DayZ Build 1.6.0 Rolling Update

[carcer 8]

Well YOU might find attachment in making decisions that you can change on a whim' date=' but a decision that I can't change is something that will always be more important to me then something I can go, "Well I can just change it later if I dont' like it."

As for the prejudice thing. So wanting a player to play as the gender they associate with is prejudiced? If you honestly believe that please see my previous statement about you and your insistence on bringing it up.

[/quote']

Are you honestly telling me that the choice you just had to make about whether or not to play a male or female character will make the game mean more to you for the rest of time? That you didn't just go "welp, I'm male" and settle to continuing to play a succession of male characters the same way you were already doing? For the overwhelming majority of people that decision was a meaningless no-brainer. For a small group of people the decision actually detracts from the experience instead of making it more meaningful, for the reasons I described above; and it's not like I am suggesting that a character should be able to change gender on the fly, like you can do with faces. You'd still have to DIE. That's not "on a whim". If you've spent a while with that character and grown attached to them, isn't feeling like playing a character of a different gender but knowing you'll lose your progress and your stuff more of this bullshit "anti-game hard choice" than not caring because you know you can never change it anyway?

Look at it this way - the single decision will, for most people, be a meaningless no-brainer once, for a handful (which apparently you are part of) be a legitimately engaging hard choice once, and for the rest be a hard choice that just makes them care less for the rest of the game. The other option, choosing the gender of each character when they are created, is again meaningless to most, another useless flippy thing for your handful and for the rest something which will make them care more about each character. The hard choices should be in the playing of the game, not the setting it up; they should not be arbitrary but emergent. I can understand your argument but I feel it is wrong and the decision as it stands only detracts from the stated goal of the game, not reinforces it.

I explained why there's prejudice in it. You can keep ignoring that explanation if you want but it doesn't change the fact that it's there or that there certainly have been many prejudiced things said people in this thread; do you want me to just say sexism, instead? Transphobia? Misogyny? Is your problem specifically with the word, "prejudice", which has some alternative meaning to you where it does not encompass those things? Getting all antsy about men pretending to be women is prejudice, and it needs to be challenged. I am not trying to shock you but make people think, myself.

[Africanized Bees 5]

The More i think about it. The more i feel that Rocket is not going to achieve what hes trying to do. No matter how you look at it this mod will always be just a game. So people act like that as well as if its just a game. Hence why people just dont care about survivors or bandits. Theres less and less groups forming because there is no goal about being good or bad just survival.

The feeling you had when you saw a player and shouting in chat FRIENDLY OR NOT ? Is just gone. I didnt have that sort of feeling in a long time with a game since this mod. And thats gone now since the 1.6.0.1 patch.

The best thing to do now. Is completely remove all weapons you start with. Make it harder to find weapons. So that people will have to team up again. Being a loner in a post apocalyptic world is just not real as far as i know.

I kind of agree people should start with no weapon. prone carwl and fear the zombies! Only issue is jerks that find weapons killing the folk with no weapons. Doh. back to square one.

[The Killing Joke 43]

I chose to play as a girl for the express reason that I believe she will be trusted more than her male counterparts. Thus, people will want to group with her more, and thus, she will be more trustworthy. She will then shoot people in the back of the head, when they least expect it.

Good girl.

[carcer 8]

Wow quite a read here.

I wanted to try out the female model purely to see what issues were associated with it from a technical standpoint (I mean' date=' this is Alpha after all folks!). About halfway through i realized somehow the players were going to have to select it. I also realized that selection is a complex process, that places some demand on the database. So I very quickly put a basic dialog together and slapped it in the middle of the authorization process. This is neither a neat or elegant solution, and as such, I didn't want people changing their minds all the time and further overloading a system that is already near capacity most of the time.

So please, every second post seems to be putting words or thoughts in my mouth and saying "clearly rocket thinks this", or "he intends to do this".

Quite simply, I wanted my little sister to be able to play DayZ, and I don't think my sister is alone in wanting to play DayZ. She wanted to be able to play as a girl. There are a bunch of cool effects and interesting data that may come out of it, but don't read too much into the implementation I made.

