The Hatchet vs Crowbar Dilemma

[Thaif 40]

Currently the difference between the Hatchet and the Crowbar is that the hatchet is superior in all respects.

Many have suggested that both the hatchet and the crowbar should be equipable as secondary weapons. This however does nothing to the terribadness of the crowbar compared to the hatchet.

So here's the suggestion on this discrepancy from me: Keep the hatchet as a primary but change the crowbar to a secondary.

This change would:

• Make the crowbar and actual option as a weapon as opposed to "I haven't found anything else yet" toy.
  
• Change the inventory size of the weapon from 10 spaces to 5 spaces. It's a metal pole not an assault rifle.
  
• Make it possible to have a silent melee weapon with a primary weapon without all the hassle. Tactical flexibility and new loadout options.
  
• Make a distinction between a hatchet(high damage primary slot melee) and a crowbar(lower damage secondary slot melee).
  

Free the crowbar from the tyranny of the hatchet and let it shine with newfound murderous purpose!

[Spidey (DayZ) 78]

Agreed. Would be an excellent change. And also here's my idea: Crowbars are kinda supposed to open locked doros and so on, right? Well.. if something like lock-system could be implemented, you could actually break locks or open locked doors with a crowbar, at the risk of high sounds, alerting zombies/players.

Anyways, this is a great idea. Beans for ya :)

[doom4mr 135]

No!

Hatchet and crowbar should be added to tool belt or at least only the hatchet, and player should be able to scroll down and have an option to take hatchet, without dropping any weapon at all.

[Igor (DayZ) 96]

I like the idea of making them less spaces to take up, a bit sketchy with the other.

[Prion 61]

No!

Hatchet and crowbar should be added to tool belt or at least only the hatchet, and player should be able to scroll down and have an option to take hatchet, without dropping any weapon at all.

this would be great, especially since there are random bugs when dropping stuff. i lost a tent yesterday after trying to put it down to get a soda out of my backpack

[Thaif 40]

If the hatchet was made selectable straight from the toolbelt there would be even less purpose for the crowbar.

Barring the possibility of additional functionality for the crowbar in the future it's going to be the most useless weapon find there is.

This suggestion doesn't need to be permanent if it's not too difficult to code in(effort and timewise) assuming the crowbar is going to be something useful in the future.

But as it is now it's as bad as finding empty tin cans in a military loot spawn. Making it a secondary weapon would give it at least some value as opposed to none.

[Conor88 17]

I think that would make the game too easy (if you got a crossbar I mean). A lot of the time I walk around with an assault rifle wishing I had the time and patience with the inventory system to use the hatchet instead. Silent death is too handy.

[HMS 115]

I like the fact that it was not a toolbelt item. It made it quicker to use - except the damn thing didn't work until I tried like 4 of them.

And considering the size of it, it should absolutely be a 1-hit kill.

[Partywaffle 24]

I support a rework of the crowbar. I want to be like Gordon Freeman in Day-Z, but at the moment the issues and low damage makes it impossible.

[xDIx Revenge 51]

It just needs a damage buff to be on par with the hatchet. However the hatchet is still more useful due to the fact its a useful utility item as well (chopping wood).

Just for you to know, the melee weapons are an extreme placeholder atm. They still "fire" bullets, just at short range, only hit where your crosshair is aiming, require reloading, have dodgy running animations, and more!

When they get fixed up in a standalone, it will be better, as i hope it will have more of an "arc" of damage, such as in Team Fortress 2. Instead of a straight line fire like a gun.

[Thaif 40]

I won't go into the hatchet damage vs crowbar damage topic as that's a different issue. Do note that hitting infected in the head will kill them with 1 hit. Bodyblows require about 4-6 hits.

With the hatchet you can almost just run around and mowdown the infected. Using the crowbar requires more finesse or you will get slapped around before getting the kill and getting slapped can mean getting knocked uncouncious with 1 hit below 9000 blood so it won't be that easy. Besides the real danger in DayZ is the other non-infected people. Infected will slap you around but they won't shoot from a roof top.

In TF 2 the melee weapons fire a fast moving invisible bullet, they don't have an arc. Though Heavy throwing wild haymakers would be something...

