Learning, and an Incentive For Real DayZ Fans

[pale1776 375]

Okay, so it seems that everyone in the game was a Delta operative.

We can make splints, administer blood transfusions, start fires, sew clothes, and can hit a moving target from 1000 yards. Now I can do all of this (minus the blood transfusion, I said Fuh Da Bihh) but most people cant.

But READ THIS, dont take our ability to do this away. Instead, put in learning books (suggested before, flooded with people who cried and mostly never thought it through) that we can red. But to satisfy the lazy ones, put it so that theres a learn button on the first page. And to satisy us true DayZers, read the required items. Say you can give a blood transfusion, but you cwant to do it faster. Find a med-book, click learn and increse the speed slightly. Wanna go faster? Flip pages until you find another learn button.

Wanna start a fire but dont have everything? Find a survival guide and click learn, then flip to the ingredients.

Say you have a water bottle (Thanks OP of the water bottle fire thread) and need a fire. You right click on the bottle, and srink it. No more options? Huh. Let me read this guide (learn button) Right click the bottle again, you can now start a fire with it and the other materials. Have even less than the bottle or need to do it faster? Find those learn buttons (or read so you can one day say "OMG DAYZ SAVED MAH LYFE ROCKET I LAHV JEUH)

Any furthet ideas?

[rybec 339]

People don't like the idea of actually having something to lose when they die. They'll mask this by saying "that's stupid" or "no classes/learning".

I'd be indifferent, but a fascinating thing you'd end up running into is if you could teach someone else with some action prompt of what you know.

 

Say you died and meet up with your buddy. He teaches you what you both found through books or other friends. Great. Say you find someone without a rifle. Maybe you could go run over to them and hold them up and try to learn from them what they know, or you'll kill them.

Something that encourages (but doesn't require) more interaction is fine by me. I mean, I play the game like I'm playing Arma. The only difference is people might not be able to fight back and I have to eat and drink.

[d.walker43 196]

I like the idea of manuals in game for things, but they are walking a fine line. I think they should be a guideline, but you should not be required to find one in order to do something. For example, if I have real life knowledge of survival, or cars, or guns, etc. I should be able to use that to my advantage in-game. sure, the manual would show me a step-by-step on what to do, but If I can or want to try doing it myself I should be able to.

[pale1776 375]

People don't like the idea of actually having something to lose when they die. They'll mask this by saying "that's stupid" or "no classes/learning".

I'd be indifferent, but a fascinating thing you'd end up running into is if you could teach someone else with some action prompt of what you know.

Say you died and meet up with your buddy. He teaches you what you both found through books or other friends. Great. Say you find someone without a rifle. Maybe you could go run over to them and hold them up and try to learn from them what they know, or you'll kill them.

Something that encourages (but doesn't require) more interaction is fine by me. I mean, I play the game like I'm playing Arma. The only difference is people might not be able to fight back and I have to eat and drink.

Yeah, Im worried that the guys from reddit who downvote every good suggestion and bitch 24/7 will come here and drown us in stupid ideas...

Maybe another Fwhatever key could be made, where it would engage in a seperate menu like tge inventory, but you scroll through knowledge on the right side and teach, and scroll on the left to learn what they know?

[Helix2000 128]

maybe after you learn it for the first time, your character can retain that knowledge permanently, but if the player forgets, there are say books to relearn it. just my 2 cents

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Meh. I'd rather just them make systems that they want to be difficult actually difficult, rather than creating some prerequisite of "find the book". Manuals and guides that help explain the processes are completely welcome, but I don't like the idea of them having a "skill book" effect that suddenly opens a particular action to your character.

 

People don't like the idea of actually having something to lose when they die. They'll mask this by saying "that's stupid" or "no classes/learning".

A lot of people (I being one of them) simply do not like the idea of artificial progression, and believe that it's quite odd to suggest that you need to open up a book in order to unlock an action rather than to simply allow everyone to attempt it. I mean, yes, it's highly unlikely that every single survivor would have the knowledge to do everything from advanced medical procedures to repairing engines and vehicle parts, but it'd be a lot better if you simply let real knowledge be the dictator of that rather than saying "you didn't press the action key on this book yet, so you can't even try to perform a blood transfusion".

