Please, DONT add a bandit-indicator in this patch

[MinxinG 50]

People, before you start complaining about it, being a bandit is not killing everyone on sight, that is being a retarded COD kiddie,

Differences about being a bandit and a griefer

Bandit:

-Check if the victim has something of value

-Dont shoot everyone on sight since it will give away ur position

-After killing someone they search the body

-Usually sets up ganks in known streets

-Usually dont go to Cherno/Elektro since he knows that almost no players will have good stuff ("late game bandit") and its risky

And much more that would make you a trully Bandit

Griefers AKA CoD Kiddies:

-Go to big cities to kill noobs

-Shoot people on sight since they dont give a shit

-After killing someone just leave the body there

Three main reasons that definetelly ruins the game

This implementation WILL NOT ruin the game, are you afraid of being flaged bandit when you encounter a group of survivors now COD KIDDIE?

I guess trully Bandits might not be giving a fuck about this implementation since they know how to actually be a bandit and take care of themselves

[bazbake 456]

Real bandits will use stealth and combat advantage and bandit IDs won't matter. "Bandies" will of course be forced to learn to shoot or gtfo.

Edited August 7, 2012 by BazBake

[wolfstriked 143]

^^^Your not getting why we want to have an indicator.I love to PVP but do not wanna kill players just trying to survive.Bandits can stealth all they want and that makes me spotting one and then going on the hunt that much more fun.So you see....I need bad people in my apocalypse so that I can take my anger out on.;)

Edited August 7, 2012 by wolfstriked

[JESUSARIUS REX (DayZ) 163]

Unless they fix the murders when defending yourself thing i don't want any indicators. To many time people get labeled as a bandit when they are truly not.

[wolfstriked 143]

^^only attack players that look violent.

[spammy@live.de 19]

According to the official dayzmod.com's statistics there are 133,392 bandits and around 666000 survivors right now. Are bandits really a PROBLEM?

Don't trust the stats. This number includes:

1) Tons of new players dieing to zombies.

2) Lots of lone wolves avoiding other players in general.

3) Lots of bandits who don't have bandit status yet.

Just try it for yourself - try to team up with other players ingame.

It's probably the biggest challenge there is in DayZ xP

[xximrtwoixx 104]

This would be true in real life, where people don't respawn. Bandits would be involved in the more conflicts than survivors and would eventually die whether because they were outskilled, unlucky or hunted (or, of course, attacked by other bandits). In game, however, there are so many bandits relative to the number of survivors, that survivors are likely to be in only slightly less conflicts than bandits (unless the survivor spends their time hiding), but the conflicts that they are in will always be someone else shooting at them first, which will usually result in them dying. PVE is a load of crap - survivors don't just turn off PVP mode; they are just as likely to get murdered if they choose to PVE instead of PVP (hell, I'd say they're even more likely to be murdered).

On top of that, as you said, it takes less time to get gear as a bandit. As a survivor, you need to SLOWLY crawl your way through populated areas, avoid other people (because most will KOS you), get your basic gear and then flee to the wild. This takes much longer than for a bandit who simply goes and gets the first gun he can find, then promptly shoots anyone he sees. If he dies, it doesn't take all that long to get another gun and he starts again. When a survivor dies with gear, they die having spent at the very least 30 minutes (usually much more, depending on time of day and server population) crawling around to get it. It's slow and it's boring and then you get either get shot by some knob on a hill with a sniper rifle because he's bored or you get shot by someone who you see in front of you, ask if they're friendly, only to have them turn, see you and kill you while you're typing/talking.

Currently I have no incentive to play this game. I don't like KOSing (previously, KOSing wasn't the point of the game) and I don't like spending ages crawling everywhere to get basic gear, only to be killed by someone for no reason (they never even take my gear). I can't see why anyone who doesn't want to play as a KOS/DM bandit would play this - for all that people say bandit identifiers would ruin the game and take away the choice, right now the choice is either KOS, live alone in the woods or die within an hour, after spending that hour crawling. There's no real choice at all.

If you think playing as a survivor is easier, go try it. Try NOT shooting everyone you see on sight and only shooting if you have actual reason to believe they aren't friendly (eg, they don't respond to you in direct). See if you last longer and get better gear by doing the "safe" (ROFL) option of "PVE" (as if you can isolate it from people PVPing you). I'll bet that you get much better gear and live much longer by hiding somewhere and shooting people on sight, then taking their stuff.

