Post apacolyptic greifing simulator for D-bags

[NFK 102]

From the videos i've seen, the threads i'm followed with much interest, and the statements made by the game's creator, it seems like the only way to approach some semblance of reality in a post apocalyptic world is to offer an "artificial conscience" to the players. Unfortunately, I cannot tell you exactly how you would go about that, but it would certainly approach the realm of "balancing".

In a game meant to have you think about your actions, on moral grounds or not, you need to provide the player with a conscience of some sort, real or otherwise.

This is intereting. An artificial conscience, or maybe an artificial psychological profile and the reaction to stress based on that profile.

Let's say every time you spawn, your character is assigned a psych profile. You don't know what that profile is until you subject him to the stress of killing other human beings. Make the majority of profiles normal, so that murders bring grief, guilt, PTSD. The game would manifest these as physical symptoms like shaking aim, nervous fits where the player loses control of the character, maybe the constant sound of muttering to yourself. Do enough murders with a non-killing psych profile, and you make your character suicidal, lose control of him, and have to watch him blow his brains out.

A small minority of profiles are abnormal. Again, when you spawn, you don't know if you got the normal or the abnormal profile. Abnormal profiles are stone cold psychos who don't suffer any symptoms from killing, because it doesn't stress them at all. So there's still psycho bandits out there, killing without remorse. There's just not many of them, because that kind of personality is rare.

A system like this would make killing inherently risky, because you don't know if the character you spawned can handle the stress.

[Sumdum 29]

The stress system would almost be interesting if it affected everybody and could be alleviated with drugs/alcohol found in game. Otherwise justifiable killing will lead to suicide which is plainly idiotic.

[andyfuji 15]

I read this, and the post itself made me somewhat sick; not because of anything Rocket said, but how his idea backfired. I downloaded DayZ because I wanted to play something like he described. I wanted to play something that forced me to think about everything I believed and throw it away. I wanted to be angry at the game. I wanted the game to feel like hell; a true psychological horror.

But actually playing the game, I felt alone. I played the game for roughly 12 hours over the course of a weekend, trying to find some kind of realization in it, and eventually it came. And this realization was of the worst kind. Over that 12 hour playthrough, I was murdered more times than I can count; cold blood, without a conscience. Each time a different hunter, but the result was always the same. They didn't say a word, they just held the gun to my forehead as I tried offer them a can of beans. I felt alone because I wanted to help people.

I felt like an outcast because I was the one with a conscience. Eventually I killed someone, and it was terrible. I felt physically sick and I never want to do it ever again. I stopped carrying around guns because I didn't want anyone to feel like they were forced to shoot me, and I didn't want to be forced to shoot anyone. There were no gun-barrels pointed at them, no brandished axes. I was less than a threat and I handed out free supplies like I was the goddamn post-apocalypse salvation army. And nearly every person I handed a free can of beans shot me in the back.

"Do you know who else murders people who are only trying to help them? Did you guess 'sharks?' Because that's wrong. The correct answer is 'nobody.' Nobody but you is that pointlessly cruel."

I felt like I was a fucking sociopath because I didn't enjoy murdering people. The game never made me angry, it just made me depressed and afraid. I'm horrified at what DayZ has shown me about society's morals. We have no empathy. We're all faceless individuals with loaded guns, ready to blow away our faceless friends; laughing as they bleed out. We realize that none of our actions have consequences, and take advantage of it. We realize people are replaceable because everyone's the same. We are armchair warlords laughing as we rape and pillage our own cities.

You can very well argue that it's just a game, but what we fail to realize is other people play the game too. No one plays CoD or TF2 and wins six games in a row then lets the other team win one; just to make them feel like they aren't complete shit. We murder them, we teabag them, and we scream at them through the microphone about how completely shit they are. I feel ashamed to admit to people that I play video games because I know what they will think of me because of it.

The only way to "fix" the game is to give it clear goals. If you let people do whatever they want, they will just end up killing each other.

[sreg 0]

I read this, and the post itself made me somewhat sick; not because of anything Rocket said, but how his idea backfired. I downloaded DayZ because I wanted to play something like he described. I wanted to play something that forced me to think about everything I believed and throw it away. I wanted to be angry at the game. I wanted the game to feel like hell; a true psychological horror.

