Arma3 Third person fix mod...thoughts?

[Daemonkid 493]

So do a third server option.  All these threads are always about replacing 3rd person as it stands.  Make an alternative, not a replacement.

 

3PP is not "broken" it is not "cancer" it is not an "exploit" any of the myriad of stupid shit people say it is.  It's a game mode, one that has been part of DayZ from the start and one that a lot of people have learned to enjoy.  Just because some people don't like it doesn't mean it's broken.

 

I'm all for alternatives and options, but the way people go about making these threads are not about discussion they are about dick measuring bullshit as an excuse to have a valid playstyle changed.

 

 

 

 

I mean look at this BULLSHIT.  Destructive?  should be completely removed?  causes damage to gameplay?

This isn't a proposed discussion, this is some one who doesn't like a game type saying it should be gone for totally subjective reasons.

Game should never have had 3PP in the first place. It detracts so much from the experience. You like having 100% situation awareness because of your god vision floating above you? It's absurd. It's pointless and does nothing but harm what this game is supposed to be about. I mean for god sakes, you can't even SNEAK up on a person who is using 3PP because they can fucking see you coming up behind them. It makes stealthy melee ambushes totally out of the question because they can see behind their heads without even needing to look away from what their looking at; at the time.

[Bororm 1156]

Game should never have had 3PP in the first place. It detracts so much from the experience. You like having 100% situation awareness because of your god vision floating above you? It's absurd. It's pointless and does nothing but harm what this game is supposed to be about. I mean for god sakes, you can't even SNEAK up on a person who is using 3PP because they can fucking see you coming up behind them. It makes stealthy melee ambushes totally out of the question because they can see behind their heads without even needing to look away from what their looking at; at the time.

Total bullshit.  no one's ever been snuck up on, on a third person server? are you fucking kidding me

 

I swear to god, do you people even play this fucking game or do you just sit around theorizing all day.

[Bororm 1156]

 

If Abe Lincoln had taken the "look the other way approach", slavery never would have been ablolished in America and the union would have split.
"But we like exploiting our free labor!"
Just because you like it, doesn't make it right.

 

Comparing 3pp to slavery, BULLSHIT.

 

 

3PP is a problem as it fragments the community. We should all be playing the same game together. Why they added 3PP to ARMA is beyond me. I honestly have no fucking idea. It's literally the dumbest shit they could've done as it trivializes 99% of the game and makes playing online even funnier.

 

Complaining that it fragments a healthy community implied in a negative way, in which the majority of people are actually playing on 3PP servers?

BULLSHIT

 

Ignoring the crutches and exploits that 3pp have and how they negatively affect gameplay is the equivalent of having cancer but ignoring it.

 

Comparing 3pp to cancer, BULLSHIT

 

 

Yeah this is a real great discussion full of hyperbole and totally subjective objections to an objectively fair mechanic.  And before you guys give me that BULLSHIT about how it's not fair, because some guy can see over a ledge.  You can do the same exact shit, so yes it is fair.  Everyone has access to the same tools.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Bororm

[Daemonkid 493]

It's pretty much impossible to sneak up on someone camping in a building with 3PP, it gives you all the advantage with no risks. It's stupid, it's pointless and it needs to go. Don't give me the bullshit you want to see your character, in all his leet gear. That's just shit. 3PP damages the whole "Hardcore survival" aspect. It gives you a wider FoV, allows you to see over objects you shouldn't. It removes almost all the tension in the game, that's an awful thing for a game that's considered "Horror" 

 

It always seems like the 3PP crowd has no legs to stand on about this topic. Tell me how 3PP helps promote fair gameplay. It doesn't.

[Bororm 1156]

It's pretty much impossible to sneak up on someone camping in a building with 3PP, it gives you all the advantage with no risks. It's stupid, it's pointless and it needs to go. Don't give me the bullshit you want to see your character, in all his leet gear. That's just shit. 3PP damages the whole "Hardcore survival" aspect. It gives you a wider FoV, allows you to see over objects you shouldn't. It removes almost all the tension in the game, that's an awful thing for a game that's considered "Horror" 

 

It always seems like the 3PP crowd has no legs to stand on about this topic. Tell me how 3PP helps promote fair gameplay. It doesn't.

 

Again you're talking out of your ass, people are snuck up on routinely in third person servers.

