Trade Zones

[S3V3N 1402]

Hi, I've been wondering- wouldn't it be acceptable to turn the churches and the surrounding areas into trade zones?

I often pick up so much stuff I feel sorry to throw away in a place where nobody needs it. I also often curse, because it is impossible to find certain items where I need them. I guess it's part of what makes it interesting, but it can be quite a drag.

The problem with my suggestion of churches it that probably some idiot is gonna camp and gun everyone down, who is outside the safe zone.

My (more complicated suggestion) would be, to turn just one or two places into base camps that are gun free zones. Those places need to be completely walled in, like military camps. You leave your gun at the entrance and then you can proceed (you cannot enter with a gun, only with ammo and gear). If you leave you get back your weapon and carry your trade items.

People could offer safe trade in the area, and I figure somehow profit from the trades made. Maybe "Protectors" get the best weapons available and can snipe anyone outside the zone, who tries to kill and steal in its vicinity. That would need some refined thought to work.

I think some trade would be awesome, since it would also be a meeting place. "Hey, you are going to Vybor let's meet up" ~ stuff like that, which is now extremely rare and random. I mean - face it - most people are connected via Skype and Steam, if they play in groups. A true ingame solution would make things more interesting and keep people mixing with each other. I would digg it for sure!

Post your thoughts on trade and trade zones. How could they work? Are they a good idea, if not why not? I'd really like to play more with other people in the game without organizing meeting place and conference calls on Skype.

[K_Tetsu 2]

Hi, I've been wondering- wouldn't it be acceptable to turn the churches and the surrounding areas into trade zones?

I often pick up so much stuff I feel sorry to throw away in a place where nobody needs it. I also often curse, because it is impossible to find certain items where I need them. I guess it's part of what makes it interesting, but it can be quite a drag.

The problem with my suggestion of churches it that probably some idiot is gonna camp and gun everyone down, who is outside the safe zone.

My (more complicated suggestion) would be, to turn just one or two places into base camps that are gun free zones. Those places need to be completely walled in, like military camps. You leave your gun at the entrance and then you can proceed (you cannot enter with a gun, only with ammo and gear). If you leave you get back your weapon and carry your trade items.

People could offer safe trade in the area, and I figure somehow profit from the trades made. Maybe "Protectors" get the best weapons available and can snipe anyone outside the zone, who tries to kill and steal in its vicinity. That would need some refined thought to work.

I think some trade would be awesome, since it would also be a meeting place. "Hey, you are going to Vybor let's meet up" ~ stuff like that, which is now extremely rare and random. I mean - face it - most people are connected via Skype and Steam, if they play in groups. A true ingame solution would make things more interesting and keep people mixing with each other. I would digg it for sure!

Post your thoughts on trade and trade zones. How could they work? Are they a good idea, if not why not? I'd really like to play more with other people in the game without organizing meeting place and conference calls on Skype.

http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/44445-safe-area/ yeah basically same as safe zones ^_^ i think they could work very well as postet in this topic

[GexAlmighty 54]

Trading is already in the game, and can only be done by being in a group, which is how it should be.

Not only that. but to make churches a safe area would be really destructive. i for one find a lot of my early decent loot at churches and if that isnt a case it is often a good place for decent PVP fire fights and fortification. i like the way churches are currently used and dont want to see them change.

Rather than safe zones, there should be player constructed strong holds that are resilliant rather than safe. not only that, but have you ever considered just going into an appartment building with your friend and closed the door? thats pretty damn safe from zombies

Edited July 24, 2012 by GexAlmighty

[-E-Claymore 22]

I see what you're going for, but trying to enforce places like isn't a realistic concept and would really break the 4th wall. In an apocalyptic event like the game has portrayed, there won't likely be any organized body that could enforce this type of system, or at least not for some time.

There's been plenty of movies that dealt with topics like this (The Postman comes to mind), and any military force/government that comes about is highly likely to be akin to a dictatorship. It's more likely that you'd be conscripted into their ranks, rather than simply trade your goods and go on your way.

I completely agree that it can be very frustrating at times to have things you don't need, and need things you don't have, but that's why you have to find a server with some like-minded people that are willing to trust, and that you can trust.

Edited July 24, 2012 by -E-Claymore

[karrr 19]

How about having no pvp no loot servers for trading purposes only, just an idea

[S3V3N 1402]

Well, in the Walking Dead graphic novel there was a prison that pretty much worked as a safe zone for a long time. There was also a small town that was walled in, so that wouldn't require a government.

