First vs Third Person Discussion (Dslyecxi video)

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

How so? The only real difference between them would be that you can see your character in third person and can no longer use third person to look over walls etc. It would actually make them much more balanced.

best suggestion I've seen is this

 

you only ever see players, zeds, loot, vehicles etc that are within your characters First person FOV, whether in 3rd or first person.

 

This way it enables Third person guys to check their surroundings, see how well hidden their character is and how pretty he looks when he runs through a forest.

 But he has no advantage at all over other players.

Edited August 23, 2013 by (MUC) Feral

[Garmalak 16]

 

There is a reason the game genre is called "FIRST PERSON Shooter".

Look at my post above yours, the idea part, I think it would solve this issue. :)

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

why cant you understand people like 3rd person ?

 

everyone likes different things !

 

you may like 3rd person you may like 1st person none is wrong just different.

 

 

blah blah like wall hack wtf you smoking? if you going down that route why give admins godmode or capability to do whatever they want ? thats worse than 3rd peson oh no you dont cry about that shit and thats basically legit hacking on every private server in the game .

 

such dramatic bs.

 

its like the kos shit.

Sure everyone likes different things, but designing a game involves deciding at some point what has a place in that game and what doesn't.

 

I like tanks and Ferrairi's too, should those be in the game?  No of course not because they have no place being there.

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

 

 

I like tanks and Ferrairi's too, should those be in the game?  No of course not because they have no place being there.

master of the devastating metaphor =)

 

its a tough fight ahead, so many guys in denial.

 

i just scanned CoD forums, BF4 forums and CSGO forums and nobody is clamouring for 3rd person,

 

i might register and make the suggestion, i'm sure even those communities will tear me apart, as this one quite rightly would for suggesting such a game breaking feature.

Edited August 23, 2013 by (MUC) Feral

[brzator47@gmail.com 524]

But then it's pointless, in fact it would put 1st person players at an advantage

So 3rd person being a huge advantage is okay and yet a proposal that would make it other way around is "pointless".

Not that locking freeview in 3rd person would put 1st person at a big, if any advantage anyway. I guess it would be better than nothing but I do hope the devs give it a bit more thought than that.

 

Dayz is either a hardcore survival experience that aims like no other for realism or it's not.

The thing is, there is nothing really hardcore about 1st person view. So many games that don't even aim for a realistic and tense experience do just fine without 3rd person. It just happened to be an option in ARMA that got popular because it gave people an advantage over those playing in standard 1st person view.

[Garmalak 16]

This is an interesting idea:

 

When ever you shoot your weapon/get hit, you immediately (automatically!) go into First Person if you were not already in it.

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

 

 

The thing is, there is nothing really hardcore about 1st person view. So many games that don't even aim for a realistic and tense experience do just fine without 3rd person. It just happened to be an option in ARMA that got popular because it gave people an advantage over those playing in standard 1st person view.

i agree, but 3rd person is so unrealistic it belongs in a game based on magic spells and supernatural powers

[terrvik 2409]

This is an interesting idea:

 

When ever you shoot your weapon/get hit, you immediately (automatically!) go into First Person if you were not already in it.

 

That's not really the problem with third person though. The problem is everytying* that comes before the shooting starts. :)

I want to be able to hide from a helicopter. A pilot in third person can just look below or behind and all around him, which ruins the experience.

 

EDIT: *everytying? I'll just leave it in...

Edited August 23, 2013 by Terrorviktor

[Trizzo 632]

why cant you understand people like 3rd person ?

 

everyone likes different things !

 

you may like 3rd person you may like 1st person none is wrong just different.

 

 

blah blah like wall hack wtf you smoking? if you going down that route why give admins godmode or capability to do whatever they want ? thats worse than 3rd peson oh no you dont cry about that shit and thats basically legit hacking on every private server in the game .

 

such dramatic bs.

 

its like the kos shit.

 

So many strawmen and bad arguments.

 

It's not about what people like or what we understand, it's about what is good for the flavour of the game. If you can't see how bad 3rd person ‘wallhacks’ you are in wilful denial. And admins hacking? What asinine irrelevance is this! Because some admins are "hacking" and nobody (according to you) "cries about it", equates to any concern about third person is totally void and or less important.

