Why ARMA Engine?

[Castle- 2]

Seems broken? hate to be that guy but its in alpha. Secondly this game is great for being in alpha I've seen games ship with this many bugs even more **cough**bf4**cough**

 

If you think this engine is sub par then you good sir need to look again.

 

honestly I think a ban is in order no joke, I mean who are you too call there work shit, some self entitled asshat you must be.

seriously? I played bf4 in closed beta and it blows this game away by far..  frostbite 3 demolishes this arma crap engine hands down.  this engine is far worse than sub par.  someone should ban you for being a fan boy.  Bottom line is this..  Dayz SA is using an outdated engine and has the worst controls and fps issues ive ever seen.... regardless of the alpha excuse.  Smooth frames and solid controls are a must for this type of game.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

seriously? I played bf4 in closed beta and it blows this game away by far..  frostbite 3 demolishes this arma crap engine hands down.  this engine is far worse than sub par.  someone should ban you for being a fan boy.  Bottom line is this..  Dayz SA is using an outdated engine and has the worst controls and fps issues ive ever seen.... regardless of the alpha excuse.  Smooth frames and solid controls are a must for this type of game.

 

Well, thanks for the $30 I guess? Have fun in Battlefield.

[Irenicus (DayZ) 289]

Why stupid thread?

[Castle- 2]

I think the engine is part of the charm. It feels like a Bohemia game.

 

Plus, what fun is DayZ without the chance of getting ArmA'd?

 

what does that even mean?  this engine is garbage. what fun is dayz when u cannot even attack a player standing 2 feet away because the game is so clunky u cannot aim ( worst mouse controls in the known world).. better yet try shooting them.  oh oh better yet.. try fighting inside a house.

[Castle- 2]

Well, thanks for the $30 I guess? Have fun in Battlefield.

oh did I pay you 30 $ ?  if so id like a refund on this mod u call a game.

[Geckofrog7 1168]

STFU VIRTUAL REALITY IS AMAZING :D

I don't know what I'd do without my oh so memorable glitches. :)

It really is a great engine for this game, it makes it so much more of a huge and paranoid experience.

[dsi24 227]

TBH the real question is "Why RV2.5 (ArmA2/Take On Helicopters) and not RV3 (ArmA3)?" But of course the answer is "get the game out faster!" Wish they waited a few months for ArmA3's engine to be finished up for ArmA3's Alpha at least... DayZ:SA still feels like an old mod due to its old engine version.

[Atomizer 53]

seriously? I played bf4 in closed beta and it blows this game away by far..  frostbite 3 demolishes this arma crap engine hands down.  this engine is far worse than sub par.  someone should ban you for being a fan boy.  Bottom line is this..  Dayz SA is using an outdated engine and has the worst controls and fps issues ive ever seen.... regardless of the alpha excuse.  Smooth frames and solid controls are a must for this type of game.

Clearly a troll, or ignorant, the BF4 "beta" you likely played was a press beta, not a real beta, and it suffered from major performance issues, and even months after release, it has plenty of issues, but instead of fixing them, since it is all managed by EA, they will work on more DLC and premium content and then have BF5 out in a year which you have to pay another $90 for.

 

This is an ALPHA, REAL, ALPHA, that isn't even 2 months old, not your press beta that comes out to hype people up for release, which is essentially the final game(yes I know there is some differences even between a press beta and release, but facts are facts), FPS issues will be resolved, mouse control will be resolved, a lot of these issues you seem to have with the "engine", have been addressed by the developers already.

 

Now I am not some ignorant fool as to think miracles can be worked, however, do not use ArmA as a reference on what this game will be like come release, ArmA is a very open and heavily scripted game, it has a lot of extra cruft that doesn't exist in DayZ SA, and that is why I believe things CAN be made better.

 

Also, I don't see how you say this engine is outdated, if it is because it is using the Take On Helicopters engine as a base, which as far as I know, branched off from ArmA2, guess what ArmA3 branched off? one or the other.

