Out of bounds item/vehicles cleanup [2012-07-06]

[*=LP=*Cpt.Kawa 57]

Isn't this a sandbox game? Where everybody is free to do what they want to do. There is not one right way how this should be played. If some guys like to collect stuff' date=' fine - if some guys like to fight in cherno/elektro, fine - if some guys want to survive with a knife, matches, a hatchet and a canteen, fine.

What do you care how others play this game?

[/quote']

If everyone is free to do what they want then are you fine with hackers coming on to your server and nuking the map killing you and destroying all your gear? They're just playing the game how they want.

There's freedom, but there have to be some boundaries.

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

[DoctorWrongpipes 31]

Why are so many guys in here so butthurt about people having tent camps off map? There is no disadvantage at all for all you monkeys. Some people invest quite an amount of time to pickup those stuff and of course they want their time investment to be save. As long as there is no other ways to stash stuff other then tents and the map is as small as it is now' date=' off-map camps are perfectly fine.

Most of the guys in here are prolly to lazy to work for their gear and as they can't have some nice replacements nobody else is allowed to have some at a save place. It is not like that those items are taken out of the game, they do respawn for others as well. So I actually don't get it why off-map camps shouldn't be allowed...

[/quote']

Because I'd rather have people find a hiding place for their camp instead of random distance and direction from some landmark like NE airfield.

Yes, this increases the chances of someone finding the camp drastically. But whats the point of 100% safe camp? Should we remove zombies and pvp too so you don't accidentally die and lose the gear you have on your character?

Where did anybody say we should remove zombies and pvp? And if I die I still loose my gear. And what's the point of not having a save camp? You die, you lose your gear but then someone with a nice stash has some gear back faster, because he worked for it in advance. Basically you don't have any arguments against off-map camps in addition to your feelings what should be right and what not. And then you are pulling this zombie and pvp BS.

Isn't this a sandbox game? Where everybody is free to do what they want to do. There is not one right way how this should be played. If some guys like to collect stuff, fine - if some guys like to fight in cherno/elektro, fine - if some guys want to survive with a knife, matches, a hatchet and a canteen, fine.

What do you care how others play this game?

---

Why are so many guys in here so butthurt about people having tent camps off map? There is no disadvantage at all for all you monkeys. Some people invest quite an amount of time to pickup those stuff and of course they want their time investment to be save. As long as there is no other ways to stash stuff other then tents and the map is as small as it is now' date=' off-map camps are perfectly fine.

Most of the guys in here are prolly to lazy to work for their gear and as they can't have some nice replacements nobody else is allowed to have some at a save place. It is not like that those items are taken out of the game, they do respawn for others as well. So I actually don't get it why off-map camps shouldn't be allowed...

[/quote']

My Butthurt sense is tingling.

Vehicles don't respawn if you take them off the map (currently that is).

I didn't refer to vehicles in my post. As they are only available in very small numbers atm it is perfectly fine if they get wiped.

What good is a camp 5-10kms outside the map where noone will find it without vehicles?

Do you always walk there and back for over 2 hours?

No our camps are very close to the map edge. And why do you care about the good or bad of having a camp 5-10kms off map and walking there for 2 hours. Maybe some people just like to walk ingame idk and I don't really care, if a camp off-map even 20km makes them happy so let them have it. What harm are you talking form such camps?

The operative word here is 'off-map'. Outside of the sandbox area. An exploit. A misuse of the engine. A cheat.

The negative responses to this news are from the players who've likely been item-duping, building duped item/tent cities and needlessly hoarding more vehicles than they or their exploiting friends could possibly need.

Every player wants to keep hold of their gear, sure, but the golden rule in this game is to not get too attached to what you're carrying. Expect to lose it. Respawn. Rinse. Repeat.

This news means the out-of-bounds exploiters have to be strategic with their camp placement and take the risks with vehicles and gear that the rest of us have to.

Now to the DC'ers, please! (probably the same guys tbh)

[*=LP=*Cpt.Kawa 57]

Oh well..so people with off-maps tents are cheaters, hackers, dc'ers, right...you are one ridiculous monkey.

Well and at this point it shouldn't be done as said by some dev without actually giving any reasons. But isn't this alpha and shouldn't be things discussed? But I guess this alpha-argument only is reasonable when it fits the feelings of some righteous people who know how this game should be played. And actually I think there is a flaw in the "don't-get-attached-to your-gear" argument. If you are not attached to anything where should the emotions come from in this game. To make this experience work, you have to get attached very close to your stuff and your live. If not it is really only respawn-rinse-repeat.

