This game is and always will be way too military focused by players

[Deathlove 2286]

Pshhhh its not military enough! I want my LMGs and AR variety damnit! XD

[hefeweizen 254]

I feel like the problems you're experiencing stem mostly from duping. With everyone spawning in the NE is seems like most people who actually loot to get gear are mostly carrying civilian stuff now. But you've got bandit groups out there duping M4s with hacked mags for their entire squad every time they die.

Duping needs to be fixed, then the database needs a good wipe. That'd go a long way towards fixing the problem.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Hefeweizen

[hotcakes 348]

>insert euphemism about gun control<

[trev186 389]

Well considering that most geared players acquire their gear in the following ways :

Duping

Server hopping

Server restart abuse for heli sites

It is an unfair judgement to say there are too many mil spawns....

Until patch .48 M4s had not spawned in over a month but they were still wreaking havoc on berezino....

Also I feel that there are many give equivalents that should exist to mil gear for anything that isn't an automatic weapon or providing ballistic protection.

The counter argument to remember is if u make the mil gear so rare tha you can barely find it then people will just seek out the next best alternative....at the same time with no mil gear u can gear up civ gear in less than 45 mins....so if u take the higher tier of gear out the mix then the game willl be even more deathmatch like cause there is no reason to go search for better gear

[Bororm 1156]

If anything should be reduced, it's military clothing not weapons.  Having super high capacity stuff gives you the ability to carry more ammo/food/water which makes survival easier, more so than the weapons themselves.  At least with limited inventory space, you have to forage for food more often, and make those decisions on what to carry.

 

 

Also, legitimate m4s actually are very rare.  90% of the ones you see are duped.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Bororm

[Whyherro123 2283]

If anything should be reduced, it's military clothing not weapons.  Having super high capacity stuff gives you the ability to carry more ammo/food/water which makes survival easier, more so than the weapons themselves.  At least with limited inventory space, you have to forage for food more often, and make those decisions on what to carry.

 

 

Also, legitimate m4s actually are very rare.  90% of the ones you see are duped.

I don't really understand the hate for "military" clothing.

I am unsure how it is in other countries, but in the US, even in a firearm-unfriendly state (yes, we do have those), you can still buy Milsurp stuff on the cheap. I myself own a set of Woodland BDU's (trousers and jacket), Web Belt, Combat harness, MOLLE patrol pack, and butt-ton of MOLLE-compatible pouches. 

 

All of this kit probably cost me less than $150 total, and I can carry enough supplies for literally weeks with only this.

 

--Patrol pack: change of clothing, extra socks and undergarments, mess tin + 3 days MRE's, extra navigation gear, extra firestarters, 5 disposable ponchos, Military Poncho w/liner (shelter and sleeping) SAS survival guide (AKA survival bible), 2 steel water bottles, 50 feet rope.

--MOLLE pouches (attached to belt/harness and backpack): dedicated survival kit, dedicated medical kit, dedicated navigation kit (maps of preferred camping areas, GPS + batteries), water treatment kit ( filter, water treatment tabs), dump pouch, firestarting kit, field knapping kit (I've recently gotten into glass-knapping for archery)

--pockets on jacket and trousers: map of local area (pick up a new one every time I go to a National/State park or Forest, absolutely free.), additional firestarters.

 

All of this stuff weighs probably less than 70 lbs. Heavy, yes, but I can take parts of it off when I want to. Going on a short hike? Take the harness with my separate kits. Backpacking in the deep woods? Take the whole ensemble in, leave most of it in base camp.

 

I've climbed Mount Greylock with my full kit on me, in the middle of a New England February blizzard, just to see how much the weight and encumbrance would affect my balance and overland speed (My Troop thought I was crazy). I found out that so long as the load is balanced, you shouldn't have too much of an issue carrying it, and your balance will not be too badly affected, once you get used to the load. I could boulder and twist just fine wearing the kit, running was a bit of an issue, but in real life, you NEVER want to run up/down/along a mountainside, as you could trip and break a leg or worse.