But actually playing the game, I felt alone. I played the game for roughly 12 hours over the course of a weekend, trying to find some kind of realization in it, and eventually it came. And this realization was of the worst kind. Over that 12 hour playthrough, I was murdered more times than I can count; cold blood, without a conscience. Each time a different hunter, but the result was always the same. They didn't say a word, they just held the gun to my forehead as I tried offer them a can of beans. I felt alone because I wanted to help people.

I felt like an outcast because I was the one with a conscience. Eventually I killed someone, and it was terrible. I felt physically sick and I never want to do it ever again. I stopped carrying around guns because I didn't want anyone to feel like they were forced to shoot me, and I didn't want to be forced to shoot anyone. There were no gun-barrels pointed at them, no brandished axes. I was less than a threat and I handed out free supplies like I was the goddamn post-apocalypse salvation army. And nearly every person I handed a free can of beans shot me in the back.

I felt like I was a fucking sociopath because I didn't enjoy murdering people. The game never made me angry, it just made me depressed and afraid. I'm horrified at what DayZ has shown me about society's morals. We have no empathy. We're all faceless individuals with loaded guns, ready to blow away our faceless friends; laughing as they bleed out. We realize that none of our actions have consequences, and take advantage of it. We realize people are replaceable because everyone's the same. We are armchair warlords laughing as we rape and pillage our own cities.

You can very well argue that it's just a game, but what we fail to realize is other people play the game too. No one plays CoD or TF2 and wins six games in a row then lets the other team win one; just to make them feel like they aren't complete shit. We murder them, we teabag them, and we scream at them through the microphone about how completely shit they are. I feel ashamed to admit to people that I play video games because I know what they will think of me because of it.

The only way to "fix" the game is to give it clear goals. If you let people do whatever they want, they will just end up killing each other.

This may seem ironic, but I'm giving you my beans. That was amazing.

Don't shoot me in the back though.

[sandorski 17]

To be worried about people because they are cold hearted in a video game is nonsense. In GTA/Saints Row I'll mow down pedestrians with a gun or vehicle and lol about it, but would never do the same IRL.

People do it in DayZ for much the same reason. It can be done, so they do it. It ruins the potential of DayZ, but it still is in Alpha and features are yet to be added that could fix it. Personally I think the Bandit Skin was a good feature that actually made people more reluctant to simply shoot on sight. It had its' flaws and needs a Redemption system.

[resident_leeonheart@yahoo.com 32]

To be worried about people because they are cold hearted in a video game is nonsense. In GTA/Saints Row I'll mow down pedestrians with a gun or vehicle and lol about it, but would never do the same IRL.

People do it in DayZ for much the same reason. It can be done, so they do it. It ruins the potential of DayZ, but it still is in Alpha and features are yet to be added that could fix it.

Couldn't have say it better. *throws bean cans to you* :beans: :beans: :beans: :beans: :beans:

Edited July 19, 2012 by leeo38

[Zak_Prestor 15]

Cheaters!

They have any stuff they want in 5 minutes, they have maphacks that show all players, vehicles and maybe tents on the map. They can spawn vehicles, tanks, helicopters and tactical bombers with nuclears missiles, they can become almost invulnerable (shoot head or neck), they can aimbot you, they can instantly teleport for 200m in 1 second. They can break legs to the whole server, kill everyone or give anyone AS50 with heatsensor.

They don't care about their gear, they are "hunters" and we are "prey". They can spawn anything they want and go kill the whole clan in it's camp, they like to hoard all the vehicles from the map in 1 specific place.

But they'll get banned sooner or later. They'll pay 10$ again and again, untill get tired of this gameplay and quit.

The second category is much meaner and more dangerous:

Seasoned clan members buy 1 account for cheating, use it for 3-5 days to track vehicles, clans and maybe tents on all EU/DE/UK/RU/LU/SE/US/../FR servers, spawn and dupe any weapons they want and then fight "fairly" against other clans/squads, but one hacker in their team can have maphack turned on to show all disposition of the enemy. One account gets banned in the same 3-7 days, but they buy a new one for the entertainment.

Both categories almost don't care about loosing their gear, thy don't need anything from killed players and the penalty for death is only 10-30 minutes until they are picked up by their clanmembers. Shoot on sight? Sire, debug monitor shows player and bandits killed, so the more you have on your counter, the "cooler" you are.

So violence brings only violence, eightfold killed n00b will kill any1 on sight after 9th respawn. So di I.

