Will Sniper Rifles be nerfed in the standalone?

[-Gews- 7443]

If you were shot with a CZ 550 in reality, would you expect to walk away after getting a little morphine and a blood bag or spend months recovering in hospital?

Especially if that CZ550 is in 9.3x62mm...

I would like them to incorporate some kind of chance into the damage. I'm really not a fan of the predictable hitpoints most all games seem to use... not totally random chance of course, highly influenced by caliber, velocity and location.

A set amount of hitpoints and damage just makes for so many problems...

[Kra 151]

To me it seems with the way they are talking about weapons in the standalone, every weapon is going to be 'nerfed'.

Nerfed in the sense that maintaining a working firing gun will take effort. Rocket's already outlined how clips, magazines and bullets are going to be separate entities. I hope they don't leave it there.

I'd like to see a full weapon maintenance system, that is, you need to clean your gun regularly, the barrel can get warped, jams, stuck trigger mechanisms, etcetc. Make it so if they're lazy run and gunners, the gun can blow up in their hands. This to me would be a very strong proponent of reducing kill on sight.

[mitor 176]

Again, this is not Call of Duty where weapons get "nerfed" because someone gets killed by them a lot. What, you want them to make them more inaccurate--less realistic?

Lol, that's ridiculous. Snipers are not realistic, you don't want to make them realistic, you only want the advantages a sniper rifle provides, but not the disadvantages.

Because using a sniper rifle requires a steady terrain, and it's weight makes them not suitable for a post apocalyptic environment. They are too big, they weight too much to be carried and be able to run and then shoot, and they require a lot of knowledge to shoot and maintain. As most of these cannot be done properly, they need to be nerfed. Not to mention that sniper rifles are accurate only if used with a lot of training...

So lets just not be so demagogic to say the word realistic and only say what you like.

Lol NO it does not. It only takes a mere few bullets to kill someone. What game are you playing?

The question is: What game are you playing?

Most assault rifles require 4 hits to kill, not to mention AK variants, which require 5 hits to kill. (5 hits will still leave the player with 500 blood so they will not kill)

Not to mention the pistols and submachine guns...

So please, let's not tell lies. I more or less agree to the last three points.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Mitor

[Inception. 9443]

Most assault rifles require 4 hits to kill, not to mention AK variants, which require 5 hits to kill. (5 hits will still leave the player with 500 blood so they will not kill)

It only takes one bullet to kill a player.

[mitor 176]

It only takes one bullet to kill a player.

So, you only quote one part of the post and then you say a partial true which doesn't negate any thing I have said. You know what we are talking about so please...

Edited May 18, 2013 by Mitor

[DemonGroover 8836]

I am no expert on guns but isnt a sniper rifle supposed to kill someone with one shot - isnt that their purpose?

The question here should be "Are sniper rifles going to be harder to shoot in SA?"

I am all for making sniper shots much more difficult, not only with bullet drop but wind factors as well. But i dont believe they should be nerfed.

[HazZarD87 166]

OP. Go back to CoD. Now!

[mitor 176]

OP. Go back to CoD. Now!

You are the one that should go back to cod, What are you doing here? Dayz is reaching a stage where it is approaching COD's way to handle damage.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Mitor

[Inception. 9443]

So, you only quote one part of the post and then you say a partial true which doesn't negate any thing I have said. You know what we are talking about so please...

Alright.

--

I never said snipers were realistic, did I? That makes this

Lol, that's ridiculous. Snipers are not realistic, you don't want to make them realistic, you only want the advantages a sniper rifle provides, but not the disadvantages.

Because using a sniper rifle requires a steady terrain, and it's weight makes them not suitable for a post apocalyptic environment. They are too big, they weight too much to be carried and be able to run and then shoot, and they require a lot of knowledge to shoot and maintain. As most of these cannot be done properly, they need to be nerfed. Not to mention that sniper rifles are accurate only if used with a lot of training...

So lets just not be so demagogic to say the word realistic and only say what you like.

pointless.

And besides, this does not change anything. They aren't going to be "nerfed" or entirely removed just because one person lacks the ability to avoid dying to them 80% of the time.

The question is: What game are you playing?

Most assault rifles require 4 hits to kill, not to mention AK variants, which require 5 hits to kill. (5 hits will still leave the player with 500 blood so they will not kill)

Not to mention the pistols and submachine guns...

So please, let's not tell lies. I more or less agree to the last three points.

All weapons only require a minimum of one bullet to kill. It isn't that hard to hit a headshot in close range.

So, really, I needn't have quoted anything more than one part of your post.

DayZ was meant to be a harsh game.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Inception.

[Zarniwoop 1193]

Make Sniper Rifles harder to shoot, hit and maintain. No nerf. Nerfing is stupid.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Zarniwoop

[Ozer 57]

we need Ace mod to be implemented. It'll solve that problem.