 

Military gear is extremely useful, and should not be snubbed to satisfy some false sense of "balance". Real life isn't balanced.

[Bororm 1156]

I don't really understand the hate for "military" clothing.

I am unsure how it is in other countries, but in the US, even in a firearm-unfriendly state (yes, we do have those), you can still buy Milsurp stuff on the cheap. I myself own a set of Woodland BDU's (trousers and jacket), Web Belt, Combat harness, MOLLE patrol pack, and butt-ton of MOLLE-compatible pouches. 

 

All of this kit probably cost me less than $150 total, and I can carry enough supplies for literally weeks with only this.

 

--Patrol pack: change of clothing, extra socks and undergarments, mess tin + 3 days MRE's, extra navigation gear, extra firestarters, 5 disposable ponchos, Military Poncho w/liner (shelter and sleeping) SAS survival guide (AKA survival bible), 2 steel water bottles, 50 feet rope.

--MOLLE pouches (attached to belt/harness and backpack): dedicated survival kit, dedicated medical kit, dedicated navigation kit (maps of preferred camping areas, GPS + batteries), water treatment kit ( filter, water treatment tabs), dump pouch, firestarting kit, field knapping kit (I've recently gotten into glass-knapping for archery)

--pockets on jacket and trousers: map of local area (pick up a new one every time I go to a National/State park or Forest, absolutely free.), additional firestarters.

 

All of this stuff weighs probably less than 70 lbs. Heavy, yes, but I can take parts of it off when I want to. Going on a short hike? Take the harness with my separate kits. Backpacking in the deep woods? Take the whole ensemble in, leave most of it in base camp.

 

I've climbed Mount Greylock with my full kit on me, in the middle of a New England February blizzard, just to see how much the weight and encumbrance would affect my balance and overland speed (My Troop thought I was crazy). I found out that so long as the load is balanced, you shouldn't have too much of an issue carrying it, and your balance will not be too badly affected, once you get used to the load. I could boulder and twist just fine wearing the kit, running was a bit of an issue, but in real life, you NEVER want to run up/down/along a mountainside, as you could trip and break a leg or worse.

 

Military gear is extremely useful, and should not be snubbed to satisfy some false sense of "balance". Real life isn't balanced.

 

It's boring.

[Whyherro123 2283]

It's boring.

It is also effective, and in my book (trained in Wilderness Survival) "effective" trumps "boring" in literally any and every circumstance. 

[massacrorBKK 64]

Imo, the problem is not too much guns (military or not)... but too much ammo.

 

We'll see in beta...

[Bororm 1156]

It is also effective, and in my book (trained in Wilderness Survival) "effective" trumps "boring" in literally any and every circumstance. 

 

Well you sound boring =P

[Deathlove 2286]

I don't really understand the hate for "military" clothing.

I am unsure how it is in other countries, but in the US, even in a firearm-unfriendly state (yes, we do have those), you can still buy Milsurp stuff on the cheap. I myself own a set of Woodland BDU's (trousers and jacket), Web Belt, Combat harness, MOLLE patrol pack, and butt-ton of MOLLE-compatible pouches. 

 

All of this kit probably cost me less than $150 total, and I can carry enough supplies for literally weeks with only this.

 

--Patrol pack: change of clothing, extra socks and undergarments, mess tin + 3 days MRE's, extra navigation gear, extra firestarters, 5 disposable ponchos, Military Poncho w/liner (shelter and sleeping) SAS survival guide (AKA survival bible), 2 steel water bottles, 50 feet rope.

--MOLLE pouches (attached to belt/harness and backpack): dedicated survival kit, dedicated medical kit, dedicated navigation kit (maps of preferred camping areas, GPS + batteries), water treatment kit ( filter, water treatment tabs), dump pouch, firestarting kit, field knapping kit (I've recently gotten into glass-knapping for archery)

--pockets on jacket and trousers: map of local area (pick up a new one every time I go to a National/State park or Forest, absolutely free.), additional firestarters.

 

All of this stuff weighs probably less than 70 lbs. Heavy, yes, but I can take parts of it off when I want to. Going on a short hike? Take the harness with my separate kits. Backpacking in the deep woods? Take the whole ensemble in, leave most of it in base camp.