I was a cheater. I spawned ammoboxes with all the stuff I needed, I used maphacks, teleports and spawned vehicles to hunt other cheaters that hunted me when I was helpless or simple players when I wanted to train myself with specific weapons. I got banned in the first wave back in June, and now I play without any cheats. But the core of community is crippled already: no penalty for being a murderous bastard, no global chat to warn people about a camper near Devil's Castle or even carma penalty in your debug monitor.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Zak_Prestor

[species5021 28]

I agree that at the moment pretty much everyone shoots on sight, and when i started this was already happening ( couple of months ago ). So it became the norm for me to shoot on sight to. But i did team up a lot still back then, and most of that was because of the chat still being active. Sure the chat doesnt make it very realistic but it did make it easier for players to band together. Although the chat was a bit of an annoyance sometimes we did lose something valuable. Even though voice direct chat still works, calling for help across side chat really showed how many helpfull people there still were. Ofcourse some devious people trapped other people but that's all in the game.

All in all i think bringing the chat back would be one of the best things to do in the growing community, give people the chance to team up directly ingame instead of over the forums where most people are to shy or to lazy to create an account and start a new topic.

Not to mention it creates instant communication with any admins currently online for reporting and illegal activity.

[klittcommander@yahoo.de 0]

Drama Drama mimimi....

We are 4 ppl in our squad. We did raid about 15 tents in the last 2 Days complete, so its possible that we've raided your tents. If u are on antother server it could be another squad. It's so f*cking easy if you have a vehicle to completle Raid other tents empty.

DayZ is no game dude.. it's an anti Game, it's Griefplay itself. The whole Zombiebros are just a little thrill in the first days. its so easy just to run from them through a building they're slowing down, Zombies gone or training other players with a horde of Zombies. Zheds are no competition anymore, they're way to easy to handle. So if "the whole server sticks together against the Zombie Armada hohoho" DayZ would get BORED. It woul be like Final Fantasy... yipiee letz do PVE 2gether *facepalm*, go back to Farmerama pls!

Dude DayZ is an Alpha, its just for having fun. Why da Hell should we do it realistic? It's so dammn buggy the time isn't worth it to play it real, in fact that throughout a bug evrything can disapear, or you just die at respawning or whatever.

If you don't like the way other ppl play, get some nightvision goggle, visit nightservers with 5/70 player. GL HF!

Srry 4 my bad english, it's not my first language.

Edited July 19, 2012 by CrazyIvan

[crazyairborne 18]

I really like the idea of getting rid of the "Kill Counter" on the screen. Numbers ruin everything. Ive been playing a week or so, but Ive already turned to the bandit side of things, just to see how high I could get my numbers. Its stupid really.(stats killed BF3 too) Have the console say "Crazy Airborne murdered Player B" and if it was a bandit you shot, have the console say something like "Crazy Airborne sought revenge on Player b" or something, just cuz i would stilll want to know if i killed a bandit or a survivor.

also this is supposed to be a sandbox, do whatever you want, you make the game right??

yet, we have to play a certain way, we have to KOS to survive.

kinda loses its sandbox ideal doesnt it?

[smudge^ 0]

Read a few pages of this thread and all I can conclude is the OP can't accept that the majority of the player base CHOOSE to play this game as a PvP game. He doesnt like it so posts on the forums. The majority of the players are choosing to kill on sight or whatever, deal with it or stop playing it really is that simple :)

[DaveAzoicer (DayZ) 135]

The issue being that PvP is the only viable option to stay alive.

There's no "cons" in being in a friendly group. You'll get killed on sight by everyone else since that's where all the benefits are.

Someone might have morphine, kill.

Someone might have a better gun, kill.

Someone might have some ammo/food, kill.

Someone is wearing a ghillie that I cant steal, kill because I'm jealous.

There's no benefits in trying to team up at this moment.

[Zak_Prestor 15]

So why did I team up in groups back in late May?

Why didn't I shoot survivor when entered a store and had seen a guy looting supposedly my gear?

Why did I help to raid NWAF to a group of n00bs, having m4a1_camo_sd and picked up from a cheater VSS vintorez (didn't know it was cheated), NVG, rangefinder, backpack and full toolbelt and none killed me for my superior stuff?

Two month ago the game had morale. Now cheaters and griefers sank in blood of newcomers.

