What to do? Tired of endless KoS, but feel RP would be too sanitised...

[rickyriot 1009]

Just for clarity, I have 1000s of hours in Dz, and I started on the mod before moving to SA.

The title itself should give you a clue. To be clear, I am not complaining about people KoS'ing, although I have to say it seems even more endemic than it's ever been.

I am not a PvP'er. I was, many years ago, and I was a good one too, but time (..and the odd bit of weed!) has dulled my reactions. I could, could, go around the map, engaging with everyone but I find that boring. Dz is touted as much as a survival as it is a PvP title, and I have to admit I much prefer the survival these days. The problem is you can't have survival on the server because people KoS all the time. Again, I am not complaining about people doing that, but it really fucks over those who are not interested in such shenanigans.

I am tempted to move to RP, but I have considerable reservations about it. I certainly don't want to be "a character actor" playing the game, I just want to enjoy the survival aspect without constantly needing to look over my shoulder.

So that's where I am, an experienced Dz player who has gotten tired of constant KoS'ing but the solution of RP feels like it would take away some of the game.

What to do?

[McWendy 675]

Just do what we do, roam the map for survival purposes. Engage people from a distance always being wary. 

Establish a small base(enclose a small building somewhere remote.) 

And shrug off the moments you do get KoS'd. 

[rickyriot 1009]

1 minute ago, McWendy said:

...

I appreciate the answer, but It's nothing I don't do already, and have been doing pretty much since SA launched.

I am a solo player and spend almost all my time away from main areas. I loot useful shit, like nails, saws, fishing hook and the like. I raid small towns for essentials like rope, cloth, sharpening stones etc. I very very rarely go near military bases and if I do it's in order to get suitable clothing/backpack not for the guns/ammo. I'll grab something to defend myself and I'll grab a rifle for killing animals but I very rarely look geared. Just the other day I was hugging the Western edge of the map, and found a garage along with a couple of buildings that I could make a simple base from. I grabbed a couple of logs and with the shovel in my hand and clearly in the animation of making a fence, some guy appeared out of nowhere and "spray and pray'ed" me. I guess they were a novice player and keen for the kill as an experienced one would have handled it differently (they had a huge advantage and I was unarmed - or at least I was in the middle of building a fence) but no KoS seems to be the answer for some.

Again, I have no issue with PvP, or the people wanting to play PvP, and if this was a game that simply relied solely on PvP (such as CoD or Battlefield) then I'd hold my hands up and say "ok, this isn't the game for me". this is why I am at an impasse, I like the game, but feel RP would dull that experience. I don't want it sanitised, but then I don't want to spend every minute in the game constantly on high alert.

 

 

[McWendy 675]

Its sad but true, good interactions are hit and miss. Most spray Just so they dont get sprayed. 

Kos grows with every Kos unfortunately.

[rickyriot 1009]

1 hour ago, McWendy said:

Its sad but true, good interactions are hit and miss. Most spray Just so they dont get sprayed. 

Kos grows with every Kos unfortunately.

It is indeed, a complete circle jerk. One person KoS, then the dead person will go on and KoS another "to even it out".

Ultimately this hits at the root of the "Dean Hall conundrum", that has plagued (for the lack of a better word) SA from launch, which is... "just what is Dz? A survival game? A PvP?"

It's not been answered and for the last 8 years or so BI have firmly sat on the fence, sometimes leaning one way, sometime the other. I totally don't blame BI here, I am sure they are just keen to not kill the golden goose, after all, those golden eggs are tasty!

This then leaves me the question, do I care enough about Dz to continue being frustrated by it, or do I accept that it's not the game I want it to be (primarily down to what the players playing want it to be - and again, I am very careful not to "blame" anyone for the way it's played). Hence the RP mention, but I've already said what my concerns about that would be.

You know what I'd be ideal for? If the old "medics on call" thing came back.

Edited October 3, 2021 by rickyriot
.. bad grammar (trust me it'll be as bad in my other posts!)

[DefectiveWater 535]

My best recommendation is to try out other maps, there's several modded maps that are quite popular: Esseker, Namalsk, Takistan, Deer Isle...
I've recently tried out Namalsk (yes... I didn't play it until now...) and it's an amazing map (although I played it with a friend so there's that).
There's also few community servers which aim for SOME roleplaying, but don't enforce it, not sure which ones tho but I do know they exist.

Maybe your best choice is to take a break from the game for a bit, and wait for the next patch to spice it up a bit.

[McWendy 675]

16 minutes ago, DefectiveWater said:

My best recommendation is to try out other maps, there's several modded maps that are quite popular: Esseker, Namalsk, Takistan, Deer Isle...
I've recently tried out Namalsk (yes... I didn't play it until now...) and it's an amazing map (although I played it with a friend so there's that).
There's also few community servers which aim for SOME roleplaying, but don't enforce it, not sure which ones tho but I do know they exist.