 

 

I don't agree with the first part of the bold, but again.  There is such a thing as a server mode called HARDCORE.  Go check it out, it's an option.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Bororm

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Yeah this is a real great discussion full of hyperbole and totally subjective objections to an objectively fair mechanic.  And before you guys give me that BULLSHIT about how it's not fair, because some guy can see over a ledge.  You can do the same exact shit, so yes it is fair.  Everyone has access to the same tools.

 

This kid likes him some corner peekin', yo. It doesn't matter how many times you call bullshit, the facts remain. Just because both people have it doesn't put players on equal footing.

 

If you're camping a corner with 3PP enabled, you can see everything around that corner. People approaching you can't see around your corner. You can plot the exact SECOND you pop out and shoot them.

 

Secondly, if you're in the ATC laying prone, you can see everything around you without having to risk your safety to peek. People below you can't see in the ATC.

 

THE WHOLE POINT IS THAT 3PP NEGATES HAVING TO PEEK TO GAIN VALUABLE SITUATIONAL AWARENESS. IT COMPLETELY NEGATES THE ACQUISITION OF INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON AROUND YOU. THERE IS NO DANGER WHEN YOU CAN SIT BEHIND A CORNER OR UNDER A LEDGE AND KNOW EVERYTHING GOING ON IN YOUR SURROUNDINGS.

 

How many threads do we have to link this video? Maybe someone actually showing you how stupid you're being with a pretty video will help:

 

[Daemonkid 493]

That's due to their own lack of situation awareness. There is a difference between getting sneaked upon by someone with the capability to kill you from range, but with a melee weapon, a good stealthy kill is impossible, you can see like 5 feet behind you. 

I don't see you explaining how 3PP isn't a gamebreaking problem with the game.

 

 

Also, if I was talking out of my ass it would be a fart.

[Bororm 1156]

That video is stupid because it's taken from a single perspective.  There's always another corner to peek around, there's always another angle to see the person back.  The map is designed with this shit in mind.

 

That video is biased BULLSHIT.

[Bororm 1156]

 

That's due to their own lack of situation awareness. There is a difference between getting sneaked upon by someone with the capability to kill you from range, but with a melee weapon, a good stealthy kill is impossible, you can see like 5 feet behind you. 

I don't see you explaining how 3PP isn't a gamebreaking problem with the game.

 

 

Also, if I was talking out of my ass it would be a fart.

 

My game hasn't broken from it, and neither have 2 million other people's.

 

I've killed people with melee before they've seen me, because guess what, people still aim down their scopes/sights and use first person on third person servers.  Keep fishing for that example of how it's impossible to sneak up on people on a third person server though. 

Edited May 17, 2014 by Bororm

[Grimey Rick 3417]

That video is stupid because it's taken from a single perspective.  There's always another corner to peek around, there's always another angle to see the person back.  The map is designed with this shit in mind.

 

That video is biased BULLSHIT.

 

Okay, show me a video or explain to me how 3PP isn't exploitive in any manner and how it improves the overall experience. That video hits the nail on the head; reality's a bitch.

 

Yelling "LOLOL BULLSHIT" in all of your posts isn't exactly lending you credibility. Until then, keep campin' them corners and feeling good about your exploitive frags, haha.

[Bororm 1156]

It's a different type of gameplay, there's nothing wrong if you don't like it.  But it is not cheating, it is not a crutch, it is not cancer, it is not whatever the fuck stupid excuses people want to call it because some guy got the drop on them, it just is.

 

If you don't like being able to peek corners, or have people peek corners at you.  There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.  So why is there something wrong with people who have come to enjoy the gameplay that results from it?

 

It's a different perspective, leading to different strategies and tactics.  Just because you think they're cheap doesn't mean a god damn thing.  People think snipers sitting in a bush 800m away are cheap, but that's a valid playstyle.

 

3PP is a valid playstyle, stop pretending like it's not.  If you want an alternative there is nothing wrong with that.  Saying something is wrong with people who enjoy it just makes you a fucking asshole, the same way as judging people by any sort of valid playstyle they might enjoy makes you an asshole.