[robciviccrx 28]

I really like the idea of getting rid of the "Kill Counter" on the screen. Numbers ruin everything. Ive been playing a week or so, but Ive already turned to the bandit side of things, just to see how high I could get my numbers. Its stupid really.(stats killed BF3 too) Have the console say "Crazy Airborne murdered Player B" and if it was a bandit you shot, have the console say something like "Crazy Airborne sought revenge on Player b" or something, just cuz i would stilll want to know if i killed a bandit or a survivor.

also this is supposed to be a sandbox, do whatever you want, you make the game right??

yet, we have to play a certain way, we have to KOS to survive.

kinda loses its sandbox ideal doesnt it?

EA and DICE ruined bf3 by dumbing it down and gearing it towards the console market, all the good stuff from 2, 2142 was taken away and replaced with "hey im getting fucked in the ass over here". :0

On topic now..

If I get the drop on a survivor I make it my business to kill them, most people tend to d/c or alt f4.

Well one time 2 of us in the firestation at NW airfield and we already shot one dude but some other guy runs in see's us runs out and starts talking over direct, comes in backwards so we could of shot him..but we left him to it and moved out. That was a rarity, personally I wont camp a place looking for kills, infact alot of times providing overwatch I have just guided my mates to the kills unless I have a clean shot.

Killing other players on sight or even after they give you something isnt griefing its increasing your odds of surviving, trusting randoms will never go well.

[gizm0 96]

EA and DICE ruined bf3 by dumbing it down and gearing it towards the console market, all the good stuff from 2, 2142 was taken away and replaced with "hey im getting fucked in the ass over here". :0

On topic now..

If I get the drop on a survivor I make it my business to kill them, most people tend to d/c or alt f4.

Well one time 2 of us in the firestation at NW airfield and we already shot one dude but some other guy runs in see's us runs out and starts talking over direct, comes in backwards so we could of shot him..but we left him to it and moved out. That was a rarity, personally I wont camp a place looking for kills, infact alot of times providing overwatch I have just guided my mates to the kills unless I have a clean shot.

Killing other players on sight or even after they give you something isnt griefing its increasing your odds of surviving, trusting randoms will never go well.

Yes, cause someone who helps you out is obviously a threat to your survival. I bet you condone those tring to kill off freeside trading as long as they clam its better for their survival.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Orthus

[heretic (DayZ) 76]

From what I've seen over the last couple of months, I'd say that there's a large, silent majority of dayz players (and former dayz players) that share this sentiment. The problem is that almost everyone who has tried to plead this case on the forums has been effectively run out of town. Actually, it's not even so much a problem of being shouted down on the forums, but rather the simple fact that rocket has repeatedly stated that his laissez-faire approach to the bandit-survivor dynamic is functioning as intended and he's been adamant in his refusals to address the issue. So, the net effect has been that most of the reasonable, sane people have effectively given up pleading for meaningful change and pretty much abandoned the game and the forums to the lowlifes. It's the societal leftovers - the griefers and trolls - who are running the asylum now. I guess that's the way rocket wants it. Welcome to dayz, motherfuckers.

i would give you beanz... but I don't have any left today :(

Good post.

Update; Beanz given. :)

Edited July 20, 2012 by heretic

[andyfuji 15]

To be worried about people because they are cold hearted in a video game is nonsense. In GTA/Saints Row I'll mow down pedestrians with a gun or vehicle and lol about it, but would never do the same IRL.

People do it in DayZ for much the same reason. It can be done, so they do it. It ruins the potential of DayZ, but it still is in Alpha and features are yet to be added that could fix it. Personally I think the Bandit Skin was a good feature that actually made people more reluctant to simply shoot on sight. It had its' flaws and needs a Redemption system.

Just because you can't physically see or hear a person doesn't make them any less real. There's a clear cut difference between games like GTA and games like DayZ that people fail to realize. We fail to realize that our opponents in a multiplayer game are real people, not AI constructs designed to be abused.

[BryceN 1]

I don't mind being killed. I bought the game 4 days ago and have died too many times to count, and I was/am still happy to create another character and do it again. I'm just losing interest in the game because there is no downside to just gunning down anything that moves. So far I have not killed a single human player, because I have never had the reason to. All my player-related deaths have been caused by players attacking me before I even get a chance to salute or holster my weapon. Yet I refuse to kill on sight and not take into account what I might do in a real life survival situation.

