Machine Shop

[pilgrim* 3514]

There are some (not many) standard factory buildings scattered around the towns -- with a large machine shop room on the ground floor.

Suppose - if you went to stand in front of a machine in the corner of the room, in that position you could repair various items - knife, axe, gun, silencer, scope, weapon-parts, mags, binocs, can-opener, vehicle spares ...

This is not intended to be high level realism, it's a simple and functional first step -  a crafting extension  - the ability to repair some items when standing in front of a machine.

So don't worry about power, maybe you hand-crank it, maybe theres a generator, but it doesn't matter at present.
Dont worry what kind of machine it is, lathe, press, drill, and don't consider the different machines really needed to carry out the different repairs (to blades, handguns, silencers, scopes, detachable weapon parts, engine parts, magazines, compass, binoculars, can-openers, whatever)  

It's simply a machine shop - if you are in the operator position you can peform the action of upgrading your object from damaged to worn, or to pristine

This would provide interesting gameplay, as there are only a few of these machine shops on the map, so it would be dangerous to go in there to carry out your repair. They would be obvious ambush points and hazardous to approach. This would require planning, travel, stealth or teamwork.

If greater threat was needed, while you were repairing/upgrading your object, the machine could emit a noise to indicate it was in use. This could be heard at a distance.

The idea of this is to be very simple, not a complicated action. Not more difficult (and not more logical)  than putting up a tent or loading a magazine. An animation and a reasonable time lapse to go with it. And as I said - maybe a sound that can be heard outside.

Would provide an in-game opportunity  to upgrade a whole range of damaged stuff that at the moment can not be improved or repaired.

 

And - provide some fun new risks and gameplay

 

xx pilgrim

Edited September 11, 2014 by pilgrim

[scriptfactory 620]

After they add barricading and door locks. Yes.

[Rammur 59]

There are some (not many) standard factory buildings scattered around the towns -- with a large machine shop room on the ground floor.

Suppose - if you went to stand in front of a machine in the corner of the room, in that position you could repair various items - knife, axe, gun, silencer, scope, weapon-parts, mags, binocs, can-opener, vehicle spares ...

This is not intended to be high level realism, it's a simple and functional first step -  a crafting extension  - the ability to repair some items when standing in front of a machine.

So don't worry about power, maybe you hand-crank it, maybe theres a generator, but it doesn't matter at present.

Dont worry what kind of machine it is, lathe, press, drill, and don't consider the different machines really needed to carry out the different repairs (to blades, handguns, silencers, scopes, detachable weapon parts, engine parts, magazines, compass, binoculars, can-openers, whatever)  

It's simply a machine shop - if you are in the operator position you can peform the action of upgrading your object from damaged to worn, or to pristine

This would provide interesting gameplay, as there are only a few of these machine shops on the map, so it would be dangerous to go in there to carry out your repair. They would be obvious ambush points and hazardous to approach. This would require planning, travel, stealth or teamwork.

If greater threat was needed, while you were repairing/upgrading your object, the machine could emit a noise to indicate it was in use. This could be heard at a distance.

The idea of this is to be very simple, not a complicated action. Not more difficult (and not more logical)  than putting up a tent or loading a magazine. An animation and a reasonable time lapse to go with it. And as I said - maybe a sound that can be heard outside.

Would provide an in-game opportunity  to upgrade a whole range of damaged stuff that at the moment can not be improved or repaired.

 

And - provide some fun new risks and gameplay

 

xx pilgrim

Ohh so you want them to copy infestation and their repair tables in mechanic shops? Mmmm yuck. Not that hard repairing stuff right now with repair kits and sewing kits tey just need a few other kits in the spawn tables lol.

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

Ummm, I'm not sure if this is a totally feasible idea as engine lathes require a lot of juice(electricity) in order to operate.  On top of that, knowing how to even operate one isn't as easy as 1-2-3 so it would be hell of a lot more difficult than putting up a tent or loading a magazine.  You'd need coolant during the procedure as to not destroy your bits, well, the bits, the right type of bit, knowing the proper angles, the speed, etc etc.

[pilgrim* 3514]

Ummm, I'm not sure if this is a totally feasible idea as engine lathes require a lot of juice(electricity) in order to operate.  On top of that, knowing how to even operate one isn't as easy as 1-2-3 so it would be hell of a lot more difficult than putting up a tent or loading a magazine.  You'd need coolant during the procedure as to not destroy your bits, well, the bits, the right type of bit, knowing the proper angles, the speed, etc etc.