I was surprised to hear that people want to play as a girl or a guy differently each time, because there is only a visual difference and I figured that not many people would really be interested in it. I certainly didn't expect it to spawn an entire discourse on sexuality in gaming, but now that it's here - sure why not. It's an interesting topic to explore because no studio wants to be caught dead dealing with this.

[/quote']

That helps clear things up a lot. I still think you've occassionally said things which need challenging but we seemed to argue ourselves into a consensus that the locked choice was your thought-through decision for the game as opposed to a quick implementation that might be subject to change. With that in mind, everyone, can we go back to arguing the options based on their actual merits?

why do I get MORE verbose when I am tired this is ridiculous

[krappadizzle 0]

I chose to play as a girl for the express reason that I believe she will be trusted more than her male counterparts. Thus' date=' people will want to group with her more, and thus, she will be more trustworthy. She will then shoot people in the back of the head, when they least expect it.

Good girl.

[/quote']

A girl who's a dick. Makes sense.

[Africanized Bees 5]

I chose to play as a girl for the express reason that I believe she will be trusted more than her male counterparts. Thus' date=' people will want to group with her more, and thus, she will be more trustworthy. She will then shoot people in the back of the head, when they least expect it.

Good girl.

[/quote']

Until Direct Chat is fixed, and then people hear your burly voice. I guarantee once voice is back in people will shoot on sight those who do not respond to friend or foe or whatever else.. I hope everyone owns a mic.

[Lupo 0]

Well YOU might find attachment in making decisions that you can change on a whim' date=' but a decision that I can't change is something that will always be more important to me then something I can go, "Well I can just change it later if I dont' like it."

As for the prejudice thing. So wanting a player to play as the gender they associate with is prejudiced? If you honestly believe that please see my previous statement about you and your insistence on bringing it up.

[/quote']

Are you honestly telling me that the choice you just had to make about whether or not to play a male or female character will make the game mean more to you for the rest of time? That you didn't just go "welp, I'm male" and settle to continuing to play a succession of male characters the same way you were already doing? For the overwhelming majority of people that decision was a meaningless no-brainer. For a small group of people the decision actually detracts from the experience instead of making it more meaningful, for the reasons I described above; and it's not like I am suggesting that a character should be able to change gender on the fly, like you can do with faces. You'd still have to DIE. That's not "on a whim". If you've spent a while with that character and grown attached to them, isn't feeling like playing a character of a different gender but knowing you'll lose your progress and your stuff more of this bullshit "anti-game hard choice" than not caring because you know you can never change it anyway?

Look at it this way - the single decision will, for most people, be a meaningless no-brainer once, for a handful (which apparently you are part of) be a legitimately engaging hard choice once, and for the rest be a hard choice that just makes them care less for the rest of the game. The other option, choosing the gender of each character when they are created, is again meaningless to most, another useless flippy thing for your handful and for the rest something which will make them care more about each character. The hard choices should be in the playing of the game, not the setting it up; they should not be arbitrary but emergent. I can understand your argument but I feel it is wrong and the decision as it stands only detracts from the stated goal of the game, not reinforces it.

I explained why there's prejudice in it. You can keep ignoring that explanation if you want but it doesn't change the fact that it's there or that there certainly have been many prejudiced things said people in this thread; do you want me to just say sexism, instead? Transphobia? Misogyny? Is your problem specifically with the word, "prejudice", which has some alternative meaning to you where it does not encompass those things? Getting all antsy about men pretending to be women is prejudice, and it needs to be challenged. I am not trying to shock you but make people think, myself.

Not trying to be a dick but it really does seem like you want someone from the Dev team to respond to this idea so...I put a link here that'll take you to the suggestion thread. I mean your arguing pretty strongly for this topic you might as well do it where it may be heard :D

Here you go http://dayzmod.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=7

[partybooper 2]

Well YOU might find attachment in making decisions that you can change on a whim' date=' but a decision that I can't change is something that will always be more important to me then something I can go, "Well I can just change it later if I dont' like it."[/quote']

I feel the same as Carcer though. And I'd support the "select your character's gender once per life" idea.

