The PvP Discussion Thread

[bacon55 (DayZ) 2]

Griefing is not PvP in a zombie coop RPG *ALPHA*.

There is no reason to shoot random people currently unless they are firing on you as it's so simple to get gear and teaming up means even more gear since you can clear more zombies safely or loot quicker.

This "PvP" is detrimental to the game especially taking into account the NVGs' date=' as new players get killed repeatedly by people camping a costal road or town with superior weapons from positions they will never be found in.

There really is no argument or way to hide it that you are a griefer if you actively believe in the pvp for this mod as it is right now.

[/quote']

Exactly this.

Hopefully the devs know this and fix it before this game is dead. It has a lot of potential but if they listen to the socially inept among us who need to stroke their pathetic excuse for existence, it's toast. Many games have had to deal with this eventuality.

[bodycount 83]

You need to allow room for griefing and ganking and also PvP. Group on group warfare has great potential in this mod. As others have said ONLY fighting zombies will get stale.

You need to have greater competition for resources. Let nature take it's course. People will not need to be encouraged to PvP if shit is scarce. People will not be killing for the lulz if they are starving to death or only have a couple of shells left.

I know Munchy stated that the Euro servers have a 50% less either respawn rate or item appearance in general. I will check it out.

IMO items need to be extremely scarce. Make the items appear randomly instead of in specific locations. Encourage mobility and encounters and not airfield camping.

It would also encourage greater trading if you have ammo for the other guys gun and he has ammo for your gun. Or more pvp. Or more teamwork.

Resources, resources resources I cannot stress that enough.

Less resources will encourage PvP for the reasons that it should take place. Not for fun or pew pew pewing but to keep your character alive for another hour or two.

[donziboy2 1]

Problem I have is it seems like its easier to shoot first then to not and die to some noob who just wants your gun..... Or the thrill of killing another player.

[bacon55 (DayZ) 2]

Problem I have is it seems like its easier to shoot first then to not and die to some noob who just wants your gun..... Or the thrill of killing another player.

The Zombie aggro thing sounds like it would solve this very easily.

Wouldn't be hard to set up a trigger either.

[abysmal 2]

You need to allow room for griefing and ganking and also PvP. Group on group warfare has great potential in this mod. As others have said ONLY fighting zombies will get stale.

You need to have greater competition for resources. Let nature take it's course. People will not need to be encouraged to PvP if shit is scarce. People will not be killing for the lulz if they are starving to death or only have a couple of shells left.

I know Munchy stated that the Euro servers have a 50% less either respawn rate or item appearance in general. I will check it out.

IMO items need to be extremely scarce. Make the items appear randomly instead of in specific locations. Encourage mobility and encounters and not airfield camping.

It would also encourage greater trading if you have ammo for the other guys gun and he has ammo for your gun. Or more pvp. Or more teamwork.

Resources' date=' resources resources I cannot stress that enough.

Less resources will encourage PvP for the reasons that it should take place. Not for fun or pew pew pewing but to keep your character alive for another hour or two.

[/quote']

I disagree. When resources are limited, people will be forced to fight each other rather than risk exposure for Zeds for nothing of value. In this situation, the relative gain of participating in PvP as opposed to PvE will be increased, and non-PvPers will likewise be more cautious and eager to act in self-defense. There is a reason preppers and survivalists consider guns to be so important in the event of an apocalypse. When has an increase in resources ever sparked more war than a resource crisis?

[bodycount 83]

I disagree. When resources are limited' date=' people will be forced to fight each other rather than risk exposure for Zeds for nothing of value. In this situation, the relative gain of participating in PvP as opposed to PvE will be increased, and non-PvPers will likewise be more cautious and eager to act in self-defense. There is a reason preppers and survivalists consider guns to be so important in the event of an apocalypse. When has an increase in resources ever sparked more war than a resource crisis?

[/quote']

That is the point. When resources are limited and you are killed for your food or what little supplies and ammo you have there will be no bitching about being griefed for fun or shot just for the heck of it. You are being killed so the other player can stay alive.

It adds a reason to actually PvP.

It adds a reason to fight.

A reason to search that fuckers bags and get his shit. Not to grief and kill for lulz. For SURVIVAL! The world has gone to shit. Zombies rule the cities and those resources will be even more precious when they are rare and you have to scour an entire town for a few cans of Dinki Di. You might not have that much ammo so every bullet will be precious and scarce.

As it is now guys are running around with m249 saws and a full loadout. Silenced M4 rifles and multiple magazines. Ak-47's out the ying yang. Winchesters all day every day. Food is plentiful enough to not even have a need to PvP. Water as well. I just played on the Euro servers and I couldn't make enough bag space in the 20 slot bag that I found less than 20 minutes into a fresh life at night in a medium town for all the food/water and ammo I was finding.

I found at least 5-6 bodies as well just stock full of ammo food water medical supplies. None of it seemingly even having been looted.

Heck I had to leave so much stuff behind.

How do I hold...all this loot?

[Freyar 8]

Yes we get it. You grief and gank people all day. That is fun for you. Nothing wrong with that. Please stop trying to convince me that I should play a different game because you are not happy with the new changes that have been put into the game. Bandits are in game now. If you do not like it maybe you could go back to call of doody. Perhaps that it a little bit more your speed?

