The camo building is stupid

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

The design of the "camo/military prison" building is very unbalanced favoring campers 100% especially on 3rd person servers. (on 1st P you can still hear the footsteps since the sound is different when they step inside the building)

One guy can defend it perfectly from 2-3 guys. Tested it myself with AKM 75 drum mag when 2 guys tried to kill me (they knew I was there since they were direct chatting me telling me to surrender lol) I just 3rd personed the crap out of them RIP and o7 for being in the north btw. U literally just need to 3rd person the main door and it's gg unless they have explosive grenades wich are rare ofc, flashbangs won't work against a good opponent since you can just turn around your head and if you don't turn your head you might aswell spray your 75 drum down the main entrance until the flashbang effect goes off.

 

First floor fell!? No problem! 2nd floor is, once again almost completely unnacessible if the defender has 5 IQ. You could just be on the area behind the stairs, behind the door of the loot room etc etc.

 

You can't go in sprinting because of some random thingy that forces you to stop sprinting when entering a building or having a slight variation on the terrain. bug?

 

I know this isn't going to be changed since it's work that is done and yeah, it would be a pain in the ass to remake it and even though it's alpha it's not going to happen as we have seen with other Arma3 bad features that stayed since the alpha days, I have the bad feeling this is how bohemia rolls, hope not.

 

Forget about attacking it if you are a lone wolf, that is for sure.

 

IMHO there needs to be windows to the 1st floor corridor and places with more altitude near those camo buildings to clear the buildings through the windows. Maybe a 2nd entrance could be a good idea too.

 

Also it is really easy to combat log inside those since the attacker will be so afraid of going in and so will just keep the patience battle up.

 

Seriously I feel so SO safe when I'm inside, my only fear being somebody ghosting to the top floor and coming down to kill me.

 

I hope I made myself clear.

Edited August 23, 2014 by DerrocK

[cartire 55]

ProTip:  If someone is camping it.  Leave.  Then you dont have to worry about engaging them when they are fortified.  Luckily, Cherarus is pretty big, so there are other places you can head too. 

[Dreypa 98]

What is this camo building you speak of.

[Ceallach 56]

What is this camo building you speak of.

 

The only "camo" building I can think of would probably be the military jail.

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

ProTip:  If someone is camping it.  Leave.  Then you dont have to worry about engaging them when they are fortified.  Luckily, Cherarus is pretty big, so there are other places you can head too. 

 

Still that is pretty frustrating when you want PvP wich is what everyone was seeking in the engagement I described... Sure those kind of buildings can exist but since this game is looking for more balanced gameplay I feel like the design of that building doesn't come in place.

[Katana67 2907]

I agree. Although not in the same language as you describe it.

 

It's interesting to me as to why the highest-value buildings are often the most linear buildings. Look at the barracks, for example.

 

One way in and out. Insanely narrow, and singular, passageway which is a "fish in a barrel" situation waiting to happen. How they're ever going to get zombies to negotiate the barracks building (without clipping through doors all day) is beyond me. Which is perhaps why there's a new barracks building model.

 

But yeah, with the jail/camo building, it's pretty much a one-trick pony when going in there. Which makes the experience either dull, predictable, or frustrating.

 

In my opinion, high-value buildings need to have at least two (if not more) entry/exit ways. Like the police station, for example.

Edited August 22, 2014 by Katana67

[jubeidok 495]

LOL!!!!! Wow, just wow.

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

LOL!!!!! Wow, just wow.

 

What is so funny about the post, can you explain yourself instead of creating a pointless comment?

 

If u are here to correct me do so but don't say "lol".

[Bigbadchuck 97]

Just go behind the building and shoot the guy in there through the window

[bonesnap 75]

Another great example why 1st person/hardcore servers are superior. Thanks OP! (Lol). So how 'bout them 1st person persistence enabled servers? We're waiting..

 

Anyways.. yeah those buildings always made great defensive positions, 1st person or 3rd.

[hellcat420 212]

there is nothing wrong with the layout of that building. if they start trying to "balance" the map for pvp we are going to end up with a flat empty boring wasteland.

[Etherious 907]

Why does everyone keep calling it a camo building? ._. Also, I also agree it should be changed a little. However, they would have to make a WHOLE new model. 

