Replace M107/AS50 with less effective russian equivalent

[Fun With Flares 72]

Pros:

One shot, then reload means you can't go "Oh shit, I didn't line it up right, better put the whole clip downrange".

Huge-ass bullet means it still works on vehicles.

Cons:

Looks stupid

Freaking massive, good luck hiding with one

Looks really stupid

[enforcer1975 1111]

You people always seem to forget that civil war with NATO interference happened in Chernarus, apparently not long before the outbreak.. thus making american/british rifles perfectly fitting for the milieu.

Some dude said in this forum that the brits were never in Chernarus.

Here is what the homepage says.

In 2009 the fictional post-soviet country of Chernarus is ravaged by civil war. For two crippling years, conflict has raged...

Players explore this volatile world with Force Recon Razor Team , part of a US Marine Corps Expeditionary Unit. The 27th MEU are deployed to Northern Chernarus on a peacekeeping mission with a mandate to prevent further civilian casualties and promote political stability.

ARMA 2 is based on the latest generation technology. It offers a uniquely vast game world, authentic and extremely detailed modern units, weapons, vehicles and environments. The branching, player-driven campaign can be played solo, or cooperatively and is accompanied by a huge range of single and multiplayer game modes.

Nothing about the brits.

Two months after the Allied military victory in Takistan, the new government is restoring the war-torn country. NATO forces assisting in this effort face the threat of insurgency, waged by the remnants of the defeated Takistani army in the mountaineous regions of Takistan. Company team of British paratroopers patrolling the treacherous mountains in Zargabad's vicinity is ordered to battle the amassing guerilla warriors

Here they are and guess where Takistan is?

One year after British and coalition armed forces successfully quelled the insurgent uprising in Takistan, the NATO Green Sea deployment is in the process of a strategic drawdown of combat troops in the region. Private military contractors shoulder the burden of the increased workload, with competition rising between the multinational organisations for lucrative security contracts. Private Military Company, ION, Inc. (formerly Black Element), successfully bid for a contract - codenamed Black Gauntlet - to provide security for a UN investigation team as they seek to piece together information regarding Takistan's abandoned nuclear weapons programme.

Civil war in Bystrica is at its end. But it’s not the end of fear for the people. War criminals like Colonel Miyovic still terrorize the country with their militia looting and murdering civilians. Forces of the Czech Republic Army are sent to restore order.

After restoring some order in Takistan; Allied forces were able to send in a small number of provisional reconstruction teams. Unfortunately local insurgents are still planning operations to damage the reconstruction process. However Czech forces are operating in the area and that should help change the status quo.

PMCs were also never a part of the Chernarus campaign as well as the Czechs...

Edited February 21, 2013 by Enforcer

[Chris529 380]

True, but what units even use AS50s? I can't find much information on it.

Also, the AS50 is ridiculously overpowered. They need to make it do about the same damage as the M107, there's no good explanation for why it does FIVE times as much damage per shot. Really ticks me off...

lol was just thinking that myself just because it's nato doesn't mean there's gonna be a crapload of them. I would say most AT squads would use rocket launchers of some kind

also someone keeps mentioning the apparent in-built range finder on the KSVK, do they mean the scope itself or an actual distance measurement displayed inside the scope? I think an SVD does that but idk about KSVK

Edited February 22, 2013 by Chris529

[Majo (DayZ) 0]

make AS50 and M107 super and I mean super-uber rare, and add SAM launcher, also super rare, done

[HERBERT-THETREE 44]

lol was just thinking that myself just because it's nato doesn't mean there's gonna be a crapload of them. I would say most AT squads would use rocket launchers of some kind

also someone keeps mentioning the apparent in-built range finder on the KSVK, do they mean the scope itself or an actual distance measurement displayed inside the scope? I think an SVD does that but idk about KSVK

True, but what units even use AS50s? I can't find much information on it.

Also, the AS50 is ridiculously overpowered. They need to make it do about the same damage as the M107, there's no good explanation for why it does FIVE times as much damage per shot. Really ticks me off...

The as50 was originaly designed for US seal teams to use as a portable anti vehicle weapon. Considering what it is, its actually fairly light. Its meant to be carried in just a couple of pieces by 1-2 men and then assembled in the field when necessary but assembly is said to take less than a minute with 1 or 2 small tools.

Yes it is overpowered for a game but arma wanted it to mimic its real world counterpart. which is very powerful with almost no drawbacks.

the scope of the ksvk is a pso scope just like the svd. theyre great if you know how to use them.

Edit: http://en.wikipedia....ernational_AS50

I tried finding more but just about everything is fucking video game shit..... <_< irony

Edited February 22, 2013 by HERBERT-THETREE

[Chris529 380]

make AS50 and M107 super and I mean super-uber rare, and add SAM launcher, also super rare, done

rarity doesn't do anything since people still have their current ones and they can dupe them anyway

[trichome (DayZ) 198]

rarity doesn't do anything since people still have their current ones and they can dupe them anyway

And thats where Private Hives can prevent that and keep them in check as we do.