 

I've climbed Mount Greylock with my full kit on me, in the middle of a New England February blizzard, just to see how much the weight and encumbrance would affect my balance and overland speed (My Troop thought I was crazy). I found out that so long as the load is balanced, you shouldn't have too much of an issue carrying it, and your balance will not be too badly affected, once you get used to the load. I could boulder and twist just fine wearing the kit, running was a bit of an issue, but in real life, you NEVER want to run up/down/along a mountainside, as you could trip and break a leg or worse.

 

Military gear is extremely useful, and should not be snubbed to satisfy some false sense of "balance". Real life isn't balanced.

Off topic: Yeah but buying military gear in the USA and wearing it wont get you arrested. Using exotic military weapons ether band by some states or that you need a special permit for will lol.

[Deathlove 2286]

Well you sound boring =P

LOL says the guy or woman with "Bor" in there name! XD

[gemellus 77]

I don't really understand the hate for "military" clothing.

It's the knee jerk reaction to anything being "military = Cawd bros go back 2 xbawks" that pervades this forum. It's really tiresome and almost as bad as the people who freak out whenever something west of Poland is added into the game, as if there's this magical wall that keeps all guns out that aren't Slavshit (and I use this term endearingly)

 

Look at the civilian protestors in Ukraine earlier this year and the current civil war. They look like they just came from NWAF:

http://ts2.mm.bing.net/th?id=HN.607987259909801089&pid=15.1&P=0

 

http://i.imgur.com/A9wIWjQ.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/EZA1BnE.jpg

 

http://www.trbimg.com/img-5300e18f/turbine/la-fg-wn-ukraine-protesters-accept-amnesty-201-001/600

 

http://media.komonews.com/images/140301_a_Ukraine_Protest___2.jpg

 

http://media.bakersfieldnow.com/images/140219_Ukraine_Protest_x_2.jpg

 

http://media.bakersfieldnow.com/images/140219_Ukraine_Protest_x_4.jpg

 

http://america.aljazeera.com/content/ajam/multimedia/photo-gallery/2013/12/photos-ukrainianpoliceclashwithprotesters/_jcr_content/slideShowImages/slide6/image.adapt.960.high.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/mtTGZRz.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/EaeGHnb.jpg

 

You know why all these guys are decked out in so much military gear? Its because its better than civilian almost always. It can take more hits, it can survive the elements and environments  far deadlier than DayZ. When SHTF, people don't dress like Mad Max extras. They don't wear awkward clumsy clothing. The smart ones pick gear thats going to help them survive: hunting and military gear. That's the realistic option for all you "but muh immershun iz ruined by so many cawd kiddies!" types.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Tibialis

[flimsypremise 94]

If you had bothered to inform yourself about the publicly announced roadmap, you'd know that there are plans to implement a global loot tracking system that permits capping the supply of specific items. So they can say, only 5 AK 101s anywhere, and no matter how many military spawns you check you won't find an AK 101 until an existing one despawns. You're complaining about an incomplete feature in an alpha release, and there's already a planned feature that completely solves the problem. I'm probably pissing into the wind here, but just. stop. posting.

Edited August 15, 2014 by flimsypremise

[Deathlove 2286]

It's the knee jerk reaction to anything being "military = Cawd bros go back 2 xbawks" that pervades this forum. It's really tiresome and almost as bad as the people who freak out whenever something west of Poland is added into the game, as if there's this magical wall that keeps all guns out that aren't Slavshit (and I use this term endearingly)

 

Look at the civilian protestors in Ukraine earlier this year and the current civil war. They look like they just came from NWAF:

http://ts2.mm.bing.net/th?id=HN.607987259909801089&pid=15.1&P=0

 

http://i.imgur.com/A9wIWjQ.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/EZA1BnE.jpg

 

http://www.trbimg.com/img-5300e18f/turbine/la-fg-wn-ukraine-protesters-accept-amnesty-201-001/600