Look at the numbers the number of alive bandits compared to alive "survivors" does not fit into your scenario where bandits make up this huge section of the player base. What does this tell you, your "survivor" buddies are shooting you along with the bandits. I do also firmly believe that you could live indeffinetly as a survivor isolated in wilderness/small towns. I am not saying it would be fun, but it is much easier to shoot Z's as they shamble in through a door way than it is to hunt players. I also agree that you can't isolate yourself from PVP but you can vastly reduce your chances of running into other players by avoiding areas that other players frequent, again didn't say it was fun. Also why do you need good gear to play as a "survivor" if your goal is to survive you don't need pvp equipment that spawns at Military locations you should be fine with what you find in barns/civilian locations.

@xXI Mr Two IXx

Banditry is easy mode. You know this for a fact. That's why you're so afraid of bandit IDs, because you can't handle actual PvP.

If you believed this, you wouldn't care about bandit IDs -- survivors would never see you because of your ninja leetness. But we both know you don't. The fact that you're still arguing instead of shrugging and going with bandit IDs is proof that all you have is anonymity and the survivors' fear of a murder tally for shooting you first.

Hate to quote myself but I've already told you why I hate bandit skins and it has nothing to with making people that don't want/like pvp harder to deal with. I don't know why you cling to the argument that bandits fear pvp from survivors, they are the ones initiating pvp with them or with other bandit groups already. The people who are double crossing are doing so for laughs or because they are noobs, experianced bandits/pvpers KOS and try to do so before the other side is aware of them.

Labeling play styles or actions as bandit or survivor has no bearing and only fits into each persons deffinition. If I shoot you for gear I'm a bandit, If I rob you at gun point I'm a bandit but I don't have my skin changed? What about if I shoot you in the leg and let the Z's Eat you, again no skin change. This is why any counter system is game breaking because it assigns arbitrary counts to dynamic player interactions. Am I a bandit because I shot you after numerous warnings to leave the area or put your gun down?? I wouldn't think so, but this system does.

There should be no "balance" in this game it is canvas and the player base paints the picture. As you so scientifically put it this is a blatant nerf to "even" out encounter chances or improve a play styles viability. If survivors want to be white hat great, they need to understand that exposure to risk will decrease your life span the same way a bandit who wants to rob someone or go player hunting does. Mommy stops handing out cookies to good boys when they become men, no one rewards you for being moral day to day so why should there be a fake moral reward in DayZ? The righteous path is usually the loneliest for a reason, and because your all babies you'd rather have a Dev come in and assign roles than have your character live the way you think people should/would in this scenario.

There are already a million ways to find a group to play with you don't need signs painted on people to make you feel safe. (They are lies anyway) But thats what all these cry baby casual players want, and apparently its what they are getting, the system is broke so it doesn't really matter but the fact Rocket is caving to all of you whiners is what really pisses me off.

The whole appeal of this game is that it is not dumbed down, nothing is given to you, and everything is against you. Thats what makes surviving great what would normally be a minor accomplishment in a different game is a huge accomplishment in DayZ and every crybaby suggestion takes another step toward ruining that experiance. Why do you think no other games that feature character persistance also feature perma death, because people can't handle it.

In the end everyone will become a bandit, but not because its better, simply because shooting other players can't be avoided.

@JulieMeyers

1/4th of the players are bandits. The number of players increased 31% in two weeks. The number of bandits increased 36%. The number of murders increased 50%. Not only are bandits increasing at a faster rate than new players, the number of murders that bandits are committing is improving even faster. People aren't just converting to banditry at a rate faster than new players can replace them, they're killing even more people.

Truth.

I think the fact that script kill/nuking takes out whole servers has something to do with the murder numbers, along with the trend to "thunderdome".

Also just because total murders increase 50% doesn't really mean anything more than there were many more players playing, you have to look at how much of an increase there was per survival attempt and in the chart you pointed out as the source of your numbers it was a meezly 2%. In that same time span a 1/4 million more players came to the mod and apparently played alot of dayz, the rate that they murdered each other was not that large of an increase but because of the mass number of players the total counts rose sharply.

Don't trust the stats. This number includes:

1) Tons of new players dieing to zombies.

2) Lots of lone wolves avoiding other players in general.