I'm not playing DayZ for that long, but the PvP really gets on my nerves. There were people stupid and slow and I had to chase them to talk to them. And when they finally notice me they open fire - popular place for that is inside a church. So the churches are supposed to be PvP areas? I am mostly annoyed by the whole "making contact" part of the game; it isn't really there. I also don't know if the point should be to shoot everyone at sight. I've had far more fun playing with others than alone. Greed is how our society works. This game displays that pretty good. And it also helps foster the bad inside every one of us.

Example: I shot some guys with an enfield that had alice bags and an M4 and a Kobra + lots of stuff. I can only imagine all the shit they went through to get it and all I had to do was wait for them and ambush them. (I heard gunfire from the castle and knew they would come that way). Does that make me a hero? No - it makes me a dick. And that's what all that PvP is in my oppinion: a show of 1 inch dicks. It doesn't make for a better game and the fact that it's everywhere at the moment is just suck. I don't ask for much, but some sanctuary would be nice, imho.

[KnT47r 51]

Make the church a safe zone yourself, the devs arent going to hold your hand with a stupid mechanic to do it lol

[Strogg 23]

Hi, I've been wondering- wouldn't it be acceptable to turn the churches and the surrounding areas into trade zones?

I often pick up so much stuff I feel sorry to throw away in a place where nobody needs it. I also often curse, because it is impossible to find certain items where I need them. I guess it's part of what makes it interesting, but it can be quite a drag.

The problem with my suggestion of churches it that probably some idiot is gonna camp and gun everyone down, who is outside the safe zone.

My (more complicated suggestion) would be, to turn just one or two places into base camps that are gun free zones. Those places need to be completely walled in, like military camps. You leave your gun at the entrance and then you can proceed (you cannot enter with a gun, only with ammo and gear). If you leave you get back your weapon and carry your trade items.

People could offer safe trade in the area, and I figure somehow profit from the trades made. Maybe "Protectors" get the best weapons available and can snipe anyone outside the zone, who tries to kill and steal in its vicinity. That would need some refined thought to work.

I think some trade would be awesome, since it would also be a meeting place. "Hey, you are going to Vybor let's meet up" ~ stuff like that, which is now extremely rare and random. I mean - face it - most people are connected via Skype and Steam, if they play in groups. A true ingame solution would make things more interesting and keep people mixing with each other. I would digg it for sure!

Post your thoughts on trade and trade zones. How could they work? Are they a good idea, if not why not? I'd really like to play more with other people in the game without organizing meeting place and conference calls on Skype.

This would be an interesting concept, but guards can't be around 24/7, and they can't always be trusted. I've heard of far more elaborate schemes being carried out to mess shit up in the gaming world. Expecting a certain level of discipline from gamers is really "touch & go".

I have read stories on the forum (who knows whether they're true or not, or whether its regular players or hackers) of small groups being able to set up sophisticated base camps, but something tells me a trade zone fall apart pretty fast, from raids or traders being robbed/murdered & looted.

The ability of players to organize in this manner will probably be better complemented in later versions of Day Z.

[Gandrew 10]

I like the idea, but I also like that you have to trust who you trade and that you could get robbed and conflict arises. Also you have it right, most bandits would probably exploit the safe zones and I think that danger should stick with you through-out the entirety of your gameplay. Maybe, player are able to create a safe zone by repairing every building in a town that will stop the spawns of zombies in that area and putting a wall and entrance to the town creating a server wide safe zone owned by those players. They can get a gate system that you are stripped of weapons but maybe you could sneak in a m9sd or a hunting knife that you can use to mug people. In response, owners can approve people to allow them the usage of guns and they can defend those in the town. Also this can create a guild type system were the players can fight for territory in the end game. Also repaired buildings slow down the amount of respawning items.

[(AOW)n4zRuDiN 10]

Very good post!

I can see where you are going, and I like your idea. At the moment trading with people you do not know is not working, your more likely to get a bullet between your eyes trying so its not worth it, so that puts it out of the equation.

I would not mind a place where you can meet people and trade your stuff, not a place with walls or fancy stuff, but a place or a good mechanic to trade. Trading with your friends is just what it is and nothing more. Remember that european server host limit is mostly 50 players and yet there's noone to trade with since you never find people.

You all talk about realism, if this were real there would be trading places, problem is atm that everyone is killing everyone, thats far from real.

Edited July 25, 2012 by n4zRuDiN

[KWilt 157]

Make the church a safe zone yourself, the devs arent going to hold your hand with a stupid mechanic to do it lol

Pretty much this.