I'm in the "pro variety" club. Long term entertainment is what ties me to a game. DayZ is a game. Don't tell me it isn't. It's not conventional, but it's still a game, and a damn good one (minus the obvious bugs).

I wouldn't have bought ArmA 2 when there was a shooting exercise in the very beginning which would rate you and give you the choice of only a small set of weapons and a rank, tied to your cd key, and for example you could never switch from a regular rifleman to a marksman, from a Private to Colonel or vice versa. I want to try everything, whenever I want. If the game has something to offer but doesn't let for reasons I haven't been told, I'll question those reasons and get bored because I can't change my experience anymore.

If DayZ would ask you which color the T-Shirt has you are currently wearing and you'd pick red, would you like the idea to never be able to switch to an olive colored Shirt afterwards? Never ever? I'd care. And I wouldn't like it.

[belgarionnl 22]

so like the new outfits and female skin! nice addition to the female base that would prefer playing as a female!

any ETA on the vehicles being fixed?

[partybooper 2]

About halfway through i realized somehow the players were going to have to select it. I also realized that selection is a complex process' date=' that places some demand on the database. So I very quickly put a basic dialog together and slapped it in the middle of the authorization process.[/quote']

Thanks for clearing that up. This is a reason I fully understand, quick and dirty implementations are the only way to get a quick glimpse if and how something could be working.

So I got hopes that the one time only selection isn't a feature set in stone for the final version.

[The Killing Joke 43]

Until Direct Chat is fixed' date=' and then people hear your burly voice. I guarantee once voice is back in people will shoot on sight those who do not respond to friend or foe or whatever else.. I hope everyone owns a mic.[/quote']

As do I. What I hope as well, is that not everybody owns the voice changing software I do. (For the record, I DO have a deep, burly voice. The software that I've used in the past covers that up nicely. It seems to work better when I use a European accent, however.)

;)

[jonryan32@gmail.com 2]

Well Rocket I did say you were welcome to come in and tell me I'm dead wrong as it was simply my interpretation of things you said :P

Well YOU might find attachment in making decisions that you can change on a whim' date=' but a decision that I can't change is something that will always be more important to me then something I can go, "Well I can just change it later if I dont' like it."

As for the prejudice thing. So wanting a player to play as the gender they associate with is prejudiced? If you honestly believe that please see my previous statement about you and your insistence on bringing it up.

[/quote']

Are you honestly telling me that the choice you just had to make about whether or not to play a male or female character will make the game mean more to you for the rest of time?

No but I am honestly telling you that a decision that can be changed at any time will never hold as much weight to me as a decision that cannot be.

Look at it this way - the single decision will, for most people, be a meaningless no-brainer once, for a handful (which apparently you are part of) be a legitimately engaging hard choice once, and for the rest be a hard choice that just makes them care less for the rest of the game. The other option, choosing the gender of each character when they are created, is again meaningless to most, another useless flippy thing for your handful and for the rest something which will make them care more about each character. The hard choices should be in the playing of the game, not the setting it up; they should not be arbitrary but emergent. I can understand your argument but I feel it is wrong and the decision as it stands only detracts from the stated goal of the game, not reinforces it.

I can respect that, but whether or not it's removed later technically it has reinforced the stated goal. We're sitting here having a rather in depth discussion about this feature are we not? Haha

I explained why there's prejudice in it. You can keep ignoring that explanation if you want but it doesn't change the fact that it's there or that there certainly have been many prejudiced things said people in this thread; do you want me to just say sexism, instead? Transphobia? Misogyny? Is your problem specifically with the word, "prejudice", which has some alternative meaning to you where it does not encompass those things? Getting all antsy about men pretending to be women is prejudice, and it needs to be challenged. I am not trying to shock you but make people think, myself.

So because some users have come in here and made prejudiced statements, Rocket is prejudice for having put in a system where you can only choose your gender once(which we now know was just a limitation he met)? That's still not sound logic.

[InterKnight 0]

Meow.

[montauk 2]

so like the new outfits and female skin! nice addition to the female base that would prefer playing as a female!

any ETA on the vehicles being fixed?

Indeed it is!

Now when are the FPS problems going away?