3) Lots of bandits who don't have bandit status yet.

Just try it for yourself - try to team up with other players ingame.

It's probably the biggest challenge there is in DayZ xP

Bandit skins have nothing to do with teaming up in game or stopping KOS, you won't be able to trust a "survivor" skinned player more than you can now for reasons that have already been expressed in the thread. Skins simply make it so that people who bitch about KOS now feel like they have people they can KOS.

Edited August 7, 2012 by xXI Mr Two IXx

[libertine 351]

Blah blah blah

Nonsense.

Yup, now I get to KOS, good. I've only been playing for a few weeks and i've come across 50 guys that looked like my damn twin brother, thus i couldn't shoot because im playing a survivor. Now i will be able to. NOW I CAN HUNT TOO, WHEN I HEAR GUNSHOTS! If i heard a fire fight before, i couldn't do anything. I can't even shoot the guy holding the gun that i heard shoot first because what if its the other guy that just took the bandits gun that tried to kill him. He might be a friendly. Even if I saw the battle, it could still be self defense, perhaps the guy was stalking him or

No more a sneaking simulation for survivors. Speaking of survivors, I shelved the game right after getting my favorite weapon and seeing the air bases when i was playing a survivor. Game is too easy and what else is there to do? Nothing. Now i can go offensive sometimes too.

[bazbake 456]

Hate to quote myself but I've already told you why I hate bandit skins and it has nothing to with making people that don't want/like pvp harder to deal with. I don't know why you cling to the argument that bandits fear pvp from survivors, they are the ones initiating pvp with them or with other bandit groups already. The people who are double crossing are doing so for laughs or because they are noobs, experianced bandits/pvpers KOS and try to do so before the other side is aware of them.

Because you have yet to counter that argument. I'm not saying murders need to be decreased, I'm just saying survivors who don't want to kill people in cold blood need to be able to respond to those who do. Right now, with the ability to change your character's name and face at will, it is impossible to keep track of bandits and punish them in-game.

But...that's really what this is about, isn't it. Your fear of retribution for banditry and this desperate need to remain anonymous to the point of breaking the game.

I think the fact that script kill/nuking takes out whole servers has something to do with the murder numbers, along with the trend to "thunderdome".

Right, because the person getting credit for those murders is....

Yeah, see, you only get a murder if you commit an actual murder and kill someone. A huge list of suddenly dead people caused by changing the status in the script code to nuke all the players won't count as a murder.

Murders committed by people are increasing faster than the bandit population.

Also just because total murders increase 50% doesn't really mean anything more than there were many more players playing, you have to look at how much of an increase there was per survival attempt and in the chart you pointed out as the source of your numbers it was a meezly 2%. In that same time span a 1/4 million more players came to the mod and apparently played alot of dayz, the rate that they murdered each other was not that large of an increase but because of the mass number of players the total counts rose sharply.

You're very confused by the math.

Percentage of living bandits goes up 2%. Percentage of people who are now listed as bandits goes up 36%. Percentage of players overall goes up 31.8%. This just means that people are becoming bandits before they are learning to survive as non-bandits. And the number of bandits is increasing faster than the population of players.

What does that mean? It means people are joining the game and almost immediately turning to banditry. And it also means those people who are already bandits are committing an increasing number of murders because there is no way in the game to punish them.

They can change their face in the options menu.

They can change their name in the options menu.

So even if I SEE SOMEONE COMMIT A MURDER, they can disconnect, change their name, change their face, and suddenly they have a BRAND NEW IDENTITY.

The numbers are obvious. This game is drifting into a murder simulator because players have total control over their anonymity.

Anyway, the bottom line is that bandit tags/IDs/skins will give people who don't want to commit murder the option to PvP with all of the cold-blooded killers. The only way it'll discourage PvP is if the bandits suddenly become afraid of getting into fights.

Are bandits afraid of fights? Do they really rack up all of their murders by saying "Friendly" and then shooting people in the face when they walk up? If so, then I find this whole panic to be pretty amusing.

Edited August 8, 2012 by BazBake

[xximrtwoixx 104]

Because you have yet to counter that argument. I'm not saying murders need to be decreased, I'm just saying survivors who don't want to kill people in cold blood need to be able to respond to those who do. Right now, with the ability to change your character's name and face at will, it is impossible to keep track of bandits and punish them in-game.