Make the medical system complicated, create a realistic flight model, put vehicle parts on an in-depth system, and let people figure it out themselves. If you know how to fly in real life, it'll be quite easy to do in DayZ. If not, you might be making more than a few attempts.

 

Plus, there's no real way to tell whether someone actually read the information. Yes, the devs could probably put the time in to make a pointless system that "detected" whether you were on a certain page at the right time (though this would be unimaginably complex for no good reason), but even this wouldn't do any good, because there's no way to prove that someone actually read the book. Information is one of those things that should be kept to the players themselves. Trying to dictate the avatar's mental capacity when a majority of the game revolves around that avatar being a representation of YOU doesn't work. You either create a personality or leave it blank, you can't do half and half and expect it to work well.

 

The furthest I'd actually go would be minor progressions in physical characteristics that increase over time. Things like running speed which increase in small increments over time as you move around more, enhanced by the weight of the stuff you carry (which could also have negative attributes if you put too much of a strain on yourself), or conditioning to the environment as you get used to it. Otherwise, most of the progression and value to the character will really be left up to gear and loot.

 

If you REALLY want to give an incentive for people to survive, you have to make the accumulation and utilization of better tiers of loot take longer and be more difficult in general. Not only will it be more rewarding, but it'll make you think twice before you kill yourself just to 'reset' (which, by the way, should generally make you worse off. New spawns should be in relatively poor condition and nursing yourself back to regular health should be one of the prime focuses during the early game.)

 

Oh, and beards. Beards would help, too.

[agentstaple 29]

I agree with chaingun. I think books should show you how to do stuff, not give you the ability to.

 

For example, I made a suggestion that the medical system be improved, instead of putting on a bandage and being fine you should have to actually "heal" the wound.

 

For example, if you are shot in the leg you should have to check the wound for shrapnel, Then remove it if present, then disinfect it, then bandage it. You can survive without the first few steps but if you leave the shrapnel in, the wound wont heal, if you don't disinfect it there is a high risk it will turn gangrene, if you don't bandage it, it wont stop bleeding.

 

All these skills could be taught in books. I think if you want to make it so you need something before doing the process add things like needle nose pliers for removing shrapnel, or sewing kits for stitching bad wounds.

 

You could do this with pretty much anything, from hunting to fixing cars.

[liquidcactus 719]

I agree with chaingun. I think books should show you how to do stuff, not give you the ability to.

 

 

I agree with this also, it would be a waste of resources I think adding learning abilities.. 

[rybec 339]

If you REALLY want to give an incentive for people to survive, you have to make the accumulation and utilization of better tiers of loot take longer and be more difficult in general.

The problem is, there is literally nothing that can be put in the game that is not controversial to cause people to like their character. If I get shot, it'll take me all of thirty minutes to get going again. The game is starting to lose some of that combat excitement just because there are so many large cities being added beside each other you just don't have to care any more. There's no reason to go anywhere at all, no reason to care about my character.

 

"It's an alpher!"

The game can be fun, has many many issues that need to be sorted out, I don't even bother doing goofy things trying to contact anyone ingame other than to punch holes in their head and torso with 7.62x39.

[lauri7x3 100]

this is not sims

no good idea

[UltimateGentleman 355]

I think most books should basically be "recipe's" on how to make certain things, things you can already make but don't know about.

 

For instance rags + stick = splint

Everyone can do that but not everyone knows how to, I'd rather learn it from the game than looking it up in Google.

 

And then there could be books that boost your efficiency in creating some things or allow you to create some more advanced items. So like with rags you could learn how to better place them on your body so as to not get infected, or maybe you could tear clothing in to smaller pieces that do the same job, so you get 1 or 2 more.

 

I don't see how learning things from books is "artificial" ...isn't that how you learn most things in real life?

 

 

It shouldn't be like press G to learn and suddenly you can instantly make a laser rifle! Or anything extreme like that of course, basic but useful stuff.

 

OR you could have to "prototype" a thing, so instead of just find the book and learn you have to find the book, then the materials and then once you've made the item you know how to do it from then on. Allowing you to do whatever you want with the book, be nice and leave it out in the open or dump it in a river.

 

 

 

The problem is, there is literally nothing that can be put in the game that is not controversial to cause people to like their character. If I get shot, it'll take me all of thirty minutes to get going again. The game is starting to lose some of that combat excitement just because there are so many large cities being added beside each other you just don't have to care any more. There's no reason to go anywhere at all, no reason to care about my character.