[Daemonkid 493]

3PP is a PLAYSTYLE now? Gosh darnit! I thought 3PP was a view perspective! It shouldn't have ANY ramifications on an actual playstyle. (Like hero, survivor ect)

 

3PP is a fucking crutch, when I can hide around a corner and camp it, wait for someone to come along who has 0 fucking chance of knowing what's on the other side of that corner, but you're there, waiting fully concealed with 0 risk to yourself to gather that intel, that's a fucking crutch. Simple as that, you can't defend something so inherently broken like that. It's just not possible. You cheapen the experience for yourself and others. 

DayZ from Day 1 should've been 1PP, it gives everyone equal footing in all situations. Not one person has an advantage over another person because one person can have 100% situational awareness with no consequences to themselves. It's a risk vs reward thing, like in the video.

 

You can scream and shout all you like, but the point still stands, 3PP is a crutch and needs to be FIXED or removed.

[Bororm 1156]

Okay, show me a video or explain to me how 3PP isn't exploitive in any manner and how it improves the overall experience. That video hits the nail on the head; reality's a bitch.

 

Yelling "LOLOL BULLSHIT" in all of your posts isn't exactly lending you credibility. Until then, keep campin' them corners and feeling good about your exploitive frags, haha.

 

Here I'll take the screencap off that video.

 

And here is another example:

(quick edit: it'd be their right not their left.  It is our left =P)

 

 

 

It's a matter of positioning, not inherently the perspective.  Just as in a first person server a player way off sniping from a bush has an advantage, because he chose a better position.

 

All these examples people bring up about why 3pp is bad are taken from a single perspective.  DayZ is not played in a vacuum, there is ALWAYS another angle.  It's whoever chose the best position for the specific situation, the same shit that is true of any encounter regardless of perspective.

 

Does it play differently?  Absolutely.  But it is not inherently unfair.  The unfairness comes from another person making better use of their tools, the same way that any advantage occurs in a pvp situation.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Bororm

[Bororm 1156]

3PP is a PLAYSTYLE now? Gosh darnit! I thought 3PP was a view perspective! It shouldn't have ANY ramifications on an actual playstyle. (Like hero, survivor ect)

 

3PP is a fucking crutch, when I can hide around a corner and camp it, wait for someone to come along who has 0 fucking chance of knowing what's on the other side of that corner, but you're there, waiting fully concealed with 0 risk to yourself to gather that intel, that's a fucking crutch. Simple as that, you can't defend something so inherently broken like that. It's just not possible. You cheapen the experience for yourself and others. 

DayZ from Day 1 should've been 1PP, it gives everyone equal footing in all situations. Not one person has an advantage over another person because one person can have 100% situational awareness with no consequences to themselves. It's a risk vs reward thing, like in the video.

 

You can scream and shout all you like, but the point still stands, 3PP is a crutch and needs to be FIXED or removed.

 

100% situational awareness, OK chief.

Lemme know when you're done being full of shit and want to have a real discussion.  Maybe after you actually play the game.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Bororm

[Daemonkid 493]

100% situational awareness, OK chief.

Lemme know when you're done being full of shit and want to have a real discussion.

You let me know first there champ.

[Bororm 1156]

You let me know first there champ.

 

Oh I'm ready for a discussion, did you actually go play?  That was quick.

[Daemonkid 493]

Yes I did, and know what I did on my 3PP character? I sat in a bush with 3PP on; near a highly traffic'd area in Berezino. (Policestation) and fired indiscriminately at any passer by.

Killed 2 fresh spawns, just using the 3PP dot for hipfire. I could see outside of the bush, and I was concealed very well.

 

Hopped onto my first person character went to a bush and guess what I was greeted with! My screen was covered in foliage! I couldn't see through my concealment to kill other players! 

Edited May 17, 2014 by Daemonkid

[Bororm 1156]

Yes I did, and know what I did on my 3PP character? I sat in a bush with 3PP on; near a highly traffic'd area in Berezino. (Policestation) and fired indiscriminately at any passer by.

Killed 2 fresh spawns, just using the 3PP dot for hipfire. I could see outside of the bush, and I was concealed very well.

 

Hopped onto my first person character went to a bush and guess what I was greeted with! My screen was covered in foliage! I couldn't see through my concealment to kill other players! 

 

Yep that's the difference between first and third person right there.

Cool, so you understand now?

[Daemonkid 493]

Yep that's the difference between first and third person right there.

Cool, so you understand now?

 

Are you mentally deficient?

[chompster 171]

Players being invisible until you have line of sight on them is the only real solution. The way that Arma3 mod did it.

