Will hackers really be subdued in SA? Not likely.

[HumanBeing25 299]

Satan Christ? oh please just call me Aporis. ;)

Because you're so arrogant then I'll call you Mr. TakesItFromBehind. No pun or offense intended :))))

[Aporis 422]

Because you're so arrogant then I'll call you Mr. TakesItFromBehind. No pun or offense intended :))))

Luv you too :)

[kichilron 8550]

This is why I will still be playing the DayZ mod alongside the standalone until private hives are supported.  Public servers just don't seem to be administrated in a way that even comes close to the private hives.  And I have zero tolerance for script kiddies or servers that aren't aggressively administrated to keep them off.  I have zero faith in public server administration or Battleye.  I had quit DayZ for a few months before I found and tried a good private hive and community.

 

 

With an ACP like Dayz.ST has everyone can host a private hive these days and there are a lot more private hives being administrated a LOT worse than publichive, especially as the admins can do whatever they want on there and noone would give anything about it.

 

Not only our (TMW's) publichive-servers are being administrated properly, have an antihack, are restart regularly and run extremely smoothly - there are a lot of other people out there still hosting publichive-servers and actually maintain them. US3480 to name one of them. It's a shame to see everyone moaning about publichive being dead while in reality it's better than ever and still more controllable than private hives with what admins do on them.

 

/back to topic:

 

SA will have publichive and it's going to be great as it's going to be a lot different and not the way it was when DayZ Mod came out. I wouldn't want to see the community split again because of the private hives where everyone does their own thing. And the way the architecture is working it will be a lot different with the scripting and cheats in general. But that has been said a lot already and we all know it will be differently and enjoyable.

[OrLoK 16182]

yes, lets try to keep it on topic, please.

 

The only antichrist you need worry about is me.

 

L

[h4yw1r3 64]

With an ACP like Dayz.ST has everyone can host a private hive these days and there are a lot more private hives being administrated a LOT worse than publichive, especially as the admins can do whatever they want on there and noone would give anything about it.

 

Not only our (TMW's) publichive-servers are being administrated properly, have an antihack, are restart regularly and run extremely smoothly - there are a lot of other people out there still hosting publichive-servers and actually maintain them. US3480 to name one of them. It's a shame to see everyone moaning about publichive being dead while in reality it's better than ever and still more controllable than private hives with what admins do on them.

 

/back to topic:

 

SA will have publichive and it's going to be great as it's going to be a lot different and not the way it was when DayZ Mod came out. I wouldn't want to see the community split again because of the private hives where everyone does their own thing. And the way the architecture is working it will be a lot different with the scripting and cheats in general. But that has been said a lot already and we all know it will be differently and enjoyable.

 

 

I'm happy for you if that's been your experience with public servers.  But my experience on the public hive had me hanging it up as far as DayZ is concerned.  They are riddled with script kiddies.  I got sick of putting in hours of game time just to lose it all to a script.  And I got sick of the ghosting and server hopping of the public hive as well.

I didn't play for a couple months.  When the urge to play DayZ starting getting to me, I checked out the private hives.  The ones I've played have been great.  If it weren't for them, I wouldn't even be playing DayZ now.  At least if a script kiddie runs his scripts on the private hive I play on, he gets banned and everyone he killed gets a prompt rollback on their survivors so that they don't lose everything to scripts.  I also like that the private hives I play on have great communities, and servers are on separate databases so there is no server hopping or ghosting, and it allows for multiple survivors since they are separate.

The point is, if you had a good experience on public hives and like to play there, then great, no one is stopping you.  But just because you and others might prefer the public hive doesn't mean everyone else should have to play where you want them to.  Let people play where they want.  I and many others prefer the private hives.  No one is forcing you to play private hives.  I shouldn't be forced to play the public hive any longer than necessary.

Edited October 25, 2013 by H4YW1R3

[gummy52 57]

there is no such thing as an unhackable game

 

Not true, but there's no such thing as an unmodifiable game client. Here is the bottom line: the moment you trust your players with the information their client is given your game is compromised. That's a fundamental problem with the conventional way many games are programmed today.

Edited October 25, 2013 by gummy52

[kichilron 8550]

The point is, if you had a good experience on public hives and like to play there, then great, no one is stopping you.  But just because you and others might prefer the public hive doesn't mean everyone else should have to play where you want them to.  Let people play where they want.  I and many others prefer the private hives.  No one is forcing you to play private hives.  I shouldn't be forced to play the public hive any longer than necessary.

