Why DayZ is no survival game

[Wayze 549]

So is the consensus I'm reading from mostly everyone is that OP is wrong?

The Beans, look at the Beans. ;)

 

 

the poll you cited is highly flawed. it cites for example basebuilding and storage as character progression, which i think is debatable.

 

persistance is not progression.

I agree, but it's kind of the only one out there. ^^

[slivniku@gmail.com 93]

you already have a "thing" that should make you care for your character - health - it takes an average of couple of hours to reach full health and it is likely to become harder as game is further developed.

[Wayze 549]

you already have a "thing" that should make you care for your character - health - it takes an average of couple of hours to reach full health and it is likely to become harder as game is further developed.

Who cares about health?

[Martmital 436]

Who cares about health?

 

Who cares about skills?

[Wayze 549]

Who cares about skills?

Don't know. Do you have a better idea? Present it here, this is why we are a community. What I know is that people care about DayZ being a survival game and having a reward for surviving long.

Edited February 3, 2014 by Wayze

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

I'm going to have to break my leg on some stairs.  Haven't had that happen since the mod but I always found it highly entertaining to roleplay Daniel Plainview.

[Mao Zedong 48]

Eh, I agree with you that dayz isn't a survival game but your suggestions to make it one kind of fail (sorry but it's true.) If you survive 500 hours you shouldn't just magically get aimbot (ie shooting like a robot).. it should be based on the players skill. Also, there will be assholes like me that don't care about skills like repairing a heli and will go around ruining your skill progress because fuck you for hiding in the woods. :)

[Mao Zedong 48]

Eh, I agree with you that dayz isn't a survival game but your suggestions to make it one kind of fail (sorry but it's true.) If you survive 500 hours you shouldn't just magically get aimbot (ie shooting like a robot).. it should be based on the players skill. Also, there will be assholes like me that don't care about skills like repairing a heli and will go around ruining your skill progress because fuck you for hiding in the woods. :)

[Martmital 436]

Don't know. Do you have a better idea? Present it here, this is why we are a community. What I know is that people care about DayZ being a survival game and having a reward for surviving long.

 

As many have already stated, the simple act of staying alive for as long as possible is reward enough.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That and beards!

[Estevacio 62]

Mcnaggin' , try to be reasonable

We are on his game to test it out, there is no purpose yet, but to find problems and just live with them until they are corrected

Quit the post new topic and start reading the problems and just say " can confirm this"

[Wayze 549]

Eh, I agree with you that dayz isn't a survival game but your suggestions to make it one kind of fail (sorry but it's true.) If you survive 500 hours you shouldn't just magically get aimbot (ie shooting like a robot).. it should be based on the players skill. Also, there will be assholes like me that don't care about skills like repairing a heli and will go around ruining your skill progress because fuck you for hiding in the woods. :)

I never was talking about an aimbot. But it's a known fact, that the more you train to shoot, the more often you will hit where you aim. It is simple training, no magic. Right now it's just the other way around. Everyone has "aimbot". Everyone can shoot like a special forces sniper veteran who has 5 medal of honors etc. wtf? What has this to do with skill?

 

And as*holes (you said that ^^) like you are always a problem. This is why DayZ is DayZ. Without losing your progress, what would be the point of the game? The point is that as*holes like you won't be able to do as much as others, because you don't give a f*ck about surviving. You go run around like a maniac. You will have your fun (probably not), but you will never get as far as someone who plays the game authentic.

 

 

I'm going to have to break my leg on some stairs.  Haven't had that happen since the mod but I always found it highly entertaining to roleplay Daniel Plainview.

This is my point. Right now, you have to roleplay it. But if your character has value, you won't roleplay it, it will be f*cking real because you do not want to die no matter what.

Edited February 3, 2014 by Wayze

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

. Without losing your progress, what would be the point of the game? The point is that as*holes like you won't be able to do as much as others, because you don't give a f*ck about surviving. You go run around like a maniac. You will have your fun (probably not), but you will never get as far as someone who plays the game authentic.

 

As many others have pointed out.  This is Alpha and maybe 10% complete.  The gun toting morons who play this game like CoD will most likely be the first ones to quit playing once the difficulty gets ramped up and weapons are harder to find while survival will become even harder.  Hopefully, to the point that you will cherish that bag of rice or can of beans.  Once the novelty of playing Call of DayZ wears off and these guys all die from hunger, because their backpacks are full of ammo herp derp, most of us will rejoice.

