Don't even make third-person an option for DayZ standalone

[exdeath 0]

No one answered my question.

Its possible to have third person view only server right now?

Another question. Many guys here are saying that we need third person view because first person one is flawed. If first person view is flawed, why you arent also asking to make the game 3rd person only? I mean, if as you say, first person view is flawed, and if we want to make the game good we need to remove flawed things?

[Jars (DayZ) 63]

We should have the freedom of choice. If you think its unfair, then use third person so no one is at a disadvantage. Besides I get a little motion sick from the headbob in first person view. And sometimes I just like being able to see whats around my character.

Troll ?

Must be .... surely .... it just doesn't seem possible to be otherwise .

[ImageCtrl 719]

Another question. Many guys here are saying that we need third person view because first person one is flawed. If first person view is flawed, why you arent also asking to make the game 3rd person only?

First person is not flawed.

We should have the freedom of choice. If you think its unfair, then use third person so no one is at a disadvantage. Besides I get a little motion sick from the headbob in first person view. And sometimes I just like being able to see whats around my character.

You can disable headbob.

Edited January 8, 2013 by NoCheats

[Pomegranate 83]

We should get freedom of choice to choose between third-person and first-person, just like we should get freedom of choice between hunger and no hunger, pvp and no pvp, and zombies and no zombies.

Yeah.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Pomegranate

[‮spacecaps 101]

BI has explained why they have included 3rd person view as a feature in the game, so since it's an actual feature, it's not actually a hack, cheat or exploit, despite your best efforts to label it as such.

Hardcore milsim community doesn't think it's a feature, and they know what they're doing, trust me. You should watch

of

. These particular videos are in Russian, but I guess it's not hard to understand that it has much more depth than your usual Battlefield or ARMA/DayZ PvP (it's simulated warfare with a different mission every time, about 70x70 people and is highly organized).

My point is that ARMA is a set of DIY parts with a pretty shitty game on top of them shipped by default, and DayZ is no exception because it's based on vanilla ARMA. Milsim community modded the hell out of it already, they've created the game that is much more deep and detailed. It's a pity that we don't have such people here in DayZ community, probably because DayZ itself is based on novelty, and attracts people mostly for a couple weeks. Sadly, what once was the ultimately brutal and atmospheric survival game with permadeath, now has become a silly multiplayer GTA clone for the most part. And no, I don't think that more choices are always good by default. Sometimes you have to enforce a feature.

Edited January 8, 2013 by KizUrazgubi

[enforcer1975 1111]

First person is not flawed.

You can disable headbob.

All first person shooters must be flawed, too. Broken fov and head bob all the way...i wonder why the ArmA related forums are the only ones with crybabies...fyi i convinced my mates to play on an expert server, after a few days of getting used to it ( nausea etc. ) they don't really want to play on 3rd person servers anymore because the gameplay is more challenging. It took me quite a while but now we are one step further...our longest 1st person session was almost 9 hours ( incl. pee breaks :P ).

It's a pity that we don't have such people here in DayZ community, probably because DayZ itself is based on novelty, and attracts people mostly for a couple weeks.

here i am although i'm more of the soft hardcore guy with respawn :D . Most players here must be from the land of the consoles ( over seas ) from what i read... Most hardcore of potential hardcore gamers are stationed around europe.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Enforcer

[dallas 5195]

Hardcore milsim community doesn't think it's a feature, and they know what they're doing, trust me. You should watch

of

. These particular videos are in Russian, but I guess it's not hard to understand that it has much more depth than your usual Battlefield or ARMA/DayZ PvP (it's simulated warfare with a different mission every time, about 70x70 people and is highly organized).

My point is that ARMA is a set of DIY parts with a pretty shitty game on top of them shipped by default, and DayZ is no exception because it's based on vanilla ARMA. Milsim community modded the hell out of it already, they've created the game that is much more deep and detailed. It's a pity that we don't have such people here in DayZ community, probably because DayZ itself is based on novelty, and attracts people mostly for a couple weeks. Sadly, what once was the ultimately brutal and atmospheric survival game with permadeath, now has become a silly multiplayer GTA clone for the most part. And no, I don't think that more choices are always good by default. Sometimes you have to enforce a feature.

I'm a part of a hardcore milsim community already, however I also really enjoy DayZ and 3rd person.

What you have to love about vanilla ArmA, isn't that it's the perfect game out of the box, but that Bohemia Interactive always delivers an open and easy platform to it's many different modding communities. And while some communities have taken a very hardcore route, they can't take claim for BI's basic engine, which allows them to mode every aspect of the game, from mission design, creating new models, addons, mods such as ACe or DayZ and yes even the difficulty level.