But...that's really what this is about, isn't it. Your fear of retribution for banditry and this desperate need to remain anonymous to the point of breaking the game.

Saying bandits are afraid of PVP or that I don't want skins because I want to avoid pvp isn't an argument, its your assumptions that cannot be proven, I say they are false so thats the end of it.

You still haven't dealt with the fact that bandit skins and their implementation via murder counters is a broken system that will result with everyone becoming a bandit, or exploiting the system via blood bags to not be labled as one. I would be fine player chosen skins, with a system that showed if you looted a body, or even a bandit indicator but there is no way to track dynamic actions with an arbitrary system so its a pipe dream. The best bet is to introduce things that foster grouping or give experianced players things to do, skins are a waste of dev time because they will always be broken.

Labeling play styles or actions as bandit or survivor has no bearing and only fits into each persons deffinition. If I shoot you for gear I'm a bandit, If I rob you at gun point I'm a bandit but I don't have my skin changed? What about if I shoot you in the leg and let the Z's Eat you, again no skin change. This is why any counter system is game breaking because it assigns arbitrary counts to dynamic player interactions. Am I a bandit because I shot you after numerous warnings to leave the area or put your gun down?? I wouldn't think so, but this system does.

Edited August 8, 2012 by xXI Mr Two IXx

[JESUSARIUS REX (DayZ) 163]

Rocket just needs to add more reasons to group up. All they have is blood bags, and cars.

[bazbake 456]

Saying bandits are afraid of PVP or that I don't want skins because I want to avoid pvp isn't an argument, its your assumptions that cannot be proven, I say they are false so thats the end of it.

No it's not. I've shown in about four different threads that the only difference between being able to shoot everyone without punishment and showing people who the bandits are is just as risky for bandits either way. There's no difference for the bandits. But instead of arguing against it or showing a counter-argument, or demonstrating a system where this is false, you just keep begging me to stop talking about it and declaring it "the end of it."

Which makes me think you know this already. You just hope no one else figures it out.

You still haven't dealt with the fact that bandit skins and their implementation via murder counters is a broken system that will result with everyone becoming a bandit, or exploiting the system via blood bags to not be labled as one. I would be fine player chosen skins, with a system that showed if you looted a body, or even a bandit indicator but there is no way to track dynamic actions with an arbitrary system so its a pipe dream. The best bet is to introduce things that foster grouping or give experianced players things to do, skins are a waste of dev time because they will always be broken.

Actually, I've shown in half a dozen threads how to fix this. By giving players permission to attack players tagged with a threat level who are:

1. Visibly swapping out items.
   
2. Armed within the last four seconds.
   
3. Bandits.
   

It protects players from unfair murder charges while allowing them to defend themselves from reasonable threats.

Also, under my proposed system, giving bandits blood bags or helping bandits in any way doesn't restore your humanity. Nor does healing people who are threats. If you're a bandit you have to rescue people who aren't bandits or let your humanity return slowly over time.

Labeling play styles or actions as bandit or survivor has no bearing and only fits into each persons deffinition.

This system recognizes people who attempt or commit murder. It then says "these people do this." It doesn't care why you do it or your elaborate justifications, it just means "this person here definitely shoots people who are unarmed and these people over here probably don't." It doesn't care about your justifications, your personality, or how many friends you have. If you attack unarmed people, you're not particularly justified.

If I shoot you for gear I'm a bandit, If I rob you at gun point I'm a bandit but I don't have my skin changed?

Because one of these people is definitely a killer and one of these people is possibly a killer. The robber hasn't killed anyone yet. Bandit is just DayZ slang for murderer. Because murders give you bandit levels, not how many times you've taken beans out of someone's backpack while armed.

What about if I shoot you in the leg and let the Z's Eat you, again no skin change.

Actually, in my system, shooting people in the leg costs you humanity. Leaving someone for dead is a little different than walking up to them and putting a bullet in their brain. Especially if the zombies haven't attacked yet (I've survived a broken leg for three hours crawling through Berezino with artifacts surrounding me until I could find morphine...it's not a death sentence...more like a nightmare).

This is why any counter system is game breaking because it assigns arbitrary counts to dynamic player interactions. Am I a bandit because I shot you after numerous warnings to leave the area or put your gun down?? I wouldn't think so, but this system does.