Edited February 3, 2014 by Caboose187

[shadowjack 254]

This is quite possibly the funniest thing I have read on the internet. However, I can accept that if you sat down to play a game and there was possibly a server glitch upon logging in and it killed you, that you would be perfectly ok with waiting a few hours until your next attempt.

 

So I have a solution, when and if you die. Do not log in for a set period.

Do not force this upon the rest of the sane gamer population.

Thank you.

 

Stupid or not if a glitch (or hacker) gets me i just chalk it up to an act of the Gods. It’s a game, roll with the punches. Walking away from the game is easy when the game is not the central focus in life.

 

You speak of forcing game play. Well everything has rules and limits. We are all forced in some way or another. One thing is for sure. No one forced you to buy into the alpha. (i hope)

 

 I do acknowledge that a lengthy timer would be a big deal for many who paid for access not expecting such a drastic change. Then again with any work in progress and with no guarantee they will build the game to suit any particular individual or group you assume the risk in purchasing the alpha.

 

 Relax, it won’t happen. The folks at BI are good capitalists and will balance profit with playability that suits a decent size audience. That is something i accept.

[Wayze 549]

Guys I am just wondering, maybe we are communicating wrong. To everyone who doesn't like the idea of a skillsystem:

 

What are the reasons you dislike the concept?

[DeatHTaX 1217]

Guys I am just wondering, maybe we are communicating wrong. To everyone who doesn't like the idea of a skillsystem:

 

What are the reasons you dislike the concept?

 

I'm sure they have already explained it. If you're gonna revive your own dead thread, at least make it slightly thought provoking

[Wayze 549]

I'm sure they have already explained it. If you're gonna revive your own dead thread, at least make it slightly thought provoking

No really, I didn't get it. Not once. I just got the argument of "OP players", which is kind of easy to fix.

[DeatHTaX 1217]

No really, I didn't get it. Not once. I just got the argument of "OP players", which is kind of easy to fix

 

Bs. I'm sure there are plenty of explanations. 

 

Stop trying to hide your pathetic attempt to revive your own thread out of "curiosity" for people viewpoints. Your thread was buried

 

Deal with it

[Wayze 549]

Bs. I'm sure there are plenty of explanations. 

 

Stop trying to hide your pathetic attempt to revive your own thread out of "curiosity" for people viewpoints. Your thread was buried

 

Deal with it

What the f*ck? :D

 

Well, if you are sure there are plenty of explanations, we can discuss it here. Or if you want it, even privately.

 

Dealt with it. :lol:

[Karmaterror 982]

Heres why i dont like a skills system....we already got it. Except we dont have gamey little skills trees, perks or anything like that. The skill rests with the player and there gear. Ganna go back to the mod for example....I pick up a toolbox...I now have the ability to repair cars, I gained a skill. And now i dont want to die because i have that skill. But i dont need a gratifying little "level up" or "skill aquired" thing to tell me. 

 

The other point is experience, players do get better at all aspects of the game as they play. They will get better at using each gun as they use it. Now i do think that skill system would be ok in as much as when you die you loose that experience. But that brings me back to my other point, if we aquire skills through gear, are we not loosing those skills when we die?

[skyline-gtr 130]

"Skyline-GTR, on 02 Feb 2014 - 4:31 PM, said:

    You have posted 5 examples of life in DayZ.

    At any one time there could be roughly 20,000 players, they are all different and all have different likes and dislikes.

    So im not sure if 5 is a great number of situations to base changing the game for.

    Your solutions seem interesting but I dont think all of them they are best placed in this game.

    Statistics: I have seen this come up before and I suggest that once you add things like this in the game, it no longer becomes about playing the game, it becomes a tool for raising statistics.

    Appearance change over time: I do like this option, with things like beard and hair growth, clothes become dirty and worn etc.

    Skills progression: I would prefer if this was not added to the game. I could talk more about why if you are interested, but it would require a lot of typing. So I just refer you to my previous post on this thread for now."
 

 

 

 

"Guess what?

The community actually appreciates the idea of character progression. It's not me who is thinking as an minority, it's you. (in terms of community)"
http://forums.dayzga...er-progression/    

 

 

Yeah dude i think you made an error here.

As you can see, I was in an agreement about character progression in terms of looks.

[Wayze 549]

Heres why i dont like a skills system....we already got it. Except we dont have gamey little skills trees, perks or anything like that. The skill rests with the player and there gear. Ganna go back to the mod for example....I pick up a toolbox...I now have the ability to repair cars, I gained a skill. And now i dont want to die because i have that skill. But i dont need a gratifying little "level up" or "skill aquired" thing to tell me. 