 

"It's an alpher!"

The game can be fun, has many many issues that need to be sorted out, I don't even bother doing goofy things trying to contact anyone ingame other than to punch holes in their head and torso with 7.62x39.

 

I agree, it can be very hard to get loot now with persistence but just finding a bunch of stuff doesn't suddenly make me want to survive.

 

A trained up character that took hours to gather knowledge would be much more valuable to me than loot, you can get loot from anyone, friends or just random suckers that weren't paying attention.

It would be an ongoing goal too.

Once you get geared up...then what? I don't have much interest in PVP and when you're geared up surviving is a cake walk so what do you even do?

Edited October 12, 2014 by UltimateGentleman

[pale1776 375]

this is not sims

no good idea

You wanna elaborate as to why instead of wasting space and contributing absolutely nothing?

And guys who dont want skills, learn will "lock" the ability they learned. Its up to them to figure how to do it by reading. You click learn and you get the option to say start a fire with a water bottle, but you didnt read that your suppose to.say, push B to blow or keep your back to the sun, or push S to squeeze the bloodbag at 5 second intervals to speed it up but not too fast so they dont die (I can see the crybaby threads now... OMG I SPAMMED ESS AND IT KILLED MAH FRAND I.WANT MOHNY BAK DIS GAYME SUKS)

Or when putting on a splint you place the knots on the outside of the limb and put one above and below the joint. Or when applying a tourniquet, you hold space and rotate your mouse in a circle to cinch it in place.

So basically, learn button would ONLY open up the new function (right click water bottle) but YOU have read to see how (rotate mouse, B to blow, S to squeeze, where to tie the knots on the splint)

Actually, better yet. Put all the functions ingame as somethong all players can do, but put the ways to become better in the book. If the player reads, he sees he pushes B to blow, where to tie the knots, and to stop bloodflow he needs to rotate the mouse. It can be discovered by accident, it can be found in a book, and *Read This* your own brain now has the knowledge, not some character that magically regenerates with amnessia.

[General Zod 1118]

I don't know where the idea that making a fire with matches available is some sort of skill to be acquired by being "outdoors man" came from, but it's not hard at all. Starting fire without source of fire is a different story. 

Blood transitions, well yes that might be a problem. But on the other hand you can give yourself one, as long as you can see your veins, and have something to hang it on. Might require medical textbook but it's completely doable. 

Sewing might be tricky first few times, but it's not rocket science. \

 

I don't know where you are from since you are surrounded by functioning morons, but most people I know are capable of starting fires and basic clothes patching. As for shooting. 

Well while minor overtime improvements to things like sewing would be ok. How will you go about accuracy ? Based on number of shots fired ? Than people with their own servers fill farm it. 

Edited October 12, 2014 by General Zod

[pale1776 375]

I don't know where the idea thatmaking a fire with matches available is some sort of skill to be acquired by being "outdoors man" came from, but it's not hard at all. Starting fire without source of fire is a different story.

Blood transitions, well yes that might be a problem. But on the other hand you can give yourself one, as long as you can see your veins, and have something to hang it on. Might require medical textbook but it's completely doable.

Sewing might be tricky first few times, but it's not rocket science. \

I don't know where you are from since you are surrounded by functioning morons, but most people I know are capable of starting fires and basic clothes patching. As for shooting.

Well while minor overtime improvements to things like sewing would be ok. How will you go about accuracy ? Based on number of shots fired ? Than people with their own servers fill farm it.

Maybe you should read my OP. I know how to sew, start a fire, and shoot. As can most everyone in Georgia. I meant that finding improvised ways (water bottle fire per say) are available as an ingame action, but to figure it out you would have to read the book to figure out what materials. And can you give yourself a bloodbag, and do you know how to prevent an oxygen bubble in the IV line from killing you? I meant that theres better ways to do things, that are available to everyone. Say S to squeeze the bloodbag. You may find it on accident, or you read the book and saw that this helps speed the process up. Have a water bottle? Find a survival guide and see that you need a few more materials and push B to blow to kindle it.

I meant things that all characters can do, but the player needs to find how. And by the way, read the post above yours, its a little more planned.

And by the way, indirect insults arent smiled upon here. lol, actually the people at my school are mostly afraid of the woods and find fishing disgusting and hunting cruel (In Georgia... seriously?)

