stuff, have a tin of beans when I get there, that'll sort me out

The helmet, boots and all the clothes I just found all fit me perfectly, what are the chances...?

 

 

Cracking me up - thank you! Love a good laugh to start the day!

[Parazight 1599]

Are you saying it is authentic? Because there have been so many Zombie apocalypse that we know how to make an authentic game about them!? It can be neither authentic nor realistic but it can be fun to play.

All I'm saying is that the intention is to make DayZ authentic.  The game isn't finished, so natually it doesn't feel as authentic as it will at launch.

 

Realistic is a terrible goal for a video game.  You're in pretty minimal danger sitting in a chair, pressing on a keyboard.

[Bonappetit 117]

The reason you starve here faster is to adjust it to the movement speed. While here you can run across the map in matter of an hour in real life it would probably take you a day or so, I assume they balanced it solely for that reason. 

[Sebidee 167]

Are you saying it is authentic? Because there have been so many Zombie apocalypse that we know how to make an authentic game about them!? It can be neither authentic nor realistic but it can be fun to play.

 

The thing about zombie apocolypses is that they are all about the theory. It's basically what would real life be like if you added in zombies. The zombies themselves don't necessarily have to make sense but everything else does.

[bain 23]

I'm just surprised. Really, surviving is not that hard. I wouldn't mind it being a tad more difficult. I do need to hit the apple trees right after spawning, but a couple towns north of the coast have all the food and gear you need. Without much effort I'm end game in about the same amount of time as before. The only difference is I'm nigh unarmed for much longer in the beginning.

Edited April 10, 2015 by Jarvis

[Pyongo Bongo 240]

I love this patch, I dont get why so many people get crayZ because of it

[Schweinsteiger 107]

Having zombies or really anything else means squat when it comes to how realistic the game wants or intends to be.

 

If you play games to take a break from reality then perhaps Bohemia Interactive games are not up your alley, realism is the one thing they are known for.

These types of responses are ridiculous.

 

Get it through your head, it is a game. We could all name two dozen unrealistic things about Dayz in less then a minute. It isn't any fun starving in less then an hour (how realistic is that) and there's nothing fun or "hardcore" about that at all, it's just stupid. For a game in which fanboys cry about the realism it isn't very realistic. And no, people don't play Bohemia games because they're so realistic (did I mention they aren't very realistic yet?) they play them because SOME elements are realistic, like how the guns handle and how good the graphics look, etc.

 

Telling someone a game isn't for them is just foolish and rude. If they want to purposely tank DayZ and develope it for a handful of players (there's lots of money to be made catering to a handful of gamers who think they're somehow elite because they can pick more apples then everyone else - NOT) then by all means devs, keep going in this unrealistic direction. If you want to make money and produce a fun game don't make it a grind fest, fix the infected and think out of the box. Thus far, even though I really like Dayz, it isn't super-original to begin with at the moment, Its still a loot and shoot game for the most part (and I've done plenty of hunting and crafting, you can only hang out in the wilderness for so long).

 

The best solution I see at the moment is server rule sets like they're using over at H1Z1. Believe it or not you can please the majority of your players and still give the "hardcore" guys a great experience. We just want infected that work properly and some original game content (something other then just loot and shoot). If DayZ is truly a game where you make your own story then we need the tools to do so, don't make the landscape so unforgiving that it becomes a chore and a bore to survive.

 

Again, no one starves to death in an hour or two. It should take way longer in game.

 

P.S.,

 

"Just how hard is DayZ supposed to be? What is the targeted experience here? How valuable should items, and thus what I carry be to me as a player?

I like to think we're pretty up front about exactly what DayZ is and is supposed to be, and as we move closer to 1.0 more and more of this will begin to take shape. 

Once, when asked how valuable tools and resources should be to a player - on a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is finding everything you need without issue, and 10 is elation over finding a can of beans (I'm paraphrasing here) Dean was quoted saying an emphatic "10"."

 

Good luck catering to a handful of players then (and by the way, Dean is gone). If finding a can of beans is supposed to make me excited then this game is definitely headed into the wrong direction. Most of us aren't saying or even asking for an easy game where everything is handed to us, but there has to be much more purpose in this game. No one wants another H1Z1 around here, but we do want a game that's fun to play. And super-quick infected (why the hell is the game called DayZ if there aren't any zombies?) with screwed up hit boxes and teleportation skills isn't what I would call hard or difficult, I'd call it all bugged up.