[Niemand (DayZ) 12]

Guess now it's not about hiding camps it's defending them. If you don't have the muscle to defend your camp imo you have no business having one in the first place.

Yes groups may have to get larger and cover all timezones. Player groups in other persistant games manage 24 hour defence very well indeed. But only the strong ones survive. The week get kicked out.

With limited people on a server at one time this will be a challenge. Not saying it will be easy but no one can defend having a map play area in game and then that map has no boundary. Removing items from a sandbox which is in effect what happens is not good.

Things are gonna get interesting.

Adapt or die... It's the Apocalypse.

How can you await from us to be online and defend our camp 24 hours a day? I, and I bet lots of other people have not the time for that. People have to work or go to school/university. We cant sit in front of our PC 24/7.

24 hours - 8 hours sleep = 16 hours - 10 hours work = 6 hours - 1 hour eating/bathroom-times = 5 hours.

and in those 5 hours people do not always want to play DayZ. once in a while you need to play something else or just watch a movie. Or you gotta wash the dishes or clothes or whatever. Mommy and Daddy will not be around forever, you gotta do your shit yourself one time.

This is a game. If this were real life - what its not - there would not be a problem in defending the camp 24/7. But this way? Its not.

I would love to hide my camp, too. But as stated already: the map is too small. I already put only cheap stuff in the tents and expect it to be found within 24h. And still they were found (a body was next to them) and empty. But I think it was the bug that made our tents empty. because no one would be stupid enough to take civilian clothing out of the tent. :D

TL;DR: Defending camps is not possible when you are not jobless in Real Life.

[andfol1@hotmail.com 0]

what exactly is concidered to be "off-map"? where the ingamemap shows a the terrain in a slilgthly different color or the end of the maps you find of Chernarus online? such as http://media.taterunino.net/Chernarus.jpg our camp is within the the ingame map edge but not visible on online maps, should we move the camp?

[alienfreak 6]

Isn't this a sandbox game? Where everybody is free to do what they want to do. There is not one right way how this should be played. If some guys like to collect stuff' date=' fine - if some guys like to fight in cherno/elektro, fine - if some guys want to survive with a knife, matches, a hatchet and a canteen, fine.

What do you care how others play this game?

[/quote']

If everyone is free to do what they want then are you fine with hackers coming on to your server and nuking the map killing you and destroying all your gear? They're just playing the game how they want.

There's freedom, but there have to be some boundaries.

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

Using the correct term it would be exploiting.

And off map tent cities are really bad because of people duping and then storing their 20 NVGs and 20GPS and 20 M4SDs and 20 DMRs and 20 L85A2 CWS there.

And believe me. I have run over quite a lot of off map tents with vehicles and 4 out of 5 of them had simply impossible amounts of tents with impossible amounts of loot in them.

---

what exactly is concidered to be "off-map"? where the ingamemap shows a the terrain in a slilgthly different color or the end of the maps you find of Chernarus online? such as http://media.taterunino.net/Chernarus.jpg our camp is within the the ingame map edge but not visible on online maps' date=' should we move the camp?

[/quote']

Did you even bother reading the thread?

Read it and then oyu will have your answer.

[*=LP=*Cpt.Kawa 57]

Isn't this a sandbox game? Where everybody is free to do what they want to do. There is not one right way how this should be played. If some guys like to collect stuff' date=' fine - if some guys like to fight in cherno/elektro, fine - if some guys want to survive with a knife, matches, a hatchet and a canteen, fine.

What do you care how others play this game?

[/quote']

If everyone is free to do what they want then are you fine with hackers coming on to your server and nuking the map killing you and destroying all your gear? They're just playing the game how they want.

There's freedom, but there have to be some boundaries.

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

Using the correct term it would be exploiting.

And off map tent cities are really bad because of people duping and then storing their 20 NVGs and 20GPS and 20 M4SDs and 20 DMRs and 20 L85A2 CWS there.

And believe me. I have run over quite a lot of off map tents with vehicles and 4 out of 5 of them had simply impossible amounts of tents with impossible amounts of loot in them.

---

what exactly is concidered to be "off-map"? where the ingamemap shows a the terrain in a slilgthly different color or the end of the maps you find of Chernarus online? such as http://media.taterunino.net/Chernarus.jpg our camp is within the the ingame map edge but not visible on online maps' date=' should we move the camp?

[/quote']

Did you even bother reading the thread?

Read it and then oyu will have your answer.

And to remove off -map tents will keep people from duping? Really..?

[Spider0804 0]

One of the best fixes yet.

