Mosin-Nagant "Obrez" Modification? [Torchia Tweet]

[Katana67 2907]

True - as long as that glue-a-rifle-to-my-back-magic persists there is probably not much reason to downgrade the Mosin. Mabe if you got another rifle and don't want to move around with two clumsy longarms. The shorter barrel and lower weight might make it more flexible though - so if you don't find any other "close combat" weapons you might cut down a second Mosin for close quarter use.

 

I do think, though, that the "weight" system will add a bit of consequence to using some weapons over others.

 

And I agree that the Mosin should be more cumbersome, and not just in terms of turning speed. Because it's not always a race to turn to face your target, especially when the buildings you'd be clearing are fairly linear (meaning, you're already looking in the direction where your adversary is, because they can only be in a few known spots inside a building).

Edited August 5, 2014 by Katana67

[hotcakes 348]

I can't see how they'll balance it after they already added the longhorn. I bet the obrez is gonna be less accurate than the longhorn.

 

*shrug*

Edit: I'm also interested in the grip used to hold the weapon. You know how the sawed-off has a borked point of aim because it's shorter than the full-size shotgun?

Edited August 6, 2014 by hotcakes

[mortaug 8]

hers a vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9jScOyH7TM bit of a kick :)

 

 

Hmmm, how about a sawn off M1 Garand?

Edited August 6, 2014 by mortaug

[trev186 389]

I can't see how they'll balance it after they already added the longhorn. I bet the obrez is gonna be less accurate than the longhorn.

 

*shrug*

Why balance...

The long horn already is horrible.

If this gun does not have a scope it will barely be useful also

Dayz is less about balance and more about what you can find imo

[slippery gypsy 107]

think mad max beyond thunderdome when he enters barter town is why 

[hotcakes 348]

Why balance...

The long horn already is horrible.

If this gun does not have a scope it will barely be useful also

Dayz is less about balance and more about what you can find imo

 

It's not terrible, it was recently buffed to 7 MOA. You can quickscope people 200m away if you try hard enough. 

 

I was shooting trees en route for shits and gigs and most of my shots were good.

[Bororm 1156]

The longhorn is pretty good now and has less noticeable sway than the mosin scoped.  For ranges 200 and under my friends are actually finding it preferable to the mosin.  My buddy was up to 12 kills with his before he died.

 

This thing will probably be less accurate and I'd imagine not mount the scope any more.  We'll have to wait and see though.

I initially figured the longhorn would be basically pointless but time has proven otherwise.  The more variety the better any ways, not all guns have to be equal and having "shitty" guns makes for funner gameplay and an added challenge.

[spensah 8]

Hmmm, how about a sawn off M1 Garand?

Looks cool, but that'd never work for a number of reasons. Pretty difficult too.

[Bororm 1156]

I want a normal m1 garand in dayz.  I wanna hear them *pings*

 

I think the game could use another semi auto rifle.  I'm hesitant to suggest something like an m14 because I could see it being a bit too powerful among the current weapon selection, but maybe it'd be ok, especially if they didn't allow any sort of scopes just yet.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Bororm

[mortaug 8]

Looks cool, but that'd never work for a number of reasons. Pretty difficult too.

Actually it's not that hard of a build.

Several things to consider though,

1) don't use a completed rifle as your project weapon because  that would make it an SBR($200.00 tax stamp & up to 6 months wait for the paperwork.)

 

2)you can't use a standard m1 stock as ATF still considers the furniture as a rifle even when cut down. you have to use an after market furniture kit that NEVER had a stock. Otherwise you are still building an SBR.(See #1)

 

3) you have to shorten the gas tube and piston. If you are only going to use low recoil ammo, you can use the original springs just cut down. This is the best bet as the recoil is . . . . . . . pretty snappy*

Full pressure loads will require a new heavier spring.

The fireball is truly impressive even at 14". The shortest you can go is ~11.5". Any shorter puts way too much stress on the receiver and bolt when fired.

 

* = this coming from someone who enjoys shooting a 45-70 derringer, so your tolerance may vary.

[slippery gypsy 107]

where has long horn been spawning ?

[spensah 8]

Actually it's not that hard of a build.

you have to shorten the gas tube and piston. If you are only going to use low recoil ammo, you can use the original springs just cut down. This is the best bet as the recoil is . . . . . . . pretty snappy*

...

Any shorter puts way too much stress on the receiver and bolt when fired.

1) And drill a new gas port...of proper diameter.

2) You mean the extra wear from the bolt cycling way faster than normal? Short barels don't cause high pressure.