If I wanted a PvP bullet-fest with some zombies sprinkled in for flavor there are a lot of other games that do it a lot better.

The one time I actually didn't get shot at on sight was when the other player needed a transfusion. We chatted a bit on the way to the hospital, and he told me if I killed him he would make sure to hunt me down, but I only had an axe, and he looked like he was doing pretty well for himself and could easily take me out with his rifle before I got the chance to chop him down. So after he finished getting the blood bag, he shot me in the face. The End.

Edited July 19, 2012 by BryceN

[sreg 0]

OMG! I GOT IT! I have the perfect solution for assholes who kill for no reason!

"The Magic Backpack"

It's not really magic, but you wouldn't have something like this in real life.

Normally, if you die, you lose everything.

Now, if you are killed by a bandit and he DOESN'T LOOT YOU, you get to keep your items.

If a ZOMBIE kills you, you still lose your items.

This makes griefing less efficent and people will just ignore griefers.

[skyter 299]

Read a few pages of this thread and all I can conclude is the OP can't accept that the majority of the player base CHOOSE to play this game as a PvP game. He doesnt like it so posts on the forums. The majority of the players are choosing to kill on sight or whatever, deal with it or stop playing it really is that simple :)

But they don't, or I wouldn't have 120 beans for saying what people are thinking.

I'm not against PvP for the 100th time, I just don't like the fact there is nothing to dissuade people like there is from letting a person go. There is a down side to letting people live, as they can turn on you and kill you instantly, and 90% of the time they will, but as it stands there is no downside to killing people. That is a fact.

With out a human aspect to the game, it's just that - Another game

Don't say "heart beat" because you need to be almost next to someone for it to become noticeable, and given the current shoot to kill mindset of everyone playing, it's a little useless wouldn't you say?

The real people who are butt hurt over anything said here ARE the PvPers

[internetTAB (DayZ) 76]

lol, Rocket the bandit x)

[chewybits 2]

I couldnt agree with you more bro. This is a part that saddens me, because most of the "tools" that run around forcing me to kill on sight would probably not survive in these actual circumstances if they were ever to come true. It suck because this game could become very very inmteresting if it added in an option for bartering and whatnot. where you could trade items amongst players, or if there were "safeguarded areas" where it would be like a refugee camp where no one could kill inside of these areas and could trade items with looters that may have made it further across the map than others. just a thought. but i do hate klnowing i cvant just loot and worry about zombies, cause ive always got the feeling that im in someones crosshairs. NOTHING ticks me off more though than running around after a spawn,trig to loot supplies and getting shot, or having someone walk around with me like they are gonna watch over me till i get established, only to have them shoot me in the back of the head while looting. They waste 15 minutes of their day watching my newly spawned character getting medical supplies and keeping me company, all for what seems to be a little bit of humor for them.... TOOLS!

- chewy bits

[KField86 237]

Jesus christ, another one of these threads. Sigh.

Edited July 20, 2012 by KField86

[sreg 0]

I got ANOTHER IDEA!

"The Spawn Shop"

It's not really a shop, but just read on.

Basically, you start with 10 bonus points.

Before you spawn, you are greeted with a screen.

You can choose what you want to spawn with.

Here are some things you could spawn with and their costs.

5 Cans of Beans [4]

5 Bottles of Water [4]

1 Revolver [7]

2 Revolver Clips [3]

1 Flashlight [1]

1 Tent [4]

1 Ghillie Suit [4]

1 Map [3]

1 Binoculars [1]

1 NV [5]

1 Small Bag [2]

1 Range Finder [3]

Every time you kill another player you get 1 less point the next time you spawn.

Every time you die from another player you get 1 more point. EXAMPLE TIME!

Bob spawns. He started with 10 points. He spent all of his points on a Revolver and some ammo for it.

Joe spawns. He started with 10 points. He spent all of his points on 5 Cans of Beans, 5 Bottles of Water, a flashlight and binoculars.

Bob kills Joe. A zombie eats Bob.

Bob spawns. He now has 9 points. He cannot afford a revolver anymore.

Joe spawns. He now has 11 points. He buys a Ghillie suit, a Range Finder, a small bag and a flashlight.

Bob can't find Joe anymore.

[LumberBack 43]

It's alpha...and pvp is what makes this game

it isnt, but you keep thinking that...when i first heared about dayz, it sure as hell wasnt because of the generic pvping...