Ebrim goes foraging! (forage yield experiment 0.56 exp)

[ebrim 998]

Introduction and Why: So earlier it was suggested that survival is incredibly difficult in 0.56 experimental and I wanted to give some idea, number-wise of how foraging really can sustain you, foraging alone but realized I had no numbers to do so. This of course is not limited to 0.56 exp, I've seen many claims of people spending a half-hour foraging only to die 10 minutes later and similar seemingly outrageous things. This went well against my own experience as I felt I had in not very long foraging been able to sustain myself with little stops here and there, enough to stay alive and get to less traffic areas of the map. Still though, without data, these are just ideas so this afternoon I did some testing...

 

Method: Sitting at one berry bush and then one apple tree in Rogovo I foraged for 5 2-minute intervals. So ultimately I foraged a total of 10 minutes at one berry busy and 10 minutes at one apple tree on US Northeast 1pp experimental server. I used the stopwatch on my phone, watched the entire animation before hitting "f" again and never went more than 5 seconds past 2 minutes to let an animation finish.

 

Results! (energy and hydration values sourced here.

 

Apples, 2 minute trials

1st trial: 2 apples

2nd trial: 6 apples

3rd trial: 6 apples

4th trial: 5 apples

5th trial: 2 apples

 

Total for 10 minutes: 21 apples

Avg apples per minute: 2.1

Total energy gained from apples: 1449 kcal

Total hydration gained from apples: 3612 ml

 

Berries, 2 minute trials

1st trial: 5 berries

2nd trial: 6 berries

3rd trial: 3 berries

4th trial: 4 berries

5th trial: 7 berries

 

Total for 10 minutes: 25 berries

Avg berries per minute: 2.5

Total energy gained from berries: 1750 kcal

Total hydration gained from berries: 100 ml

 

Total Energy gained from 20 minutes of foraging: 3199 kcal

Total Hydration gained from 20 minutes of foraging: 3712 ml

 

What the hell does all this mean?: I'm a nerd! But also... 10 minutes of foraging either apples or berries will get you more calories than a can of peaches and either drastically more and a quarter as much hydration and more than triple the energy of most other canned foods. Maybe this doesn't sound like a lot but keep in mind that I'm idle while doing this, meaning that I'm burning the minimum amount of calories, far less than even walking. In addition to burning minimal calories while foraging, in the 20 minutes I gained nearly as much as energy as you would get from eating an entire bag of rice (3740 kcal) while not suffering the dehydration effects.

 

So why the hell does it feel like it takes so long?: Well, finding canned/dry foods is rarely what one is specifically seeking to do. Instead, one is often "looting" when doing this, not searching for anything specifically. When foraging, you're only gathering food or as I like to say, you are trading time for energy. I'd suggest if you are foraging, set a timer for 2 minutes while you do it, this way it feels like goes much faster I found doing these trials. And you're actually getting a significant reward for the time spent.

 

Are you suggesting I forage for 20 minutes?: Definitely not. My advice is always: forage to stay alive, perhaps do no more than two minutes at a time to keep yourself from starving but don't try to get energized doing this. Keep yourself alive by foraging and then go check what's in that next shed, or the next town. Maybe you'll run into a chicken, maybe you'll find a can of beans, maybe you'll find that rifle you've been looking for and now can hunt.

 

----

 

Please, discuss. :)

Edited May 21, 2015 by Ebrim

[Coheed_IV 381]

You've been berry busy.

 

[ebrim 998]

Oh and pictures!

 

During apple trials (let none go to waste!)

 

During berry trials! (berries are being hidden in "vicinity" behind other berries)

[SaveMeJebus 164]

Just out of curiosity is there any way to figure out how much energy/hydration you burnt during those intervals? 

[Whyherro123 2283]

So then, let us discuss the possibilities of "other" foraging, AKA other plants. The models for which are already in-game

 

Cat-tail: If you pay attention to the plants you can see alongside a watersource (pond, stream, the ocean weirdly enough,) cat-tail will be one of them that stick out the most, alongside "generic" (which are useful in and of themselves) water-reeds. 

