Third Person View should be Over-the-Shoulder, NOT a bird's eye view.

[harteman 155]

1pp will be my preferred playstyle, once sound is worked out well enough.

 

Right now though, it is a clusterfuck.  I need full use of all my in-game senses to properly defend myself.  Not being able to hear a guy running nearby kills it for me.

 

I view 3pp as a compromise.  I don't have good hearing in-game, but the extra vision enables me to play as if I did.

[Whyherro123 2283]

1pp will be my preferred playstyle, once sound is worked out well enough.

 

Right now though, it is a clusterfuck.  I need full use of all my in-game senses to properly defend myself.  Not being able to hear a guy running nearby kills it for me.

 

I view 3pp as a compromise.  I don't have good hearing in-game, but the extra vision enables me to play as if I did.

This is one of the primary reasons I play on 3PP servers. IRL, all of my senses would be working to provide me information before an attack. I would be listening, smelling, looking, hell, even pheromones would be involved. 

 

In Day Z, you just have two senses, and only one works with any sense of reliability. So, until they fix sounds in the game, playing on a 1PP server is really severely crippling you.

 

Plus, there is the fact that, even with headbob turned all the way down, I still get motion-sickness for some reason. Don't get carsick, don't get seasick, but if I play on 1PP servers, I get nauseous.

[-Gews- 7443]

Right now though, it is a clusterfuck.  I need full use of all my in-game senses to properly defend myself.  Not being able to hear a guy running nearby kills it for me.

In Day Z, you just have two senses, and only one works with any sense of reliability. So, until they fix sounds in the game, playing on a 1PP server is really severely crippling you.

Well, I disagree. In 3PP players can watch you from behind any object or even over crests of hills, from under pond surfaces, etc, then pop up and shoot as players pass by. No point looking for these enemies, since you won't see anything, only option is to avoid the area entirely. At least in 1PP a careful and observant player has a chance to spot hidden bandits by thoroughly glassing the area or just keeping his eyes peeled and his head swiveling.

 

The only thing I have a real problem with is the zombie cries. Their sounds are broken and often seem to come from random directions.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Gews

[scriptfactory 620]

 

Well, I disagree. In 3PP players can watch you from behind any object or even over crests of hills, from under pond surfaces, etc, then pop up and shoot as players pass by. No point looking for these enemies, since you won't see anything, only option is to avoid the area entirely. At least in 1PP a careful and observant player has a chance to spot hidden bandits by thoroughly glassing the area or just keeping his eyes peeled and his head swiveling.

 

For me, personally, camping isn't a problem in this game. I simply adjust my playstyle. I don't run down the streets of Elektro without having first surveyed the town from sniper hill. Even then I stick to cover, run building to building. Cheaters kill me more than campers do...

 

The funniest thing about this on-going debate is, people always find a way to rationalize why players avoid the superior 1PP-only servers. BIS changed the server terminology because some people speculated that "Hardcore" mode was scaring people away. Players come up with clunky ideas to make the PvP element more "balanced" in 3PP:on that BIS says they won't implement. They complain on the official forums, private forums and Reddit. And after all of this the 1PP server numbers and player counts keep dropping.

 

At some point people need to come to terms with the fact that 1PP-only mode isn't popular, will never be popular, and they should be happy that BIS added 3PP:off mode for them in the first place. People that prefer 1PP-only are a very vocal minority and I don't see this changing any time soon.

 

Enjoy what you have. Go play your superior game 3PP:off mode. Just accept that mode players think Regular mode is just a little more fun. Especially while server- and client-side FPS is garbage.

 

Just my opinion.

[Judopunch 523]

 So, until they fix sounds in the game, playing on a 1PP server is really severely crippling you.

 

The playing field is even in this regard. Im surprised someone who seems to always advocate more realism uses god-cam for any reason. It seems kinda hypocritical :P

 

 

 

The only thing I have a real problem with is the zombie cries. Their sounds are broken and often seem to come from random directions.

 

The cry seems to always originate from the zombies location and the sound plays out from that location in its entirity. So for example if you hear it 90* left, as you turn your head left the sound will stay in your left ear until the effect plays out.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Judopunch

[Whyherro123 2283]

The playing field is even in this regard. Im surprised someone who seems to always advocate more realism uses god-cam for any reason. It seems kinda hypocritical :P

 

 

 

The cry seems to always originate from the zombies location and the sound plays out from that location in its entirity. So for example if you hear it 90* left, as you turn your head left the sound will stay in your left ear until the effect plays out.

I acknowledged my own hypocrisy with regards to 3PP, but at least having a wider field of vision give me the ability to react realistically when a bugged-out zombie jumps me from behind while making no noise. 