Not that i care, i simply stick to HC servers, and only play 3pp with my noob friends.

[gibonez 3633]

I think we are long past the stage where we as a community decides if it is a problem or not.

 

Everyone can agree to some extent that this is indeed a pressing issue and indeed negatively affects gameplay.

 

While not technically an exploit it is a crutch.

 

Now we need to talk on how to fix it and fix it in a way that does not completely remove 3pp.

[Bororm 1156]

No but it seems you are.  I updated my post on the previous page with more screenshots taken directly from that video, showing how none of those situations are unfair from a game mechanic standpoint and all are a result of positioning.

 

Look, I get it, you don't like the gameplay that results from 3PP.  Again, nothing wrong with that.  That doesn't mean it's broken though, it means you don't like it.  Do you understand the difference between not liking something, and something being broken?

 

I am telling you, I have never in my countless hours of DayZ felt I was "cheated" by some one using third person, because I go into it fully aware of the results that can occur from playing with that perspective enabled.  I adjust accordingly.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Stuff and things.

 

Your provided "examples" of how 3PP isn't exploitive are almost insulting, dude. They didn't even pertain to the ease with which one can ascertain full spatial awareness of an area from a position of concealment.

 

If you're camping underneath the stairs in an ATC at any given airfield, you can see anyone coming well before they get close to you without peeking. The guy entering the ATC has no idea you're there and couldn't see you even if he wanted to. You, at any point, can pick when you want to reveal yourself and blast him taking him completely off guard. You were provided this knowledge without having to risk taking fire when peeking by a flawed game mechanic.

 

It is almost impossible to push into a building where you know people are camping on a server that has 3PP enabled. If the defenders don't kill you, they're extremely bad as they have every advantage (assuming equal equipment).

 

Now, on a 1PP enabled server, it's a completely different (and more realistic) story. Even when defending, you need to periodically peek unless you're content with staring at the same corner for hours on end. You can't tell your friend, "He's on the right side of the door, flank around him and pick him off," without peeking thus risking your safety. This is, y'know, how it'd be in a real life situation. Even in the context of a video game, it's highly unfair to be able to see your opponent before they can see you. This is not a discussion on camouflage and snipers, this is a discussion on flawed game mechanics.

 

Obviously there are people who prefer the "arcade" feeling of a video game, and that's fine. But DayZ strives (so they say) to be as authentic as possible. Last I checked, extrasensory perception isn't authentic. If you're this type of person, there are literally dozens of other games out there you can go play.

 

[Bororm 1156]

Players being invisible until you have line of sight on them is an alternative. The way that Arma3 mod did it.

Not that i care, i simply stick to HC servers, and only play 3pp with my noob friends.

 

Fixed that for you buddy.

[Bororm 1156]

Your provided "examples" of how 3PP isn't exploitive are almost insulting, dude. They didn't even pertain to the ease with which one can ascertain full spatial awareness of an area from a position of concealment.

 

If you're camping underneath the stairs in an ATC at any given airfield, you can see anyone coming well before they get close to you without peeking. The guy entering the ATC has no idea you're there and couldn't see you even if he wanted to. You, at any point, can pick when you want to reveal yourself and blast him taking him completely off guard. You were provided this knowledge without having to risk taking fire when peeking by a flawed game mechanic.

 

It is almost impossible to push into a building where you know people are camping on a server that has 3PP enabled. If the defenders don't kill you, they're extremely bad as they have every advantage (assuming equal equipment).

 

Now, on a 1PP enabled server, it's a completely different (and more realistic) story. Even when defending, you need to periodically peek unless you're content with staring at the same corner for hours on end. You can't tell your friend, "He's on the right side of the door, flank around him and pick him off," without peeking thus risking your safety. This is, y'know, how it'd be in a real life situation. Even in the context of a video game, it's highly unfair to be able to see your opponent before they can see you. This is not a discussion on camouflage and snipers, this is a discussion on flawed game mechanics.

 

Obviously there are people who prefer the "arcade" feeling of a video game, and that's fine. But DayZ strives (so they say) to be as authentic as possible. Last I checked, extrasensory perception isn't authentic. If you're this type of person, there are literally dozens of other games out there you can go play.

 

 

Stopped reading at "flawed" let me know if you wanna have a real discussion without your personal bias as well.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Bororm