 

I SAID (please do read it) :

 

This is not intended to be realism, it's simple and functional

Don't worry about power ... it doesn't matter at present.

Dont worry what kind of machine it is, lathe, press, drill, grinder

Don't consider the different machines really needed to carry out the different repairs.

If you are in the operator position you can peform the action

The idea of this is to be very simple.

It's a simple and functional first step -  a crafting extension.

 

There are all kinds of additions that COULD be added LATER if that's what hits your spot .. but NO ..

- you could ADD generators You could ADD a city power grid You could ADD different machines, metal lathes grinders, power cutters, precision tools...You could ADD cans of oil, water cooling, you could add welding and welding masks... But NO NO NO NO

This idea is NOT any of that; as I said very clearly

 

Start with ONE simple IDEA

That's all.

 

xx

Edited September 12, 2014 by pilgrim

[Cpanther 221]

Ummm, I'm not sure if this is a totally feasible idea as engine lathes require a lot of juice(electricity) in order to operate.  On top of that, knowing how to even operate one isn't as easy as 1-2-3 so it would be hell of a lot more difficult than putting up a tent or loading a magazine.  You'd need coolant during the procedure as to not destroy your bits, well, the bits, the right type of bit, knowing the proper angles, the speed, etc etc.

Hehe.. yeah, i work with turning machines before and you are right..the "newish" ones can be programmed and they do the job for you (CNC turning machines ) But the old ones that you see in the game are manual, and they are more tricky to operate.. and dangerous.

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

I SAID (read it) :

 

This is not intended to be realism, it's simple and functional

Don't worry about power ... it doesn't matter at present.

Dont worry what kind of machine it is, lathe, press, drill.

Don't consider the different machines really needed to carry out the different repairs.

If you are in the operator position you can peform the action

The idea of this is to be very simple.

It's a simple and functional first step -  a crafting extension.

 

There are all kinds of additions that COULD be added LATER if that's what hits your spot .. but NO ..

- you could ADD generators You could ADD a city power grid You could ADD different machines, metal lathes grinders, power cutters, precision tools...You could ADD cans of oil, water cooling, you could add welding and welding masks... But NO NO NO NO

This idea is NOT any of that; as I said very clearly

 

Start with ONE simple IDEA

That's all.

 

xx

I read it and the simplicity of the idea is utterly terrible.   

[pilgrim* 3514]

I read it and the simplicity of the idea is utterly terrible.   

 

Well I did warn ya...was an idea for one small step for useful gameplay, and that might be built up later

but thanx

Now let's hear yours, Caboose

Edited September 12, 2014 by pilgrim

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

Well I did warn ya...was an idea for one small step that might be built on later

but thanx

Now let's hear yours, Caboose

I'm all for the idea of using the lathes in the machine shop but I believe they should have to be fixed up like cars and also require the proper tools to use them.  They obviously don't need to go to extremities to operate them such as apply the right amount of pressure and angles on the item being crafted or repaired.  Needing proper coolant to apply to the bits and metals that are being lathed, a source for powering them(this is the tricky one and kid of the reason why i don't think we'll ever see them being used), finding the right bit(s) to bore your holes with.  I kid you not when I tell you operating a lathe isn't as easy as 1-2-3.  Hell even CnC machining you need to program all your directions in order for the machine to do a proper cut.   

Edited September 12, 2014 by Caboose187

[pilgrim* 3514]

I'm all for the idea of using the lathes in the machine shop but I believe they should have to be fixed up like cars and also require the proper tools to use them.  They obviously don't need to go to extremities to operate them such as apply the right amount of pressure and angles on the item being crafted or repaired.  Needing proper coolant to apply to the bits and metals that are being lathed, a source for powering them(this is the tricky one and kid of the reason why i don't think we'll ever see them being used), finding the right bit(s) to bore your holes with.  I kid you not when I tell you operating a lathe isn't as easy as 1-2-3.  Hell even CnC machining you need to program all your directions in order for the machine to do a proper cut.   

 

Yeah I know I live in a French village my old mate has a fully equipped machine shop across the road full or REAL post war machines. Can do anything there. And I was a london transport fitter for a while, so I'm no stranger to vernier-precision metalworking (not CnC).