 

Besides, I switch to 1PP in order to actually fight. Only when I am actually running around do I use 3PP, due to the apparent "motion sickness" thing I have with 1PP.

[TEST_SUBJECT_83 465]

I for one absolutely cant stand 3PP servers.

I think they have no place in a game like DayZ/Arma,

but 3PP isn't going anywhere so there is no point in trying to convince anyone otherwise.

3PP is here to stay, just deal with it and play on the servers you prefer.

Edited January 6, 2015 by TEST_SUBJECT_83

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

I for one absolutely cant stand 3PP servers.

I think they have no place in a game like DayZ/Arma,

but 3PP isn't going anywhere so there is no point in trying to convince anyone otherwise.

3PP is here to stay, just deal with it and play on the servers you prefer.

This here.  The devs have already created their monster and are now stuck with it.   

[goldtoaster 30]

And none of that justifies one person having extra visual information over another person with zero risk.

Simply not rendering what you can't see fixes that and makes the games PvP fair and balanced

Or you know... You can just play on 1st person servers. This is why I don't understand the bitching. You guys have an option yet you choose to bitch about 3rd person still.

[scriptfactory 620]

Or you know... You can just play on 1st person servers. This is why I don't understand the bitching. You guys have an option yet you choose to bitch about 3rd person still.

Because no one plays on 1PP servers. The servers are less popular by a factor of 10. I would even wager that the majority of the first person enthusiasts in this thread play on 3PP servers much of the time. RP and private shards are normally 3PP due to the popularity of the mode. So they want to force Bohemia to make the game more fair for their desired perspective or simply force their desired playmode on everyone else.

They are a bit like the people crying about anti-KoS/griefing game mechanics being added. Only things that they like should be added to the game. Any kind of choice is bad since it will further splinter the community.

Edited January 7, 2015 by scriptfactory

[gibonez 3633]

Or you know... You can just play on 1st person servers. This is why I don't understand the bitching. You guys have an option yet you choose to bitch about 3rd person still.

 

Once again that does not fix the problem.

[chickenmcfuggits 49]

Maybe there could be an item in the game, a mirror or something, that lets you enter traditional 3rd person and peek around/over things. It could be complete with animation of character holding the mirror out of whatever barrier hes behind, giving others a chance to spot his hand and mirror peeking around over something.

 

Seems realistic and very survivalish.

Edited January 7, 2015 by Chzy

[gibonez 3633]

Maybe there could be an item in the game, a mirror or something, that lets you enter traditional 3rd person and peek around/over things. It could be complete with animation of character holding the mirror out of whatever barrier hes behind, giving others a chance to spot his hand and mirror peeking around over something.

Seems realistic and very survivalish.

Or why not just add the actual periscope and it functions just like real life?

Ace mod had one

[chickenmcfuggits 49]

Or why not just add the actual periscope and it functions just like real life?

Ace mod had one

 

Yea I thought about that too, mirror just seemed more MacGyverish and more common than an actual periscope, you could find a bathroom with an intact or shattered window, break it and then theirs your rudimentary 3rd person. Maybe the mirror would only display a small fraction of the screen simulating the small size and difficulty of it while the periscope provided full vision around objects, corners and such. I guess this would also incur a sort of "price" for being able to look over and around stuff, that being you have to unequip whatever you're holding and take out the mirror/periscope.

 

I don't know if they'll ever do anything about 3rd person, but it could at least be something for 1st person servers.

Edited January 7, 2015 by Chzy

[Jex 1104]

I acknowledged my own hypocrisy with regards to 3PP, but at least having a wider field of vision give me the ability to react realistically when a bugged-out zombie jumps me from behind while making no noise. 

 

Besides, I switch to 1PP in order to actually fight. Only when I am actually running around do I use 3PP, due to the apparent "motion sickness" thing I have with 1PP.

 

Yeah except you don't have a wider field of vision, the camera is just a little further back from you and the FOV slider changes your....FOV :)

 

Which in turn stops you feeling sick. I was playing a mix of 3pp and 1pp but recently, my friend and I have changed to 1pp exclusively. I've gone back to 3pp servers and the game now feels stupid to play as I look over things - it's just half the game and every now and then I love having the shit scared out of me when a zombie I wasn't expecting screams and jumps at me from nowhere. I also like it when we hear gun shots and we have to decide what to do and how to position. The intensity of it is so much better than 3pp where you run to a bush or behind a rock and then use "suck all life from this encounter" view and just camp looking around until you spot movement.

 

If you want a real game, First person is where it's at. You can't just run around corners. It makes you think about placement and makes you feel vulnerable when you hear a gunshot or footsteps when you're not expecting them. Do you stay put, do you run away, do you reposition, do you go hunting - each decision has consequences in 1st person. In 3rd person all that is removed when you can just look over everything and around corners.