When they were deciding what to use as a game engine, they went with the Take On Helicopters engine because ArmA3's branch was too unstable to work with at the time.

 

If you think it is outdated because they have used the same engine since the early days, then the same is said for BF4, don't be ignorant to think Frostbite 3 is not a modified Frostbite 2 etc, engines are rarely made from scratch, because they come with a massive development time overhead along with "stabilizing" and "expanding" the engines feature set, a mature engine is usually always better to work with as a base, even if you strip a large chunk out and rewrite it.

 

Now come release, or at least beta, if performance or controls(I have to assume you mean the mouse movement, I would like a 1:1 mouse ratio as most others do) are still an issue, then it becomes more appropriate to bitch about it.

Edit: Just want to clarify this part, I am not saying you don't bring issues up, the devs need to be made aware of issues, however flat out saying "it is this way because the engine is shit" is not productive.

 

This is why you don't compare a press beta to an actual alpha, heck, an actual beta and a press beta are different enough, this is a GOD DAMN ALPHA.

 

 

Terms:

Press Beta: A beta released as a marketing tool, it is essentially a demo for people to try out the game and drive pre-orders, and that is why you only got 1 map in BF4 beta.

 

Actual Beta: Usually betas are considered "content complete", as in, all the mechanics and art assets etc are in the game, and this is where the game starts being polished up towards release, there are always exceptions to this, as new mechanics and art assets could be added during beta, but the focus is usually on bug fixing and any balancing as required.

 

Alpha: This is where a lot of the game mechanics and artwork is not in the game yet, heck, some mechanics might not even be fully planned out yet, or existing ones could change, there is obviously still bug fixing going on, but since the actual code base(engine/game) is in flux, certain bugs will remain until that part of the games code base is stabilized, even if the devs attempt a band aid fix, it will just break later as the code is still being worked on, this is normal, this is natural, this is ALPHA.

Edited January 25, 2014 by Atomizer

[Solopopo 330]

The developers know what they are doing with the arma engine. They have been using it for a while, and the framework of the old game is still there for them to work with, which saves a lot of time.  They are modders after all, not really game developers. If they switched engines we wouldn't see DayZ till 2018 and it wouldn't even be recognizable. 

[svenbreakfast 231]

I dunno the ARMA engine is pretty amazing. You just have to be able to appreciate what it does that other engines could never aspire to. It's a simulator engine, not an FPS confection.

[sYs 133]

My best question is why SA is using RV3 engine instead of RV4 engine? In the long haul the RV4 engine would be better.  

[DeatHTaX 1217]

I'd be curious to see if the frostbite engine could handle this scope of a game.

[Nebulae3 422]

The Wall bug will be there in release version too - unless they get a new game engine, which I recommend; either Frostbite 3 that BF4 used, or Cryengine 3 that Star Citizen will use.

You don't have that low fps due to buildings in BF4 for example as you have in larger villages in Arma 3, and this standalone. 

 

http://www.crytek.com

http://www.frostbite.com

B)

 

Edited: I'm curious too, what are the main reasons to use this engine?

I'm following the topic too. 

Edited January 27, 2014 by Ori42

[zaphodity (DayZ) 41]

Part of the hilarity is that it was broken to begin with. That's what makes DayZ.

[Mdogg2005 447]

Well, thanks for the $30 I guess? Have fun in Battlefield.

Agreed.  Also he forgot to mention that BF4 is mostly unplayable and we paid 60$ for a game that released in a worst state than it's closed alpha and beta tests.  BF4 is a joke and I doubt there will be any significant changes in the game.  If they knew how to fix them, they would have by now.

 

Also, (to the person you quoted, not you) if you think that EA is really gonna let DICE hault development on future expansions and titles to fix BF4 you are gullible as hell.

[Nebulae3 422]

You also need to understand that the version of the RV engine you see in DayZ is FAR from the RV engine you see in the Arma games mate.