Maybe your best choice is to take a break from the game for a bit, and wait for the next patch to spice it up a bit.

True. Chernarus doesn't do it for me anymore. Got bored of that 2 years ago. Then we started modded maps. Was An eye opener with Total new experiences. 

[rickyriot 1009]

23 minutes ago, DefectiveWater said:

My best recommendation is to try out other maps, there's several modded maps that are quite popular: Esseker, Namalsk, Takistan, Deer Isle...
I've recently tried out Namalsk (yes... I didn't play it until now...) and it's an amazing map (although I played it with a friend so there's that).
There's also few community servers which aim for SOME roleplaying, but don't enforce it, not sure which ones tho but I do know they exist.

I'd say it's more the server than the actual maps, although it's a fair comment that I should try a change of scenery. My experiences with the modern Namalsk is that KoS is even greater. With the limited resources and size of the map it's understandable. Takistan is almost impossible to be a survival type. Huge open tracks of land with little, if any, cover. That leaves Esseker and Dear Isle, both of these feel unfinished. I don't own Livonia, it's not a map that appeals to me.

23 minutes ago, DefectiveWater said:

 

Maybe your best choice is to take a break from the game for a bit, and wait for the next patch to spice it up a bit.

 

I've taken a break loads of times, especially that barren 0.6x no update year and the shambles of 1.0 and them saying "we won't fix shit because we can't but really we think you don't care" in one of the worst BI press release I've ever seen!

Still, to their credit, they are pulling things round now - who knew that console money would be the 'silver bullet' to that? Forgive my cynicism here, while it's tongue in cheek, we all know that waiting for BI to patch/fix/update a very specific issue is futile.

 

[McWendy 675]

Deer isle is very very good. Been in development since the SA Release. 

You should definitely try that one out again. 

Edit: if you dont like soloing anymore you can join us. 2 40yr olds. (Not on weed anymore) 🙂

 

Edited October 3, 2021 by McWendy

[rickyriot 1009]

16 minutes ago, McWendy said:

True. Chernarus doesn't do it for me anymore. Got bored of that 2 years ago. Then we started modded maps. Was An eye opener with Total new experiences. 

This is the double edged sword of Chernarus...

On one hand you want a very stable and solid map, Chernarus offers us that.
On the other you want it to be dynamic.

I guess the gas zones provide some of that, although I'd be keen to see much more, and i think of all the maps the gas "fits" it's definitely Chernarus.

[rickyriot 1009]

8 minutes ago, McWendy said:

Deer isle is very very good. Been in development since the SA Release. 

You should definitely try that one out again. 

I think I've played Deer Isle in Arma, certainly something close to it. It's not a bad map, and.. obvs.. much better than I can do, but all the servers I go on are either empty or loaded with mods which nullifies any survival aspect.

I think the thing is, and this is not in any way dismissing anything that has suggested, whether there is a niche of Dz that would suit my current play-style. Changing maps is one option but it's not really going to resolve my issue, simply kick the can down the road.

 

Edit: just to add, there is no guarantee there is an answer, it might just be that I've drifted away from what the majority of others who play the game prefer.

 

 

Edited October 3, 2021 by rickyriot

[Tonyeh 454]

Let's be honest, the vast majority of DayZ players are cunts. Just like the vast majority of any online game. Most are just there to kill other players, because that's all they know. That's the only way to play a game for them. I've had newspawns spawn in at the same time as me and immediately try and attack me...and for what? I don't have anything for them. Then there's the sniper twats who sit on hills for hours shooting at folk for no reason other than to kill another player. They don't take their stuff, they're not interested in that. They just want to shoot other players from the safety of distance. They're the absolute worst kind of DayZ player. Then there's the trap merchants, the pricks that leave bear traps, mines and now this tripwire shite lying around to fuck up another player. They're not even around to see anyone walk into the trap so they can take their stuff. What's the point?

The KOS in a face to face situation everybody has done and that's down to sheer panic most of the time and I'll admit, I've done it. I've also shot people as they've run into a house I'm hiding in and I've shot people from afar too (which is different to sniping). But, TBH, without the PvP killing DayZ would be a rather dull experience, don't you think? It's the threat of constant death and having to start everything again that makes the game exciting. Even if getting killed is a trying experience, depending on the level of "geared" your toon is at.

However, the survival aspect of the game is just far too easy and that's a real problem for people who want to be PvE. There's simply no challenge as there's food everywhere. The two main aspects of rural survival in DayZ are warmth and food and both are in abundance. Loot a few places and you've got all the winter clothing you need. Find a knife, a rifle and a few rounds and you're all set for hunting the abundant game that roams around the map.