 

 

cat-tail are INCREDIBLY useful for survival, with uses ranging from food, to bedding, to firestarting, to medicine, to cordage and weaving material. The Scouts have a saying:"If you find cattail, you have food, water and fire".  This is because cattails only grow in water free of pollutants. You still should boil/treat the water, but it is relatively clean

 

http://prepforshtf.com/survival-uses-for-cattails/#.VV0tZ_lVhBc

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-cattail.htm

 

The "food" aspect of cattail is important, as the roots actually contain more starch per weight than potato. A good-sized cattail plant will fill you up and keep you going for hours of hiking, all in an easy-to-gather, easy-to-cook package.

 

"Weeds": These are plants that often grow in margin-lands, aka old field and such, that actually are rather good for you, being high in Vitamin C, as well as being tasty. The easiest to recognize are Dandelion, Chicory, and Goldenrod. Goldenrod is visible in-game, as the large single-stemmed plants with spreading tufts of flowers, and dandelions and chicory can really be found anywhere grass could grow. Nearly all of the chicory and Dandelion plants is edible, and Goldenrod can be used to make teas, as well as a flour substitute in breads.

 

http://ultimatesurvivaltips.com/goldenrods-bum-wrap-clearing-this-helpful-herb/

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-dandelion.htm

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-chicory.htm

 

 

Plantain: Another useful "foragable" is Plantain. The leaves are edible, and it can be used as a poultice to treat pain, as a tea to treat diarrhea, or the seeds and seed husks as a laxative.

 

 

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-plantain-broad-and-narrow-leaf.htm

 

There are many many more plants that I have noticed in-game that would either be edible, serve as "backwoods medicine", or be otherwise useful in survival. The devs just have to add "uses" for the model.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Whyherro123

[Unforeseen 24]

I haven't found a single berry or apple in the last 500 attempts. I gave up. It was sooooooo irritating.

[IAmWattsLive 5]

You know what they say. 21 apples a day keeps the doctors away :p 

 

Thanks for the post brotha!

[Whyherro123 2283]

I haven't found a single berry or apple in the last 500 attempts. I gave up. It was sooooooo irritating.

Then you are lying. Simple as that.

 

By statistical probability alone, you would have found at least one fruit for every 30 searches, at the VERY LEAST.

 

And I have found more than that.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Whyherro123

[Coheed_IV 381]

Cat-tail: If you pay attention to the plants you can see alongside a watersource (pond, stream, the ocean weirdly enough,)

Isn't it the Caspian Sea? Still right though, not sure about Cat-tail there? Not sure how the LHD got in there with A2.

[Whyherro123 2283]

Isn't it the Caspian Sea? Still right though, not sure about Cat-tail there? Not sure how the LHD got in there with A2.

By the fact that you can only catch sardines in the ocean, and the "improvised fishing trap" can only be put into saltwater, the "Green Sea" (the body of water that Chernarus lies on) is apparently saltwater.

 

And cattails grow worldwide.

[ebrim 998]

Just out of curiosity is there any way to figure out how much energy/hydration you burnt during those intervals? 

 

So the only data I know about passive and active energy consumption is probably old and outdated from this

. If we assume I was idle for 20 minutes and active for 1 minute (moving from bush to tree), I burnt 95 kcal worth of energy according to these numbers. Similarly if I had been active the whole time (looting) I would have burnt 315kcal. That said, these numbers have likely been tweaked a good bit since this video was made, especially when character heat comfort was introduced. The general consensus is that sprinting uses more energy than jogging now which didn't seem to be the case when this video was made so take these estimates very lightly. Edited May 21, 2015 by Ebrim

[Coheed_IV 381]

Yeah, good info on cattail. I would like to see much more in terms of fire starter and cordage. What's in game is too simple. How do they work for fire starter in damp weather?