 

Here’s a novel idea, how about fixing both. And third person goes way beyond the mod to the SA where admins are irrelevant.

 

And no this isn't like KOS at all. Anybody who complains about KOS doesn't get it. Besides KOS is not about gameplay in the sense that we are talking about here.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Trizzo

[dgeesio 1034]

i agree, but 3rd person is so unrealistic it belongs in a game based on magic spells and supernatural powers

 

 

arguing unrealistic in a zombie slash/infected person survival videogame haha.

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

arguing unrealistic in a zombie slash/infected person survival videogame haha.

not when it comes to mechanics, all games fall short of reality but some strive for realism and aim to get as close as possible using current technology.

 

Floating 9 feet in the air to spot a player who is on the other side of a tree, a building and 2 walls while remaining invisible is so stupidly game breakingly unrealistic i cant believe we are having this debate at all.

 

Get rid

Edited August 23, 2013 by (MUC) Feral

[Trizzo 632]

arguing unrealistic in a zombie slash/infected person survival videogame haha.

 

And that, ladies and gents, is your tap out.

[dgeesio 1034]

So many strawmen and bad arguments.

 

It's not about what people like, it's about what is good for the flavour of the game. If you can't see how bad 3rd person ‘wallhacks’ you are in wilful denial. And admins hacking? What asinine irrelevance is this! Because some admins "hacking" and nobody (according to you) "cries about it", equates to any concern about third person is totally void and unimportant.

 

Here’s a novel idea, how about fixing both. And third person goes way beyond the mod to the SA where admins are irrelevant.

 

no bad arguements it was put as a relevant answer. you give your op but why is yours anymore valid than the next person ? it isnt.

 

thats why 3rd person vs 1st is total bs idea.

 

at end of day people are just aguing preference 99.9 percent of time. i use both !

 

also people stating wall hacks for third person when every admin has far more worse tools is why i put it. so his statement is nothing in comparison.

 

 

how about fixing both who says third person is broke ? yet again a preference of you or others saying it is !

 

 

standalone has the admin stuff locked down so admins wont be gods !

[mercules 1290]

arguing unrealistic in a zombie slash/infected person survival videogame haha.

 

It really isn't all that unrealistic. All you would really need is a mutated strain of Rabies that acts faster and doesn't respond to current treatments.

Aside from that we do need to talk about some realism and the reason is that if I could jump to the top of the supermarket in a hop the game would no longer fit the genre. It would also make getting away from zombies really easy and ruin the game play. FPS tend to be simulators with an extra element and the better (notice I didn't say popular) ones tend to be more realistic. 

When I play Mass Effect I WISH I could play in First Person. I think the game would have a much better feel too it. 

 

[Garmalak 16]

But yeah, Admins can teleport and give themselves 50 satchel charges and blow up every single building in cherno

And you are going:

"wah wah he can see over A F-ING WALL"

Edited August 23, 2013 by Garmalak

[Trizzo 632]

no bad arguements it was put as a relevant answer. you give your op but why is yours anymore valid than the next person ? it isnt.

 

thats why 3rd person vs 1st is total bs idea.

 

at end of day people are just aguing preference 99.9 percent of time. i use both !

 

also people stating wall hacks for third person when every admin has far more worse tools is why i put it. so his statement is nothing in comparison.

 

 

how about fixing both who says third person is broke ? yet again a preference of you or others saying it is !

 

 

standalone has the admin stuff locked down so admins wont be gods !

 

 

Bad argument doubled down on: "Wall hacks don't mean anything because admins might use better hacks"...

 

Soooo.... We are playing Counter-Strike, and i'm using speed hack BUT because you are using god mode (according to you) that means my speed hack doesn't matter because your hack is better than my hack :facepalm:  FIX BOTH

 

And people arguing for first person just aren't arguing a preference, even if they prefer to play in first person. First person radically changes the balance of the game, the flavour of the game, the intensity of the game. Third person diminishes all of these aspects and retards strategy and gameplay.

 

 People arguing for third person are arguing for perspective and nothing more. Third person only adds nothing, it changes nothing. First person only, does.

 

I doubt a person defending third person can point to a single postive way that it enchances gameplay, in the theme of a survival simulator trying to best replicate a life like experience.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Trizzo

[mercules 1290]

no bad arguements it was put as a relevant answer. you give your op but why is yours anymore valid than the next person ? it isnt.