Its been rewritten, to fit a "mmo-architecture", so the clients cannot control anything anymore, basicly thats why we had to wait for the Alpha, until now :)

It has its problems atm, but its also a brand new branch of an old, tested and tryed, engine tbh, so let them find they're way.

They need to do some things with the engine now, thats never been done before, its "pionering" at its finest really.

What Dean and BI are trying to do with DayZ has never been done before.

An open world MMO-survival game, with tons of sandbox features and no restrictions pretty much, i would like to see anything that comes close to this and can look and function as good as DayZ does, in this extremly early state.

Sure we got games that look similar, but ive yet to see a game that has the same level of debth as DayZ, in such an early Alpha, because the game isnt actually a game yet, its just a giant stress test of the new architecture, they spend so much time working on.

Most of what has been done the past 6-12 months, are "under the hood" and not something you can see as a costumer really, but it is what will make the foundation of DayZ very strong.

Give them some months to get every little bit of the core engine in place, and im quite sure you will see the full potential of the RV engine, in this aspect.

And honestly, the RV engine is amazing, dating all the way back to the first Operation Flashpoint (2001). Its old and you can see it from time to time, but its been upgraded and worked on for so many years and its the ONLY engine in the world, that can do what it does, in term of simulations and calculations, not to mention the entire scripting side of the engine aswell. (Which will be shutdown for DayZ, but still)

BI are trying to turn the RV engine into something it has never been before and theya re actually doing one hell of a job, DayZ is running SO MUCH BETTER then Arma 2 or Arma 3 ever did a month into the alpha development tbh.

 

 

God, this is so funny when it is sad "MMO" "MMO". There is nothing MMO in this game and it's engine is nothing like MMO. MMO means MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE and normally MMO handls about 2000 to 4000 players. This RV junk barely handles 40 players and due to the fact that they have 1 PC running zombie spawns and loot spawns now this game is so EMPTY. They removed everything from the game, even DayZ mod looks better now.

 

I also bought Radeon R9 290 specifically for this game and you know how many fps do I get on Novoselki and new Cherno? 25! TWENTY FIVE FRAMES PER SECOND I get with the top Radeon R9 290 card with a i7 4770k overclocked to 4.4 Ghz and an SSD installation.

 

There is nothing could be done to fix this game. Even if someone launches it in 5 years hardware it will still work the same way.

 

Also, Cryengine which was already mentioned here could do all this stuff - big areas, lot's of trees and vegetation, object spawns and it also already includes physics and network code which does not have to be redone. It can handle lots of players on the same server due to the proper utilisation of CPU because if Cryengine sees that there are CPU cores which could be used it uses them. When RV sees that there are CPU cores could be used it ignores them.

 

Bohemia should wake up - we have 16 to 32 cores processors here and PC hardware stagnating with the per core performance. There is no way you can optimize something that bad. IT has to be redone from scratch or on a good engine basis which ACTUALLY USES PC RESOURCES AND NOT IGNORES THEM.

 

qft.

I agree, don't call this an mmo with an maximum of 40 players on each server on this huge map.

About hardware; if you can't run games like star citizen get a new pc.

I would rather have some 'few' official quality servers compare to 'some' kids/admins abusing god mode on private servers.

They also need to increase the requirement on hardware to even run a server.

The quality is really bad sometimes with slow responds from the server - when you eat, aim doing something with your character in-game.

Edited January 27, 2014 by Ori42

[Mdogg2005 447]

Wow it's almost as if the game was a work in progress and in alpha stage... If only there was some warning that told us about this before we bought it or even every time we launched the game... hmm.....

[djporternz 644]

The quality is really bad sometimes with slow responds from the server - when you eat, aim doing something with your character in-game.

To be fair, this is related to the vaguaries of the internet. Even BI can't fix the internet!

[djporternz 644]

Wow it's almost as if the game was a work in progress and in alpha stage... If only there was some warning that told us about this before we bought it or even every time we launched the game... hmm.....