[Whyherro123 2283]

Yeah, good info on cattail. I would like to see much more in terms of fire starter and cordage. What's in game is too simple. How do they work for fire starter in damp weather?

 

[Deathlove 2286]

So then, let us discuss the possibilities of "other" foraging, AKA other plants. The models for which are already in-game

 

Cat-tail: If you pay attention to the plants you can see alongside a watersource (pond, stream, the ocean weirdly enough,) cat-tail will be one of them that stick out the most, alongside "generic" (which are useful in and of themselves) water-reeds. 

 

 

cat-tail are INCREDIBLY useful for survival, with uses ranging from food, to bedding, to firestarting, to medicine, to cordage and weaving material. The Scouts have a saying:"If you find cattail, you have food, water and fire".  This is because cattails only grow in water free of pollutants. You still should boil/treat the water, but it is relatively clean

 

http://prepforshtf.com/survival-uses-for-cattails/#.VV0tZ_lVhBc

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-cattail.htm

 

The "food" aspect of cattail is important, as the roots actually contain more starch per weight than potato. A good-sized cattail plant will fill you up and keep you going for hours of hiking, all in an easy-to-gather, easy-to-cook package.

 

"Weeds": These are plants that often grow in margin-lands, aka old field and such, that actually are rather good for you, being high in Vitamin C, as well as being tasty. The easiest to recognize are Dandelion, Chicory, and Goldenrod. Goldenrod is visible in-game, as the large single-stemmed plants with spreading tufts of flowers, and dandelions and chicory can really be found anywhere grass could grow. Nearly all of the chicory and Dandelion plants is edible, and Goldenrod can be used to make teas, as well as a flour substitute in breads.

 

http://ultimatesurvivaltips.com/goldenrods-bum-wrap-clearing-this-helpful-herb/

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-dandelion.htm

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-chicory.htm

 

 

Plantain: Another useful "foragable" is Plantain. The leaves are edible, and it can be used as a poultice to treat pain, as a tea to treat diarrhea, or the seeds and seed husks as a laxative.

 

 

http://www.survivaliq.com/survival/edible-and-medicinal-plants-plantain-broad-and-narrow-leaf.htm

 

There are many many more plants that I have noticed in-game that would either be edible, serve as "backwoods medicine", or be otherwise useful in survival. The devs just have to add "uses" for the model.

I know you can pick cat tails in The Long Dark and can consume them for nutrition. Im hopping Dayz does the same thing to. Cause i really like doing that when things get down to the wire with extreme survival conditions in that game.

[yazar8 584]

I actually learned cattail is a useful plant here, GJ.

[pilgrim* 3514]

good post Ebrim ! this should be in the survival guides.

 

Once you are off the beach, past the first startup survival - farming is 100% the easiest way to go on living decently. It "seems" to take time but it is a rapid activity considering the food gain in that time. Farm (plant 1 maybe 2 tiles), eat, move on. 

Also - I think Ebrim said this in another forum - Using "dirty" water to grow crops is an easy way to convert bad water (risk of illness) into hydration without medications.

 

but - still no way to boil water to purify it, which is silly, and cooking is too complicated to be realistic (except gas stove) so farming is far better than hunting.

[to boil drinking water IRL you need burning twigs and an empty tin can, you do not need an oven]

 

* * *

 

AND scuse me off topic (..while you're there)

 

On Exp. did anyone notice what happened to "collect seeds"  from farming.  Is that back in yet ?

Or has it been deliberately taken out, or just forgotten ?

Will this be back in the next patch ?

 

xx

Edited May 21, 2015 by pilgrim

[Beizs 186]

AND scuse me off topic (..while you're there)

On Exp. did anyone notice what happened to "collect seeds" from farming. Is that back in yet ?

Or has it been deliberately taken out, or just forgotten ?

Will this be back in the next patch ?

xx

I can only speak for pumpkins, as they are all I've ever grown (some of the best food in the game, honestly), but when you cut the pumpkin into slices, you also get a bunch of seeds.