So, in the end, the only real threat to a toon's survival is the other players.

As to the RP servers, I only played on one once and it was ok. There was a safe town where there was no shooting allowed and I was tasked with gathering food for the town. Other players were tasked with gathering different supplies, like lumber etc. So I head off with my scoped Winchester and In a few hours I had gathered more food than could have been eaten in a month of playing and it quickly got boring. But that was just one server, there might be other RP servers out there with a different set up.

As an aside, I will say that's it's incredibly ironic that on the pure PvP maps, like Esseker and Takistan, I've had more players willing to talk and team up than I have ever had on Chernarus.

[rickyriot 1009]

11 minutes ago, Tonyeh said:

Let's be honest, the vast majority of DayZ players are cunts.

Ha! You had me at the first line!

The points you raise are also very fair, imo anyway. I have to say the servers I play on tend to be vanilla (or very lightly modded) community servers. So the abundance of loot and/or food is perhaps not as plentiful as other servers, but you are right to the extent that food isn't the issue it could (should?) be, as one cow not only gets you enough meat for days, but bones for fish hooks which will feed you for another couple of days.

Thanks for the comments regarding the RP stuff, too, I'm really torn. I see some YT stuff and think, yup let's do that, then I read the "sign up" forms for the servers and it's like amateur dramatics night and I have to create a backstory and I'll be honest it turns me off.

[Tonyeh 454]

And to prove the point, I've just been shot by some cunt who came up saying he was friendly. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and he shot me.

[Parazight 1599]

5 hours ago, rickyriot said:

Ultimately this hits at the root of the "Dean Hall conundrum", that has plagued (for the lack of a better word) SA from launch, which is... "just what is Dz? A survival game? A PvP?"

It's not been answered and for the last 8 years or so BI have firmly sat on the fence, sometimes leaning one way, sometime the other. I totally don't blame BI here, I am sure they are just keen to not kill the golden goose, after all, those golden eggs are tasty!

I've asked this myself.  I determined that it doesn't really matter how BI defines it.  The game defines itself.  It's a huge sandbox.  It has people and ways to kill other people, mostly.  The most dangerous part of DayZ is other people, hands down. 

Wasn't part of the Dean Hall vision to create a sandbox for social interactions, to see how people would behave?  Pretty naive, imo.  No one actually dies IRL when I shoot them in DayZ.  The premise of the game is pretty much nonsense from the start, but it sure is fun to shoot at people knowing that there's no consequences, ever.  It sure is fun to mess around with shooting NPCs, gearing up, surviving along the way, launching cars into space and other sandbox stuff.  All things unrelated to positive social interactions.  The best way to progress is to shoot other people and take their loot.  The scenery is pretty nice along the way, however.

[McWendy 675]

3 minutes ago, Parazight said:

.  The scenery is pretty nice along the way, however.

No Lies here. Most chill invironment to walk around in and Just have a beer and cosy along. 

[Derleth 1357]

12 hours ago, rickyriot said:

Ha! You had me at the first line!

The points you raise are also very fair, imo anyway. I have to say the servers I play on tend to be vanilla (or very lightly modded) community servers. So the abundance of loot and/or food is perhaps not as plentiful as other servers, but you are right to the extent that food isn't the issue it could (should?) be, as one cow not only gets you enough meat for days, but bones for fish hooks which will feed you for another couple of days.

Thanks for the comments regarding the RP stuff, too, I'm really torn. I see some YT stuff and think, yup let's do that, then I read the "sign up" forms for the servers and it's like amateur dramatics night and I have to create a backstory and I'll be honest it turns me off.

I felt much like you about constant KOS on regular servers. For a long time I played on official servers like survivalist nomad, staying away from towns and military areas, living off the land and only raiding towns for specific items when necessary (usually repair kits). I became quite good at not being seen, it was interesting to observe other players running around killing each other never knowing I was there. But in the end I grew tired of always being on high alert so I created my own server for a more chill experience where the environment would truly be the greater threat. Meaning (much) more zombies, less food, less guns... Not gonna try and recruit anyone to my servers here, my point is there is a huge variety of community servers. It is not just stupidly modded pvp with traders etc or extreme RP - there are servers that are focused on survival and interactions, some with no-KOS rules, some with pvp allowed in certain areas and so on.

Many community servers are modded to shit with traders etc, but far from all of them. The modding community are honestly creating some magic out there and some servers are using them just right - although these servers are usually low populated since for some reason the greater part of the DayZ player base seems to either stubbornly stick to official servers or migrate towards the uber-modded monetised trader servers (why anyone would wanna play on such servers is beyond me, but to each their own...)

