no to KoS - dayz cinematic

[Coday 248]

It's about time. My last notoKoS-video is 5 years ago and KoS players still represent a large part of the player base. However, at the moment, there isn't more KoS than some years ago (according to my experiences).

Please let me know if you have any feedback (criticism / improvement suggestions)! Thanks 🙂

 

 

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

Good luck with that! KOS is one of the worst impairments to an interesting gameplay in DayZ, definitely worse than all the bugs combined.

I recommend checking out various servers, HC with night seems to involve less KOS. Also, DUG servers limit ammo spawns a lot, this definitely affects players' behaviour.

Keep it up, hope to see you around in Chernarus!

[lex__1 168]

There are private server - RP. They work rules that prohibit KoS without cause, or KoS outside certain areas for KoS. Violation of the rules - a ban.

[Kirov (DayZ) 585]

16 hours ago, lex__1 said:

There are private server - RP. They work rules that prohibit KoS without cause, or KoS outside certain areas for KoS. Violation of the rules - a ban.

I believe that the OP had a different point to make (that on servers without any rules, KoS still shouldn't be the default).

[Coday 248]

On 11/25/2019 at 4:22 PM, Kirov (DayZ) said:

Good luck with that! KOS is one of the worst impairments to an interesting gameplay in DayZ, definitely worse than all the bugs combined.

I recommend checking out various servers, HC with night seems to involve less KOS. Also, DUG servers limit ammo spawns a lot, this definitely affects players' behaviour.

Keep it up, hope to see you around in Chernarus!

Thank you very much. Sometimes I play on hc servers or on 1st-person-only servers. 

On 11/25/2019 at 11:13 PM, lex__1 said:

There are private server - RP. They work rules that prohibit KoS without cause, or KoS outside certain areas for KoS. Violation of the rules - a ban.

The video has a preface because of arguments like that. Read it.

RP Servers which forbid KoS or that have specific zones lack tension. 

On 11/26/2019 at 3:39 PM, Kirov (DayZ) said:

I believe that the OP had a different point to make (that on servers without any rules, KoS still shouldn't be the default).

Thank you!

[William Sternritter 449]

15 hours ago, Coday said:

The video has a preface because of arguments like that. Read it.

RP Servers which forbid KoS or that have specific zones lack tension. 

Sorry what exactly are you looking for then? Because the tension comes from the fact that you have no idea what the other person will do. If everyone adopts no KoS approach then again, you have no tension just as if there was a rule or zone. You can't have both. 

[William Sternritter 449]

@Coday, honestly I'm in fact quite confused by your video. You show us clips where you have previous interaction with the players before the shooting starts. That alone hardly qualifies as KoS. People don't always talk and people who decide to shoot at you mid action are just assholes, but far from KoS. That is just good old backstabbing. Not to mention that your clips show a lot of military areas and people are jumpy in those in general. I myself, go into military areas with the mindset of shoot first and ask later.

Moreover, there is specifically a clip of you aiming at another player demanding that they put their hands up. And you're confused why they shot at you. Really? If I was that other player I would shoot too and without hesitation. I've had quite a few interactions which started with weapons in hands on both sides but they all ended with talking, item exchange and even looting a town together and then parting separate ways. You know why? Because no one started the interaction with put your hands up. If you want to insert control into the situation that is understandable, but this is also an escalation. It is a very risky start, especially if you're alone, and you can't expect people to submit just because. Oh and it absolutely does not qualify as KoS on the other player's part. If you don't want to shoot, just don't shoot dude.

I had a player give the bird once as we met in a doorway, it was very early on I had a gun in hand and apparently the other player though I'll shoot. I guess I could aim at him and whatnot, but my intention was to move on. So I did. No one spoke a single word. 

[Coday 248]

On 11/28/2019 at 9:22 AM, William Sternritter said:

Sorry what exactly are you looking for then? Because the tension comes from the fact that you have no idea what the other person will do. If everyone adopts no KoS approach then again, you have no tension just as if there was a rule or zone. You can't have both. 

You are right but the video still has a preface. Why is no one able to read it?

 

On 11/28/2019 at 10:25 AM, William Sternritter said:

You show us clips where you have previous interaction with the players before the shooting starts. That alone hardly qualifies as KoS.

Everyone knows how KoS looks like. I showed these clips because they matched the commentary. 

 

On 11/28/2019 at 10:25 AM, William Sternritter said:

Not to mention that your clips show a lot of military areas

Military areas in the spawn area. According to my opinion that are areas you can loot quickly and pass through, move on inland ...

 

On 11/28/2019 at 10:25 AM, William Sternritter said:

you aiming at another player demanding that they put their hands up. And you're confused why they shot at you. Really?

A hold-up is the safest way to approach an armed player. The clips should demonstrate (in relation to the clip before) that giving up can be helpful. I don't get why people prefer to die instead of surviving a hold-up. If there is no hope for killing the robber or if resistance is absolutely hopeless it is just dumb to resist. 