The translation here is: "You shoot other players' date=' therefore your opinion is wrong and you belong in those [i']other shooter games. I don't think this conversation was about the Bandit system in itself (seriously though, as it is now, it's far too easy to slip down and it takes a ridiculous amount of time and effort to get back up, especially if you were defending yourself.)

The fact the PvP has been so ubiquitous from the game's very inception shows how integral it is to the gameplay' date=' and attempting to eliminate or discourage it would be stifling. At the same time though, I don't think random deathmatching should be the biggest part of this mod, because one can play literally any other game to get that experience. What I think we need is to make it a more productive and directed activity, rather than random griefing. "PvP with a purpose" is what I think we should strive for, through the implementation of factions.[/quote']

I'm not sure how that would work out. What would factions fight over? What boon would a player get? What about players that prefer to be independent anyway? Should the area that has for the most part been desolate (save for zombies) suddenly have civilization?

Another solution to the current situation would be to incentivize PvE. There is no reason to attack the Zeds, especially considering how easily avoided they are, but killing a human player will always yield valuable items. I think that some sort of increase in humanity or some other kind of benefit from killing Zeds, no matter how marginal, would make the focus of the game less about spawnkilling other players, and more about working together to survive.

It would need to be balanced out so that "farming" zeds isn't the sole activity of the game to balance out PvP behavior, nor should an "accidental" self-defense zed kill result in clearing someone's name.

To keep this game fun without compromising the sandbox element, what we need is to create more legitimate forms of player activity, and subtly incentivize certain player behaviors, rather than punishing others. If PvE is pointless, and PvP is without gain at all, the safest course of action is to sit and hide by a stash, which is not what I think anyone would like to see this game turn into.

Tuning the zombies to hunt a bit more aggressively at night may help push people away from barricades and stashes.

All PVP does is piss people off and make them PVP so you make a vicious cycle of people just PVPin and nobody has any fun

To be honest' date=' taking your resources is part of the game. You may [i']prefer to scavenge for them, but face it, there are plenty of people that would be happy to kill you for it. Fallout (One and Two.. forget 3 and NV), Planescape Torment, even Baldur's Gate has elements to these. You're in a lawl-less [/Freudian slip] area and your tools are what help you enforce that. If you're upset about losing the contest of arms to be able to enforce your will (in this case, keeping your equipment), well.. perhaps something more structured is for you?

Hopefully the devs know this and fix it before this game is dead. It has a lot of potential but if they listen to the socially inept among us who need to stroke their pathetic excuse for existence' date=' it's toast. Many games have had to deal with this eventuality.

[/quote']

You know you've got a good game when your 15 servers are near capacity (~400 players at once?) and people are on your forums proclamating doom.

[griffinz 2816]

If PvP was disabled I would probably stop playing...even though Im not a bandit. It just takes too much away from the game

[munchy 9]

You know you've got a good game when your 15 servers are near capacity (~400 players at once?) and people are on your forums proclamating doom.

Soooooooo much love for this post <3

[Redrick (DayZ) 72]

If it's any consolation to those mad about the bandits just outright killing people, and not even bothering to loot them: I came across like 6 bandit bodies today within a mile radius without their loot taken.

Whether this is good or bad I don't know, but I did enjoy taking up some extra supplies and knowing someone was able to get some "Fight fire with fire" action against them.

[abysmal 2]

I'm not sure how that would work out. What would factions fight over? What boon would a player get? What about players that prefer to be independent anyway? Should the area that has for the most part been desolate (save for zombies) suddenly have civilization?

Factions already exist. Look at Legion, for example. There doesn't need to be any intrinsic 'boon' coded in the game itself to allow people to group together, the benefit to the players is the obvious protection that comes with banding together. As it stands, the mod already almost necessitates cooperation to do some things (try building a car on your own). However, I don't see how enabling teamwork on a greater scale would really affect deliberately independent players (such as myself) at all.

[snypr18 2]

At first I loved PvP, but it has become such a nightmare to even leave the beach that I have nearly given up on this mod.

All you wannabe bandit heroes out there who think you are adding another level of "realism" and "immersion" to this mod need to wake up and realize that killing people on the coastal area who are just trying to get situated is not fun, they dont appreciate it, and it doesnt make you anything but a bully and an asshole.

If you want to PvP, get your shit, get off the coast, and head inland. Go set up shop where the good equipment spawns. Get some ambition. Stop this retarded "bean wars" bullshit on the beach and let the defenseless respawning players get some equipment, or the playerbase for this mod is going to drop in half.

I have lost count of how many times I have been sniped on the beach by some bully with a rifle. It is pathetic. My current "favorite" moment in this mod was spending about an hour and a half getting a group together and outfitted, at night of course, only to have some jackass snipe me from a rooftop and never even attempt to collect my stuff. What fun.

[tpenn 9]

"Oh nvm, it's just a zombie"

That about sums it up.

Sentiments like that is what I've heard increasingly in the last few days on at least the US servers. Along with incessant side-chat chatter about who's shooting whom, where and with what.