 

http://media.komonews.com/images/140301_a_Ukraine_Protest___2.jpg

 

http://media.bakersfieldnow.com/images/140219_Ukraine_Protest_x_2.jpg

 

http://media.bakersfieldnow.com/images/140219_Ukraine_Protest_x_4.jpg

 

http://america.aljazeera.com/content/ajam/multimedia/photo-gallery/2013/12/photos-ukrainianpoliceclashwithprotesters/_jcr_content/slideShowImages/slide6/image.adapt.960.high.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/mtTGZRz.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/EaeGHnb.jpg

 

You know why all these guys are decked out in so much military gear? Its because its better than civilian almost always. It can take more hits, it can survive the elements and environments  far deadlier than DayZ. When SHTF, people don't dress like Mad Max extras. They don't wear awkward clumsy clothing. The smart ones pick gear thats going to help them survive: hunting and military gear. That's the realistic option for all you "but muh immershun!" types.

Yeah but i play both Xbox and these kinds of games all the time. So you REALLY CANT just muddle everyone into one type of category of gamer.

 

I also hand no idea the country Poland was in the game as well..... XD

[gibonez 3633]

I don't really understand the hate for "military" clothing.

 

It is quite simple.

 

People don't want arma.

 

If they wanted to play Arma they would be playing Arma. They wan't Dayz to be something completely different from Arma and ignore the military aspect as much as much as possible.

 

They wan't dayz to be this

 

Not this

 

[captain_finnish 134]

8/10 people I talk to or come across in this game only care about the military loot.

No shit! Of course people want better loot in a game that is all about looting. Military loot gives people advantage so people want it. It is like asking people "do you want more money?".

[Chaingunfighter 917]

It is quite simple.

 

People don't want arma.

 

If they wanted to play Arma they would be playing Arma. They wan't Dayz to be something completely different from Arma and ignore the military aspect as much as much as possible.

 

They wan't dayz to be this

 

 

Not this

 

 

Ignore the military aspect as much as possible? Then wouldn't that mean getting rid of everything military in the game?

 

If they did that you'd lose half the guns, including the Mosin & SKS, which are both still used by many armies. Do you really think a game where every gun but the IZH-43 and Mosin (with no attachments) is removed, and only 100 rounds of 7.62 and 12 Gauge across the entire game, would be fun?

[gibonez 3633]

Ignore the military aspect as much as possible? Then wouldn't that mean getting rid of everything military in the game?

 

Of course not I am just saying people don't want dayz to turn into arma or any other mainstream bro shooter this is where the hesitation and dislike for military themed things seems to stems from.

The anti military stance also probably comes from what the mod turned into with dayz mods like breaking point where the entire game is full of high end military gear.

 

The SKS and the Mosin would of course not apply in the same category of what constitutes a military weapon. Sure once a long time ago those were military issue but now they are no longer have the mind share as being a military weapon.

 

Both of them are now more popularized for being cheap, affordable mil surplus rifles that shoot cheap affordable ammo that is readily available.

[Xbow 362]

Military weapons are desired because they aid your survival better than civilian types. And because vast quantities of military weapons and ammunition were procured they are both more common than civilian types.

 

If you want to make military weapons less available allow them to degrade if they are not taken care of properly...the corrosive primers of Eastern European ammunition will eat a weapon alive with enough time and stupidity on the part of the operator. Springs and small parts of weapons will indeed break and need replacement all the time. Weapons cleaning kits, lubricants, and small arms repair kits made from the internals stripped from say an AKM you found and need only for spare parts is a good idea.

 

But that won't and shouldn't slow down the demand for and acquisition of military weapons in DayZ. And it might be good to remember that with just AK pattern weapons  something on the order of two hundred million were made world wide. One AK type for every thirty five to  forty people on the planet,  and that's just one basic type of military weapon. Actually there are probably enough modern military shoulder weapons on the planet to have one military weapon for every fifteen to twenty people. It is the civilian weapons and the ammunition they use that would be rare.   

 

And then there is the fact that If there were no military weapons in the game that would not slow down the PvP action at all. 