Maybe they could put something on Steam... Big letters... Maybe a blue background or something... Right at the top... say... so it couldn't be missed.

 

And maybe the devs could come out and say something about 'Not buying the game right now' or something...

 

Just a thought!

Edited January 27, 2014 by DJPorterNZ

[drchzburgrz 2]

.

 

I also bought Radeon R9 290 specifically for this game and you know how many fps do I get on Novoselki and new Cherno? 25! TWENTY FIVE FRAMES PER SECOND I get with the top Radeon R9 290 card with a i7 4770k overclocked to 4.4 Ghz and an SSD installation.

 

 

i highly doubt this claim, I max it out with everything very high at 1080p with a r9 270x with a 4 core amd processor average 40-60 fps

Edited January 27, 2014 by drchzburgrz

[Mdogg2005 447]

Maybe they could put something on Steam... Big letters... Maybe a blue background or something... Right at the top... say... so it couldn't be missed.

 

And maybe the devs could come out and say something about 'Not buying the game right now' or something...

 

Just a thought!

That would hurt sales.  Who would buy a game that even the creator says not to? ;)

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

Honestly, what was the reasoning behind choosing to base this game off the ARMA engine?

I know that's where it began from the mod, but for the standalone, I thought it would have been a much better idea to start fresh? Rather then trying to work from something that seems so broken to begin with...

I mean, you can't polish a turd...

Have you ever used a theremin?

 

A theremin for the outsider is a frustratingly convoluted electronic  musical instrument that is played without touching it. For an experienced player,  it's an unique instrument that can produce beautiful, eerie sounds and play unlike any other.

 

How does that relate to engine choice? Think.

[Nebulae3 422]

To be fair, this is related to the vaguaries of the internet. Even BI can't fix the internet!

 

No, it's not internet issues; it's about bandwidth and quality hardware related

to host a server. And, of course, it's alpha, so they can optimize the software.

[v3c1c 86]

Well back then when idea about Dayz SA poped up no one expected that so many copies will be sold and this is not the end. So decision was - ok let's make it on same engine what made Dayz so popular.

And it will be much cheaper in case if Dayz sale will not go as planed

 

Fact is - even more polished and with lots of new stuf it is still the same RV engine. And it does not mattar how hard Rocket and BIS will try DayZ Standalone will never ever be more than late ALPHA or early BETA

shoot me in leg if I am wrong - but I can guaranty that Dayz will not be in BETA in 2014. and never will be realy finished 

 

And I can BET all engines out there can support same huge map as RV can - only diference is AI calculations. In Arma series very "smart" AI is needed but in Dayz AI (zeds) should be dumb as fuc#@ 

 

I hope I am wrong 

[Mos1ey 6301]

Well back then when idea about Dayz SA poped up no one expected that so many copies will be sold and this is not the end. So decision was - ok let's make it on same engine what made Dayz so popular.

And it will be much cheaper in case if Dayz sale will not go as planed

 

Fact is - even more polished and with lots of new stuf it is still the same RV engine. And it does not mattar how hard Rocket and BIS will try DayZ Standalone will never ever be more than late ALPHA or early BETA

shoot me in leg if I am wrong - but I can guaranty that Dayz will not be in BETA in 2014. and never will be realy finished 

 

And I can BET all engines out there can support same huge map as RV can - only diference is AI calculations. In Arma series very "smart" AI is needed but in Dayz AI (zeds) should be dumb as fuc#@ 

 

I hope I am wrong 

 

Yes, you are a little bit wrong.

 

AI in ArmA is horrible, it's an absolute pain in the arse. What does make ArmA good are things like weapon ballistics and how player skeletons work. Name one other game where your bullets actually spawn in the barrel of your weapon, not just the centre of your screen.

 

There are a lot of reasons why Dean chose ArmA as his base for the mod, he didn't just jump into it blindly.

Edited January 28, 2014 by Mos1ey