It's not arbitrary. You kill someone who's unarmed, you're a murderer. You kill someone who murders lots of people, you're not a murderer. That's not arbitrary, that's a hard, solid rule.

Anyway, shooting people after telling them to put their gun down wouldn't count as a murder under my new system. Shooting them because you don't want them walking in your territory would be murder, though. Otherwise you could just call the entire region of Chernarus your territory and then shoot anyone you see and this is ridiculous.

Anyway, just because you're a murderer and don't want other people to know it because you can only commit murder at point blank range with your hatchet after people bandage you does not make my points any less valid. It just makes you an example of why my point is so strong.

Edited August 8, 2012 by BazBake

[Choice777 9]

I think there should be an indicator for bandits, but only like for repeat offenders.

Like people who kill more than X players withing 24 hours, and more than X players over 7 days.

Like some sort of 3 colors traffic light system.

Green is zero kills in 24 hours, less than 3 in 7 days.

Yellow someone who has killed max 1 over 24h, less than 3 players in 7 days.

Red is all the happy trigger rambo wannabe's.

I mean killing someone once in a while might be fun..but doing it all day long just to ruin everybody's fun is a no go.

Edited August 8, 2012 by Choice777

[ruarz 739]

Not personally in favour of bandit indicators but I don't mind them trying a mechanic out and seeing it works.

Edited August 8, 2012 by ruarz

[xximrtwoixx 104]

No it's not. I've shown in about four different threads that the only difference between being able to shoot everyone without punishment and showing people who the bandits are is just as risky for bandits either way. There's no difference for the bandits. But instead of arguing against it or showing a counter-argument, or demonstrating a system where this is false, you just keep begging me to stop talking about it and declaring it "the end of it."

Which makes me think you know this already. You just hope no one else figures it out.

I'm not attempting to argue against it, I'm telling you your assumption that this is a reason why players dislike bandit tags is false. People don't like them because its broke and attempts to remove or nullify the dynamic nature of interactions, the point you recagnize when you say "Your" system takes care of how its broke....

Actually, I've shown in half a dozen threads how to fix this. By giving players permission to attack players tagged with a threat level who are:

1. Visibly swapping out items.
   
2. Armed within the last four seconds.
   
3. Bandits.
   

It protects players from unfair murder charges while allowing them to defend themselves from reasonable threats.

Your system and the real system are two different things, so its rather pointless to argue merits of a system that doesn't exhist....

And I'm sure a system can distinguish between a reasonable and non reasonable threat...

Here's some scenarios...

So a player is trolling zombies to you, but they have their gun out so they aren't recently armed you shoot them you get a murder.

A survivor is following another group of survivors he is armed/unarmed whatever, the group is going back to their base he won't stop after warnings so they shoot him a murder....

An unarmed survivor gets in your car/chopper you can't shoot them for fear of a murder??

Also, under my proposed system, giving bandits blood bags or helping bandits in any way doesn't restore your humanity. Nor does healing people who are threats. If you're a bandit you have to rescue people who aren't bandits or let your humanity return slowly over time.

I know you hate bandits, err killers, err groups that kill people outside their group. Everyone should help every total random stranger they meet, waste their resources just beacuse its the right thing to do because your system says so....

This system recognizes people who attempt or commit murder. It then says "these people do this." It doesn't care why you do it or your elaborate justifications, it just means "this person here definitely shoots people who are unarmed and these people over here probably don't." It doesn't care about your justifications, your personality, or how many friends you have. If you attack unarmed people, you're not particularly justified.

The current system tracks murders as killing anyone that is not a bandit, so you should add seperating kililng someone who is unarmed against sumone who is armed to your list of improvements. But that would mean anyone armed would be open for murder and that would defeat the purpose of putting signs on some people.

Also I like that elaborate justifications don't matter, but a different skin somehow does. So player A gets the skin unjustly but because he has the skin player B is free to PVP player A at their whim free of penalties and without justification.

Because one of these people is definitely a killer and one of these people is possibly a killer. The robber hasn't killed anyone yet. Bandit is just DayZ slang for murderer. Because murders give you bandit levels, not how many times you've taken beans out of someone's backpack while armed.

But survivors aren't up for being robbed so instead are murdered, maybe bandits will start shooting, looting, healing but that sounds like a waste of resources.