 

The other point is experience, players do get better at all aspects of the game as they play. They will get better at using each gun as they use it. Now i do think that skill system would be ok in as much as when you die you loose that experience. But that brings me back to my other point, if we aquire skills through gear, are we not loosing those skills when we die?

Wrong, we don't have a skill system, we are playing a game based on player expirience and luck. Those two factors decide about life and death. But alright, I get your point.

 

Important is the "I don't want to die because..." part. That's not true. All the things you get are worthless. A repairbox? Who cares about it. Whatever gear you have, it doesn't matter to the most people. If they die, they have enough gear in their base.

Now, if a repairbox would be super rare, then yes. You would probably do everything to not lose the box (not to not die). But if a repairbox is superrare, the game is just unbalanced. Here we go with factor 2, luck. You can search for 100 hours and still not find a repair box, because it's based on luck. You can survive for 100 hours and search for a repair box without making ANY progress in that regard. But if the repair box is common, it's not worth anything. So your logic equals to "skills are worth nothing" or "skills are based on pure luck".

You can decide which one you choose, but currently it's "skills are worth nothing", that's how it is. In my opinion more importantly though is, that if you have a system based on gear as skills, people will indeed get bored by survival. They survived for 200 hours and found their first repairbox, but they know that a freshspawn can equire the same within 5 minutes, if he is lucky. And how long do you want to search for loot? How do you want to balance a game where it takes more than 10 hours to get the best gear?

Another problem is that you can save skills by simply putting them into a tent. You can save 100 hour progress by putting it somewhere save.

 

So as your assumption "Gear = skills" is kind of not really fitting, I am still wondering why do dislike the idea of having skills. You said yourself that people equire the skills by picking them up, simply based on luck, not on effort. What do you have against a system where you equire skills just by effort (and luck, as you require the items)?

In both cases you lose the progress after dying.

Edited February 5, 2014 by Wayze

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I don't like skills because they introduce an objective into the game. People would focus on the payoff of gaining skill level, rather than focus on whats happening in the game.

 

It's like when you play a game like call of duty and some people want to use the crappiest weapons because they need to unlock something associated with using it.

 

An example in DayZ would be a medical skill. Groups of bandits would simply kidnap freshspawns and use them to level up their medical skill. It makes it no longer about kidnapping someone for a specific reason, or torturing them for psychological reasons, rather it would create a bunch of kidnappings that would simply be a means to leveling up your skill. The game would force these practices on the players, because players always find the most efficient means of leveling up skills.

 

There are very few skills I can imagine working in the setting of DayZ. There's just too much to consider.

[Wayze 549]

I don't like skills because they introduce an objective into the game. People would focus on the payoff of gaining skill level, rather than focus on whats happening in the game.

 

It's like when you play a game like call of duty and some people want to use the crappiest weapons because they need to unlock something associated with using it.

 

An example in DayZ would be a medical skill. Groups of bandits would simply kidnap freshspawns and use them to level up their medical skill. It makes it no longer about kidnapping someone for a specific reason, or torturing them for psychological reasons, rather it would create a bunch of kidnappings that would simply be a means to leveling up your skill. The game would force these practices on the players, because players always find the most efficient means of leveling up skills.

 

There are very few skills I can imagine working in the setting of DayZ. There's just too much to consider.

A medical skill system will be implemented. This is not something to argue about, it's Deans idea.

 

Let me do this:

I don't like loot, because it's introducing an objective to the game. People would focus on the payoff of collection loot, rather than focus on whats happening in the game.

 

But, to solve your problem:

The longer your survive, the higher you skills can get. You cannot grind because after you do something once, you need to wait an amount of time to do it again. Additionally, skills like reparing and crafting consume valuable goods.

 

There are many ways to fix these problems. So if they were fixed, would you like a skill system?

[skyline-gtr 130]

I don't like skills because they introduce an objective into the game. People would focus on the payoff of gaining skill level, rather than focus on whats happening in the game.

 

It's like when you play a game like call of duty and some people want to use the crappiest weapons because they need to unlock something associated with using it.

 

An example in DayZ would be a medical skill. Groups of bandits would simply kidnap freshspawns and use them to level up their medical skill. It makes it no longer about kidnapping someone for a specific reason, or torturing them for psychological reasons, rather it would create a bunch of kidnappings that would simply be a means to leveling up your skill. The game would force these practices on the players, because players always find the most efficient means of leveling up skills.

 

There are very few skills I can imagine working in the setting of DayZ. There's just too much to consider.

 

 

Very nicely worded!

[Wayze 549]

Very nicely worded!

I agree, but the content is kind of flawed. :|