Everything in the mod is subject to change. This is an open Alfa so suggestions are more likely to get implemented or even considered than in Beta or a released game.

Thanks for the comments so far.

[killzone_kid 51]

Nothing is more useless than double barrel shotgun where each pair of shells take 1 space! Bang bang and you are out of ammo.

[Partywaffle 24]

Nothing is more useless than double barrel shotgun where each pair of shells take 1 space! Bang bang and you are out of ammo.

This has great value here.

Bumping due to the fact that everyone posts great ideas on the suggestions forum, and then forgets about their topics.

Anyone else tired of the obnoxious re-posts?

[Thaif 40]

Re-posting is inevitable with a big enough community.

I personally have found the "Doublet" AkA double barrelled shotgun quite useful. It's relatively quiet for town or city raiding and can drop people with 2 shots(not guaranteed though).

It's issue is the ammo hassle. I wish we could use the 8rnd M1014 for it without splitting.

If only you had a quiet secondary weapon that's easier to find than M9SD when your out of ammo...

Don't worry Partywaffle, I did not forget. It's rather that I don't like spamming threads even if they are my own.

[xDIx Revenge 51]

In TF 2 the melee weapons fire a fast moving invisible bullet, they don't have an arc. Though Heavy throwing wild haymakers would be something...

I think you will find it is an arc of damage. You can "swing" your melee weapon and turn into someone who isn't in your crosshairs and it will do damage. Right now swinging your weapon in DayZ fires a bullet at your crosshairs. Personally i think they should implement a system (when Standalone with ragdoll etc comes in), where you knock infected down with your melee weapons if you hit them in the chest, or decapitate them if you hit them in the head. Similar to L4D style melee.

[Thaif 40]

TF2 melee does not have an arc, swinging and turning to hit people is how the "bullet" for the melee works. It's not synched to the animation, meaning you can begin a swing, turn around, and hit with the invisible "bullet" that the melee weapon "shoots". This means there is a slight delay to when the hit will land.

L4D2 melee does have an arc however. Clearly the coding for that melee is done differently than in TF2. I wouldn't mind having a similar melee swing mechanic as in L4D2.

But all of that is a bit off-topic.

Thanks to everyone for the generous bean donations and for the comments, both for and against.

[Partywaffle 24]

I prefer when there is an arc melee "swing" rather than the firing of a bullet. However it seems that with the Arma II engine the possibilities are limited with that. It would probably require a lot of engine tweaking and coding to add a melee arc.

Question about the crowbar since I have never actually picked one up: Do you also have to reload it like the axe? I laugh every time I have to pull out the axe.

Also: is there a speed difference between axe and crowbar?

[Thaif 40]

It used to need reloading but it was fixed not so long ago(in patch 1.7.2). I haven't noticed any speed diffence between the two except killing speed. They seem to swing equally fast.

I'm under the impression that the Arma engine is quite flexible so we might get melee swing arc if rocket gets some development help. Otherwise it might take too much of his development time.

COVER ME I NEED TO RELOAD

[twix (DayZ) 24]

Yes crowbar's need rework. Here's my suggestion for all crowbar lovers. Heat crowbar, poke target, target yells, great way to induce screams in this game without having zombies attack you.

[Partywaffle 24]

Bump for great justice.

I used a crowbar after dieing for the first time in a week. After having to turn around and use it to defend myself I died for the second time this week.

[Thaif 40]

Remember to aim for the head. Kills instantly. When the game actually registers the hit and the animations stop glitching.

I remember having 20 kills just 5 minutes off the spawn with the crowbar and 14 headshots. That's Elektro for ya.

[Partywaffle 24]

Don't mind me giving this thread a much needed bump. Been practicing with the crowbar, and head shots are such a pain!

[Thaif 40]

True. But it's much more satisfying to drop an infected with one swing and know you pulled it off. When with the hatchet you just run at them and swing.

And when you're surrounded it actually feels like a fight to the death against overwhelming odds and if you win...It's like you're the One Free Man.

[Someonerandom 5]

It is incredibly hard to decapitate with a melee wep irl possible but rlly hard

Edited August 3, 2012 by Someonerandom

[The Satanic Bean 5]

why not have the crowbar take up a few inventory slots but have the ability to cycle to it with f just like grenades?