 

 

Mine is more valid because it isn't just an opinion or "preference" it has logical reasoning about why it makes the game more interesting and fits the style of game better. Your opinion is valid and should be heard, but it should also be backed up by reasoning and it isn't. You don't give reasons for your opinion, just assume that because it is an opinion there is no right or wrong to it, which is incorrect. Thousands of years ago people had the opinion/belief that the Sun orbited the Earth, they were not right. You have a belief that 3rd person is better for the game than 1st but can't explain why you think that way, which most likely means you are incorrect. Oh, and "People like it." isn't a reason it is good for a game. Thousands play CoD, Battlefield, and other similar games without 3rd person so you can't use, "They want more players." as a valid argument either. 

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

what concerns me is the comments about BiS consulting Youtubers on this issue.

 

What kind of game designer places 'how it looks in videos' over 'how it feels to play'?

[Skat3rat 1633]

I think a good compromise would be to lock the camera position behind your character in third person - not allowing you to angle it over/around walls using freelook etc and keeping the camera close enough to your body that it can't be exploited much even with a relatively high FOV.

 

^This.  I think it would work really well.  I understand why people want 3rd person out of the game, but I honestly enjoy it.  Not so that I can use it to cheat, but because it makes things like running long distances, checking out my character, and other reasons, more enjoyable.

 

Back when I started DayZ, I had no clue how to go into third person, because I was on a laptop.  I played for a good month or so in first person until I learned how to go into 3rd.  While 1st did make it more realistic, 3rd helped with things like my fps, riding things like bicycles, and etc.

 

Removing 3rd person wouldn't be a game breaker for me, but it would really suck.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Skat3rat

[SmashT 10907]

The other idea which I think Rocket touched on is having the camera mode change depending on what you are doing, so for example if you are running (and have third person enabled) the camera basically pulls back behind your character and then when you stop it moves back into first person. If you want to get an idea how this would work, something similar actually already happens in ArmA/DayZ mod when you move through a doorway into a small building like those small industrial shacks (it doesn't go all the way back to first person but you get the idea)

Edited August 23, 2013 by SmashT

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

The other idea which I think Rocket touched on is having the camera mode change depending on what you are doing, so for example if you are running (and have third person enabled) the camera basically pulls back behind your character and then when you stop it moves back into first person. If you want to get an idea how this would work, something similar actually already happens in ArmA/DayZ mod when you move through a doorway (although it doesn't go all the way back to first person it does move the camera a lot closer to the character)

it's still a mechanic that mocks careful, thoughtful, stealthy and tactical gameplay, only it mocks slightly less.

[dgeesio 1034]

The other idea which I think Rocket touched on is having the camera mode change depending on what you are doing, so for example if you are running (and have third person enabled) the camera basically pulls back behind your character and then when you stop it moves back into first person. If you want to get an idea how this would work, something similar actually already happens in ArmA/DayZ mod when you move through a doorway into a small building like those small industrial shacks (it doesn't go all the way back to first person but you get the idea)

 

like skyrim on mouse scroll through it from first person to third. thats one easy way.

[fluxley 2228]

like skyrim on mouse scroll through it from first person to third. thats one easy way.

 

Not quite, the idea is that you dont get the option to zoom out whenever you want, the camera would automatically move back only if you are running. and so prevent people from just standing behind a wall and using 3rd person.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Fluxley

[St. Jimmy 1631]

Not quite, the idea is that you dont get the option to zoom out whenever you want, the camera would automatically move back only if you are running. and so prevent people from just standing behind a wall and using 3rd person.

This sounds some solution. If you've run in standing position like 20s you could switch to the 3rd person but if you stop, change your stance or go from W to S/A/D your view is reseted. But you could still exploit with it somehow because the camera is so up and far away from your character.

[fluxley 2228]

This sounds some solution. If you've run in standing position like 20s you could switch to the 3rd person but if you stop, change your stance or go from W to S/A/D your view is reseted. But you could still exploit with it somehow because the camera is so up and far away from your character.

 

Yeah, its better than what we currently have but it would still be possible to see over walls while running.

 

Personally I just can't see a good reason for 3rd person being in a game like dayz.