Grass is worthless eye candy

[roguetrooper 201]

Just like in Arma, grass actually is worthless (and FPS consuming) eye candy. All it does is to block your view (being prone) while others can see you from a greater distance. More or less the direct opposite of what you would expect from reality.

Edited August 7, 2014 by RogueTrooper

[blacklabel79 949]

You know this is true in ALL engines right ? Since no consumer PC has the power to draw grass over vast distances.

Edited August 7, 2014 by {Core}BlackLabel

[Jex 1104]

I see the OP's point. Even though no engine renders grass out passed what, 100m, why is it the AI can see through it? Or can they now - has this been rectified and is now a thing of the past?

Also how about working on drawing grass out to 500m - can't they just have less of it but more spread out?

[Khanarac 252]

They removed it in dayzero and it worked fine there. Gotta find some bushes. 

There it enabled fights where you wouldnt expect them, sometimes over huge ranges, since people can actually be prone and still see.

Edited August 7, 2014 by Khanarac

[BeefBacon 1185]

There are solutions to this, I think. I seem to remember an ARMA 2 or 3 mod that simulated grass at long distances without actually drawing it. I think the land, when drawn at a distance, was raised a little bit so it covered up prone players. As I recall it looked quite good. I suppose something similar could be achieved by having players be semi-transparent when prone in grass. and viewed at a distance. Going closer to them renders them opaque.

[soulfirez 901]

I see the OP's point. Even though no engine renders grass out passed what, 100m, why is it the AI can see through it? Or can they now - has this been rectified and is now a thing of the past?

Also how about working on drawing grass out to 500m - can't they just have less of it but more spread out?

Often thought this myself in regards to thinning it out a little and thus using the same cpu draw by spreading it over a larger range. Not sure if the AI can still see through it or not as i have mostly given up on the stealth idea with zeds currently ( i have to often been caught prone in a situation where i never saw the zed coming but they saw me exagerated further by the fact zeds make alot less noise now almost no groans at all..)

 

Edit Yeah beef and bacon there has been the sinking players into the ground when viewed from range its not perfect but it does help ( though it requires a larger more detailed ground texture to really make the effect work half decent.)

Edited August 7, 2014 by SoulFirez

[gibonez 3633]

Wish it was forced rendered like Rust now is .

 

Before you could not render the Grass in rust in order to gain an advantage. Through technical trickery you can no longer do this on the EXP servers yet you lose almost no performance with the grass.

[krisfx 11]

The PR guys managed to modify the grass in the Battlefield 2 engine to render at a large distance so it could be used as cover, but the maps were much smaller so on this scale I assume it's much trickier. 

[twinturbonet (DayZ) 294]

I would totally be okay with the devs removing ALL grass and leaving just bushes and trees.  Not even sure if they could do that, but if they did, I'd be okay with it.

[blacklabel79 949]

This "Problem" exists in all the MP games i Play..it Comes up now and then...

Its just a technical Limitation.

Altho i liked how they did it in arma3? where 1/3rd of your Body "sinks into the ground" if viewd from a certain distance.

[Jex 1104]

Often thought this myself in regards to thinning it out a little and thus using the same cpu draw by spreading it over a larger range. Not sure if the AI can still see through it or not as i have mostly given up on the stealth idea with zeds currently ( i have to often been caught prone in a situation where i never saw the zed coming but they saw me exagerated further by the fact zeds make alot less noise now almost no groans at all..)

 

Edit Yeah beef and bacon there has been the sinking players into the ground when viewed from range its not perfect but it does help ( though it requires a larger more detailed ground texture to really make the effect work half decent.)

 

Another thing I was thinking that could be done as well is the uses of patchwork grass. So you don't have grass evenly spread out.

 

You start by rendering the grass around the player but as you move away from the player the grass gets less and then further out it just renders "patches" of grass. These patches would be small and spread apart far so in between it would be derendered landscape. The patches though would be numerous enough to make them worth hiding in.

 

So looking from your player, you would see fairly thick grass coverage to 50-100m then it thins out a lot then you get just patches. From your eyes there would be maybe 50-100 of these patches so more than enough to hide in (unless you check all 50-100 patches).

 

The problem of course is how much can u render, remembering the further out u go, the available space that needs to be covered increases exponentially.

[Jex 1104]

I would totally be okay with the devs removing ALL grass and leaving just bushes and trees.  Not even sure if they could do that, but if they did, I'd be okay with it.

 

I like the grass, just thin it out a lot so u can render it out to 500m. With the new stance system in arma 3 you can now moves so much that seeing just over the grass isn't an issue. Of course when the other guy ur shooting at doesn't see any grass around you, you stand out.

 

A bare landscape just looks awful and unrealistic though great for the FPS :)

[Mark Darkers 151]

well keep in mind, for compensation of the grass not drawing at certain distances, the ground texture gets leveled upwards, this means when a player goes prone only 1/3 of his body mass will be visible. If you don't have a backpack, most of the times players won't be able to spot you.

[Combine (DayZ) 247]

Due to running around the coast last weekend I'm pretty sure that "coast grass" (shilf or whatever you call it?) DOES get rendered past your average or usual grass rendering distance.

 

Could think about that.

 

I guess that counts as "hard" bushes and stuff, not "soft" grass that's everywhere or in most places. I say: Either cut out grass completely or increase rendering distance by 25m or more. Or something like that.

[Evil Minion 943]

Altho i liked how they did it in arma3? where 1/3rd of your Body "sinks into the ground" if viewd from a certain distance.

Probably the best solution - it makes grass work similar to bushes at greater distances. If done right it would produce an effect similar to the real thing. Also a general minor blurring effect at distance would help as it avoids sharp edges that would make it much easier to spot someone.

[taco86 156]

If grass cannot be rendered and simulated all the way out to the edge of player rendering range then it needs to be removed...  As others have pointed out, the way grass effects game play is actually the complete opposite as one would expect.

[ZomboWTF 527]

Afaik arma 2 had a grass concealment layer at distance without any mod at all, i doubt they removed this from toh or dayz sa, just go test it with a friend going prone at 200 meters without a backpack and without moving, if they completely disappear with aiming down with a gun, its still there

[roguetrooper 201]

In my custom Arma 2/3 maps I always implement an option to turn off the grass completely (in the lobby, forced for all players). It makes the world look clean and sterile, but actually having no grass at all is the fairest - compared to the "unrealistic" grass.

 

I know that prone bodies sink into the ground partially. Maybe it's a step into the "right" direction", but also not an optimum.

[pilgrim* 3514]

Bodies in cover or prone at a distance = give them transparency according to distance, or a semi transparent green pattern skin

[Katana67 2907]

And? What's your point?

 

Do you want the grass to be improved? Or removed?

 

Because one of those makes more sense than the other.

 

HINT - It's the former.

 

Edited August 8, 2014 by Katana67

[Cpanther 221]

Grass ? use a tree or a bush, a wall, a hole in the ground.....in real life a soldier will never prone in an open field hoping that the grass will hide them. And if realism doesn't do it for you...no CPU is powerful enough to run a map like DayZ with grass everywhere all the time.

[sai (DayZ) 137]

Just add random prerenderd images overlaid on distant terrain. Doesn't need to be ingame renderd grass, If a player is in grass they will blend into it based on how tall the renderd grass is on their spot and their clothing. It would be very easy to do. But it's not going to happen.