 

 

We're discussing the Standalone here - and the discussion is going on about what you're describing you experienced and whether it's going to be happening less in the SA.

And it's more than likely that the scripting-problems are going to be solved with the SA and therefore there is no need to have anything else other than publichive, which makes your argumentation redundant.

 

As much as I understand your pain there's no need to say we need private hives for SA, as there isn't going to be anything like modding anyway and private hives would in no way be safer than publichive in SA.

 

 

And what you're saying about publichive is not true anymore as well. We actually have the ability to make our servers safe now and there are a couple of servers out there that are making their servers safe. And the reason why I was saying that, is that I am running 2 servers that have a very good antihack installed which many private hives don't even have. That plus active staff supporting a server makes it better than private hives. You just have to find a server like that, but they are out there and they are still on publichive.

[broguenz 333]

Hackers is giving 'them' too much credit. Won't stop an actual and determined hacker, slow them down at best.

 

Script injection will be less of a problem..i would think.

Edited October 27, 2013 by RogueNZ

[AbhChallenger 4]

As said before. Unless they have managed to close every potential hole in the software a hacker could break through just like any other software.

 

However, it will stop 99 percent of the "easy" hacking due to the way the Arma engine was designed.

[SalamanderAnder (DayZ) 1747]

You don't know what you're even talking about Ozelot. They are rewriting the engine to specifically prevent client side script injection, which is the major cause of all hacking. Of course you can't fully prevent hacking, but at the very least it can be minimized to a playable level. The other half of it is keeping a vigilant, updated system which will catch successful hackers and ban them. But with the new server/client architecture, script injection will basically be impossible. The server is in control of all scripts.

Edited October 27, 2013 by SalamanderAnder

[AbhChallenger 4]

Also unless I am mistaken. They will be using Steamworks and that means VAC right?

 

VAC is pretty damn good at punishing hacking that it can detect. Overall not a good environment for those who want to hack the game for the lols and that is a good thing for DayZ.

[tsandrey 379]

 

VAC is pretty damn good at punishing hacking that it can detect. Overall not a good environment for those who want to hack the game for the lols and that is a good thing for DayZ.

Not really. VAC is a bad decision (what is rocket even thinking?!). ESP cheats won't be detected, and many cheaters will use them. It's not something obvious, but it will hurt many people.

Edited October 27, 2013 by TSAndrey

[Elo 44]

A sniper in an area where a lot of players will come by (thnk airfield or cherno) using an aimbot / esp is all you need to ruin the game

[kichilron 8550]

You will always have that, though. You have that in every game, even on Battlefield / Call of Duty / Counterstrike.

 

You will not have people nuking entire servers and their population or scripexecute them. That is what we're talking about here, as that has been the real problem with DayZ for a long time.

 

 

Even though I must admit those parachuting cows were hilarious.

[thecoolestloseryouknow 38]

I don't remember exactly, but I believe rocket said something about loot being all on one client (I know little about all this tech shit so I probably sound like a 8 year old to you guys) so it will be much easier for servers to catch hackers that spawn things in.

[Elo 44]

You will always have that, though. You have that in every game, even on Battlefield / Call of Duty / Counterstrike.

 

You will not have people nuking entire servers and their population or scripexecute them. That is what we're talking about here, as that has been the real problem with DayZ for a long time.

 

 

Even though I must admit those parachuting cows were hilarious.

 

 

Those games have no permadeath. Any hacking in DayZ is amplified by the fact that death basically is game over.

 

It really doesn't matter if you get killed by a nuke or by somebody using a radar and an aimbot, your day is ruined either way

Edited October 27, 2013 by Elo

[Mos1ey 6301]

Not really. VAC is a bad decision (what is rocket even thinking?!). ESP cheats won't be detected, and many cheaters will use them. It's not something obvious, but it will hurt many people.

 

A lot of Steam exclusive games use VAC as well as a third-party anticheat. I wouldn't be surprised if that was what Rocket had in mind.

[kichilron 8550]

If you take it to heart like that and can't just keep playing DayZ after you died you might have to think twice. That's the fun part - regearing afer you died. And you will never know if it was illegit or not. Always thinking it was illegit it going to poison your mind. Happens way too often these days, that people accuse others of foul play, while they were just running across an open field with a sniper overwatching it.

 

But just let the Standalone come. It will be a different feeling. You will not even get to think about it ;-)

[liquidmind 320]

I think it's interesting how people forget....