 

Don't be so stubborn (devs) that you stop listening to your player base. Are you making the game for us or for yourselves?

Edited April 10, 2015 by Schweinsteiger

[Whyherro123 2283]

-snip-

 

 

1) In a survival situation, when you are stressed out, frightened, running around, etc, your metabolic needs often (read: next-to always) skyrocket. Such as it is in Day Z. That is why we "starve" so fast in-game. Not including that, when you spawn in as a freshspawn, you have no idea the last time you ate. For all we know, your character has been surviving for a month, and last ate a week ago

 

2) The "Z" in Day Z doesn't stand for "Zombie". It stands for "zero", as in "reset the calendar", "Year zero", all that jazz.

[soulfirez 901]

These types of responses are ridiculous.

Snip

Don't be so stubborn (devs) that you stop listening to your player base. Are you making the game for us or for yourselves?

Ah there making the type of game they said from the very start the hard survival game Rocket had envisioned as he sweat his ass off in singapore doing survival training lol.

 

Just a little quote of dev hicks and what he wrote on the steam page..

 

Just how hard is DayZ supposed to be? What is the targeted experience here? How valuable should items, and thus what I carry be to me as a player?

I like to think we're pretty up front about exactly what DayZ is and is supposed to be, and as we move closer to 1.0 more and more of this will begin to take shape. 

Once, when asked how valuable tools and resources should be to a player - on a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is finding everything you need without issue, and 10 is elation over finding a can of beans (I'm paraphrasing here) Dean was quoted saying an emphatic "10".

 

Feel free to read the full topic here on the steam page http://steamcommunity.com/games/221100/announcements/detail/129817471142924892

 

Im glad you like H1Z1 sounds like moving ahead it will be more your sort of game perhaps?? or atleast till modding comes in them i am sure someone will make a ubber lootz missions and NPC trader epoch style abomination you will probably love..

Edited April 10, 2015 by SoulFirez

[ebrim 998]

People that are starving to death in 40 minutes in 0.55 are either mentally challenged or exaggerating. Now, if you spawned into December conditions in the rain and quickly become cold and hypothermic, sure, that may be possible. However in 0.55 it's always sunny out, so there must be some other cause. There's virtually always some source of food nearby in 0.55 and water for that matter. Eat some berries for energy (don't try to become energized like an idiot, you'll spend a long time, get enough and move on) and use apples for hydration - or drink from a pump or pond (if you don't mind risking cholera). Once you get away from the coast your options for food expand rather quickly.

 

If you choose to screw around on the coast, looking around fruitlessly in empty buildings you either have to sustain yourself by foraging or just accept that you'll likely starve. That is your choice, you are gambling finding something other people have missed in lieu of gathering calories. If that gamble fails, it's not a fault of the game for giving an impossible situation, you just chose to roll the dice and lost. If people were genuinely in an impossible situation I'd have more sympathy but as someone who plays the game and doesn't starve to death and thus knows it's quite possible (even easy) I have no sympathy for this "the game must cater to the idiot way I choose to play" viewpoint. It's a survival game and a crucial part of survival games is an effective use of resources and time. Without constraints (such as metabolic rate) that economy of resources and time becomes meaningless and thus stops being a survival game.

 

To get at the thread title, enjoyment and realism can fit well together and even better with a proper abstractions of realism to fit into the vision of the game which many of us enjoy.

Edited April 10, 2015 by Ebrim

[Evil Minion 943]

I am playing DayZ because I want to enjoy realism/authenticity and a challenging as well as unforgiving gameplay. I also value a diverse gameplay that requires some effort to get a reward and punishes carelessness and mistakes.

 

I sometimes enjoy it more casual and easy-going - but when I do I won't play DayZ but one of the million other games out there. When I come here I do not want easymode. I do not want PvE to be simple and PvP to be the only challenge - if I want this I will play a dedicated PvP game. I do not want player interactions to be restricted and the game being mainly PvE - if I want this I will play a dedicated PvE game. I am here to enjoy the challenge. No challenge -> no enjoyment -> I am off playing something else.

[lvlagic 25]

Last time I checked I'm not at Elektro, so why all the people taking pot shots at me?

The buzz about dayz for me is.. "Player...!"

You or your buddies spot someone, the heart is racing, have they seen you? Are they friendly? Will they try and kill you? Are they alone? Can you trust them? Should you talk to them? Should I shoot that mofo in the guts and feed him disinfectant while he bleeds out?