Suckle the sweet teet of justice you off-mappers.

Now you have to play with the same conditions as legit players.

Next its going to be "Oh herp derp I didnt know duping was an exploit as it was not explicitly said it was."

[Azrail (DayZ) 211]

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

you are clearly not meant to camp off the map.

the map has a border for a reason.

going off the map to hide your stuff from others is effectively making your stuff 'save' when it shouldn't be.

keeping items safe from others is contradicting the idea of perma death, defeating the whole point of this mod.

that's common sense now, isn't it?

so, building a camp of the map can be considered breaking a rule, like cheating.

there is this set of rules you need to follow, there is no exceptions like "but my tent is just behind the hill close to the border"

you have to draw a line for everyone not to step over, and in this case the map border literally is said line.

you can consider yourself lucky you won't be banned for it.

or maybe you will o.O

[mofokk 6]

How the fuck are people trying to justify the use of off map tent camps because the map is TOO SMALL. here is my suggestion. don't put all your tents up in one location /facepalm.

damage limitation when compromised and overly visible to others.

I use a network of single tents and have still got 3 yet to be compromised since the tent wipe. and yes they are on the map not out of bounds.

[*=LP=*Cpt.Kawa 57]

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

you are clearly not meant to camp off the map.

the map has a border for a reason.

thats common sense now' date=' isn't it?

so, building a camp of the map can be considered breaking a rule, like cheating.

you can consider yourself lucky you won't be banned for it.

or maybe you will o.O

[/quote']

That is not a cheat at all as you don't fkin manipulate the game. What's wrong with you? Hacking, cheating, duping...its some fkin storage. Maybe it is breaking a virtual rule, I'll give you that. But it isn't a real border, is it? And what reason would that be?

Maybe it is off-map now in some narrow minded persons view, but what would be the reasons to not make it "legit"?

But I guess the righteous people win, who are knowing how this game is meant to be played...

[Robert512 12]

Lovely, more oppertunities for the lone wolfes who prowl the North regions.

If there is one thing you can learn from the Walking Death is that permanent settlements are difficult to maintain, and they usually don't have to move house because of the Zeds becomming obnoxious, its the others.

This will restore a bit of the balance between different types of gameplay, hoarders have to learn to make smaller camps, if possible and practical guard them round the clock or at least during times when the server is crowded, wich will be during daytime most of the time.

This is where barbed wire, tanktraps, sandbags and the new beartraps will come in to play, use them wisely, if you do than it will be possible to guard a camp with only 1 or 2 persons, and leave it unattended at nights. So are you going to fence in a good loot spawn or the place where you store your loot?

[Jenkss 0]

Sounds good.

Still never actually seen anyone driving a vehicle in multiple months of play time and only found one campsite.

They wanna go to the effort of hording items, they should make realistic sites. Have the chance of losing them.

Will make for a much cooler game overall

[hooumeri 3]

Realism my ass, the current map size is too small to hide any vehicles properly. By that I mean hiding them with a chance of them being where you left them after you come back from dinner.

Hiding helicopters will be impossible. If it were realistic I could just fuel my shit to its full and fly far out of the infected area. Anyone who hasn't gotten vehicles legitimately (not just walk into one or not just spawn one *cough*) can't understand how big of a task it is to a) fix the vehicle b) hide it properly.

I am aware of the fact that nothing can be hidden perfectly, I am not asking for that. But the current map size is too small to hide any vehicles. You have just ruined the core aspect of DayZ for me. Finding someone else's vehicle is supposed to happen on the road when they're driving, fuelling or fixing their car on the roadside. Not walk 20 minutes on the borders of the map and find them without doing pretty much any effort for it. 2-3 players can EASILY scavenge the most obvious hiding places for vehicles within an hour, just walk within a few hundred meters of each other starting from west going all the way up north and then going east. Any other forest is irrelevant as they're too heavy with traffic.

Yes, I mad. Give us locks, something to hide the vehicles with or rafts.. Something to protect what we have scavenged for more than a day.

Reading this topic proves my point, this update only helps noobs who have never even seen vehicles. Maybe leave the fucking coast and look for them in the already too obvious spots, that's what I've done and that's how I've gotten my vehicles (which were stolen by ESP hackers, thank you).

This is where barbed wire, tanktraps, sandbags and the new beartraps will come in to play, use them wisely, if you do than it will be possible to guard a camp with only 1 or 2 persons, and leave it unattended at nights.

My ass, if you have a toolbox and you're not a fucking mole you can easily detect all of these and scavenge the camp.