I assume that cutting the other plants will yield seeds too.

[igor-vk 909]

I dont do farming, I only search for apples and berries, and I wont starve. Its not problem in CLE or hunger/thirst mechanics. Problem is in players themseves. Early dayz spoiled players with M4/Mosin/AKM in every Police station/granny house on coast. Also, cans everywhere... Most of players, I thing at least 75% thought that dayz will be same only with new guns every month. Now that game is going ti its intended direction towards survival game, people cant do their PvP Berezino/Electro squad wipe/deathmatch sessions and they come to forum and reddit and whine. I just want to ask them one thing: why they cant see with all crafting, tools, survival options where game is going. Why would devs lose time with hand drill, or all things you get from skinning animals, or crafting leather clothes or things like that if they are making twitch shooter??

People who want good PvP experience should try Arma 3 mods.

There arent many real hard survival games on marked, even less multiplayer games. Let us strugle, let us search for that apple that will save u from starving to death, let me decide if I will cut some sticks with badly damaged knife or I will save it for skining boar.

[pilgrim* 3514]

I can only speak for pumpkins, as they are all I've ever grown (some of the best food in the game, honestly), but when you cut the pumpkin into slices, you also get a bunch of seeds.

I assume that cutting the other plants will yield seeds too.

 

OK Does this work at present ? - or only on Exp ? - for me pumpkins stopped giving seeds a while ago (when persistence started) and today on the current build nothing has changed.

I can no longer get option to collect seeds from a pumpkin with any cutting tool at all.

 

I don't find any "cut into slices" option either. Is this only on experimental ?

 

or what am I doing wrong ? In the current build I'm convinced there is no such option. I guess if its on exp it will come back to mainstream soon.

[also kind of crazy that you cant mix packet seeds and harvested seeds, but it aint killing me]

 

xx

 

          [edit] Things you can do with an invisible pumpkin :

         

          :)

Edited May 21, 2015 by pilgrim

[Beizs 186]

OK Does this work at present ? - or only on Exp ? - for me pumpkins stopped giving seeds a while ago (when persistence started) and today on the current build nothing has changed.

I can no longer get option to collect seeds from a pumpkin with any cutting tool at all.

 

so what am I doing wrong ?

 

I'm sure I got them when I cut the pumpkin in to slices. As in, not an option to cut out seeds, but just cut them in to slices.

[Schweinsteiger 107]

In exp the seeds appear in your inventory after slicing up pumpkins. You can make a hand drill only with oak bark at the moment. Rabbit snares/traps do not currently work in exp, neither does fishing with a fishing pole or using a fish trap. When you craft these objects, they just disappear, nowhere to be found after you've successfully crafted them. If you hunt and are on a summer/spring server, do not use a stick to cook the meat, you'll get hyperthermia and will have to find a lake or a pond and jump in. I've been using the stoves with success. Crafting leather items works fine (not sure why we can't make a water bottle that holds just as much water as a canteen or a PET bottle?). I like the survival aspect but we need more options for sure.

[ebrim 998]

In exp the seeds appear in your inventory after slicing up pumpkins. You can make a hand drill only with oak bark at the moment. Rabbit snares/traps do not currently work in exp, neither does fishing with a fishing pole or using a fish trap. When you craft these objects, they just disappear, nowhere to be found after you've successfully crafted them. If you hunt and are on a summer/spring server, do not use a stick to cook the meat, you'll get hyperthermia and will have to find a lake or a pond and jump in. I've been using the stoves with success. Crafting leather items works fine (not sure why we can't make a water bottle that holds just as much water as a canteen or a PET bottle?). I like the survival aspect but we need more options for sure.