 

But what you're saying is like saying " IRL its difficult to repair a helicopter and you cant walk around with a main rotor assembly in your backpack"  - we all know that

 

If helis ever join DayZ, are you going to want a realistic method of mounting the rotor assembly on the mast and connecting up the control mechanics, and testing and certifying them?

 

Really ? ..WOW ...  remember this is a 'game'

 

And with road vehicles in game, some of them are going to need rebores, broken push rod changes, burnt-out driveshaft bearings replaced, gearbox changes (and rebuilds, why not) with the right gaskets, and seals, and tubing, and wiring, and change the grease nipples while you're there.; and the clutch is fucked, and some truck parts might not be easy to find, are the brushes ok in that old alternator, or maybe let's convert it to take a dynamo.. check the condition of the battery, and an oil change at least,..hubs badly dented, rotate the retread tyres, this tyre leaks? damn steering rod broke, have to replace it or weld it or make a substitute, what size pins you need in there? where are the circlips pliers? and how about some Churchill Tools, as well as the standard heavy duty full range mechanics tool-wall, and the jacks..and an inspection pit.... hole in the exhaust will make a damn lot of noise, hear that 8 km away, you want to risk that..?? timing's right out, won't start except on a long hill if ya lucky, leaves a trail of smoke a mile long.. 2 full days work there if we had a team and all the pieces brand new, and floodlights (no electricity? no arc welding then) .... hmmmm

 

(cough) -   this is just road vehicles we're talking about here, right?.. nothing fancy

 

... remember this is a 'game' -  a lot of the actions already incorporated are moderately - or extremely - simplified

 

[ For instance, you perhaps know something of how much real skill and experience it takes, and the time and the special tools required, to craft a bow that will endure and shoot true, capable of bringing down a full grown deer ? even an emergency unseasoned wood survival bow to last a day, still requires selected wood, tools, fire, glue, shaping, hardening, stringing, and the same for the arrows. None of that is in the game. ]

 

xx

Edited September 12, 2014 by pilgrim

[kichilron 8550]

Topic cleaned.

 

Please keep the offtopic to a minimum.

[Baker. 1484]

There are some (not many) standard factory buildings scattered around the towns -- with a large machine shop room on the ground floor.

Suppose - if you went to stand in front of a machine in the corner of the room, in that position you could repair various items - knife, axe, gun, silencer, scope, weapon-parts, mags, binocs, can-opener, vehicle spares ...

 

I like this idea, would be nice if it wasn't just 11 metal lathes in there like a real machine shop lol. 

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

Yeah I know I live in a French village my old mate has a fully equipped machine shop across the road full or REAL post war machines. Can do anything there. And I was a london transport fitter for a while, so I'm no stranger to vernier-precision metalworking (not CnC).

 

But what you're saying is like saying " IRL its difficult to repair a helicopter and you cant walk around with a main rotor assembly in your backpack"  - we all know that

 

If helis ever join DayZ, are you going to want a realistic method of mounting the rotor assembly on the mast and connecting up the control mechanics, and testing and certifying them?

 

Really ? ..WOW ...  remember this is a 'game'

 

And with road vehicles in game, some of them are going to need rebores, broken push rod changes, burnt-out driveshaft bearings replaced, gearbox changes (and rebuilds, why not) with the right gaskets, and seals, and tubing, and wiring, and change the grease nipples while you're there.; and the clutch is fucked, and some truck parts might not be easy to find, are the brushes ok in that old alternator, or maybe let's convert it to take a dynamo.. check the condition of the battery, and an oil change at least,..hubs badly dented, rotate the retread tyres, this tyre leaks? damn steering rod broke, have to replace it or weld it or make a substitute, what size pins you need in there? where are the circlips pliers? and how about some Churchill Tools, as well as the standard heavy duty full range mechanics tool-wall, and the jacks..and an inspection pit.... hole in the exhaust will make a damn lot of noise, hear that 8 km away, you want to risk that..?? timing's right out, won't start except on a long hill if ya lucky, leaves a trail of smoke a mile long.. 2 full days work there if we had a team and all the pieces brand new, and floodlights (no electricity? no arc welding then) .... hmmmm

 

(cough) -   this is just road vehicles we're talking about here, right?.. nothing fancy

 

... remember this is a 'game' -  a lot of the actions already incorporated are moderately - or extremely - simplified

 

[ For instance, you perhaps know something of how much real skill and experience it takes, and the time and the special tools required, to craft a bow that will endure and shoot true, capable of bringing down a full grown deer ? even an emergency unseasoned wood survival bow to last a day, still requires selected wood, tools, fire, glue, shaping, hardening, stringing, and the same for the arrows. None of that is in the game. ]

 

xx

Where did I say it had to be realistic?  I just said your idea is bad because, well it is.  Just walk up and voila, you magically repair whatever item needs repairing.  All I said was it should have to be setup and maintained exactly like they would do vehicles.  Was that so hard to grasp?