[mortaug 8]

Actually the pressure is the same, you just get less velocity since you have less barrel for the powder to burn in. Also accounts for the massive fireball you get :)

The problem is that to use a heavy enough spring to compensate for the shorter distance in which it has to slow the recoil, it makes unloading the rifle or reloading before completely empty a bit difficult

 

If you would like to see a chart of how the velocity decreases by barrel length http://ballisticsbytheinch.com/index.html has a nice chart only 223 in rifle though :(

Edited August 6, 2014 by mortaug

[Chaingunfighter 917]

This isn't strictly relevant to the thread or any of the weapons at hand, but this is sort of why I think that rifles will always be patently better than their smaller CQC counterparts.

 

Chernarus' engagements are pretty well geared toward long-range engagements, even in cities.

 

Aside from keeping something like a shotgun as a primary for the sole purpose of clearing buildings like barracks/jails, I don't see a distinct niche that they can fill and still be commonplace. And most other long-range weapons can do the job just as well.

It may have a use for the simple fact that you can store it in a backpack unlike the 9130 and thus will have a use for the 7.62x54mmR which will probably be more common than .308 when they become separate.

It's really no different than cutting down the IZH-43, although the Sawed-Off IZH-43 is a very good CQB weapon, unlike the Obrez which is only going to make it more useless in most cases. I mean, it may not excel in any role, but it is quite a badass looking weapon and the 5 round capacity of high-powered bullets may appeal to some.

 

I don't know. I don't think every weapon added really needs to fill a particular niche in that it needs to be useful, but more so in just that it has to give off a different performance, for good or for worse. I mean, adding the P1 would've been fairly pointless considering the CR75, as they're both just semi-automatic 9x19mm handguns, but the CR75 is more versatile and has a higher capacity.

The Obrez may not see a lot of use, but I guess it doesn't need to. It's not really meant to be a gun that people use (or intend to use) as a permanent weapon, similar to the new CR527. The CR527 might have a few good attachments, including a hunting scope, which may give it some flexibility, but otherwise it's going to be outclassed by the SKS which has double the capacity and doesn't need magazines, and the Mosin, which uses a more powerful round and can currently utilize a powerful scope (Assuming they don't take the LRS from the Mosin once better sniping platforms come into play).

[hombrecz 832]

Hmm I wish you could use machinery (lathe?) in some of those workshop houses that looks a bit like piano house but bigger.

Ofc electricity is off, but maybe you could scavenge some gas generator, hook it up to one of those and only then do some more complex weapon customisation?

 

It would make a noise that could attract both players and zombies though, but I guess workshop in Grishino could work well.

 

And yes, I would so welcome more crafting in DayZ. I plan to go full crossbow once we can craft arrows/bolts.

[Exorade 214]

 

m1 garand

 

m14

 

SVT-40.

 

 

 

 

where has long horn been spawning ?

 

 

 

The old office/school.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Exorade

[q.S Sachiel 470]

This isn't strictly relevant to the thread or any of the weapons at hand, but this is sort of why I think that rifles will always be patently better than their smaller CQC counterparts.

 

Chernarus' engagements are pretty well geared toward long-range engagements, even in cities.

 

Aside from keeping something like a shotgun as a primary for the sole purpose of clearing buildings like barracks/jails, I don't see a distinct niche that they can fill and still be commonplace. And most other long-range weapons can do the job just as well.

 

I'm pretty much onboard with this.

There's just about nothing justifying me cutting down a mosin, unless i'm really just starting out (and who finds hacksaws anyway).

 

If it's a 1+mech=2 process, then you're sacrificing either a bayonette (redundant as can opener does job and bayo doesn't skin atm) or range for what?  If it takes up 4-8 slots in your gear than maybe, but if you're in need of a quick CQC weapon and you've got mosin, either pistols out or drop your LRS and go ironsights.

 

I get the point in 'real life' for if you're robbing a 711 or want to be particularly concealed in your assault/defense, but people out there in Cherno aren't going to stop and gawk because they can't see your gun, they're just going to shoot at you from a range you'll find it harder to hit them at.

I see no purpose in sacrificing flexibility of the mosin here, but it would be cool if it's a completely new weapon, and variation with same ammo type should be only a good thing....

Edited August 6, 2014 by q.S Sachiel

[Rudette 435]

                                 +

=

My hopes. My dreams.

[LegitOldSchool 261]

You got a concealable and more mobile full power gun with a five shot magazine. Might have its uses. I doubt this more or less improvised weapon will be nearly as accurate as the Longhorn. It might also be louder and more difficult to handle - hwoever damage might be comparable and it shoots faster. Probably more on a mid-range sidearm with effective ranges between Magnum and Longhorn.

 

1- Longhorn is easier to conceal, this would take as much space as a saw-off shotgun.