Making the mod too noob friendly, that's what is happening. rocket always wanted to keep this as harsh for the beginners as possible, and now this?

[alienfreak 6]

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

you are clearly not meant to camp off the map.

the map has a border for a reason.

thats common sense now' date=' isn't it?

so, building a camp of the map can be considered breaking a rule, like cheating.

you can consider yourself lucky you won't be banned for it.

or maybe you will o.O

[/quote']

That is not a cheat at all as you don't fkin manipulate the game. What's wrong with you? Hacking, cheating, duping...its some fkin storage. Maybe it is breaking a virtual rule, I'll give you that. But it isn't a real border, is it? And what reason would that be?

Maybe it is off-map now in some narrow minded persons view, but what would be the reasons to not make it "legit"?

But I guess the righteous people win, who are knowing how this game is meant to be played...

Rocket and the other developers repeatadly said that you are not supposed to make camps there.

So yes, we know how this game is meant to be played

[Azrail (DayZ) 211]

Maybe it is breaking a virtual rule' date=' I'll give you that. But it isn't a real border, is it? And what reason would that be?

[/quote']

its a virtual rule and a virtual border, in a virtual world... i don't really get your point... rules are to be followed, borders not to be crossed. virtual or not.

Maybe it is off-map now in some narrow minded persons view' date=' but what would be the reasons to not make it "legit"?

[/quote']

i made my point clear in my post, saving items from other players doesn't play well in a perma-death game.

But I guess the righteous people win' date=' who are knowing how this game is meant to be played...

[/quote']

so it shall be.

[alienfreak 6]

Realism my ass' date=' the current map size is too small to hide any vehicles properly. By that I mean hiding them with a chance of them being where you left them after you come back from dinner.

Hiding helicopters will be impossible. If it were realistic I could just fuel my shit to its full and fly far out of the infected area. Anyone who hasn't gotten vehicles legitimately (not just walk into one or not just spawn one *cough*) can't understand how big of a task it is to a) fix the vehicle b) hide it properly.

I am aware of the fact that nothing can be hidden perfectly, I am not asking for that. But the current map size is too small to hide any vehicles. You have just ruined the core aspect of DayZ for me. Finding someone else's vehicle is supposed to happen on the road when they're driving, fuelling or fixing their car on the roadside. Not walk 20 minutes on the borders of the map and find them without doing pretty much any effort for it. 2-3 players can EASILY scavenge the most obvious hiding places for vehicles within an hour, just walk within a few hundred meters of each other starting from west going all the way up north and then going east. Any other forest is irrelevant as they're too heavy with traffic.

Yes, I mad. Give us locks, something to hide the vehicles with or rafts.. Something to protect what we have scavenged for more than a day.

Reading this topic proves my point, this update only helps noobs who have never even seen vehicles. Maybe leave the fucking coast and look for them in the already too obvious spots, that's what I've done and that's how I've gotten my vehicles (which were stolen by ESP hackers, thank you).

Making the mod too noob friendly, that's what is happening. rocket always wanted to keep this as harsh for the beginners as possible, and now this?

[/quote']

What if you are not allowed to fly out or the whole world is infected`?

But the problem lies in the "realism" TBH. Nobody would be Teleporting into another dimension for two weeks suring a zombie outbreak and leave his stuff there unattended.

Peopl would have camps and during the times they are not out hunting they will be there, effectively protecting their camp. Or they would even leave behind one guy who watches over their stuff.

But sadly we have a life. And as such we may be on holidays or just offline during the night. So your stuff is unprotected like 99.9% of the time (you are there only really small parts of your time). Unlike the 30-40% what would be realistic if you were only two guys always going out together.

The only realistic implementation would be to tie things to an account and spawn/despawn them with the characters of that account. So if you are online but not at your camp it will be unprotected.

If you are not online I would consider it that you are at your camp and protecting it.

If you are online and someone finds your tent/vehicle you are screwed and it is either plundered or now even tied to him. But if you are on your well earned holidays in the carribean not your tent and vehicles (7 days...) will be lost or plundered with nearly a 99% chance.

But as rocket is a premium game designer one can only dream about a game not premium designed for unemployed internet addicts.

[penox 2]

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

you are clearly not meant to camp off the map.

the map has a border for a reason.

thats common sense now' date=' isn't it?

so, building a camp of the map can be considered breaking a rule, like cheating.

you can consider yourself lucky you won't be banned for it.

or maybe you will o.O

[/quote']

That is not a cheat at all as you don't fkin manipulate the game. What's wrong with you? Hacking, cheating, duping...its some fkin storage. Maybe it is breaking a virtual rule, I'll give you that. But it isn't a real border, is it? And what reason would that be?