[carcer 8]

Well Rocket I did say you were welcome to come in and tell me I'm dead wrong as it was simply my interpretation of things you said :P

Well YOU might find attachment in making decisions that you can change on a whim' date=' but a decision that I can't change is something that will always be more important to me then something I can go, "Well I can just change it later if I dont' like it."

As for the prejudice thing. So wanting a player to play as the gender they associate with is prejudiced? If you honestly believe that please see my previous statement about you and your insistence on bringing it up.

No but I am honestly telling you that a decision that can be changed at any time will never hold as much weight to me as a decision that cannot be.

I can respect that, but whether or not it's removed later technically it has reinforced the stated goal. We're sitting here having a rather in depth discussion about this feature are we not? Haha

So because some users have come in here and made prejudiced statements, Rocket is prejudice for having put in a system where you can only choose your gender once(which we now know was just a limitation he met)? That's still not sound logic.

I think the key point here is that it's not something that can be changed at ANY time. You only get the choice once per character, and you have to die if you want to change it. From your perspective, assuming you have spent time on a character and do not wish to die and lose your stuff, that's a fixed point; you can't change it without fucking up or giving up, neither of which we assume you intend to do. From mine, getting to make the choice makes me feel more invested in the character because I have been given greater grounds to define them within, and so I care more about what happens to that character.

Regarding our neverending prejudice debate, well, rocket told someone who asked if it could be not-permanent choice to go back to WoW and then encouraged others to stick to their own gender, so I don't think my interpretation was entirely a random stab in the dark (but I do concede I was less charitable than I ought to have been because I saw his comments in the context of some of the other more definitely questionable things said by other posters). In fairness, I did say prejudice or misplaced optimism; of course, the secret third option that we all forgot existed, that it was just quick thing he didn't put much thought into and he has a sense of humour, turned out to win the prize today. Oh well! Such is life.

At any rate I think I've said pretty much all there is to say about these things from my perspective.

[Mycaelis 12]

I must say, I'm suprised that this Male / Female character choice has created such a flurry of opinion. I've selected to play as a female (even though I'm male) and it's not that bigger deal for me whether I play as either, or if I cannot change it again.. Only issue so far, is the fact that the female characters breathing is quite loud when she's tired...

[billw 1]

Regarding our neverending prejudice debate' date=' well, rocket told someone who asked if it could be not-permanent choice to go back to WoW and then encouraged others to stick to their own gender, so I don't think my interpretation was entirely a random stab in the dark (but I do concede I was less charitable than I ought to have been because I saw his comments in the context of some of the other more definitely questionable things said by other posters). In fairness, I did say prejudice [b']or misplaced optimism; of course, the secret third option that we all forgot existed, that it was just quick thing he didn't put much thought into and he has a sense of humour, turned out to win the prize today. Oh well! Such is life.

At any rate I think I've said pretty much all there is to say about these things from my perspective.

Obviously this is a moot point from the DayZ point of view as the reasoning (or lack of) has already been explained.

What I don't get is how not being able to select gender more than once equates to prejudice? Who is the prejudice against other that people who want to change their characters gender more than once? In this case life itself is prejudiced by making people be born male or female, sex change operations not withstanding. Possible new game mechanic: if you can find a scalpel and morphine you should be able to perform an in game sex change op.

[Katana67 2907]

Wow quite a read here.

I wanted to try out the female model purely to see what issues were associated with it from a technical standpoint (I mean' date=' this is Alpha after all folks!). About halfway through i realized somehow the players were going to have to select it. I also realized that selection is a complex process, that places some demand on the database. So I very quickly put a basic dialog together and slapped it in the middle of the authorization process. This is neither a neat or elegant solution, and as such, I didn't want people changing their minds all the time and further overloading a system that is already near capacity most of the time.

So please, every second post seems to be putting words or thoughts in my mouth and saying "clearly rocket thinks this", or "he intends to do this".

Quite simply, I wanted my little sister to be able to play DayZ, and I don't think my sister is alone in wanting to play DayZ. She wanted to be able to play as a girl. There are a bunch of cool effects and interesting data that may come out of it, but don't read too much into the implementation I made.