Your justification shows that you only wish to punish people that play in a way you don't like, ie PVP people that do not wish to PVP at that time. Your fine with PVP on your own grounds, ie hunting bandits and shooting them unawares but if you are a victim of pvp without warning or what you see as reason then you cry about it.

Actually, in my system, shooting people in the leg costs you humanity. Leaving someone for dead is a little different than walking up to them and putting a bullet in their brain. Especially if the zombies haven't attacked yet (I've survived a broken leg for three hours crawling through Berezino with artifacts surrounding me until I could find morphine...it's not a death sentence...more like a nightmare).

Again *Your system* so it really has no bearing

The art of trolling isn't leaving someone for dead, you shoot them in the leg then bring the horde to them so you know they die, or shooting them in the leg when Z's are already after them.

It's not arbitrary. You kill someone who's unarmed, you're a murderer. You kill someone who murders lots of people, you're not a murderer. That's not arbitrary, that's a hard, solid rule.

Again with unarmed, you should really add that to your system or tell rocket to add it to the revamped skin system.

I guess acknowledging that armed people are always a threat kind of ruins your black and white take on this though so I can see why you qualify it.

Also see arbitrary,

2 (of power or a ruling body) Unrestrained and autocratic in the use of authority

Anyway, shooting people after telling them to put their gun down wouldn't count as a murder under my new system. Shooting them because you don't want them walking in your territory would be murder, though. Otherwise you could just call the entire region of Chernarus your territory and then shoot anyone you see and this is ridiculous.

Anyway, just because you're a murderer and don't want other people to know it because you can only commit murder at point blank range with your hatchet after people bandage you does not make my points any less valid. It just makes you an example of why my point is so strong.

I believe shooting someone after giving them orders and they don't comply would be a murder in your system as you specified, or if you know how to avoid this via code please let me know because its basically what breaks the bandit skin system.

Your territory is exactly how far you are able to impose your will on other people, if I have an AS50 that could be up to a 1500m circle, if I am in a large group of players it could be a significant portion of the map I guess. If I don't want armed/unarmed people around us and they refuse to leave your system punishes me for freely exercising my right to defend myself and or territory. It doesn't matter why I don't want someone there, if I give them the option and they don't comply what other option is there? Be trolled give up my gear/loot?? This is why a skin system is broken and why everyone will end up as bandits.

[Mister Motivational 24]

@BazBake

You've commented quite aggressively about your new system, out of curiosity do you believe that this system you have developed will encourage those who have become bandits to increase their level of banditry?

If interactions such as killing someone who has shot at you but is not a bandit continue to count as murders then a player who has justifiably defended their self runs the risk of becoming a bandit.

I've never shot another player because I've either been shot myself, we decided to trust one another or we both left one another alone and went separate ways.

If I can see a player is a bandit then I'm aware they are an absolute threat and I can shoot them with no negative consequences, I may be inclined to start firing.

So would a bandit not have even more incentive to fire on me, even if their intended play style is passive or cooperative simply for fear of their life?

*edit* Another thought that came to mind:

I play with a group who prefer to KOS when we're not playing together. Because I tend to take the lead in group situations, these guys refrain from KOS because they know how I feel about it.

When we need supplies from a store one strategy I prefer to use is to offload my supplies into their packs, then make my way into the store while they provide over watch. One has a military sniper rifle and the other scouts with binoculars, this affords me a good deal of protection.

If someone makes their way toward the store while I'm in there my team alerts me, then I can announce to the stranger I'm there and I've got covering fire watching out for me. I can warn them to stay out and I'll leave peacefully once I'm done, which means by your systems standards I could then fire on them and it would not count as a murder.

However, if they decide to disregard the message and continue forward or if they tell me to stuff myself what happens when my sniper takes them out? If that player wasn't a bandit my sniper now has a murder, though he was protecting an innocent player who also was not a bandit.

Edited August 8, 2012 by Mister Motivational

[fish911503 136]

@BazBake

You've commented quite aggressively about your new system, out of curiosity do you believe that this system you have developed will encourage those who have become bandits to increase their level of banditry?

If interactions such as killing someone who has shot at you but is not a bandit continue to count as murders then a player who has justifiably defended their self runs the risk of becoming a bandit.

I've never shot another player because I've either been shot myself, we decided to trust one another or we both left one another alone and went separate ways.

If I can see a player is a bandit then I'm aware they are an absolute threat and I can shoot them with no negative consequences, I may be inclined to start firing.