My dad is ex SF, so he taught me survival skills and such, which by the looks of this ebola scare, Id say that it will be an outbreak by December, and rioting and chaos will insue near latr January, early February. SO GUYS, STOCK UP ON FOOD AND AMMO, CAUSE THE ITS ABOUT TO HIT THE FAN

Sorry, just tryin to indirextly save lives here...

[Chaingunfighter 917]

The problem is, there is literally nothing that can be put in the game that is not controversial to cause people to like their character. If I get shot, it'll take me all of thirty minutes to get going again. The game is starting to lose some of that combat excitement just because there are so many large cities being added beside each other you just don't have to care any more. There's no reason to go anywhere at all, no reason to care about my character.

 

"It's an alpher!"

The game can be fun, has many many issues that need to be sorted out, I don't even bother doing goofy things trying to contact anyone ingame other than to punch holes in their head and torso with 7.62x39.

You can't do anything without finding someone who'll dissent, that's inevitable. However, the most realistic and LEAST controversial way you can go about this is by making MINOR physical progression and major expansive progression through loot. There will be people that dislike it but it's far better than just trying to through "skills" or "mandatory reading" in there. I mean, should the game make you take and pass a quiz before you can use the "start helicopter" action? It'd be ridiculous.

 

 

 

Maybe you should read my OP. I know how to sew, start a fire, and shoot. As can most everyone in Georgia. I meant that finding improvised ways (water bottle fire per say) are available as an ingame action, but to figure it out you would have to read the book to figure out what materials. And can you give yourself a bloodbag, and do you know how to prevent an oxygen bubble in the IV line from killing you? I meant that theres better ways to do things, that are available to everyone. Say S to squeeze the bloodbag. You may find it on accident, or you read the book and saw that this helps speed the process up. Have a water bottle? Find a survival guide and see that you need a few more materials and push B to blow to kindle it.

I meant things that all characters can do, but the player needs to find how. And by the way, read the post above yours, its a little more planned.

And by the way, indirect insults arent smiled upon here. lol, actually the people at my school are mostly afraid of the woods and find fishing disgusting and hunting cruel (In Georgia... seriously?)

My dad is ex SF, so he taught me survival skills and such, which by the looks of this ebola scare, Id say that it will be an outbreak by December, and rioting and chaos will insue near latr January, early February. SO GUYS, STOCK UP ON FOOD AND AMMO, CAUSE THE ITS ABOUT TO HIT THE FAN

Sorry, just tryin to indirextly save lives here...

Yep, a disease that doesn't even spread through the air is going to destroy the planet by 2015. Just like how the Swine Flu destroyed the Earth by 2010 and AIDs nearly made the planet implode in 1980.

The only reason there will be rioting over this shit is if people keep acting all paranoid about it and start to break down because, oh no, TWO people in a country of three hundred million have a disease, because it was CLEARLY preventable. I'm sure more people will get sick, but that doesn't mean it's the end.

Even the Spanish Flu, which spread during World War I over 100 years ago, was super deadly and killed millions, but didn't even come close to bringing down society. And keep in mind this was back 100 years in health care when the conditions on the front lines in Europe were arguably as bad (if not worse) as they are in West Africa today. That was an airborne disease, and it still failed to exterminate us.

Edited October 12, 2014 by Chaingunfighter

[stielhandgranate 480]

SO GUYS, STOCK UP ON FOOD AND AMMO, CAUSE THE ITS ABOUT TO HIT THE FAN

Sorry, just tryin to indirextly save lives here...

 

 

"I have too much ammo"

 

-no one ever

[UltimateGentleman 355]

Maybe you should read my OP. I know how to sew, start a fire, and shoot. As can most everyone in Georgia. I meant that finding improvised ways (water bottle fire per say) are available as an ingame action, but to figure it out you would have to read the book to figure out what materials. And can you give yourself a bloodbag, and do you know how to prevent an oxygen bubble in the IV line from killing you? I meant that theres better ways to do things, that are available to everyone. Say S to squeeze the bloodbag. You may find it on accident, or you read the book and saw that this helps speed the process up. Have a water bottle? Find a survival guide and see that you need a few more materials and push B to blow to kindle it.

I meant things that all characters can do, but the player needs to find how. And by the way, read the post above yours, its a little more planned.