2- It DOES have more ammo loaded

3- Recoil would be AWFUL because of the way you're holding it. Instead of your hand going up like when holding a longhorn, the recoil affects your whole arm length because of the position of your wrist bent forward. The handle angle is meant to send the recoil force to your shoulder, but there's no butt-stock left to absorb it.

4- Damage would be even with longhorn, shorter barrel means less velocity exiting the barrel. There's no way the damage can be comparable to the rifle itself if the barrel is shorter, simple physics.

5- Shoot faster? HOW? It's the SAME bolt action mechanism! You can't make it faster, if anything it would be SLOWER because of the awkward way you have to use the bolt mechanism on a shorter frame. Try using a rifle's bolt action mechanism while it's not pushed against your shoulder, awkward.

6- Range? Same as longhorn, same barrel length

 

Conclusion: It would be a bigger, slower firing, awful recoil, slow shooting, non-scoped Longhorn, WITH FOUR MORE BULLETS.

Edited August 6, 2014 by EchoZeero

[OrLoK 16186]

Hello there

 

It may not be the most effective weapon, but at the end of the day its stil a weapon.

 

If it is reduced then it will be easier to carry.

 

Now, as the mechanics stand as of NOW there's no real reason to cut down a Mosin. But we dont know what will happen in the future. Perhaps weapon damage will be locational and a cracked stock might be a reason to cut it down.

 

TBH I like the Sawn off shotgun just because. If I can hit a target with a sawn off mosin I might just carry that. Just because.

 

Lastly, Id rather have one of these than nothing at all.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[gibonez 3633]

Something as simple as having the weapon bump and interact with the environment would make this a very viable option for room clearing.

 

What good would a almost 6 foot long mosin be if it bumps into the walls when clearing a house. The obrez would be a good solution to this especially if they make everything far more rare to the point where finding an sks is like hitting the jack pot.

[Katana67 2907]

I see no purpose in sacrificing flexibility of the mosin here, but it would be cool if it's a completely new weapon, and variation with same ammo type should be only a good thing....

 

This is sort of where I'm at. Not only is the vanilla Mosin just good at what it does in the first place, the obrez just seems to make it worse in all regards. It's not like you need a shotgun/SMG to clear a building, you can do so pretty well with a Mosin.

 

Which is why I think that they need to add certain parameters (like barrel length collisions perhaps, faster raise/draw times, and enhanced movement via a weight system) which allow folks using dedicated "CQC" weapons to actually harness an advantage.

 

Not that I don't want the obrez, I want as many weapons in-game as they can get. But I just think the weapons need to be made useful, to a reasonable degree, first... and then made various as a second priority.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Katana67

[mortaug 8]

Hmm I wish you could use machinery (lathe?) in some of those workshop houses that looks a bit like piano house but bigger.

Ofc electricity is off, but maybe you could scavenge some gas generator, hook it up to one of those and only then do some more complex weapon customisation?

 

It would make a noise that could attract both players and zombies though, but I guess workshop in Grishino could work well.

 

And yes, I would so welcome more crafting in DayZ. I plan to go full crossbow once we can craft arrows/bolts.

yes I seem to either finds crossbows or bolts. Never both on the same character :(

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Something as simple as having the weapon bump and interact with the environment would make this a very viable option for room clearing.

 

What good would a almost 6 foot long mosin be if it bumps into the walls when clearing a house. The obrez would be a good solution to this especially if they make everything far more rare to the point where finding an sks is like hitting the jack pot.

An SKS? I don't know. I'd say the SKS should be a mid-game rifle on the entire spectrum of release guns. Even in the current game the AKM is superior to the SKS in almost every way, except for the fact that you need a magazine for it. The M4A1 is also generally a better performing weapon.

 

Even then, the SKS isn't some godlike room-clearing weapon. Sure, it's better than the Mosin, Sporter, LongHorn, and CR527, and in some cases the Blaze 95 and regular IZH-43 for large groups, but handguns usually perform just as well (the FNX-45 and CR75 are probably better), the ARs (AK101, AKM, and M4A1) are far better and the sawed-off IZH-43 is king.

 

Now, if they want to make the SKS a high-end weapon on the civilian lists, then I'd be okay with that, but as a whole it's not anything special.

[hombrecz 832]

Now, if they want to make the SKS a high-end weapon on the civilian lists, then I'd be okay with that, but as a whole it's not anything special.

 

We have to wait and see. Game is still so far from the beta phase in which they will start tweaking and polishing loot tables and stuff.

I agree that SKS should not be totaly basic weapon though. If they remove LRS from Mosin, that could be the most common rifle along with Sporter I guess. CZ527 should be more accurate than Mosin and be able to mount a scope ofc.