So would a bandit not have even more incentive to fire on me, even if their intended play style is passive or cooperative simply for fear of their life?

*edit* Another thought that came to mind:

I play with a group who prefer to KOS when we're not playing together. Because I tend to take the lead in group situations, these guys refrain from KOS because they know how I feel about it.

When we need supplies from a store one strategy I prefer to use is to offload my supplies into their packs, then make my way into the store while they provide over watch. One has a military sniper rifle and the other scouts with binoculars, this affords me a good deal of protection.

If someone makes their way toward the store while I'm in there my team alerts me, then I can announce to the stranger I'm there and I've got covering fire watching out for me. I can warn them to stay out and I'll leave peacefully once I'm done, which means by your systems standards I could then fire on them and it would not count as a murder.

However, if they decide to disregard the message and continue forward or if they tell me to stuff myself what happens when my sniper takes them out? If that player wasn't a bandit my sniper now has a murder, though he was protecting an innocent player who also was not a bandit.

The scenario you describe at supermarket is easily fixed by implementing a "team" system into the game. It's so simple and could solve many issues at the moment. Team spawning, not getting a murder for protecting a team member...it could also be used to implement new mechanics that wouldn't be possible without it.

[Mister Motivational 24]

The scenario you describe at supermarket is easily fixed by implementing a "team" system into the game. It's so simple and could solve many issues at the moment. Team spawning, not getting a murder for protecting a team member...it could also be used to implement new mechanics that wouldn't be possible without it.

This again goes against authenticity, if I warn someone I can now shoot them with impunity and all my friends can too. All a group of snipers would need is one idiot to run through town warning everyone so they could get guilt free kills. There's no point to the murder and bandit kill counters except to appease the ego.

[Choice777 9]

In real life there's " rumors " You know who's a bandit and who not.

Having people act like jerks cough..i mean bandits, 24/7 just isn't cool.

[xximrtwoixx 104]

The scenario you describe at supermarket is easily fixed by implementing a "team" system into the game. It's so simple and could solve many issues at the moment. Team spawning, not getting a murder for protecting a team member...it could also be used to implement new mechanics that wouldn't be possible without it.

There is also no way for a system or code to determine if you are protecting someone, just as there is no way for a system to determine if sumone is a threat. The fact that rules or parameters are established means that people will know the rules and then abuse, min/max, and make them pointless.

Thats why I think Dev time should be focused on the systems and subsystems that result in KOS/DM instead of trying to put a bandaid on PVP with skins and rules, its not going to work and is a waste of time.

In real life there's " rumors " You know who's a bandit and who not.

Having people act like jerks cough..i mean bandits, 24/7 just isn't cool.

If you never talk to strangers, or never see strangers, or no one witnesses something then how would a rumor escape about a bandit, his acts, or his location??

Here's a rumor for you...

"There are bandits at Cherno, Electro, NW airfield, and Stary you should avoid these places"

Its common sense were 90% of PVP/"Bandit" action is, you don't need a "rumor" system wasting game resources to tell you.

Edited August 9, 2012 by xXI Mr Two IXx

[dallas 5195]

Maybe the bandit skin only had a minor effect, however removing it had a major one.

[Zoop 343]

This just in...

even with the new bandit system in place, I'm still going to shoot everyone I see. Why? Because fuck you, that's why.

[zombiejun 13]

LoL I sure hope they will add some kind of skin to bandits, but i hope they do not make it look like the last one, it looked cool, so many people shot other people just to get it because it was kind of like a achievement..

[libertine 351]

This just in...

even with the new bandit system in place, I'm still going to shoot everyone I see. Why? Because fuck you, that's why.

Im gunna hunt every filthy piece of shit pussy bandit down. Every fucking gunshot i hear, i'm now coming to check out, where i used to ignore or move away from a 100% of the time to avoid since i couldn't know if the guy was a bandit or not. Now 0% of the time will i not check it out in the hopes that some a-hole is wearing black. Now its bandit munching time. In fact, why not implement cannibalism, now that im going to fucking make swiss cheese out of bandits so often. Good idea Thane. Hope i remembered to bring the salt when i encounter you Zoop, cause im gunna need it, err your going to need it..... Edited August 10, 2012 by Thane

[libertine 351]

oops

Edited August 10, 2012 by Thane