If you want a safe zone, set one up with a group yourself. No reason that the game should artificially do it for you.

[S3V3N 1402]

The fascinating things about DayZ are:

- the game writes its own story and every new round is a new adenture

- despite all the open world-ness the game has very few rules and the admins aren't interfering like on any other PvP heavy MMO

The result of the latter is a maximised feeling of freedom . That's the problem with the safe zone - if there is just one, everybody will explot it, or it has to be governed by an admin. If there are many, the game loses a lot of appeal and it will take away from other parts that are great now. I think what is missing is some kind of reward. I would totally go about and establish a lasting safe zone, if I had the means to do so.

In the Chernarus Life Revolution mod, I always build bases the cops had a hard time finding a way into. However that won't work in DayZ. Safe Zones would have to be player nogotiated in DayZ and disappear as quickly as they are established. I am thinking that most of the problem the game has at the moment is due to the lack of communication options.It would have to be something easy that everyone recogizes. A visual cue, perhaps.

For example, if I want to trade, it could be that my player skin changes as a result. I see other players with lets say - a yellow safety vest - and I know they want to trade. If I don't want to trade, I will shoot that guy or proceed on my own way. If he is smart, he won't approach me when I don't wear the vest, The problem with this is that a player is more visible with the vest (which is the point of it, but makes him more vulnerable at the same time). It is difficult to create a balance when the only rule in the game is "shoot first, ask questions later".

Another (better) option might be to have a shop in towns that only opens if you have the required items for a trade. So outside there is a list. You can put whatever you want in the shop and write down your price (e.g. 1911 mag x2 -trade for sardine canx2 or baked beansx2 or 1 of each, just click on arrows to adjust the amount). So if another player comes around he can enter the trade items and will receive what you offer. Next time you come by a shop (anywhere) you can retrieve your trade items. You can get the payment from any shop on the map, but you have to go to a particular one to see what they offer and pay for it there.

It's really hard to find something not too intrusive with the realism approach. I tried to give some examples, maybe someone will comment and expand on these ideas. I also like the trading in groups idea, but I find it hard to figure out how to organise meeting place and time, unless on the forums. I'm looking for mechanisms that will work entirely ingame.

[jackrc11 15]

I want rocket to add bombs just so i can plant one on the side of the trade zone and kill everyone >:D

[Strogg 23]

I want rocket to add bombs just so i can plant one on the side of the trade zone and kill everyone > :D

Cue for battle of waterloo music while hackers do fly-bys in helicopters.

[zython (DayZ) 196]

I don't like the idea of safe zones, because in an actual zombie apocalypse, no magical barrier is going to stop someone from raiding a church or whatnot.

[S3V3N 1402]

Zython - you are clearly wrong. Trade is how humanity works from the earliest of times. Trade has always been organized by tribes and later by individuals and naturally they had to adhere to some rules. Trade doesn't only mean goods exchange, it means exchanging news + information, too.

I don't like that DayZ is completely rule free and people claim that to be "realism". No, it's not realism, it's deathmatch - which is just a game mode. Imagine in reallife - if you are on the run and have been alone for days and weeks and you see another survivor, your first thought is to shoot him/her? - I doubt that.

The reason you wouldn't do that is because he/she may have information you don't posess. They may know something you don't and they may be able to help beyond supplying you with some loot from a dead body. Apart from the more practical aspects you would also not shoot them for moral reasons. After all, we are still humans and have some empathy for each other. That separates us from animals, too.

I am not saying they have to be constant zones, I'm just saying it should be made possible to recognize a trade zone/ trader and use it, just like you use hospitals and shops now. You go there for a purpose. Or, differently said: they add purpose to the game. Trading is just another means of creating purpose, but this time it's not for the greedy and bandit players that shoot everyone, but for the ones that want to coop and bond in the game without knowing each other through Skype or these forums. The trade zones are an in-game solution to bond and play together. One that is native to the game and not imposed on it.

Edited July 25, 2012 by S3V3N

[S3V3N 1402]

Cue for battle of waterloo music while hackers do fly-bys in helicopters.

That would imply I always play on the same server and only want to live by trade. It would also mean I have to spread the word about the zone for days/weeks, before I can expect anyone to come there by purpose. I am looking for a way to do something similar to create a purpose, just like I wrote above. Sry for bumping the thread, but I felt I had to reply, why your suggestion has some merit, but is completely unpractical.

[K_Tetsu 2]

I dont knwo why many people dont like the idea maybe they should realize that not everyone has many friends playing this kind of games to work together with...