We've had our Namalsk server up now for about 6mths and in that time I've found 1 AS50, 3 M107s and 2 KSVK's and lost them all again :P bar the AS50 which I currently have in my inventory. We have all guns in the game spawning and there's no duping on our server and theres not tons of them all over the place it's fairly balanced between non 50's and 50's.

[aleksiuski@gmail.com 58]

Remove M107 and AS50, bring in KVSK and make it occupy backpack slot. Thisway you have to choose; super awesum firepower with no backpack or not so awesum sniper-rifle and backpack.

[Jeremiah Cross 55]

My vote would be to replace the M107 and AS50 with something more along the line of a Dragunov and an SKS (which, yes, can make a pretty dang good sniper rifle), For an anti-vehicle weapon, why not just add RPG's and maybe a rare (1 per server?) Anti-Aircraft launcher, like a 9K38 Ilga (an infrared homing SAM made in Russia.). Hell you could still use launchers to take out other players, and if they keep the buildings destructible in SA, you could laugh as the bambis run for cover only to die anyway. Of course the missiles for launchers would need to be more like Crossbow bolts are now, probably even taking up 2 or 3 slots.

[enforcer1975 1111]

And thats where Private Hives can prevent that and keep them in check as we do.

We've had our Namalsk server up now for about 6mths and in that time I've found 1 AS50, 3 M107s and 2 KSVK's and lost them all again :P bar the AS50 which I currently have in my inventory. We have all guns in the game spawning and there's no duping on our server and theres not tons of them all over the place it's fairly balanced between non 50's and 50's.

And that is still too much considering there are a lot of players who could have found half the amount in six months on the same server, too. You can never cover the whole island and you never know how much of those spawn unless you have a spawn statistic somewhere showing otherwise.

The as50 was originaly designed for US seal teams to use as a portable anti vehicle weapon.

And that's where a portable rocket launcher comes in play because it's more effective than a single bullet if the chances to encounter a light armored vehicle are minimum, why waste a magazine on a vehicle when you can waste the gunner with one shot...imo the big snipers are too hyperized as the universal weapon for every need in games and are always wielded around. Those rifles are no longer anti material rifles anymore and nobody is hiding that fact...

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

A term that I don't really agree with in this case is "overpowered". A .50 BMG should be powerful. It's the simplicity of use that makes it so ridiculous.

Ideally, (and realistically) an AMR would need a bipod to be used accurately.

That one change should cut a fair bit of "OPness" right out.

I've said before, weapon handling makes very little sense (I think Gews has similar thoughts on the subject). Hopefully SA can address some issues.

I don't want these weapons removed, but they should be rare. WAAAAAY rarer than anything we've seen so far.

Their Eastern Bloc cousins should be added to provide more authenticity and variety, but I don't see the benefit in reducing the variety of weapons in-game.

Edited February 22, 2013 by Chabowski

[attorney1977 311]

True, but what units even use AS50s? I can't find much information on it.

Also, the AS50 is ridiculously overpowered. They need to make it do about the same damage as the M107, there's no good explanation for why it does FIVE times as much damage per shot. Really ticks me off...

I asked this question on the Arma 2 forums and got the reply that the bullets the AS-50 uses are specifically anti-materiel (to penetrate engine blocks etc) as opposed to the garden-variety .50 BMG used by the M107.

I think it needs to be like this in Arma to work with the vehicle penetration system they have in place.

It doesn't make much sense in the world of DayZ though I agree. Either would rip through a human like a hot sword through cheap margarine.

Agree as well that the guns are fine and having a 50 cal in game is okay, as long as the downsides are represented. At the moment, these guns have all the pros, but none of the cons.

I know some guy posted a video of a soldier firing one standing up, but the guy looked like he was breaking his back.

Cons suggested:

• Heavy
  
• More space in inventory
  
• Possibly can only sight it up when crouched/prone or deployed bipod)
  
• Poss make it a choice between carrying backpack or a 50 cal.
  
• Can't reload on the move.
  
• Maybe new anims for carrying the thing while moving.
  

Obv it's a lot of work and depends on if there's a stamina system and how the new inventory system works.

Edited February 22, 2013 by Horde

[nobody 31]

It's almost same

Edited February 22, 2013 by Ladas325

[enforcer1975 1111]

I asked this question on the Arma 2 forums and got the reply that the bullets the AS-50 uses are specifically anti-materiel (to penetrate engine blocks etc) as opposed to the garden-variety .50 BMG used by the M107.

I think it needs to be like this in Arma to work with the vehicle penetration system they have in place.

