New Ammo Type:7.62 tokarev and the tt33 ppsh41 and the c96

[agouti 105]

So I would like to make a suggestion of adding the new ammo type, 7.62 tokarev. Now, before I make my argument for this gun, let me address the arguments against this gun. The first is that many of the guns that would be chambered in this round could be chambered in other rounds. My rebuttal to this, is that the 7.62 tokarev is a unique round that is flatter shooting and more deeply penetrating than other rounds, making the performance just not the same. The other argument is there are claims of only a handful of firearms which can use this round. My rebuttal to this is that there are currently only two firearms that can use the .380, currently only two firearms that use the .22lr, and currently only two firearms that use the .357. I'm suggesting in this list 3 firearms, the tt33, the ppsh-41, and the c96.

 

These are historically relevant firearms, which were mass produced and found all over soviet countries (the c96 not so much]. The c96 is a bit of an oddball, but it's been produced for so long commercially, it's found in nearly every country. Now, you might claim the c96 is not meant to handle the higher pressures of the 7.62 tokarev round, and while this is true, I say to you: it'll last longer than boots in experimental. Maybe, it'll give you a reason to use the firearm maintenance kit.

 

Note: there are other guns which use this round like the cz-52, the pps-43. early iterations of the stetchkin, and the px-3, however, I feel, the number of firearms in the game which are implemented is somewhat limited, and the 3 I listed above are the most loved and iconic.

[Zboub le météor 250]

that makes sense.

 

but remember that one more type of ammunition lower your chances to find the good combo gun+magazine+ammo.

 

currently we have :

- .22 LR

- .380 ACP

- 9mm

- 45 ACP

- .357 magnum

- 5.45*39 confirmed for next exp

- 5.56*45

- 7.62*39

- 7.62*51

- 12 gauge

 

i don't know if one more caliber is viable solution :| . but sure tt33 and ppsh-41 would fit this game extremely well.

[thedogfoodyayho 295]

The only thing I would want more than this is 7.62x38mm and my Nagant... but that's not going to happen...

 

I used to suggest this caliber all the time but I got no support for it and gave up... It would really add something to the game, as it would be pretty much the most accurate Automatic cartridge, and it could go through the ballistic helmet. It could also probably penetrate applique armor on cars while .45 and 9mm bounce off. 

 

But as far as SMG's go, the PPS-43 is probably a better option as it's more compairable to the other SMG's. A  drum mag would unbalance SMG's, and the PPS remained in service longer.

 

Anyway, I think 7.62 tok makes more sense the .30-06 atleast

Edited October 24, 2014 by thedogfoodyayho

[a_ruttle 199]

I fail to see the logic behind the argument against adding lots of different ammo types, with a proper loot spawning system you'd negate the problem of finding the right ammo for the gun you have, and the other point they constantly swirl about multiple ammo types being confusing for noobs is just stupid anyway.

 

But things as they are I'd be happy with 2 Russian pistol rounds [7.62 and 9x18] and 7.54R. Oh and a wide variety of shotgun shells [buck/slug/rocksalt/beanbag]

Edited October 24, 2014 by a_ruttle

[agouti 105]

The only thing I would want more than this is 7.62x38mm and my Nagant... but that's not going to happen...

 

I used to suggest this caliber all the time but I got no support for it and gave up... It would really add something to the game, as it would be pretty much the most accurate Automatic cartridge, and it could go through the ballistic helmet. It could also probably penetrate applique armor on cars while .45 and 9mm bounce off. 

 

But as far as SMG's go, the PPS-43 is probably a better option as it's more compairable to the other SMG's. A  drum mag would unbalance SMG's, and the PPS remained in service longer.

 

Anyway, I think 7.62 tok makes more sense the .30-06 atleast

 

Not to go off topic, but the nagant can use .32 s&w, and .32 auto with a special cylinder. seeing as the makarov uses the .380 version, instead of the usual 9x18, if they were to include the revolver, that would be the way to go, as the .32 would allow pocket pistols and the skorpion. 

 

 

 

I think if the ammo spawn rate was upped a bit, we'd have no problem. Even as it is, I have no problem.