 

There used to be somewhat of a reputation for playing games that didn't help you along years ago. Where games basically said "fuck you, you're not getting any help." Where you had to learn skills to be able to compete. I guess those days are gone now and in the gaming world there's not really any point in being good at anything now since devs put so many crutches in today's games.

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

Yeah except you don't have a wider field of vision, the camera is just a little further back from you and the FOV slider changes your....FOV :)

 

Which in turn stops you feeling sick. I was playing a mix of 3pp and 1pp but recently, my friend and I have changed to 1pp exclusively. I've gone back to 3pp servers and the game now feels stupid to play as I look over things - it's just half the game and every now and then I love having the shit scared out of me when a zombie I wasn't expecting screams and jumps at me from nowhere. I also like it when we hear gun shots and we have to decide what to do and how to position. The intensity of it is so much better than 3pp where you run to a bush or behind a rock and then use "suck all life from this encounter" view and just camp looking around until you spot movement.

 

If you want a real game, First person is where it's at. You can't just run around corners. It makes you think about placement and makes you feel vulnerable when you hear a gunshot or footsteps when you're not expecting them. Do you stay put, do you run away, do you reposition, do you go hunting - each decision has consequences in 1st person. In 3rd person all that is removed when you can just look over everything and around corners.

 

There used to be somewhat of a reputation for playing games that didn't help you along years ago. Where games basically said "fuck you, you're not getting any help." Where you had to learn skills to be able to compete. I guess those days are gone now and in the gaming world there's not really any point in being good at anything now since devs put so many crutches in today's games.

It's a shame quite frankly, Bohemia could have created one of the best fps's on the market but now they've put themselves in a corner to appease to a loud fraction of the community who wants an RPG instead of a hardcore survival game.  Needing to see your character is not a core function and needing to peek over walls is not a core function and creates bland boring gameplay as their is no suspension in the core gameplay as nothing can surprise you.

[gibonez 3633]

It's a shame quite frankly, Bohemia could have created one of the best fps's on the market but now they've put themselves in a corner to appease to a loud fraction of the community who wants an RPG instead of a hardcore survival game.  Needing to see your character is not a core function and needing to peek over walls is not a core function and creates bland boring gameplay as their is no suspension in the core gameplay as nothing can surprise you.

 

There are still a multitude of things they could do to appease both sides and more importantly fix the gameplay as a result.

 

- Readjust the cameras position

- Not render players that the player cannot see

- Disable third person view wen prone or crouching

- Remove iron sights for third person servers and have all aim done with a crosshair.

- etc

 

Any number of the above could solve the problem while keeping the majority of the people happy.

 

PVP will be better for it and those few that do complain will be complaining because they can no longer peek around cover thus their opinion should be ignored.

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

There are still a multitude of things they could do to appease both sides and more importantly fix the gameplay as a result.

 

- Readjust the cameras position

- Not render players that the player cannot see

- Disable third person view wen prone or crouching

- Remove iron sights for third person servers and have all aim done with a crosshair.

- etc

 

Any number of the above could solve the problem while keeping the majority of the people happy.

 

PVP will be better for it and those few that do complain will be complaining because they can no longer peek around cover thus their opinion should be ignored.

Don't get me wrong, Gibonez, I know you've mentioned the fourth wall thingy a lot of times but even that is pretty lame as it makes people pop in and out of existence.  3pp removes the element of surprise and suspense.  You can open a door to a building and spot the guy waiting in ambush for you without even seeing him.  That is stupid.

Edited January 8, 2015 by Caboose187

[gibonez 3633]

Don't get me wrong, Gibonez, I know you've mentioned the fourth wall thingy a lot of times but even that is pretty lame as it makes people pop in and out of existence.  3pp removes the element of surprise and suspense.  You can open a door to a building and spot the guy waiting in ambush for you without even seeing him.  That is stupid.

 

Yea it absolutely makes people pop in and out of existence but it works on a realistic concept and that alone merits its inclusion.

 

It is not the first game to do such a thing either. Project Zomboid does the exact same thing, what you cannot see is not rendered and this in turn leads to some sometimes terrifying game play.

 

 

I still think the best approach is a multifaceted attack on the problem.

 

Primarily the fourth wall type of approach but built right into the engine to eliminate any problems with it, a smart fade in system so characters are seamlessly blended in while in third and lastly a camera reposition so that any pop in you would encounter is far less noticeable due to the new camera.

[Jex 1104]

Whilst I agree, I'd prefer to stick to the point that 1pp over 3pp for me is just a lot more immersive and now that I exclusively play 1pp, playing 3pp is simply half the game. I did miss watching my character a little at the start but that soon goes to be replaced with a weird feeling of looking at yourself but not through your eyes. Not everyone wants immersion of course, they just want easy pvp.