 

Yeah boosting your efficiency in things through usage and learning would be great.

Everyone should be able to do everything but it should be easier for the skilled, the longer people survive the more accustomed they become to surviving there's no reason why it shouldn't work like that in the game happens in virtually every zombie movie/series that lasts an extended period of time.

 

People who've bandaged a lot of wounds or read how to do it properly should have access to a mini game kind of thing where they put it in the right place and stop bleeding faster for instance as well as reduce the risk of infection.

But everyone else should have the option of press F to bandage, quick use essentially but not the instant cure like it is now.

 

It's bad enough that with no explanation as to why we can all do things not everyone in real life knows how to, there needs to be some learning curve to it else you can't really call this hardcore survival at all. It's just press this to do this and be fixed or fix something, you don't need to know how to at all.

 

 

Heck some learning in the game might even be educational to kids who think they're a hardcore survivor due to playing the game as it is.

[pale1776 375]

You can't do anything without finding someone who'll dissent, that's inevitable. However, the most realistic and LEAST controversial way you can go about this is by making MINOR physical progression and major expansive progression through loot. There will be people that dislike it but it's far better than just trying to through "skills" or "mandatory reading" in there. I mean, should the game make you take and pass a quiz before you can use the "start helicopter" action? It'd be ridiculous.

Yep, a disease that doesn't even spread through the air is going to destroy the planet by 2015. Just like how the Swine Flu destroyed the Earth by 2010 and AIDs nearly made the planet implode in 1980.

The only reason there will be rioting over this shit is if people keep acting all paranoid about it and start to break down because, oh no, TWO people in a country of three hundred million have a disease, because it was CLEARLY preventable. I'm sure more people will get sick, but that doesn't mean it's the end.

Even the Spanish Flu, which spread during World War I over 100 years ago, was super deadly and killed millions, but didn't even come close to bringing down society. And keep in mind this was back 100 years in health care when the conditions on the front lines in Europe were arguably as bad (if not worse) as they are in West Africa today. That was an airborne disease, and it still failed to exterminate us.

Theres riots in Ferguson because a cop shot a man who just broke his jaw and robbed a gas station... You can be sure some dumbass will start a rumor, and people will get pissed and follow along. And technically it is, if you are infected and sneeze then the virus lingers and settles on everything around it, I mean damn hows it killed all these people in africa if its not deadly? And swine flu was a lie, perpetrated by the government. Yeah it was real, but how the hell was noone in Mexico infected if it originated in Mexico?

Plus you know... all it takes is for an isis fighter to get ebola on purpose and suicide bomb a mall...

My point is, if theres fear there will be riots. When War of The Worlds came out, an excerpt was broadcast as a news story on the radio to promote it. People thought it was real, and rioted and acted like they were gonna die. Many people died from that. Whixh is why its illegal to broadcast fake news like that

Look it up, War of the Worlds Radio Riots

And no need to be a smartass Chain, its better to prepare and not use it than it is to not prepare and need it

Edited October 12, 2014 by Owen.

[rybec 339]

"I have too much ammo"

 

-no one ever

 

 

 

"You have too much ammo" -Diane Feinstein

 

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

It should be like in Cataclysm-DDA really:

 

-Skills are trained by practice, every level in a skill give you some basic crafting recipes.

-Each crafting recipe used to practice can only learn you so much (no max leveling by crafting pointy sticks endlessly).

-Books can be read to learn more recipes and are also a way to train skills (books have a minimum skill to read them and a max skill they can teach you).

-How fast you learn is determined by your focus, aka comfort: well fed, hydrated and warm players learn easily, tired, hungry and wounded players don't.

-All skills rust over time when not practiced.

[Askelon 36]

I think a skill system, or a system that forces you to read books to be able to do stuff is a no-no.

 

If there was to be a skill system, it would be based on practice.

 

Books should have information on how to do tasks, which can be helpful, but if you already know how to do something you shouldn't need a book to tell you.

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

I think a skill system, or a system that forces you to read books to be able to do stuff is a no-no.

 

If there was to be a skill system, it would be based on practice.

 

Books should have information on how to do tasks, which can be helpful, but if you already know how to do something you shouldn't need a book to tell you.

Why not?