[DURRHUNTER 597]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmemecrunch.com%2Fmeme%2FPRZC%2Fjohn-wall-bruh&ei=Ha9KVNXwGIS5yQSMwYCgAg&bvm=bv.77880786,d.aWw&psig=AFQjCNF-aGBLftRs8gt7MXRY0WkDmv6tIg&ust=1414267034657396

all these new gun and ammo threads lately got me like 'seriously?'

ok

MP41r = PPSh41 in 9mm Parabellum

Norcino type 54 = Tokarev TT33 in 9mm Parabellum

goddamn people.

Edited October 24, 2014 by DURRHUNTER

[alexeistukov 272]

The chance of ammo suggestions like that being added, (since 9x18mm Makarov was not added), is now very slim..

 

I wish we could have calibers like that, even if they did only allow for the implementation of 5 or 7 weapons that are chambered in it.

 

We will all just have to be patient and wait for mod support  to come out (which i cannot wait for), unless some miracle happens and the devs change their minds, 

[alexeistukov 272]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmemecrunch.com%2Fmeme%2FPRZC%2Fjohn-wall-bruh&ei=Ha9KVNXwGIS5yQSMwYCgAg&bvm=bv.77880786,d.aWw&psig=AFQjCNF-aGBLftRs8gt7MXRY0WkDmv6tIg&ust=1414267034657396

all these new gun and ammo threads lately got me like 'seriously?'

ok

MP41r = PPSh41 in 9mm Parabellum

Norcino type 54 = Tokarev TT33 in 9mm Parabellum

goddamn people.

 

Why the fuck should we have to find rechambered variants of those famous firearms?  They are not the authentic version.

 

I personally find it utter bull shit that they did not add 9x18mm Makarov to the game.  9mm allows for the implementation of more firearms, but 9x18mm Makarov was made in the Soviet Union and is a very common handgun ammunition found in most Eastern European countries.  

 

Now, i am not here to argue about calibers with anyone as i already had my share back in summer.

 

Mods will show what players truly wanted in the base game.

[agouti 105]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmemecrunch.com%2Fmeme%2FPRZC%2Fjohn-wall-bruh&ei=Ha9KVNXwGIS5yQSMwYCgAg&bvm=bv.77880786,d.aWw&psig=AFQjCNF-aGBLftRs8gt7MXRY0WkDmv6tIg&ust=1414267034657396

all these new gun and ammo threads lately got me like 'seriously?'

ok

MP41r = PPSh41 in 9mm Parabellum

Norcino type 54 = Tokarev TT33 in 9mm Parabellum

goddamn people.

 

 

Did you not read my original post? The 7.62x25 has unique properties. I already addressed your argument. I started my argument by addressing the rebuttals.

"Now, before I make my argument for this gun, let me address the arguments against this gun. The first is that many of the guns that would be chambered in this round could be chambered in other rounds. My rebuttal to this, is that the 7.62 tokarev is a unique round that is flatter shooting and more deeply penetrating than other rounds, making the performance just not the same. "

 

And alexi, it doesn't matter if it's only  5 or 7 guns. Each ammo type now already only has like 2 guns for it, except for the 9x19.

 

 

Please, read my original arguments people.

Edited October 24, 2014 by agouti

[thedogfoodyayho 295]

Not to go off topic, but the nagant can use .32 s&w, and .32 auto with a special cylinder. seeing as the makarov uses the .380 version, instead of the usual 9x18, if they were to include the revolver, that would be the way to go, as the .32 would allow pocket pistols and the skorpion. 

 

 

 

I think if the ammo spawn rate was upped a bit, we'd have no problem. Even as it is, I have no problem.

I doubt they'll add that either, seeing as the Vz.64 scorpion is .380 and anyway, a Nagant chambered for a pocket pistol round would make it useless.

But yeah i don't have any problem with any ammo besides 7.62x39 and 9mm para, which they made really rare on purpose for no apparent reason. (9mm only seems to spawn in police cars while pistols still spawn everywhere) i really don't see why they're so obsessed with not having very many calibers. It a challenge you'd have to face irl.

[TheCreeper (DayZ) 3565]

As much as I would love to see the pistol added in its native caliber, I doubt it will happen. Personally I LOVE the Tokarev, hell, I own one, well, one of its clones ( Zastava M57 ) and with the surplus steel core ammo, armor means next to nothing. Would fit in the game well, just don't see the coders/devs spending the time to put it in.