Fishing and rabbit snares most certainly work in exp right now. The problem you're running into is that crafted items must have a place in your inventory to go or they, as you say, disappear. The problem I ran into with the fish trap is that you can catch sardines fine but you can't prepare them like you could before with a knife nor can you cook them whole, at least not on an ashwood stick, I guess I should try with a pot. Interesting point about getting really hot while cooking with the stick. One thing that comes into mind to try also is not putting the hot food into your inventory but putting it on the ground and eat it from there.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Ebrim

[Schweinsteiger 107]

Fishing and rabbit snares most certainly work in exp right now. The problem you're running into is that crafted items must have a place in your inventory to go or they, as you say, disappear. The problem I ran into with the fish trap is that you can catch sardines fine but you can't prepare them like you could before with a knife nor can you cook them whole, at least not on an ashwood stick, I guess I should try with a pot. Interesting point about getting really hot while cooking with the stick. One thing that comes into mind to try also is not putting the hot food into your inventory but putting it on the ground and eat it from there.

Hey Ebrim,

 

No, I've played DayZ long enough to realize that you need empty inventory slots for certain things. And if you don't have an empty slot then the item drops on the ground in your immediate area. It may very well have been a problem with the server for all I know, I'm just saying that those traps shouldn't have disappeared out of existence, they should have dropped to the ground. I tried it several times, with ample inventory space and received no joy my friend.

 

So, what's your take on it then? I guess I'll try again and report back on what happens.

[ebrim 998]

Hey Ebrim,

 

No, I've played DayZ long enough to realize that you need empty inventory slots for certain things. And if you don't have an empty slot then the item drops on the ground in your immediate area. It may very well have been a problem with the server for all I know, I'm just saying that those traps shouldn't have disappeared out of existence, they should have dropped to the ground. I tried it several times, with ample inventory space and received no joy my friend.

 

So, what's your take on it then? I guess I'll try again and report back on what happens.

 

Yup, you're exactly right, in 0.55 it would have worked just like that. There's still inventory funkiness in experimental though and it really just comes down to having room in your inventory or the crafted item just goes *poof*. For example if you were to craft a fishing rod without a massive empty backpack, or your melee shoulder spot open, the rod would just vanish. But if you remove whatever is in your melee spot it'll appear right on your shoulder, safe and sound. Hopefully when 0.57 goes stable things will go back to being deployed to vicinity if you don't have room but that's just not the case right now. 

 

(For what it's worth, if you look at my couple screenshots early in this thread you'll see I'm wearing both an improvised bow and improvised fishing rod)

Edited May 21, 2015 by Ebrim

[Schweinsteiger 107]

Yup, you're exactly right, in 0.55 it would have worked just like that. There's still inventory funkiness in experimental though and it really just comes down to having room in your inventory or the crafted item just goes *poof*. For example if you were to craft a fishing rod without a massive empty backpack, or your melee shoulder spot open, the rod would just vanish. But if you remove whatever is in your melee spot it'll appear right on your shoulder, safe and sound. Hopefully when 0.57 goes stable things will go back to being deployed to vicinity if you don't have room but that's just not the case right now. 

Okay, when I crafted the fishing rod I wasn't aware that I needed a shoulder spot open. I likened it to cutting an ashwood stick. I thought the rod would fall to the ground and I could then just pick it back up. What about the rabbit snare though? Shouldn't it have appeared in my backpack? As for the fish trap, it was the first time I ever crafted one. When I held it in my hands there was no scroll option available. Same results when it was in my backpack. I even put the fish trap on my hotbar and still received no joy.

 

I've been moving away from canned goods lately, since I expect the game to become more dependent on wilderness survival. I've always hunted though and it seems things have changed there also. I remember the animals giving way more steaks then they do now, maybe the guts and the fat account for the reduction in meat? I've used the fat for cooking (in the cooking pot on a gas stove). I once ate both the guts and the fat and got pretty sick. Someone told me the fat is good to eat but after that experience I really don't want to take the chance. Maybe it was the deer guts that made me sick? Can the fat be eaten safely?

 

Thanks,

 

-Schweinsteiger.