[Tonyeh 454]

4 hours ago, Derleth said:

I felt much like you about constant KOS on regular servers. For a long time I played on official servers like survivalist nomad, staying away from towns and military areas, living off the land and only raiding towns for specific items when necessary (usually repair kits). I became quite good at not being seen, it was interesting to observe other players running around killing each other never knowing I was there. But in the end I grew tired of always being on high alert so I created my own server for a more chill experience where the environment would truly be the greater threat. Meaning (much) more zombies, less food, less guns... Not gonna try and recruit anyone to my servers here, my point is there is a huge variety of community servers. It is not just stupidly modded pvp with traders etc or extreme RP - there are servers that are focused on survival and interactions, some with no-KOS rules, some with pvp allowed in certain areas and so on.

Many community servers are modded to shit with traders etc, but far from all of them. The modding community are honestly creating some magic out there and some servers are using them just right - although these servers are usually low populated since for some reason the greater part of the DayZ player base seems to either stubbornly stick to official servers or migrate towards the uber-modded monetised trader servers (why anyone would wanna play on such servers is beyond me, but to each their own...)

For me, it's the high alert that makes the game exciting though and without it, DayZ is a very poor single player experience. But like you I became pretty expert at not being seen. I'd be able to hide behind walls, doors, sheds etc and other players would waltz right by me never even knowing I was there. Once I hid amongst a load of dead zombie bodies and several players that killed them stopped by and were yapping about what they were going to do next. They hadn't a clue that I was about 2 feet away from them.

As to the overmodded servers, some of them are pretty awful. DayZ is fine with a few tweaks here and there and there are some good mods around. But some hosts go too far. I was on one last night and it was practically unplayable with all the shit on the screen. There was a permanent compass, a steam of shite from other players typing and the names of locations and their distances floating around. I lasted about 20 minutes.

[William Sternritter 449]

15 hours ago, Tonyeh said:

And to prove the point, I've just been shot by some cunt who came up saying he was friendly. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and he shot me.

Did you start playing yesterday? 😄 When they wave at you or say stuff like "Hey, how's it going?" you can give them the benefit of the doubt. But if they say "Hello friend" or "I'm friendly" or any of that bullshit, you immediately attack or run, whichever is more opportune for you. 

Roaming and observing other players (occasionally sniping them) is still enjoyable and sadly maybe the only way to play if you want your character to survive longer. Playing against the environment is also fun, but it's a different experience. Let's you see all of the map though 🙂 

Edited October 4, 2021 by William Sternritter

[Tonyeh 454]

But you see, sometimes people are friendly and into the bargain, I only had a BK18 with a single round. So either way I was probably buggered anyway. I wasn't about to lose much so it wasn't too much bother. In normal circumstances things would, more than likely, work out different.

[Parazight 1599]

On 10/3/2021 at 9:34 AM, rickyriot said:

What to do?

Consider the Official public Community hive.  It does have pros and cons.   It's vanilla Chernarus.  There can't be admin abuse.  It's low pop.  The servers aren't the best, but they're generally free of cheaters.   Most of them have a small band of regulars, 8-15 people each, with random other players. This hive still retains that ability to be open to anyone (the best part imo) while letting you remain disconnected from the community if you want to be. 

Here's me raiding a base on community hive.  There's bases all over the place on the community hives, too.

 

[drgullen 596]

11 minutes ago, Parazight said:

Here's me raiding a base on community hive.

My favorite part was watching you eat the apple.  That was epic.  😜

[nemorus 257]

It is how the game was designed. Guns everywhere, poor building system, static environment and pretty much nothing else. There is no meaning in surviving without hope or clear target; Surviving for the hell of it is pointless...

Majority will always KOS because it's the thing that gives them 'that' adrenaline boost. Recently a lot of servers turned into "Organic RP" kind of bullshit to look better. Let's take "Frostbite" server as an example. Most people will kill there on sight - it doesn't matter if they're from official factions, if they're streaming or RPying. Most of them are bloodthirsty bandits or just douchebags. Sure there are people to talk to but it's a drop in a ocean that already turned sour. And even if this contact finally happens it's always the same: "you need something? take it and good luck". People are playing in their small groups - they don't need anything else. And so this game is boring to play without companions.

[William Sternritter 449]

2 hours ago, Tonyeh said:

But you see, sometimes people are friendly and into the bargain, I only had a BK18 with a single round. So either way I was probably buggered anyway. I wasn't about to lose much so it wasn't too much bother. In normal circumstances things would, more than likely, work out different.

My point is, people who really are friendly do not say "I'm friendly" or "Hello friend". That is a lesson learned. People who are friendly start the interaction differently. 

[Just Caused 423]

Being highly geared is not the best situation to be in when meeting new people in hope to meet them. Also, server selection matters. Official servers are 99% KOS, so avoid those. Try to meet people when you're freshie then gear up with them. That way, you'll make a bond so people will have harder time thinking of betraying you.