They dont need to be any magical barrier zone just protected by NPC sentrys with good accuracy thats all. It would make the game more realistic because in any big catastrophes people worked togehter [in hiroshima some time after the incident people rebuild their market to sell stuff]

So it could be on a relatively safe place where the NPC sentrys shoot at anyone attacking other survivors or sentries (in an area around the town). [They dont even have to make some new coding because Shooting NPCs ist what ARMA2 can do best ]

I think it would make the game more interesting and you would have a chance to interact with unkown people in a safe manner [even more taunts wouldnt be so effective in terms off communitcation because the gun is faster than any taunt ^^]

So Bandits could be a problem but its realistic too where a market is there are bandits stalking trading routes. But you could sneak around them /other friendly groups clear the path to the safe zone.

[xTLRxPrototype (DayZ) 15]

I think that trade zones or safe zones should be made by the players. I don't think they should just be added. For example (Using random server) lets say US101 players know that it is safe to be in Elektro and they don't kill each other there out of respect, but players on US561 have agreed on Cherno being a safe zone and not killing each other there out of respect. I feel like if Rocket adds thing FOR us, it would decrease the fun I have from the game.

Edited July 25, 2012 by xTLRxPrototype

[deathwizard77@gmail.com 28]

Rocket has said from the beginning we need to make the rules we just need to enforce them. Any safe zone put in by the game anyway would just be camped so second you came out of it you would be shot. You want a trade zone get 20 people together to hold a town and enforce the rules. This is how rocket wants it and this is how it would need to be done.

[dennisho1234 2]

[S3V3N 1402]

What i don't get is how you want to make it public to anyone that there is a Trade Zone in Cherno? You cannot use global chat, you can only reach people in the vicinity through direct chat. The trade zones that are player made would have to be organized 24/7, which imho is an impossible task.All the people (including Rocket), who say this should be player organised should give a proper example on how to do it.

At the moment this game is in chaos. What is the overall plan for the game? As I see it, the zombies will play a less and less significant role in the game and in the end we will have two armies facing each other again - just what Arma is now. You don't need zombies for that, we can just play Arma then and actually have a better game.

I have another idea for a trade option that would require very little change to the current game. Make every tent into a trade area. You can drop your gear there and name a price for it.The next tent you come by, you check if anything was sold or if you need something. That would make the trading a bit more random, but also keep it from becoming safe zones. You could also leave message at these tents and try to negotiate meeting points with other survivors. It would take a little longer to setup gear and meeting exchange, but it would work and only slightly bend the whole realism idea.

Edited July 25, 2012 by S3V3N

[K_Tetsu 2]

Thats trading between well armd groups im talking about >strange< solo players meet at a spot protected by NPCs so you dont have to shoot on sight!

What i don't get is how you want to make it public to anyone that there is a Trade Zone in Cherno? You cannot use global chat, you can only reach people in the vicinity through direct chat. The trade zones that are player made would have to be organized 24/7, which imho is an impossible task.All the people (including Rocket), who say this should be player organised should give a proper example on how to do it.

At the moment this game is in chaos. What is the overall plan for the game? As I see it, the zombies will play a less and less significant role in the game and in the end we will have two armies facing each other again - just what Arma is now. You don't need zombies for that, we can just play Arma then and actually have a better game.

Thats the point why it wont work and I'm not using the same server all the time [not server hopping I need daylight after work /different working times] + I dont think any clan could make a reals safe zone 24/7 with fair rules [imagine you come into the trading zone with ghilisuit and night goggles why do you think one of the "neutral" camp leaders dot tell me giv ur stuff our clan or we kill you. There has to be a real neutral entitty like an NPC to ensure that otherwise its useless because I will never trust other players with a gun pointing at me.

[S3V3N 1402]

Okay, I saw the vid, but that is a very elaborate way to trade. Very nicely done, though. Not everybody has an SVD or other sniper available to cover them during a trade. I think the tent idea isn't so bad. Yet it doesn't mean face to face trading, which was something I wanted to have, because trading is a a social thing to me. I'd like to be able to just have somewhere to relax and have a laugh for once in a while in DayZ.

[K_Tetsu 2]

Okay, I saw the vid, but that is a very elaborate way to trade. Very nicely done, though. Not everybody has an SVD or other sniper available to cover them during a trade. I think the tent idea isn't so bad. Yet it doesn't mean face to face trading, which was something I wanted to have, because trading is a a social thing to me. I'd like to be able to just have somewhere to relax and have a laugh for once in a while in DayZ.

Yep thats my opinion too some spot to meet unknown people in a relaxed /relativly safe spot