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

Just go behind the building and shoot the guy in there through the window

 

If only there were windows to the 1st floor corridor. Or do you mean the window of the 2nd floor? I can't think of many prison buildings that allow that since they are on the higher ground.

 

 

Why does everyone keep calling it a camo building? ._. Also, I also agree it should be changed a little. However, they would have to make a WHOLE new model. 

 

 

They were called camo buildings back on the DayZ mod days, my fault.

Edited August 22, 2014 by DerrocK

[Bororm 1156]

I agree that it's super hard to breach, when the neaf was mainly those 2 buildings it was constant headaches of trying to get people out of them (my group plays to pvp, so we'd rather the challenge than leaving).  Grenades would be very helpful, hopefully they become a little more common as time goes on.

 

I don't know that it needs to be redesigned, because as mentioned above, you start trying to balance every building and you're going to end up with a really dull map.  The major thing that would need to be fixed is wall glitching of course, but that's not inherent to that building alone, although it's one of the more popular ones.

[Katana67 2907]

I don't know that it needs to be redesigned, because as mentioned above, you start trying to balance every building and you're going to end up with a really dull map.  The major thing that would need to be fixed is wall glitching of course, but that's not inherent to that building alone, although it's one of the more popular ones.

 

I think some people set the bar insanely low for what constitutes "balance" of something.

 

Adding two, vice just one, entries/exits to a building doesn't make a building "balanced." Just means there's more to take into consideration when assaulting/defending, and varies the situation more so for both sides.

 

Rather than "Welp, they'll be coming through the front door... let me train my Mosin on the only entryway" it becomes "Shit, there's two doors... Which one do I pick?"

 

Likewise, it changes from "Welp, I've got to check corners X, Y, and Z... and if there's nobody there, I'm good" to "I've got to check corners X, Y, and Z if I go in through entrance 1... or corners A, B, and C if I go through entrance 2."

 

Doesn't necessarily make the building more "balanced," just makes for a varied (and therefore, marginally unpredictable) experience.

Edited August 22, 2014 by Katana67

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

I agree that it's super hard to breach, when the neaf was mainly those 2 buildings it was constant headaches of trying to get people out of them (my group plays to pvp, so we'd rather the challenge than leaving).  Grenades would be very helpful, hopefully they become a little more common as time goes on.

 

I don't know that it needs to be redesigned, because as mentioned above, you start trying to balance every building and you're going to end up with a really dull map.  The major thing that would need to be fixed is wall glitching of course, but that's not inherent to that building alone, although it's one of the more popular ones.

 

I didn't understand neither from you nor from the original guy who said that balancing the map would make it dull. Why does adding a 2nd entrance or a pair of extra windows make the map dull? :/

[hellcat420 212]

I didn't understand neither from you nor from the original guy who said that balancing the map would make it dull. Why does adding a 2nd entrance or a pair of extra windows make the map dull? :/

this is not cod or battlefield. pvp is not supposed to be balanced, that is what makes pvp in this game fun.

Edited August 22, 2014 by hellcat420

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

this is not cod or battlefield. pvp is not supposed to be balanced, that is what makes pvp in this game fun.

 

Oh, then bring in an AS50 TWS, who cares, pvp is not supposed to be balanced right

[hefeweizen 254]

Still that is pretty frustrating when you want PvP wich is what everyone was seeking in the engagement I described... Sure those kind of buildings can exist but since this game is looking for more balanced gameplay I feel like the design of that building doesn't come in place.

 

In what world were the creators of DayZ looking for "balanced gameplay". Authentic maybe, but not "balanced".

The first response telling you to leave if someone is camping the prison was the correct answer, there is nothing compelling you to try to attack the people camping the prison except damn foolhardiness.

Edited August 22, 2014 by Hefeweizen

[ChainReactor 922]

Imo, it's not a bug, it's a feature. Camo buildings as well as barracks are high loot buildings. I see no problem in them having a threat to be trapped inside. Getting an AKM or a high cap vest shouldnt be as easy as getting a can of peaches.

 

That being said, the risk of being trapped inside is not a must have feature for high loot buildings, so i am totally fine with the ATC tower or the fire / police stations have multiple entrances / exits. But high traffic / high risk buildings shall not necessarily have an emergency exit. And to be honest, if someone camps the jail, i either decide to fight him or simply move on and loot the rest of the area. Theres nothing exclusive spawning in there, and if a guy is already in it, it is most likely looted anyway.