Edited August 15, 2014 by Xbow

[Exorade 214]

8/10 people I talk to or come across in this game only care about the military loot. 

 

One of the things I think might effect this thinking, would be to have more civilian vests and coats in the game that have the same amount of storage space as the military vests and coats. Right now if you think of Dayz as some game where you have to get all the "top-tier gear" military vests and coats are at the top of that list because they give you the most storage space.

 

Sure, there are hunting pants and cargo pants that have the same amount of space as TTsKO and gorka pants, but no civilian jackets with more than four spaces.

 

Also tracksuit pants need to have the same space as the jeans, otherwise I don't see any reason to actually pick them up, other than that they look kinda cool. 

[hombrecz 832]

There is simply no balance at the moment, that is all.

Once we are in beta, then we should be seeing some good military stuff being more rare, even clothing and ammo as well.

 

So at the moment, it's more about adding stuff and mechanics, rather then ballancing stuff or polishing gameplay.

 

I strongly hope, that during beta phase, weapons and ammo, will get more rare.

Also canned food will not be that plentifull, so that we will have to hunt animals.

 

I'm not saying I want 100% "The Road" experience, but I think scavenging should be harder in every aspect.

So yeah, I'm waiting for beta to see how the gameplay changes (I hope it will).

[gibonez 3633]

I'm not saying I want 100% "The Road" experience, but I think scavenging should be harder in every aspect.

So yeah, I'm waiting for beta to see how the gameplay changes (I hope it will).

 

Cmon man wouldn't you love it if your character was so weak and could not move fast enough from being malnurished that you get stuck up by this guy ?

 

 

A game where you are balling out of control if your revolver has all 6 rounds in it ?

 

A game where if you encounter another player you instantly get super possessive and defensive about your half a can of beans and your canteen of filthy ash water ?

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Of course not I am just saying people don't want dayz to turn into arma or any other mainstream bro shooter this is where the hesitation and dislike for military themed things seems to stems from.

The anti military stance also probably comes from what the mod turned into with dayz mods like breaking point where the entire game is full of high end military gear.

 

The SKS and the Mosin would of course not apply in the same category of what constitutes a military weapon. Sure once a long time ago those were military issue but now they are no longer have the mind share as being a military weapon.

 

Both of them are now more popularized for being cheap, affordable mil surplus rifles that shoot cheap affordable ammo that is readily available.

 

Plenty of armies still issue Mosins and SKS rifles. Sure mainly for second line, support, or DMR/sniper roles, but they're still around. Either way, I fail to see how having a variety of military items makes the game bad.

 

What's wrong with having 20 different vests if they're all rare? That would actually increase the variety in people you see, but not everyone would be relegated to civilian clothing for variety. You'd have a good mix of everything.

 

Same with guns. What exactly is wrong with having a MK17 in the game, if it were per say a helicopter crash site weapon? Some people seem to follow the mindset of;

 

 

"It's not a military shooter, therefore anything currently issued to military forces should not be in the game"

 

Which is illogical. Why is an M4A1 unreasonable when an AKM isn't, both are commonly issued military rifles, that are select-fire, have 30 round magazines (generally), and fire intermediate cartridges. The only major difference (in a game, that is), is the aesthetic. The M4A1 isn't as associated with rag-tag civilians and guerrillas, so people assume that in a post-apocalyptic environment they'd completely disappear.

 

 

Plus, I'd reckon the M4A1 and AKM appear in almost every single shooter out there. Maybe not those specific models (the names tend not to match up with the gun anyway), but can you really name an abundance of popular FPS games that don't have some AK variant and some AR-15 variant?

Edited August 15, 2014 by Chaingunfighter

[gibonez 3633]

 I fail to see how having a variety of military items makes the game bad.

 

 

I never said it would make the game bad. I am merely explaining how and where the anti military gear stance comes from.

 

Arma is great heck military gear is great in arma and everyone loves that but keep that in Arma. People simply wan't dayz to be different to truly be a zombie survival game and not Arma 2 with zombies as would surely happen with a wide selection of military clothing, equipment and weapons.