[pilgrim* 3514]

Where did I say it had to be realistic?  I just said your idea is bad because, well it is.  Just walk up and voila, you magically repair whatever item needs repairing.  All I said was it should have to be setup and maintained exactly like they would do vehicles.  Was that so hard to grasp?

 

Caboose, I paraphrase (no harm intended) : 'Your agument is bad because, well it is.. Just walk up and voila, you magically repair whatever vehicle item needs repairing (as long as you're not shot in the back by the people who stake out the works, because they know how useful that place is) . As I suggested (following your argument) a vehicle should have to be setup and maintained like they are in real life .. "is that hard to grasp", you say, but it's your own argument are you using it against me or against yourself ?.. I wrote a paragraph on that, to point out how non-starter this idea of complexity is, in a survival game at the level of detail of DayZ, where (e.g) you can "craft" a killing bow with a stick and a piece of cord in seconds.. and it works with deadly force and lasts until you die. Completely crazy, you and I AGREE.. but that's how the game works.

 

As for "realism" - You ask "Where did I say it had to be realistic?",  well, quote  << Needing proper coolant to apply to the bits and metals that are being lathed, a source for powering them (this is the tricky one and kind of the reason why i don't think we'll ever see them being used), finding the right bit(s) to bore your holes with>>

 

For future reference (in case the basic idea is ever implemented)  plenty of SMALL machine shops have petrol generators to run them.

I don't know if you're aware that the Afghan "arms villages" that can build any kind of infantry weapon to order, made from SCRATCH if you want .. use portable generators to power their equipment. So IF in the future this idea required extending, there are additional features that could be added to make it (to some extent) more "realistic" ... but at the present I'm not even suggesting that the machines are differentiated, they could be lathes, presses, grinders, polishers, and work with aluminium, glass, rebar, alloy tube or sheet steel.. I suggested that initially we don't even go in to that. I want to put the machine shop idea on the table - we are supposed to be surviving and there is equipment around in only two or three map locations that can greatly help us do this, let's put it in the game and refine it later.

 

I'm just proposing a simple starter element that could improve gameplay, it changes the situation and the player interaction, makes movement necessary, adds new risks.. it's a new, useful, gameplay possibility (and that's all). And it solves in-game the problem of damaged hardware, which has no solution at present.

 

And sure, if you dont like it, I'm cool. I don't disagree with you. But the real difficulty of using Real World machine shop equipment is totally beside the point. When we get to vehicles, the difficulty and specializations of repairing those, will NOT be reflected in the game in anything even close to "realism" as you know. I mentioned helicopter "repairs"-  that's a laughable concept however detailed and complex the "helicopter crafting" introduced into the game (remember the Mod?) - check the web for mounting a rotor assembly, and find details of the linkages (wow - NOBODY can do that, get [even slightly] real !! ). But much much simpler - I mentioned creating self-bows for hunting. In reality that operation is NOTHING like the "crafting action" present in the game.

 

I said that my idea MIGHT be interesting to enable repair of a LOT of things that cannot be repaired at present in the game, AND it would make interesting gameplay as there are only 2 or 3 'machine shops' on the whole map, AND  - with regards to machine maintenance, power, and different machines/dies/drills/maintenance-and-adjustment tools required - a very few of these elements COULD be introduced in later development if they were thought apt and IF the basic idea worked at all. But those additions would be greatly limited and simplified of course - (a generator maybe ?) - because this is DayZ.

 

However, I don't mind you panning the idea Caboose, it's simply a straightforward little idea I threw into the mix. But the reasons you give for disliking the idea are truely over-complex and don't fit at all with what is actually happening in the game.

 

Anyway, your point is taken. Good that someone thinks and takes an interest.  And (aside)  usually it's the military fans who shout for close-to-absolute "realism", but only in the firearms - and don't give a damn about health, hunting, food, crafting, and all the other DayZ elements. You can shoot deer with a sharp stick no problem, as long as coriolis effect and multiple crosswinds and different densities of warm air are included in the sniping parameters.