[s4pphire 45]

The game in no way needs to be realistic. The game will NEVER be realistic. No game will. And with the accruacy I'm not talking just aiming down yout sights im talking just hip firing in general (yes I just used the term hip firing so get the hell over it). It's a spray and pray game that is won by the sniper rifle. And when say it takes a whole clip of stanag your leaving out the mass ammount of inacurate shots not due to the player's aim but to the gun itself. Even then it will take quite a few rounds if you get teh shots off. Then take a look at the DMR. Almost no spread.

And don't you talk crap about comparing something invalid to COD. Nerfing in cod? What are you smoking? It wouldn't surprise me if your one of the people that ravage barraks looking for anything that slightly resembles a DMR. Then sit at the nearest airfield on top of a firestation.

Bad players such as yourself get killed by sniper rifles. Common sense goes a long way: back when I stopped playing on official servers somewhere in September or October, I was at -2 million humanity mostly through sniping, and at least 95% of the them are always the same type of bad players who stand next to windows looting, run through open fields in broad daylight without a care in the world or feel that climbing the rooftop to pick up a Makarov is more important than their life.

Long story short, if the majority of your deaths result from sniper rifles, you are most definitely doing something wrong and should instead ask yourself how you can fix your mistakes.

PS: It takes four body-shots to kill with Stanag rounds, and are available to some of the best assault rifles in the game. M4/M16 are both extremely reliable weapons with very respectable accuracy, even long range.

[liquidmind 320]

The whole damage-model is different in SA.. don't compare Mod-Weapons to Standalone.

I still hope the whole "I have to shoot other players to win the game"-mentality stops when Standalone offers new methods of collaboration and more threats to protect from.

Those who play DayZ for a long time now, know that it wasn't that KoS-style in the beginning. Players getting bored, starting to shoot at random. I remember people posting "I'm a bandit now till standalone comes out, because there is nothing to do for a hero" and stuff like that.

Also. There won't be hero and bandit in Standalone as far as we know, so the whole game mechanic might change. to the better I think.

[hasin5 5]

The guns are already nerfed up to the extent of realism - You can't really 'nerf' a sniper-rifle.

[Powell (DayZ) 734]

What's to nerf? A powerful round firing at high speed and distance can't really be nerfed; it's physics

[-Gews- 7443]

What's to nerf? A powerful round firing at high speed and distance can't really be nerfed; it's physics

I've seen people on here suggest that sniper damage start out at a very low level, and slowly increase in power as the round goes further and further...

[Henryllex~ 407]

Sniper rifles are fine, what we need is make them less easy too shoot.

I mean this:

lets say i have a m24, im carrying it, but it is gonna weight a total of 6kg without loading, so i need to get my secondary up so i can run, then i see somebody camping, i get to the ground, instead of shooting, i take out and load my rounds, set up bipod, wait until i stop shaking and then i shoot. what i mean is that before shooting we need to go by a whole procces of 20 secs before i can even use the weapon itself. and if we are carrying the rifle in our hands, we can run at all or very far, we need to dismount the rifle and the barrel separately, by tools, or get my secondary so i can run a little faster than walking. So its not gonna be like oh look a sniper rifle, im gonna take it and camp, and more like, hmmm sniper rifle, should i take it? i dont even have the tools to set it up so i can run and do everything more precisely and fast.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Henryllex~

[Chaingunfighter 917]

You must be playing it wrong...

More like spawn, run to Pusta, get hatchet, get food, run to Staroye, get Enfield, shoot deer, build fire, cook meat, camp, run to Dolina, fill water bottle, run to Polana, find tent, raid supermarket, run to Dubrovka, find bicycle, bike to Klen, observe Krasnostav, hide bike, raid supermarket, find helicopter crash, take AKM, scout airfield, sneak through forest, get KOS.

Every post I see you make makes me feel absolutely stupid because you know 10x more than I do on any topic.

(EDIT: 10x + 1 because 10 x 0 is still 0)

Edited May 19, 2013 by Chaingunfighter

[Sozinho 58]

The term "balancing" and "nerfing" do not apply to a game like dayz. Everyone has an equal opportunity to get these "over powered" weapons, so it is naturally balanced by the ability of the player

[Powell (DayZ) 734]

If I could do one thing to sniper rifles, is I'd give it a realistic sight (ie red orchestra) where the scope doesn't fill the whole screen and you have peripheral vision; that'd make sniping harder as the scope FOV is less.

[HazZarD87 166]

You are the one that should go back to cod, What are you doing here? Dayz is reaching a stage where it is approaching COD's way to handle damage.

you come up with all this bs yourself or is it substance induced. This whole thread is just OP being mad cause bad

[pxxl 259]

Thread allready exists here: http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/131625-will-snipers-be-removed-or-at-least-tweaked-in-sa/

ill post the same response:

You know you can counter a sniper right?