Maybe it is off-map now in some narrow minded persons view, but what would be the reasons to not make it "legit"?

But I guess the righteous people win, who are knowing how this game is meant to be played...

All I have to say... BUTTHURT MUCH?

[Robert512 12]

This is where barbed wire' date=' tanktraps, sandbags and the new beartraps will come in to play, use them wisely, if you do than it will be possible to guard a camp with only 1 or 2 persons, and leave it unattended at nights.[/quote']

My ass, if you have a toolbox and you're not a fucking mole you can easily detect all of these and scavenge the camp.

So where is the person watching me trough a scope with his finger on the trigger?

[WalkerDown (DayZ) 296]

@DEV: need clarifications. The h24 thing is just for the first time (now), so you have 24h to save your stuff or you'll loose it. But then the stuff off-map will be cleared "immediately" (or randomly) even if used once within 24h right? Otherwise i may just leave an alt account there and use it to move those vehicles once a day.

[Preslei 6]

Any argument AGAINST this, is just proof that too many people went far beyond what the devs told you to do, in order for you to play the way you guys want to.

The argument that this makes it noob friendly: How so? Those of you who hide things in the barren, and far off parts of Debug plains, are stupid and trying to play cautiously as opposed to risking it by finding a proper, in-bounds hiding spot. Who is the noob now?

I was walking along the border of the map, which does and always has existed, for a reason. I found three vehicles off in the plains beyond the border. What is the reason? Get the one, or two cars you need, don't hoard because you're a jackass. This is meant to be a survival game, and no, that does not mean everything will be realistic. Don't make an argument for realism.

The Devs are making this game mode.

They set the rules.

They call the shots.

Most importantly, if anyone knows how this game is intended to be played, it is them.

Any arguments against that are those who don't want to follow their rules.

[*=LP=*Cpt.Kawa 57]

its a virtual rule and a virtual border' date=' in a virtual world... i don't really get your point... rules are to be followed, borders not to be crossed. virtual or not.[/quote']

My point is, the map was made bigger way bigger, but not yet modelled. If one would be referring to game mechanics than this off-map rule is virtual as it is possible (without manipulating the game) to go off-map. Thats why it is a virtual rule.

i made my point clear in my post' date=' saving items from other players doesn't play well in a perma-death game.[/quote']

Nobody is preserving items form players in the 1st place. Just go out there and find them yourself, how about that? And isn't a "perma-death" game exactly the best reason to get your gear to the safest place possible.

so it shall be.

I couldn't really find a explanation form the devs why off-map tents shouldn't be used.

Development doesn't exactly happen by sticking to the rules. But I guess it is better to play it "the right way" instead of making some development progress.

[Azrail (DayZ) 211]

@DEV: need clarifications. The h24 thing is just for the first time (now)' date=' so you have 24h to save your stuff or you'll loose it. But then the stuff off-map will be cleared "immediately" (or randomly) even if used once within 24h right? Otherwise i may just leave an alt account there and use it to move those vehicles once a day.

[/quote']

really? people pay another 30 bucks to keep their ingame items save?

and i bet they cry twice as much when they ragequit.

[pvt_ammo@hotmail.com 164]

So you are saying that off-map tents are the same as hacking? Its the same as the guy before with his zombie and pvp-removal BS. What harm is done by off-map tents and what harm is done by hacking? If you don't have any arguments don't just try to pull some BS.

you are clearly not meant to camp off the map.

the map has a border for a reason.

thats common sense now' date=' isn't it?

so, building a camp of the map can be considered breaking a rule, like cheating.

you can consider yourself lucky you won't be banned for it.

or maybe you will o.O

[/quote']

That is not a cheat at all as you don't fkin manipulate the game. What's wrong with you? Hacking, cheating, duping...its some fkin storage. Maybe it is breaking a virtual rule, I'll give you that. But it isn't a real border, is it? And what reason would that be?

Maybe it is off-map now in some narrow minded persons view, but what would be the reasons to not make it "legit"?

But I guess the righteous people win, who are knowing how this game is meant to be played...

Sorry Kawa, but you're an idiot if you cannot see the benefits to game play as a whole by restricting these activities outside the map bounds.

You're also an idiot if you think saving tents/vehicles outside of map bounds is a legit way to play the game. By your definition, if I'm playing a game of football, it's ok for me you take the ball and hide it in the parking lot.

[jsteph87@live.com 1]

Just made hiding choppers impossible.