 

On 11/28/2019 at 10:25 AM, William Sternritter said:

I've had quite a few interactions which started with weapons in hands on both sides but they all ended with talking, item exchange and even looting a town together and then parting separate ways. You know why? Because no one started the interaction with put your hands up.

I've had these as well. Many of my videos show that. I often tell these players that everyone can shoulder his weapon and after that the situation is "defused" for the moment. 

[William Sternritter 449]

If I'm right than the preface of your video perhaps does not answer the question. Also the question is aimed at your words here, not at the preface of the video. Preface of your video is by the way even more vague than your words here. I understand the appeal but you realize that ironically trying a different playstyle may be KoS, right?

Military area is a military area, regardless of its location.

Hold-ups are good if you have an advantage in numbers. Otherwise it's a quick draw stand off. If you do not understand why people defend themselves that's fine, just don't be surprised by it. But it does go back to the whole tension thing. You never know how the situation will go. You just assume from your position, this is the best way to handle it, but even if it works 10 times for you, situation 11 may go horribly wrong. Still dude, srsly, if you point a gun at someone's face, expect a bullet to the head. 

[William Sternritter 449]

@Coday, I'd like to break down the first encounter on the stairwell to clarify what I mean, because to me it stands out as the most obvious of how your good intentions basically cost you your life for no reason. My point of view is that your appeal is good, but your execution is flawed. 

Now, on surface you're right and we can simply write it all off as the other guy being a dick. I've met more than enough people who would not acknowledge in any way just start shooting, but ... 🙂 

1. You're in a military area, as wrote above people are jumpy there
2. You tell me, but I have a suspicion that you knew the guy was there and you approached him deliberately 
3. Not everyone talks, sorry but that is the state of things. You calling the guy out about it is just dumb. In a stress situation like this you act first, then care about stuff like coms and your remarks just may make the guy say to himself, screw you. 
4. You see that the other guy does not communicate, does not put his gun away but you still press forward. This is why I doubt this as a KoS encounter. You had all the time in the world to walk away from there. It's not just about the other guy but also about you
5. And here's the big one, because the points above for me are little missteps that alone do not create a shooting scenario yet. Let's suppose the guy would be friendly and would not want to kill you. Do you realize where you're both standing? On a stairwell, basically a choke point. Which means in order for the other guy to move forward without hurting you, he must pass next to you in a confined space. You, a stranger that he does not know and has no reason to trust. I personally would never let that happen. You would have to leave the building and I would come out after you and then we can part our ways. Because I'm not taking the change that as soon as we're point blank, you will not pull a surprise shotgun, try to tie me up or some shit like that. So if you stand where you are or even more towards me ... yeah you're dead and  it's not a KoS situation.

Hope this gives you a slightly different perspective and you have better encounter in the future 🙂

[Coday 248]

@William Sternritter thanks for your detailled explanation. I understand your point of view but I think differently. Btw, concerning your very first comment the preface answers everything.

[aaronlands 55]

Gotta go with @William Sternritter on this one, at least in terms of general strategic methods.  It's a careful balance when dealing with players.  If you insult players too much (and that unfortunately can mean asking them to put their hands up or as my brother does, yelling: "Strip!") it can activate a sort of kamikaze mode.  I find often it is best to establish communication but keep distance and objects and buildings in between.  I've definitely had encounters which started out with both having their guns drawn.  I never really get angry at KoS because I understand that people will respond in such different ways that I have to account for that when approaching anyone. 

This is an aside but, really DayZ is the embodiment of the Hobbesian state of nature where no one has laid down their absolute rights in return for a social contract.  In other words, I know that you know that you can kill me at any moment's notice to get your way.  Hobbes said it best: 

"In such condition [state of nature], there is no place for industry; because the fruit thereof is uncertain: and consequently no culture of the earth; no navigation, nor use of the commodities that may be imported by sea; no commodious building; no instruments of moving, and removing, such things as require much force; no knowledge of the face of the earth; no account of time; no arts; no letters; no society; and which is worst of all, continual fear, and danger of violent death; and the life of man, solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short."

 

Vigilante Gamer, which was recommended to me by another user on this forum, has a collection of YouTube videos that while old still stand the test of time.  He has a video series on approaching other dangerous players (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q51PFEBlKDw) and one where he applies Sun Tzu's Art of War to DayZ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fn9gcOOjnvA

 

Edited November 29, 2019 by aaronlands

[-Gews- 7443]

7 hours ago, aaronlands said:

 It's a careful balance when dealing with players.  If you insult players too much (and that unfortunately can mean asking them to put their hands up or as my brother does, yelling: "Strip!") it can activate a sort of kamikaze mode.

Yes, if a player tries to order me around, I will shoot at them. How disrespectful. Eg:

"Put your weapon away."

no u