I eat regularly back here in the real world, so I find it hard to get excited about finding a tin of sardines or some berries. A game based around eating isn't exactly going stimulate the masses. The human interaction, the not knowing, the decision making, that's what makes this game, all you survivalists can take yourself off to Bodmin moor for the weekend if you want to be cold and hungry, I would have to get a flight to Baghdad to get what I get out of dayz, but the trouble with that is I don't a nice black screen telling me I am dead, but more I portably I don't get to re-spawn...

[ebrim 998]

Last time I checked I'm not at Elektro, so why all the people taking pot shots at me?

The buzz about dayz for me is.. "Player...!"

You or your buddies spot someone, the heart is racing, have they seen you? Are they friendly? Will they try and kill you? Are they alone? Can you trust them? Should you talk to them? Should I shoot that mofo in the guts and feed him disinfectant while he bleeds out?

I eat regularly back here in the real world, so I find it hard to get excited about finding a tin of sardines or some berries. A game based around eating isn't exactly going stimulate the masses. The human interaction, the not knowing, the decision making, that's what makes this game, all you survivalists can take yourself off to Bodmin moor for the weekend if you want to be cold and hungry, I would have to get a flight to Baghdad to get what I get out of dayz, but the trouble with that is I don't a nice black screen telling me I am dead, but more I portably I don't get to re-spawn...

 

None of that excitement about encountering another player goes away just because every once in a while you have to eat or that you have to give some thought to what clothes you're wearing beyond their tactical value.

[Schweinsteiger 107]

Ah there making the type of game they said from the very start the hard survival game Rocket had envisioned as he sweat his ass off in singapore doing survival training lol.

 

Just a little quote of dev hicks and what he wrote on the steam page..

 

Just how hard is DayZ supposed to be? What is the targeted experience here? How valuable should items, and thus what I carry be to me as a player?

I like to think we're pretty up front about exactly what DayZ is and is supposed to be, and as we move closer to 1.0 more and more of this will begin to take shape. 

Once, when asked how valuable tools and resources should be to a player - on a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is finding everything you need without issue, and 10 is elation over finding a can of beans (I'm paraphrasing here) Dean was quoted saying an emphatic "10".

 

Feel free to read the full topic here on the steam page http://steamcommunity.com/games/221100/announcements/detail/129817471142924892

 

Im glad you like H1Z1 sounds like moving ahead it will be more your sort of game perhaps?? or atleast till modding comes in them i am sure someone will make a ubber lootz missions and NPC trader epoch style abomination you will probably love..

That was uncalled for (the H1Z1 assumption). Talking about insulting a man! (that's the type of elitism people really find offensive bro)

 

No, I like DayZ more for both obvious and not so obvious reasons. The infected are bugged  right now, not overly aggressive. I don't think the food issue is a serious one, I can survive and yeah, you're right, it isn't a secret as to the direction the devs said they were taking. Either way I'll adapt and probably be better off for it. They already made most of their money so they can pretty much make the game that Dean invisioned.

 

Peace out hommie!

Edited April 11, 2015 by Schweinsteiger

[Jonah_Hobbes 171]

You've obviously never played goat simulator.

 

DayZ is a mod from a military simulator.  What did you really expect from DayZ SA?  It just took a step closer to what the devs have been saying it's supposed to be for a while now.  You have to be exaggerating on how long it took you to find one can of sardines.  I'm not one of the people on these forums that's just going to yell "Get gud n00b" but loot and food isn't too hard to attain.  I haven't picked a single apple tree since this patch and I've played every day since it has come out.  You just have to re-think your loot runs and sneak around/run away from zombies.

 

Hint:  Check outhouses, deer stands, and guard towers

Actually this is the strategy I used, but I lost my geared up toon and started again on the coast and it's not been as effective. So I'm eating humble pie at the moment.

 

I discovered parts of the map are empty of loot and I'm not just talking about looted houses on the coast. I've hopped a couple of 1-2 player servers that I know are always around that number to test the loot. I found x1 soda can in an hour in little villages like Polana. They look unlooted but are empty apart from some clothes. Compare that Karsnoe which has every 3-4 houses dropping a can of food or drink. I've noticed that a lot of the coastal and middle map towns don't have outside toilets. Yet you go north and they are there and jam-packed with loot.

 

I'm almost dead after eating some raw steak from a cow I killed and getting sick and then getting jumped by a z. Hopefully my next spawn will be different.