Please don't ever compare Battlefield and ArmA and please don't talk about less choices. Bohemia Interactive and DICE are nothing alike. While DICE says: "Modding is a declingin thrend," Bohemia welcomes you with open arms. ArmA has never been only for the hardcore, it's for everyone, who likes as many features as possible and the level of entry is so low, that anyone can open the editor, drop a unit on a map, press preview and get a basic taste of what you can do with their editor/engine.

So I short, choice is always good in ArmA, DayZ isn't ArmA, it's Rocket's concept and for the last ten months, 3rd person view has been a part of this concept. So if he were to remove such important and loved aspect of DayZ, there'd have to be more convincing arguments, than what's been presented here.

As it stands, there are expert servers out there, enforcing 1st person, it's up to the hardcore zombie-sim communities to fill them up. Don't force your preferences on me, because you refuse to fill up your own servers.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Dallas

[Imafighter 236]

I love first person. Those who get "motion sick" have their head bob set to high.

[DoomsdayClock 34]

I don't see third person as being a cheat or a hack. If I'm on a server that allows third person (which is most servers) then I'll take advantage of it just as most other people will.

But the most fun I've had in the game was on a hardcore server with first-person only. You get immersed more so in the game and you don't have to worry about being spotted by someone hiding behind a building who can see you with third person.

I found that it made running through towns and cities more exciting, you're constantly looking behind you for zombies and bandits. I just enjoyed it a lot more and it gave the game a more realistic feel.

But first-person isn't for everyone, so like I said, I'll still take advantage of third-person if it's available.

I'd say still include third-person in the stand alone, just make more hardcore servers.

[Teme007 0]

I totally agree, 3rd person view should be disabled from SA. Crosshair too :)

[badbenson (DayZ) 38]

So if he were to remove such important and loved aspect of DayZ, there'd have to be more convincing arguments, than what's been presented here.

you silly goose! this isn't about who has the best arguments. it's about how many people are actually willing to go hardcore. i'm guessing that more people that play dayZ aren't playing arma at all. believe me the real arma communities like shacktac weren't really intrested in dayZ for long. also when it comes to dayZ you can only talk about something like a community when it comes to private hives maybe. everything else is just a big mess.

so dayZ being the PvP griefing fest it is today it's kind of silly to talk about who has the better arguments when the whole reason people make threads like this is that 3rd person can and will be exploited alot (just watch some PvP videos on youtube). it's not about personal preference or anything like that. just simple competitiveness. and yea since most people are like you nothing will happen to your "loved aspect" (made me lol). so stop acting like "your side" has out-debated the other side. it's just stupid. i'm sure most people who want to restrict to 1st person like 3rd person too but actually are able to see how 3rd person is used and are willing to make a small sacrifice. unlike most people here.

and you obviously haven't played on a real arma PvP server. otherwise you would know that they never allow 3rd person because they know what it does. sure arma has a big spectrum but noone can convince me that dayZ isn't about PvP.

[exdeath 0]

Another question. Many guys here are saying that we need third person view because first person one is flawed. If first person view is flawed, why you arent also asking to make the game 3rd person only?

First person is not flawed.

Thats also my opinion and also (this one I am not sure yet) the opinion that we should limit the servers to first person view only.

I am asking this question because many guys here are using the argument "first person view in day z is flawed" to say why we need 3rd.

The strange thing is that they say that we need 3rd person view because first person one is flawed, but they just ask for the additional 3rd person mode, they dont ask to remove forever the flawed (in their opinion) first person one or at least remove (and keep 3rd person) it until its fixed.

[liquidcactus 719]

I'm sorry but im sure only sailors and faggots get motion sickness from gaming :P

[Michaelvoodoo25 3120]

End of the day, Go and play what style you like, Just don't try to preach to everyone else.

[ImageCtrl 719]

it's about how many people are actually willing to go hardcore... it's kind of silly to talk about who has the better arguments when the whole reason people make threads like this is that 3rd person can and will be exploited alot (just watch some PvP videos on youtube).

Don´t find the video atm. Someone posted here a few month ago a video killing 100 people in cherno without dying. 3rd person... lying on a roof.

I think first person needs more advertising, i´m happy to hear all the better arguments for first person only.

Edit: not shure, belive he died @ kill 96 because someone was logging in to server behind him.

Edited January 9, 2013 by NoCheats

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

Don´t find the video atm. Someone posted here a few month ago a video killing 100 people in cherno without dying. 3rd person... lying on a roof.