 

we had raining cows, zombies, helicopters, planes. Spawned in super-chests. people teleported to their doom, hackers teleporting behind players killing them. Mass-killing of servers, Burning maps, invisibility hacks, Deathmatch-arenas, Infinite As50s, Aimbots,.... 

 

And now people are like "What are they even trying for, they will never make a hack-proof game. People will use ESP to see everything in their 500m network-bubble"....

 

"No, that the server decides what is allowed, compared to the client that decided it before, will not change ANYTHING about hacking. It's basically the same game."

 

Ignorance is bliss... 

[gummy52 57]

You don't know what you're even talking about Ozelot. They are rewriting the engine to specifically prevent client side script injection, which is the major cause of all hacking. Of course you can't fully prevent hacking, but at the very least it can be minimized to a playable level. The other half of it is keeping a vigilant, updated system which will catch successful hackers and ban them. But with the new server/client architecture, script injection will basically be impossible. The server is in control of all scripts.

That means nothing. No one is even script injecting DayZ Mod anymore, everyone is just memory hacking, which can be done to any game.

[SalamanderAnder (DayZ) 1747]

 

This is from January. In it Dean clearly describes the main differences between the new server client architecture. Consider this. Ballistics in Arma 2 are calculated by each client individually, and then resolved. Now, the server calculates all bullet trajectories. This means the only way to make a bullet go through walls is to literally hack the server. Same goes for running any scripts, creating items, ect. The server dictates all variables based on player input, so it is now the umpire.

 

Even rocket admits that it probably won't stop people from hacking in some minor ways, but cows from the sky, teleportation, boxes full of equipment randomly appearing and the mass hack attacks should finally be a thing of the past. These are the debilitating hacks which ruin the game outright, and they are still there. "Memory hacking" means basically fuck all when the server is constantly logging and dictating your health, location, inventory, and ballistics. It also makes catching cheaters much easier, which means they can be removed quickly by admins before they start to create mass chaos, as they generally do.

Edited October 27, 2013 by SalamanderAnder

[HumanBeing25 299]

Since probably 9/10 here haven't got a clue whatsoever how an aimbot or any other cheat really works, let me be the first to say this: it is possible to prevent many cheaters by encrypting memory, for example, but that will slow the game down drastically. It is also possible in various other ways, such as the anti-map"hack" Dota 2 has, where the Dota 2 servers don't send information to the clients about players who're not already able to be seen (they're under fog of war), but that will in turn slow the game down (when the DayZ is as big as it is) network-wise, and again result in poor performance.

It is also possible to put in anti-debugging security to prevent people from finding the relevant offsets in the first place, but this security will be broken easily if not done right - and either way it will eventually be bypassed anyway.

 

Then again there's more ways, such as creating false character objects in memory that the cheat creator will not know is not a real player but merely a distraction.

The server can do some calculations on mouse movement even, to find out whether suspicious behavior goes on, and so on.

 

There's many ways, but ultimately most of the possible ways to fully secure or at least secure the client more will result in worse performance, either client-wise or network-wise.

[Ozelot (DayZ) 394]

I think it's interesting how people forget....

 

we had raining cows, zombies, helicopters, planes. Spawned in super-chests. people teleported to their doom, hackers teleporting behind players killing them. Mass-killing of servers, Burning maps, invisibility hacks, Deathmatch-arenas, Infinite As50s, Aimbots,.... 

 

And now people are like "What are they even trying for, they will never make a hack-proof game. People will use ESP to see everything in their 500m network-bubble"....

 

"No, that the server decides what is allowed, compared to the client that decided it before, will not change ANYTHING about hacking. It's basically the same game."

 

Ignorance is bliss... 

If all those hacks were available from the beginning, that means there are a TON of un-exposed vulnerabilities still existing in the engine. A lot of the hacker slow down is probably just due to less people playing and having gotten bored with it.

[brzator47@gmail.com 524]

 that means

No, it doesn't mean exactly that. Are you not reading what everyone is saying or you're just choosing to ignore it?

[Wayze 549]

A sniper in an area where a lot of players will come by (thnk airfield or cherno) using an aimbot / esp is all you need to ruin the game

A sniper :lol:

 

First the dude has to find a sniper, if he is lucky as hell, he may find half a mag with it. Well, I don't think you are able to ruin a game with 4 shots, no matter how much aimbot you use. And I am pretty sure that an aimbot won't work, I mean it would be a freaking complicated aimbot, calculating the weapons velocity, the players distance, where to aim to hit the player and ofcourse it would have to have some kind of system that detects where the player will move the next second.

Yea, I don't see that happen.

Edited October 27, 2013 by Wayze