 

 

Side note: Crappy video of me with my Tokarev, with a special shout out

 

http://youtu.be/bhM6DDdAPeM?list=UUvaxpoR7q5kv2uYPLXjnoBQ

[AP_Norris 1018]

I fail to see the logic behind the argument against adding lots of different ammo types, with a proper loot spawning system you'd negate the problem of finding the right ammo for the gun you have, and the other point they constantly swirl about multiple ammo types being confusing for noobs is just stupid anyway.

 

But things as they are I'd be happy with 2 Russian pistol rounds [7.62 and 9x18] and 7.54R. Oh and a wide variety of shotgun shells [buck/slug/rocksalt/beanbag]

I think there should definitely be more ammo types, the game is meant to be challenging. Whatever can be taken from reality to make it more challenging is likely pretty welcomed by me.

I've gone from COD to battlefield to Arma, DayZ and Red Orchestra in interest of realism. I liked the mod because it didn't try to make itself easy for me.

I don't want them to go backwards to cater for new players.

[alexeistukov 272]

Did you not read my original post? The 7.62x25 has unique properties. I already addressed your argument. I started my argument by addressing the rebuttals.

"Now, before I make my argument for this gun, let me address the arguments against this gun. The first is that many of the guns that would be chambered in this round could be chambered in other rounds. My rebuttal to this, is that the 7.62 tokarev is a unique round that is flatter shooting and more deeply penetrating than other rounds, making the performance just not the same. "

 

And alexi, it doesn't matter if it's only  5 or 7 guns. Each ammo type now already only has like 2 guns for it, except for the 9x19.

 

 

Please, read my original arguments people.

 

...I said i don't care if the caliber implementation only added 5 or 7 guns... i am actually for the calibers being added, i don't give a shit about how many guns they add.

 

How about you read my original post again?

[BeefBacon 1185]

While I like the idea of these guns being added, I'm not a huge fan of diluting the ammo pool even further, especially if it's with yet another 7.62 round. I'd rather these weapons use existing ammo, even if they don't use that ammo in real life.

[star-lord252 83]

7.62 rounds would be a good addition to the game as well as the guns. The one I would love to see is the PSSH-41. The devs have kind of been only focused on assault rifles regular rifles these past few updates(the exception of the bakial m133 finally other shotgun). It seems that smgs have been left out. Smgs came before assault rifles and smgs are still widely used by police military and riot control. The PSSH would be a good start again.

Edited October 25, 2014 by DaNic2553

[rybec 339]

While I like the idea of these guns being added, I'm not a huge fan of diluting the ammo pool even further, especially if it's with yet another 7.62 round. I'd rather these weapons use existing ammo, even if they don't use that ammo in real life.

What it would open up though, is making hard choices. You found a lot of ammunition for weapon X and you just found weapon X. Your weapon Y is arguably better, but you're almost completely dry. Are you going to abandon Y for X because you now won't have to worry about ammunition, or are you going to tough it out and be very stingy with your ammunition for Y praying you'll find more for it?

 

Assuming the person isn't going to juggle these two weapons on back and in hand.

[Chaingunfighter 917]

It's a unique round, I'll give ya that, but the biggest detrimental factor is that it simply has very few guns (and even fewer that would actually perform noticeably different from each other) that actually go along with it. Yes, it is a unique case in that not only is the round special, but also the guns that go along with it, and it's extremely realistic for the environment, but it's simply not practical for development as is.

 

Granted, I'm not against it being added

 

Why the fuck should we have to find rechambered variants of those famous firearms?  They are not the authentic version.

 

I personally find it utter bull shit that they did not add 9x18mm Makarov to the game.  9mm allows for the implementation of more firearms, but 9x18mm Makarov was made in the Soviet Union and is a very common handgun ammunition found in most Eastern European countries.  

 

Now, i am not here to argue about calibers with anyone as i already had my share back in summer.

 

Mods will show what players truly wanted in the base game.

 

There'll be the share of hardcore, ultra realistic mods just as there were for DayZ, and many were quite popular. However, god knows we'll also have hundreds of easy mode mods that simply make the games many times more unrealistic, adding things like currency & trade shops, NPCs, building massive forts, spawning with a full arsenal (or at least being able to get one in a short period of time), and all of that. And these were where the majority of players went.