Travel in larger group

1. sniper will think twice about giving his position away

2. once sniper has fired a shot, you can split up and flank

3. your gear can be guarded by the remaining survivors

Movement

1. always scan the area before moving ahead

2. stay away from open fields, move through cover.

3. never loot your kill immediately after shooting him down

Maybe find a Sniper rifle and shoot down the snipers yourself?!

I personally wouldn't want to play DayZ without the looming danger of snipers all over the place.. where is the fun in that?

[Heathcz 84]

I think its not that snipers would be op, but that blood system, and the fact that pistol takes you 800 and such, thats just bullshit. Like, normally, even a pistol would take you down normally, the system is just retarded. wait for SA, thats it.

[-Gews- 7443]

I think its not that snipers would be op, but that blood system, and the fact that pistol takes you 800 and such, thats just bullshit. Like, normally, even a pistol would take you down normally, the system is just retarded. wait for SA, thats it.

Yeah but standard ArmA damage is also too lethal... get hit in the toe at close range and you die, even if it's just a 5.45mm. The ACE damage mod is a lot better but most things are lacking.

For a start, I think the differences in damage are too much right now.

For example a 7.62x39mm has 56% of the energy a 7.62 NATO has, so it does 56% of the damage a 7.62 NATO does...

A 9x19mm has 11% of the energy a 7.62 NATO has, so it does 11% of the damage a 7.62 NATO does...

Really?

Humans are pretty thin-skinned animals, they're not big game. Most bullets of reasonable power can go through a human, so I doubt there would be such a massive difference in their effects when using FMJ ammunition... would the person shot be able to tell the difference? The biggest factor is placement - did the bullet hit any vital organs or not?

Putting more and more energy in comes with diminishing returns... I' rather see all the damages closer to each other.

Instead of

9x19mm = 889

7.62x39 = 4500

7.62 NATO = 8000

I'd rather see something like

9x19mm = 2660

7.62x39 = 6000

7.62 NATO = 8000

If you didn't notice, I was simply taking the square of the differences...

I still feel following some kind of formula is important for consistency. Something that really bothers me is when people just "bullshit" damage values.

"Oh, screw it, let's make a 45 as powerful as a 12-gauge because I feel like it should be for no particular reason"

I'm curious to see what the new pistol damages will be in the 1.7.7 patch. If they've gone back to the old "Makarov = 2000, 9x19mm = 1389, 45 ACP = 4500" I will have the biggest fit of indignant rage...

[HazZarD87 166]

Yeah but standard ArmA damage is also too lethal... get hit in the toe at close range and you die, even if it's just a 5.45mm. The ACE damage mod is a lot better but most things are lacking.

For a start, I think the differences in damage are too much right now.

For example a 7.62x39mm has 56% of the energy a 7.62 NATO has, so it does 56% of the damage a 7.62 NATO does...

A 9x19mm has 11% of the energy a 7.62 NATO has, so it does 11% of the damage a 7.62 NATO does...

Really?

Humans are pretty thin-skinned animals, they're not big game. Most bullets of reasonable power can go through a human, so I doubt there would be such a massive difference in their effects when using FMJ ammunition... would the person shot be able to tell the difference? The biggest factor is placement - did the bullet hit any vital organs or not?

Putting more and more energy in comes with diminishing returns... I' rather see all the damages closer to each other.

Instead of

9x19mm = 889

7.62x39 = 4500

7.62 NATO = 8000

I'd rather see something like

9x19mm = 2660

7.62x39 = 6000

7.62 NATO = 8000

If you didn't notice, I was simply taking the square of the differences...

I still feel following some kind of formula is important for consistency. Something that really bothers me is when people just "bullshit" damage values.

"Oh, screw it, let's make a 45 as powerful as a 12-gauge because I feel like it should be for no particular reason"

I'm curious to see what the new pistol damages will be in the 1.7.7 patch. If they've gone back to the old "Makarov = 2000, 9x19mm = 1389, 45 ACP = 4500" I will have the biggest fit of indignant rage...

Well bullet damage is a strange beast IRL too. It's dependant on so much more factors than just speed and calibre. I doubt that with the current computing power you could have a playable game that portrays it even reasonably accurate. I know of plenty of cases where police fired over 10 rounds of 9mm into someone and after that had to resort to a headshot to put 'em down. Same thing goes for a guy I know who was in Afghanistan. He fired 4 times into an oncoming insurgent, after each hit the guy just kept on coming. It took 4 5.56mm rounds within 100m before he finnally stayed down.

On the other side, the same rounds are known to put people down in one hit if they hit a "sweet spot". (This is all considering FMJ rounds.)

Bottom line is, untill games can simulate human anatomy and the effects of gunfire on it in a realistic way, we will always have to cut some corners damage wise. Overall I think ArmA does a decent job, better than other games at least.