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Theres riots in Ferguson because a cop shot a man who just broke his jaw and robbed a gas station... You can be sure some dumbass will start a rumor, and people will get pissed and follow along. And technically it is, if you are infected and sneeze then the virus lingers and settles on everything around it, I mean damn hows it killed all these people in africa if its not deadly? And swine flu was a lie, perpetrated by the government. Yeah it was real, but how the hell was noone in Mexico infected if it originated in Mexico?

Plus you know... all it takes is for an isis fighter to get ebola on purpose and suicide bomb a mall...

My point is, if theres fear there will be riots. When War of The Worlds came out, an excerpt was broadcast as a news story on the radio to promote it. People thought it was real, and rioted and acted like they were gonna die. Many people died from that. Whixh is why its illegal to broadcast fake news like that

Look it up, War of the Worlds Radio Riots

And no need to be a smartass Chain, its better to prepare and not use it than it is to not prepare and need it

Maybe, but only time will tell. I completely agree - it's good to be prepared. I have sufficient emergency supplies and food available on hand in the case that shit does ever hit the fan. It's quite possible that Ebola will become worse, or that there will be some chain of riots, but to assume that to be the case is fallacious. The War of the Worlds broadcast happened at a point in which public radio broadcasts started to become truly common, and at the time were fairly realistic. Just like some of the first motion pictures, such as the one of the train approaching the camera, made people jump out of their seats, fearing it would come out of the screen and run into them. There was also the fact that Hitler had just recently risen into power and Japan was fast away fighting in Manchuria by 1938, the environment created fears that an invasion was inevitable.

 

By the way, those kinds of broadcasts aren't illegal. The panic ensued because most of the listeners tuned in after it was announced that they would be playing the broadcast, and thus they were led to believe it was actually occurring. It would only be illegal if you were pushing under the guise that it WAS happening for real.

 

These kinds of things require the right set of events to occur at the right times. I'm not saying it won't happen, but I don't necessarily believe it will. You really believe there were no documented cases of swine flu in Mexico? There were over 50,000 confirmed cases by 2010, and that's just what they were able to prove. Mexico has far lower medical standards and records than in the United States, so it's inevitable that there will be misinformation when trying to transfer it, even though you can find said information anyway. Even if it was mis-communicated, that doesn't at all mean that it was a lie put forward by the government. I'm not going to argue conspiracies, but I fail to see the reasoning.

 

If an ISIS fighter gets Ebola and is able to bomb a shopping mall, then they're either at a point where they aren't showing symptoms, or somehow they've managed to get into a public area in a terrible state and still pull off the bomb. Either way, blowing themselves' up is just going to destroy the Ebola or leave very limited trace amounts, and I doubt people are going to try and get any closer to the explosion than they needed to. They'd be better off just bombing the guy at his full strength so they know that he can do it without making himself obvious.

There are far better ways to spread chemicals or biological diseases than bomb a shopping mall with Ebola. Somehow I don't believe you put any actual thought into that, at all.

[Chaingunfighter 917]

It should be like in Cataclysm-DDA really:

 

-Skills are trained by practice, every level in a skill give you some basic crafting recipes.

-Each crafting recipe used to practice can only learn you so much (no max leveling by crafting pointy sticks endlessly).

-Books can be read to learn more recipes and are also a way to train skills (books have a minimum skill to read them and a max skill they can teach you).

-How fast you learn is determined by your focus, aka comfort: well fed, hydrated and warm players learn easily, tired, hungry and wounded players don't.

-All skills rust over time when not practiced.

Crafting recipes aren't really the focus here, because things like piloting a helicopter wouldn't need any crafting (presumably.)

 

And it just wouldn't work for people who know how to do something to see; "well, I know how to do this in real life, but I can't do it ingame because I haven't sharpened 10 sticks yet and pressed the action button on this one specific book".

You can make the system complicated but eventually people will figure out how to grind themselves up to the maximum 'levels'. Things that are supposed to be difficult should actually be difficult, rather than just having a lot of beforehand requirements. If you have real life knowledge, then good for you, you're a step ahead of everyone else.

[Askelon 36]

Why not?

Like Chaingun said, if you already know how to do something, you shouldn't have to "hit action on this book to be able to do it."

 

While I'd be fine with doing that or simply doing an action a lot might make your character more efficient at a task, a person shouldn't have to do things like that if they know what to do to begin with.