 

Granted, just like you, I have no problem with letting people play how they want to play. I'm just saying that's not a very strong argument for inducing even more stuff like this, because it seemed like most mods wanted a faster placed gameplay, not a slower one.

 

Though if it were up to me I'd just add as many guns under the sun as I could, and make sure that the more realistic guns spawned often (Mosins, Tokarevs, Makarovs, etc.), somewhat outlandish guns being somewhat uncommon (M16s, FN FALs, G3s, etc.) and unusual or highly out of place have extremely low chances of spawning, but still being findable (ala Kriss Vector, UMP-45, M1 Garand, etc.)

 

I'm actually in the process of making a DaiZy (Single player DayZ) mod that utilizes tons of different mods in order to create an experience like this. Unlike most typical custom DayZ setups, I've used some of the most obscure and outlandish mods to add things people wouldn't expect - SVT-40s, Mosin-Nagants (in the mod), PPSh-41s & PPS-43s, Tokarevs, RPDs, and a hell of a lot more. It's even cooler having access to the weapon's code because I was able to make ammo compatible by creating variants that shared magazines and whatnot (such as loose Mosin Nagant bullets being used in an SVD or SVT). Granted, I can't upload it publicly because I've used tons of them and I never actually asked for permission (it was for personal use), but it's still a fun idea that I would love to expand to the standalone, with features such as individual bullets, weapon customization, additional/enhanced buildings, and all of the other things that make DayZ standalone great.

[agouti 105]

It's a unique round, I'll give ya that, but the biggest detrimental factor is that it simply has very few guns (and even fewer that would actually perform noticeably different from each other) that actually go along with it. Yes, it is a unique case in that not only is the round special, but also the guns that go along with it, and it's extremely realistic for the environment, but it's simply not practical for development as is.

 

Granted, I'm not against it being added

 

 

There'll be the share of hardcore, ultra realistic mods just as there were for DayZ, and many were quite popular. However, god knows we'll also have hundreds of easy mode mods that simply make the games many times more unrealistic, adding things like currency & trade shops, NPCs, building massive forts, spawning with a full arsenal (or at least being able to get one in a short period of time), and all of that. And these were where the majority of players went.

 

Granted, just like you, I have no problem with letting people play how they want to play. I'm just saying that's not a very strong argument for inducing even more stuff like this, because it seemed like most mods wanted a faster placed gameplay, not a slower one.

 

Though if it were up to me I'd just add as many guns under the sun as I could, and make sure that the more realistic guns spawned often (Mosins, Tokarevs, Makarovs, etc.), somewhat outlandish guns being somewhat uncommon (M16s, FN FALs, G3s, etc.) and unusual or highly out of place have extremely low chances of spawning, but still being findable (ala Kriss Vector, UMP-45, M1 Garand, etc.)

 

I'm actually in the process of making a DaiZy (Single player DayZ) mod that utilizes tons of different mods in order to create an experience like this. Unlike most typical custom DayZ setups, I've used some of the most obscure and outlandish mods to add things people wouldn't expect - SVT-40s, Mosin-Nagants (in the mod), PPSh-41s & PPS-43s, Tokarevs, RPDs, and a hell of a lot more. It's even cooler having access to the weapon's code because I was able to make ammo compatible by creating variants that shared magazines and whatnot (such as loose Mosin Nagant bullets being used in an SVD or SVT). Granted, I can't upload it publicly because I've used tons of them and I never actually asked for permission (it was for personal use), but it's still a fun idea that I would love to expand to the standalone, with features such as individual bullets, weapon customization, additional/enhanced buildings, and all of the other things that make DayZ standalone great.

 

If you could make this multiplayer, and for a mod for a mod of the standalone, this sounds legit as fudge.

Edited October 25, 2014 by agouti

[Chaingunfighter 917]

If you could make this multiplayer, and for a mod for a mod of the standalone, this sounds legit as fudge.

If I could (and can), I would (and will).

 

If I release it publically I'll try and get permission from those who made the mods, at least some of the bigger ones (many are old and haven't even been updated since 2009, or even earlier). I can't say it'll go around well, because a lot of modders from the ArmA community seem to dislike DayZ, or at least the mods, because so many people took them without permission.