 

We have a kind of standard of how "realistic" crafting is across the board.. I was thinking of that. BUT thanx for the input.. this is why I put the idea up in the first place.

 

Something of this nature (or a good alternative) will have to be introduced when vehicles arrive, unless we're going to stick with the Mod way of doing things.  So I thought - why not start now ?

 

= just an idea = just a starting point =

Edited September 13, 2014 by pilgrim

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

As for "realism" - You ask "Where did I say it had to be realistic?",  well, quote  << Needing proper coolant to apply to the bits and metals that are being lathed, a source for powering them (this is the tricky one and kid of the reason why i don't think we'll ever see them being used), finding the right bit(s) to bore your holes with>>

This is the only part I'm going to quote you on.  Three items needed to get the lathe running.  Three..... Coolant, bits and a power source.  Vehicles will most likely even have more than three just to get the functional so I think I was being extremely lenient on the "realism".  Again, I like the idea of using them to repair or even craft but not in the way you want it even just for a quick early version.  

 

What I mean is if they do take in this idea, don't half ass it and at least put in some form of place holder mechanic to use it.  Hell, I can't stand the lack of animations for how we drink water from a fountain, we don't even use the pump lol.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Caboose187

[benedictus 160]

Ohh so you want them to copy infestation and their repair tables in mechanic shops? Mmmm yuck.

 

Care to expand your opinion "mmm yuck" doesnt tell us much.

[Rammur 59]

Care to expand your opinion "mmm yuck" doesnt tell us much.

I was being sarcastic dont post just to get that post count up.

[liquidcactus 719]

There are some (not many) standard factory buildings scattered around the towns -- with a large machine shop room on the ground floor.

Suppose - if you went to stand in front of a machine in the corner of the room, in that position you could repair various items - knife, axe, gun, silencer, scope, weapon-parts, mags, binocs, can-opener, vehicle spares ...

This is not intended to be high level realism, it's a simple and functional first step -  a crafting extension  - the ability to repair some items when standing in front of a machine.

So don't worry about power, maybe you hand-crank it, maybe theres a generator, but it doesn't matter at present.

Dont worry what kind of machine it is, lathe, press, drill, and don't consider the different machines really needed to carry out the different repairs (to blades, handguns, silencers, scopes, detachable weapon parts, engine parts, magazines, compass, binoculars, can-openers, whatever)  

It's simply a machine shop - if you are in the operator position you can peform the action of upgrading your object from damaged to worn, or to pristine

This would provide interesting gameplay, as there are only a few of these machine shops on the map, so it would be dangerous to go in there to carry out your repair. They would be obvious ambush points and hazardous to approach. This would require planning, travel, stealth or teamwork.

If greater threat was needed, while you were repairing/upgrading your object, the machine could emit a noise to indicate it was in use. This could be heard at a distance.

The idea of this is to be very simple, not a complicated action. Not more difficult (and not more logical)  than putting up a tent or loading a magazine. An animation and a reasonable time lapse to go with it. And as I said - maybe a sound that can be heard outside.

Would provide an in-game opportunity  to upgrade a whole range of damaged stuff that at the moment can not be improved or repaired.

 

And - provide some fun new risks and gameplay

 

xx pilgrim

 

Very good idea I think.. But like the chap above said after barricading and doors can be locked.

 

I reeeealy also want to see industrial areas revamped and alot of those huge industrial buildings need to be enter able...In my opinion industrial areas are a big part of dayz lore thus needing those tall seedy buildings with lots windows where anyone or anything could be watching you while you sneaking through an industrial alley late at night searching for pilgrim's machine shop ^_^

[liquidcactus 719]

Ummm, I'm not sure if this is a totally feasible idea as engine lathes require a lot of juice(electricity) in order to operate.  On top of that, knowing how to even operate one isn't as easy as 1-2-3 so it would be hell of a lot more difficult than putting up a tent or loading a magazine.  You'd need coolant during the procedure as to not destroy your bits, well, the bits, the right type of bit, knowing the proper angles, the speed, etc etc.

He did explain it's suppose to be simple ???

[benedictus 160]

I was being sarcastic dont post just to get that post count up.

 

Doesnt that go for you too? We both wasting space here with this chitchat. 

 

And I was just being sarcastic, right?