The entire theme, reason d'etre of DayZ has eroded right before our eyes. When the "Z"s in DayZ have become about as noteworthy as that fuzzy brown bunny that skirts about the grassy knolls, it's time to examine the direction the mod is heading into (and if it's towards PVP, well there are a lot better PVP experiences out there without the petty distraction of zombie bunnies and food cycles).

Don't let DayZ become a mod about insignificant bunnies. Make it a mod about surviving the bunny apocalypse.

[Freyar 8]

TEXT

You screw up and get Zombie's attention and yeah.. it doesn't turn into a "It's just a zombie" scenario. "Oh shit! Oh shit! Oh Shit-where-is-my-ammo-why-do-I-have-only-one-bullet-left?!" is what that turns into.

New players will fight each other often (which I was one of them), eventually they'll start pushing for broader goals.

[trauma.au 14]

Totally agree, the reason it's gravitating to PvP is because the only threat a zombie poses is the off chance they 1 shot you to the ground AND you get really unlucky with a long wait time to get back up, I've suffered death to this very annoying mechanic a few times.

Even having no ammo is no issue, I've kited about 30 zombies for over a kilometer with out a worry in the world.

[tpenn 9]

New players will fight each other often (which I was one of them)' date=' eventually they'll start pushing for broader goals.

[/quote']

I was also a new player once, coming from PR actually. Funny how it only took a modicum of common sense to realize I had PR for PVP and somehow didn't find it necessary to shoot the first and every person I encountered because LOLZ.

it doesn't turn into a "It's just a zombie" scenario. "Oh shit! Oh shit! Oh Shit-where-is-my-ammo-why-do-I-have-only-one-bullet-left?!" is what that turns into.

Except just is used as a comparative' date=' as in after being shot: "Oh don't worry it [u']just grazed you", implying not that there isn't danger but rather there are much more important things to worry about.

As you quoted, you can yell all of that out while being chased by a zombie for over 30 seconds, it's scary and intense, but in comparison to the current and incessant "PVP" situation you'll be lucky to get off even an "Oh sh-" most of the time before you even realize what's happened. Clearly zombies have become just the sideshow in this circus act.

So yeah, "it's just a zombie" pretty much sums up the current DayZ experience pithily and well, quite sadly really.

[Grey2ham 1]

I'm a bandit at the moment. Last night I killed a survivor who surprised me in some woods (away from the coast). He didn't see me, but we bundled into each other less than 50 yards apart. If he'd seen me he would have killed me first. I found some painkillers and revolver ammo.

He'll probably complain because he got killed without being able to see me. But I was very close. Should I have left him to go on his way? I could of, but if he'd seen me I'd be dead. So I shot him in self defense. Totally not his fault. Only wrong place wrong time.

[trauma.au 14]

I'm a bandit at the moment. Last night I killed a survivor who surprised me in some woods (away from the coast). He didn't see me' date=' but we bundled into each other less than 50 yards apart. If he'd seen me he would have killed me first. I found some painkillers and revolver ammo.

He'll probably complain because he got killed without being able to see me. But I was very close. Should I have left him to go on his way? I could of, but if he'd seen me I'd be dead. So I shot him in self defense. Totally not his fault. Only wrong place wrong time.

[/quote']

That's exactly how I became a bandit. Sucks so much when you just get shot out of the blue... reason being "you were near me". But that's how it goes. No one believes the other guy won't shoot and they shouldn't believe it.

[Freyar 8]

That's exactly how I became a bandit. Sucks so much when you just get shot out of the blue... reason being "you were near me". But that's how it goes. No one believes the other guy won't shoot and they shouldn't believe it.

As it should be for a game design like this.

[trauma.au 14]

I doubt the intent was to have all players shoot all other players on sight.

[alienfreak 6]

I doubt the intent was to have all players shoot all other players on sight.

More than half of all players are now bandits.

2766 out of 4993 are now bandits.

Thats 55.4% of all players.

As we see the bandit system is NOT working AT ALL.

What we need is a way to choose a model/skin for your character which is distinct and with which people can identify you.

So its like you are a takistani rebel or so and people can tell each other that the takistani rebel guy is PKing a lot and spread the word.

You shoot people while being seen? Well you gotta live with the fact that you are now hunted because everyone knows how you look. If you shoot people without being noticed: Kudos to you.

Plus this gives a feeling of being unique and having a group that looks a like is really cool.

Plus it fixes people being not identifiable on servers which do not use the spotting system (which is horrible and should be ALWAYS deactivated).

[trauma.au 14]

I think the number of bandits will fall dramatically when the humanity regeneration works.

[donziboy2 1]

I say add a parameter that if your a bandit your gun makes 50% more noise....

So you shoot and you have more zombies from farther away on your azz.

[alienfreak 6]

I say add a parameter that if your a bandit your gun makes 50% more noise....

So you shoot and you have more zombies from farther away on your azz.

lol wat.

no ^^

[trauma.au 14]

I say add a parameter that if your a bandit your gun makes 50% more noise....

So you shoot and you have more zombies from farther away on your azz.

lol wat.

no ^^

Yea.... nah.