Granted, I don't explicitly need permission because they don't actually own the rights to the mods, but I'd feel wrong doing it. I will definitely see what can happen, though.

 

On terms of DayZ Standalone, I'd absolutely love to, but I can't promise anything. I have no idea what the extent of modding will be, nor how compatible mods for other games will be (it's always across the board), but if it can be done I will do it. And even if I can't port it directly I'll do the same thing with the other mods and try and create a similar experience.

 

Take this with a grain of salt, though. I'm an amateur coder, nothing more. All I really did was change the text on a few scripts by using mods already installed, I didn't actually make any new content as far as it's concerned.

[thedogfoodyayho 295]

If I could (and can), I would (and will).

 

If I release it publically I'll try and get permission from those who made the mods, at least some of the bigger ones (many are old and haven't even been updated since 2009, or even earlier). I can't say it'll go around well, because a lot of modders from the ArmA community seem to dislike DayZ, or at least the mods, because so many people took them without permission.

Granted, I don't explicitly need permission because they don't actually own the rights to the mods, but I'd feel wrong doing it. I will definitely see what can happen, though.

 

On terms of DayZ Standalone, I'd absolutely love to, but I can't promise anything. I have no idea what the extent of modding will be, nor how compatible mods for other games will be (it's always across the board), but if it can be done I will do it. And even if I can't port it directly I'll do the same thing with the other mods and try and create a similar experience.

 

Take this with a grain of salt, though. I'm an amateur coder, nothing more. All I really did was change the text on a few scripts by using mods already installed, I didn't actually make any new content as far as it's concerned.

What mods did you actaully use? I could never find any Mosins or SVT's that were of any quality besides Vilas's old Arma 1 WWII addon. I did find one that was Post-war german weapons, including an RPG2, Really nice PPSh and SKS with a nice sound. (And some shitty mosins)

[Chaingunfighter 917]

What mods did you actaully use? I could never find any Mosins or SVT's that were of any quality besides Vilas's old Arma 1 WWII addon. I did find one that was Post-war german weapons, including an RPG2, Really nice PPSh and SKS with a nice sound. (And some shitty mosins)

The two german weapons packs by Marseille were actually where I got the Mosin M1891/30 I used (as well as other guns). Vietnam the Experience and the Unsung mod have Mosins, but they're M38s and M44s. I originally used the Iron Front ports for bolt-action rifles, because they're the highest quality models and have actual animations, but too much else got screwed up so I decided not to keep them.

 

The SVTs came from Vietnam The Experience as well. Not the best quality models ever but it's a lot better than nothing, and that was my main concern. (ArmA 2 isn't some game where I'm too concerned with good quality models)

[TulaNoyes 5]

they could add avt 40 with realistic recoil lol. http://youtu.be/lmN5Q2qDOmE

[TulaNoyes 5]

I would like to see the Russian weapons added in their original calibers.. since dayz is in a Russia-ish landscape.

[stielhandgranate 480]

The chance of ammo suggestions like that being added, (since 9x18mm Makarov was not added), is now very slim..

 

I wish we could have calibers like that, even if they did only allow for the implementation of 5 or 7 weapons that are chambered in it.

 

We will all just have to be patient and wait for mod support  to come out (which i cannot wait for), unless some miracle happens and the devs change their minds, 

 

Hold some hope, remember when the devs said they defiantly weren't going to add 5.45x39?

[hannibaldaplaya 1095]

but remember that one more type of ammunition lower your chances to find the good combo gun+magazine+ammo.

 

So. Fucking. What.

 

That's a good thing.

 

Fuck this game's current caliber work. Lets get proper calibers and shit. 7.62x54R, not 7.62x51 for a mosin. Lets get 9x18 for the Makarov. Hey, guess what, guns like the Bizon use 9x18 too! Keep 9x19 for more modern 9mm weapons like the CZ75 and MP5. While you're at it, add every caliber possible. Make SEVERAL revolvers. Why only have one? .44, .357, .38, .32. Lets see them all. 12 gauge buckshot, slugs, yes, please. How about some .308? 30-06? Lets put them all in.

 

Every round possible should be in the game and every gun possible should be in the game. A post apocalyptic sandbox should have barely any limits in terms of what the hell you can find.