I think first person needs more advertising, i´m happy to hear all the better arguments for first person only.

Edit: not shure, belive he died @ kill 96 because someone was logging in to server behind him.

Metro 2033 and stalker wouldn't have been the same in 3rd person.

[g4borg 74]

actually if you hear better arguments for first person in this thread, you are not listening or just reading what you already stand for.

without 3rd person, dayZ would not have become this success.

even those who like 3rd person, use first person a lot - its not an argument, which is better. its a feature, which is even copied by other games in the same setting. FYI you have to find out how to switch to 3rd person and start in 1st person anyway in arma, so why are all searching for the hotkey for that immediately? right.. so first person is already advertised, it is just not used that much.

what if 3rd person could not be used to see things behind obstructing objects, with the chance of making some things transparent, which are clearly out of view? thats an improvement, which might be solvable in the client and addresses the real issue - and only valid argument against 3rd person anyway.

I heavily dislike 3rd person in shooters. But dayZ aint a shooter,

[Wep0n 532]

what if 3rd person could not be used to see things behind obstructing objects, with the chance of making some things transparent, which are clearly out of view? thats an improvement, which might be solvable in the client and addresses the real issue - and only valid argument against 3rd person anyway.

i heavily agree on that point. there needs to be a way to fix the exploit, and no one would have to complain third person anymore.

Since it is already officially part of the standalone, people have to accept it that there WILL be third person servers. Alot of alternative animations which might be implemented depend on third person so that the player knows what the heck the character is doing (http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/96165-arma-2-smk-animations/). Rocket also said that he was thinking about removing the hud completly, and you should be able to see all the needs the player has on the character movement/appearance/sound which makes third person even more relevant.

solving things on the client side sounds really good, but i do not know how to accomplish that realistically... will the people you see behind the wall be invisible? or just the whole area black out? i cannot imagine very well how this could be realized whitout making it look weird when some parts just become invisible...

but when i think about it... making it extremly BLURRY might solve the problem. there wont be any movement or objects displayed, but the background will keep some kind of basic colour so that it doesnt just look black, but obvious for the player that he cant see stuff.

i might post blurry vision as a suggestion, im wondering what people think about it...

my initial idea was a camera which is locked if there is something in the way.

imagine you lying on a rooftop. normally you can move your camera down to see whats there.

or you are behind a wall, move the camera so that you see something behind it.

the idea was only to be able to move the camera where your player could actually see it.

the roof exploit can easily be fixed by just locking the camera when you are lying on the ground, and you will only be able to move it until ground level, and not going further down.

how you can fix the "seeing over walls/windows" exploit might be alot tougher, since the camera should register what is plausible to see and what not...

[logan23 118]

Solution is to have some Servers which are First person only,

Players who want that experience can go there and others who want a 3rd and first person can go to other servers, win win

[ImageCtrl 719]

actually if you hear better arguments for first person in this thread, you are not listening or just reading what you already stand for.

The discusion had changed to "what play now"... I was listening, to the arguments. "I get ill" and "I like it"... these arguments are ok for me.

its not an argument, which is better. its a feature, which is even copied by other games in the same setting. FYI you have to find out how to switch to 3rd person and start in 1st person anyway in arma, so why are all searching for the hotkey for that immediately?

Because it has an advantage, that's the reason, they saw it at youtube... and the two reasons I mentioned.

Back to OP & solutions

what if 3rd person could not be used to see things behind obstructing objects, with the chance of making some things transparent, which are clearly out of view? thats an improvement, which might be solvable in the client and addresses the real issue - and only valid argument against 3rd person anyway.

what if...

I would love it. See no loot, no Z, no enemies. They should be invisible when not in the field of view.

Edited January 9, 2013 by NoCheats

[whatup2003 67]

Don't like exploiting 3p view with looking around corner and such.

Don't like the different server setting idea. People will always want an easy way out when there is one.

If something can be done to the camera to limit 3p view exploits, it would be great.

[WiFiN 55]

i might post blurry vision as a suggestion, im wondering what people think about it...

I tried to collect all "fix third person" ideas here. If TPcamera doesn't provide any exploits in any way I'm okay with that.

Edited January 9, 2013 by WiFiN

[Wep0n 532]

alright, let me post some collective ideas there....

[Pomegranate 83]

alright, let me post some collective ideas there....

Remove third person mode and make it so you can change your FOV to something like 120 without messing up the sights of a gun.

[lille_bingo-mannen 10]

Yeah, some of us get motion sickness with first person after 30 minutes of playing. We like our third person, thanks.

Lower your headbob to nill.