I was surprised to hear that people want to play as a girl or a guy differently each time, because there is only a visual difference and I figured that not many people would really be interested in it. I certainly didn't expect it to spawn an entire discourse on sexuality in gaming, but now that it's here - sure why not. It's an interesting topic to explore because no studio wants to be caught dead dealing with this.

[/quote']

People will always read into stuff that shouldn't be read into... and overreact. They still believe that a choice can be undone by reloading a previous save, or at least, adopt this mindset. (Thus causing others to have to explain things, so don't call me a hypocrite for having to respond to others who have over-read into a simple mechanic)

If you want to be a chick and are a dude, go for it. That choice is yours and making it a permanent one is a great thing. Likewise, I really encourage people having some manner of choice who identify with females... you know... like females.

Consider this, people, there was no choice before... now there is one. You're upset over being given more freedom, by compounding it with... it's not free enough. Well, I hate to break it to you, total freedom went out the door when we started banding together in units called "families". But Rousseauian freedom is neither here nor there. Considering the insane amount of freedom we have in Day Z with regards to gameplay... I think you'll live. Point being, this is clearly just a mechanic intended to have a player reflect his/her gender in game.

It's not meant to endorse gender-swapping for the hell of it, to make some grand sociological statistic on how females are more/less of a threat, or even RP. As I understand it, from the way Rocket has phrased it before... it's primarily for WOMEN who want to play as WOMEN. If you're a dude and you want to play as a woman, that option is there... but it is one with consequences... and thus has actual meaning.

I really disagree with the "go back to WoW if you want that" dismissal of certain mechanics that are -somewhat- forgiving, as it disregards the validity of those mechanics and discourages people to work with them to make it fit into the mod naturally. This mechanic, the gender mechanic, is a good example of that. Both types of games have gender selectability, but simply go about it differently because they were considered in the context of each game's overall objective.

I find it sort of odd seeing Rocket, and just intelligent forum posters... having to defend every little decision and test because people simply don't get their way. It's one thing to disagree with something on principle, or perhaps making suggestions when you think it could be improved... but being so entitled that you cannot just accept a choice that you may or may not have to make simply because it exists, doesn't make much sense to me.

Now, I don't like endorsing the Rocket dick-riding. So I'll say this, kind sir, I agree with your intention behind the gender/sex selectability and support it with a friendly thumbs-up.

[sircrisp@gmail.com 0]

Logged in and lost my inventory after selecting male in gender select screen. Not cool.

Lost my NVGs and m4

[Ravenspear 22]

snip~

You sir, have put my thoughts down in a well reasoned and eloquent argument. A better one than I could have come up with, without a long time to think. +1 to you, man. +1

[John (DayZ) 62]

Logged in and lost my inventory after selecting male in gender select screen. Not cool.

Lost my NVGs and m4

That's curious. I still had the M16 that I had acquired pre-rollover.

At any rate, Carcer & company, while I agree that discussing this topic is important - and, in fact, agree with Carcer for the most part (though, now that it's been brought to light that repeatedly switching gender might place a very heavy load on the servers, I don't know that it's the right way to go regardless of how we feel) - it would be polite of you all to open a suggestion thread on the subject and debate there. This thread should focus more on the overall update than this individual aspect. Thread's getting a bit clogged, y'know?

Here's hoping to a frame rate fix today!

[Ravenspear 22]

And again, to all you people with the fps issue, I refer you to Rocket's post

Could I have some server owners email their RPT files? I am almost CERTAIN the servers aren't cleaning up (again). Hence the slow descent into FPS madness....

Be patient, people. Problems aren't solved in a matter of hours. Usually, anyway. Rocket's proved me wrong before.

[aleksiuski@gmail.com 58]

When I logged in after the update, I did not receive dialog to change/alter my characters gender, and I had lost one tent and two piles of firewood from my character. Also, my inventory is now bugged, and I can accidentally pick up stuff that will replace stuff in my inventory. Deleted m249 magazine with a can of coke because of this... i see two empty slots in inventory, pick up pepsi, lost m249 magazine that was replaced by pepsi.

[HelloJesus 0]

Didn't receive any gender selection either.

[djshauny1 222]

still getting fps issues

and whoever said that 7fps is playable is silly lol