 

Also, that dude camping the jail could be you just being trapped by someone outside whishing there would be a second exit.

Edited August 22, 2014 by ChainReactor

[Katana67 2907]

People appear to be just looking at the word "balance" and are reacting to that.

 

If the jail building had two entryways normally, and never had one entryway, would it be any less interesting/fun/PvP-oriented?

 

Not to me. Think less about it being "balanced" and more about it being made varied/unpredictable versus formulaic and predictable. I don't want my risky entry into a high-value building to be formulaic (i.e. check these two corners for players camping).

 

Would people be up in arms, wanting there to be one entryway instead of two? I doubt it.

 

It could be argued that by making the high-value buildings varied in terms of entry/exit routes, you're actually making it more dynamic and unpredictable for both the attackers and defenders. Thereby making the experience more unforgiving for those who mismanage the situation (on both ends).

Edited August 22, 2014 by Katana67

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

In what world were the creators of DayZ looking for "balanced gameplay". Authentic maybe, but not "balanced".

The first response telling you to leave if someone is camping the prison was the correct answer, there is nothing compelling you to try to attack the people camping the prison except damn foolhardiness.

The way they are doing the weapons and the armor, the clothing etc all of them have a balance point into them.

 

If they were fool or not that is not my problem but I would have done the same since, atm there is nothing to do but the very occasional PvP, opportunity they didn't want to waste.

[blackberrygoo 1416]

We definitely don't need to change this building , just the other night I rushed into the middle jail building of the NW airfield : there was a camper with his back against the wall (I knew because two minutes earlier I opened the door and quickly jumped to the side like I always do out of suspicion , turns out my suspicion was right as he unloaded at least 20 akm bullets towards the opening door ) .

I took one bullet to my body maybe more but luckily wasn't unconcious , so I rush in and zig zag towards the stairs, I somehow miss the stairs and end up right next to him against the wall next to the stairs , we both quickly realized our positions and fired madly .. Luckily he hadn't reloaded and only had ten bullets or so to spray at me , which most hit the stairs as he pulled the trigger while turning (dumb idea if you have no ammo to waste ) and during this I unleash the beast of a black sks I have into his chest and skull ..

Check and mate son the camper goes down due to a bit of luck , good aim and rushing ... But if you don't want to try your luck if there are campers in this building try this method which I use if I don't want to die :

1.) either wait for another person to be gunned down in the doorway and wildly shoot into the door when you see the campers looting, or

2.) keep running past the door and opening it , the campers will be scared enough to shoot at least half the time ; then when you hear the reloading ammo sound you dash in , hoping to not be taken down by another camper who isn't reloading at the time (both tricky methods but better than not doing anything then dying after trying to rush in at a random time ).

Edited August 23, 2014 by Grapefruit kush

[DerrocK (DayZ) 39]

Imo, it's not a bug, it's a feature. Camo buildings as well as barracks are high loot buildings. I see no problem in them having a threat to be trapped inside. Getting an AKM or a high cap vest shouldnt be as easy as getting a can of peaches.

 

That being said, the risk of being trapped inside is not a must have feature for high loot buildings, so i am totally fine with the ATC tower or the fire / police stations have multiple entrances / exits. But high traffic / high risk buildings shall not necessarily have an emergency exit. And to be honest, if someone camps the jail, i either decide to fight him or simply move on and loot the rest of the area. Theres nothing exclusive spawning in there, and if a guy is already in it, it is most likely looted anyway.

 

Also, that dude camping the jail could be you just being trapped by someone outside whishing there would be a second exit.

 

The bug I pointed out was the sudden stop/speed reduction when entering a building or on some terrain variations. I'm not pointing out the risk of being trapped inside, actually the opposite to that, I'm trying to say that building is way too dull and offers very very low excitement combats (since it goes all down to patience battle) and very very low succes rate for the more offensive players.

[IkaikaKekai 1957]

So your saying a military building, which are normally designed to be easily defendable from attackers, should be the opposite?  Maybe the bunkers at Normandy should have had unlocked doors on the beach side to make it fair for the Allies?  This is more realisitic rather than 'fair'.  If you want to assault this building, play it smart.  Find some grenades before you go raiding one or just ignore the building entirely.