 

On bigger populations you now have idiots trying to stop and eat you. How you can survive long enough with everything looted within a 30 minute radius of the coast? Yep I'm living off apples and berries but it's tedious as f*ck.

 

Missing the zombie melee but I can live with the stealth. I think they are easier to avoid, but are a pain as they are silent when they attack.  Wish they'd get rid of the greyed-out screen when you are sick, etc. Sure make me move slower, sure have more vomiting, but can we keep the color vision?

 

love it, but as others have said lets make it surviving more achievable rather than down to low pop servers or pure luck.

Edited April 12, 2015 by Jonah_Hobbes

[Jonah_Hobbes 171]

People that are starving to death in 40 minutes in 0.55 are either mentally challenged or exaggerating. Now, if you spawned into December conditions in the rain and quickly become cold and hypothermic, sure, that may be possible. However in 0.55 it's always sunny out, so there must be some other cause. There's virtually always some source of food nearby in 0.55 and water for that matter. Eat some berries for energy (don't try to become energized like an idiot, you'll spend a long time, get enough and move on) and use apples for hydration - or drink from a pump or pond (if you don't mind risking cholera). Once you get away from the coast your options for food expand rather quickly.

 

If you choose to screw around on the coast, looking around fruitlessly in empty buildings you either have to sustain yourself by foraging or just accept that you'll likely starve. That is your choice, you are gambling finding something other people have missed in lieu of gathering calories. If that gamble fails, it's not a fault of the game for giving an impossible situation, you just chose to roll the dice and lost. If people were genuinely in an impossible situation I'd have more sympathy but as someone who plays the game and doesn't starve to death and thus knows it's quite possible (even easy) I have no sympathy for this "the game must cater to the idiot way I choose to play" viewpoint. It's a survival game and a crucial part of survival games is an effective use of resources and time. Without constraints (such as metabolic rate) that economy of resources and time becomes meaningless and thus stops being a survival game.

 

To get at the thread title, enjoyment and realism can fit well together and even better with a proper abstractions of realism to fit into the vision of the game which many of us enjoy.

 

 

The thing is people are not screwing around on the coast. A lot of comments on here are from people who know where to go and know where to look for loot. I spawned up near Berezino and immediately headed inland to hit Polana and head up to Gorka and then north. I was on a tiny server when I hit Polana and I found one can of soda, no food. I hooped a few lol pop servers and still unlooted towns had little to nothing and no food.

 

I was totally with you until I got killed and res-pawned recently. I've been surprised at how difficult it is to get further than the middle map at the moment.

[soulfirez 901]

That was uncalled for (the H1Z1 assumption). Talking about insulting a man! (that's the type of elitism people really find offensive bro)

 

No, I like DayZ more for both obvious and not so obvious reasons. The infected are bugged  right now, not overly aggressive. I don't think the food issue is a serious one, I can survive and yeah, you're right, it isn't a secret as to the direction the devs said they were taking. Either way I'll adapt and probably be better off for it. They already made most of their money so they can pretty much make the game that Dean invisioned.

 

Peace out hommie!

LOL nothing elitist about it at all , you suggested dayz take a note out of the server rules of H1Z1 so that must mean your playing it yes?? i have ,didnt much like it . Your whole post was a childish stamping the ground going i know you are making the game this way BUT I WANT IT THIS WAY LISTEN TO MEEEEEEEEEEEE..... Suddenly you decide to be reasonable and you think that gives you the right to call someone elitist for answering with all the respect your self entitled ,passive aggressive , whinny post deserved...

 

I find bitchy i want the game this way, my way rather than the clearly marked out direction of the game from the start offensive, Mr making the game for 12 people the devs should listen to us....

[ebrim 998]

The thing is people are not screwing around on the coast. A lot of comments on here are from people who know where to go and know where to look for loot. I spawned up near Berezino and immediately headed inland to hit Polana and head up to Gorka and then north. I was on a tiny server when I hit Polana and I found one can of soda, no food. I hooped a few lol pop servers and still unlooted towns had little to nothing and no food.

 

I was totally with you until I got killed and res-pawned recently. I've been surprised at how difficult it is to get further than the middle map at the moment.

 

I'm currently playing with house rules to eat nothing that I'm not taking from the environment - so just foraging, horticulture and hunting on a 1pp server with 24x accelerated day/night cycle. If I can manage that then I'm sure anyone can manage to survive under "normal" conditions if they're willing to adapt their strategy.