ArmA vanilla doesn't have such a system in place. It works on hitpoints - so basically you can even disable the tracks of an armored vehicle provided you have the time and amount of ammo. A group of players on the same side as we were who were jealous of our group having captured a Bradley before thy could in Wasteland shot my left track to force us to come out, it was undamaged and became light orange due to the gunfire...really great if you consider the game having a simulation background and the old LibMod beeing able to simulate armor penetration ( either it penetrated and did or didn't do damage depending on the hit location or it didn't penetrate at all causing no damage ) although it was a fan made mod...at least you can shoot other players who think that two car doors can save them from a .30 cal bullet.

[attorney1977 311]

I know, I should have just said hitpoints instead of "vehicle penetration system".

I remember when you used to be able to blow up a T-72 with a Makarov (provided you put enough ammo in it).

[thesodesa 99]

The military grade scoped rifles have been removed in the latest community patch 1.7.6.

[lipemr 160]

Remove M107's and AS50's, add M99 single shot having the same damage as the AS50 to fulfill the anti-vehicle purposes.

The army wouldnt bring anti material sniper rifles to civil war operations.

All people that are against removing these misplaced semi-auto AM rifles from dayZ are whiny kids who cant kill people with proper weapons. Anti material rifles arent supposed to be used against personell in any way.

[-Gews- 7443]

The military grade scoped rifles have been removed in the latest community patch 1.7.6.

W-w-w-what?

Do you mean the two controversial rifles with over 10,000 ft-lbs of muzzle energy, or all scoped rifles save the CZ 550?

The first I don't mind, the second would be a major *cough* fuckup. Too lazy to look it up since I'm on a mobile device from 2008 and everything takes ten times as long.

[HERBERT-THETREE 44]

And that's where a portable rocket launcher comes in play because it's more effective than a single bullet if the chances to encounter a light armored vehicle are minimum, why waste a magazine on a vehicle when you can waste the gunner with one shot...imo the big snipers are too hyperized as the universal weapon for every need in games and are always wielded around. Those rifles are no longer anti material rifles anymore and nobody is hiding that fact...

That whole post was about the real version of the as50 not the ingame one. one bullet from an as50 would be enough to stop a light armored vehicle because the bullet punches through the armor and bounces around inside killing the occupants. This is not true in the game of course but like i said that post had very little to do with the in game weapon.

[-Gews- 7443]

Speaking of rocket launchers, why don't we ever see any RPG-7Vs or newer versions? Don't tell me they're not common, far more common in real life than those silly AS50s... and with the OG-7 warhead they're very deadly anti-personnel / anti-chopper weapons too.

[enforcer1975 1111]

That whole post was about the real version of the as50 not the ingame one. one bullet from an as50 would be enough to stop a light armored vehicle because the bullet punches through the armor and bounces around inside killing the occupants. This is not true in the game of course but like i said that post had very little to do with the in game weapon.

That isn't a rubber bullet...and if you hit the right place...then maybe. In the game you can kill the passengers of light armored vehicles with a .50 if you aim at the right place of course. It was quite entertaining to watch the AI trying to replace the driver one after another just to keep their vehicle moving...

Speaking of rocket launchers, why don't we ever see any RPG-7Vs or newer versions? Don't tell me they're not common, far more common in real life than those silly AS50s... and with the OG-7 warhead they're very deadly anti-personnel / anti-chopper weapons too.

Maybe because the devs are western gun fanboys...?

Edited February 22, 2013 by Enforcer

[Clumzy (DayZ) 377]

Every gun is built without a scope

There are several guns with built-in scopes.

[HERBERT-THETREE 44]

That isn't a rubber bullet...and if you hit the right place...then maybe. In the game you can kill the passengers of light armored vehicles with a .50 if you aim at the right place of course. It was quite entertaining to watch the AI trying to replace the driver one after another just to keep their vehicle moving...

Armor peircing rounds have enough power to penetrate armor but only once, because of that the bullet can go through the first layer to get to the interior of the vehicle but it doestnt have the power to penetrate a second layer. once inside the bullet will most likely (not deffinetly) ricochet around the interior of the vehicle untill someting manages to stop it. Rubber bullets wouldnt even scratch a light armored vehicle. I have not tried it in arma.

[enforcer1975 1111]

Armor peircing rounds have enough power to penetrate armor but only once, because of that the bullet can go through the first layer to get to the interior of the vehicle but it doestnt have the power to penetrate a second layer. once inside the bullet will most likely (not deffinetly) ricochet around the interior of the vehicle untill someting manages to stop it. Rubber bullets wouldnt even scratch a light armored vehicle. I have not tried it in arma.

That's what i was referring to, that bullet won't bounce around like a rubber bullet inside a vehicle until it hits something that stops it because if it doesn't hit anything that's it. Of course it can come back almost the same way it came in, too but i doubt it will bounce around cartoon style like you were picturing it.

Edited February 22, 2013 by Enforcer

[-Gews- 7443]

I doubt one shot from a .50 would take out an armoured vehicle, especially since most armoured vehicles nowadays are able to stop .50 calibre rounds.

Anyways, reviewing my stance, I want the AS50 out of the game, pronto. Stick it on the ban list... I'm fine with the M107 but the AS50 has to go.