Poll - Why aren't people playing hardcore mode

[LeeVanSpliff 156]

I play hardcore. I see it more as an extra character - for when my softcore character is parked next to a bunch of friends who're not online and I feel like running around and looting some stuff.

 

Don't understand that people find hardcore unrealistic. I mean, compared to softcore where third person lets you look over fences and around corners at people who can't see you.

 

Switching to first person felt very claustrophobic at first, but that's a hurdle you'll get over quickly. Do remember to turn the head bob down all the way though ....

[Lithium1056 45]

I play hardcore. I see it more as an extra character - for when my softcore character is parked next to a bunch of friends who're not online and I feel like running around and looting some stuff.

Don't understand that people find hardcore unrealistic. I mean, compared to softcore where third person lets you look over fences and around corners at people who can't see you.

Switching to first person felt very claustrophobic at first, but that's a hurdle you'll get over quickly. Do remember to turn the head bob down all the way though ....

More of a question here(since I play almost exclusively in first person) are you saying that "Hardcore" servers use a different hive?

I was under the impression it used the same character? If so I think I might find a hardcore server for the express purpose of having a character I can play when my friends aren't playing

[LeeVanSpliff 156]

More of a question here(since I play almost exclusively in first person) are you saying that "Hardcore" servers use a different hive?

I was under the impression it used the same character? If so I think I might find a hardcore server for the express purpose of having a character I can play when my friends aren't playing

 

Yeah, different hive for hardcore. Very handy indeed with a second character. Also for testing theories involving climbing on top of tall structures or running naked through Berezino or whatnot.

[UltimateGentleman 355]

If you want something realistic, you probably shouldn't be looking at a  VIDEO GAME.

 

A video game that aims to be as realistic as possible? Why in the fuck shouldn't I want something realistic?

What a stupid statement.

 

I don't see how OBE mode is more "realistic" than hardcore. o.O

 

Never said it was but hardcore isn't any more realistic so I'm picking the one I find most fun, if hardcore was better I'd switch between both.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Hardcore is balanced, Regular is not. That's why people don't play Hardcore.

Sitting in a building around a corner knowing exactly when someone is coming thus being able to time their demise perfectly is not balanced.

Sitting on top of a ledge watching someone below over the crest being able to position yourself perfectly for a kill without risking being spotted is not balanced.

You can't use the argument "everyone can do it" because whoever has the high ground or is closest to a wall has a 100% advantage over the other person. That is not balance.

Hardcore is the only truly balanced way to play DayZ. If you want to garner information about your surroundings, you have to take risks and expose yourself.

People use all kinds of excuses as to why they don't play Hardcore, but it ultimately boils down to people wanting whatever advantage possible when they play a game.

3rd person view was the biggest mistake Bohemia ever made. It's a fucking military simulator, yet it's the only mainstream shooter with 3rd person view. Even COUNTER-STRIKE forces 1st person view; 3rd person can only be enabled when you set sv_cheats to "1". I wonder why...?

Most missions in ARMA are easy mode even on more difficult settings simply because you can gather information over hills and around corners without exposing yourself. DayZ is advertised as a realistic/authentic survival horror title, yet it incorporates a camera view that even Bioshock doesn't.

My favorite part is when people tell me they're good at DayZ when they've only played Regular. Then we group up to play Hardcore and 99% of their "tactics" go out the window, resulting in them camping a spot when shit hits the fan because they have no idea how to play DayZ when the playing field is level.

Enjoy your Tomb Raider Z.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Grimey Rick

[sabre05 351]

A video game that aims to be as realistic as possible? Why in the fuck shouldn't I want something realistic?

What a stupid statement.

 

It doesn't aim to be as realistic as possible. It aims to be as AUTHENTIC as possible. If you want realism ask to be banned by Battle Eye when you die, because guess what. There's no respawns in real life.

[blowurselfup 54]

I play Hardcore all the time

 

Give it a try if you DARE! Meet me at Green Mountain

[St. Jimmy 1631]

3rd person ruins the immersion for me. If a game is authentic it isn't enough if the immersion is ruined.

[Lithium1056 45]

Hardcore is balanced, Regular is not. That's why people don't play Hardcore.

Sitting in a building around a corner knowing exactly when someone is coming thus being able to time their demise perfectly is not balanced.

Sitting on top of a ledge watching someone below over the crest being able to position yourself perfectly for a kill without risking being spotted is not balanced.

You can't use the argument "everyone can do it" because whoever has the high ground or is closest to a wall has a 100% advantage over the other person. That is not balance.

Hardcore is the only truly balanced way to play DayZ. If you want to garner information about your surroundings, you have to take risks and expose yourself.

People use all kinds of excuses as to why they don't play Hardcore, but it ultimately boils down to people wanting whatever advantage possible when they play a game.

3rd person view was the biggest mistake Bohemia ever made. It's a fucking military simulator, yet it's the only mainstream shooter with 3rd person view. Even COUNTER-STRIKE forces 1st person view; 3rd person can only be enabled when you set sv_cheats to "1". I wonder why...?

Most missions in ARMA are easy mode even on more difficult settings simply because you can gather information over hills and around corners without exposing yourself. DayZ is advertised as a realistic/authentic survival horror title, yet it incorporates a camera view that even Bioshock doesn't.

My favorite part is when people tell me they're good at DayZ when they've only played Regular. Then we group up to play Hardcore and 99% of their "tactics" go out the window, resulting in them camping a spot when shit hits the fan because they have no idea how to play DayZ when the playing field is level.

Enjoy your Tomb Raider Z.

I play a normal server and don't use 3pp for any combat situation or in any area I might encounter a player. Also battlefield utilizes 3rd person in vehicles on "core" servers. At least one edition of call of duty had a 3rd person game mode. So the truth of the matter really is this from a programming perspective. Most other games do not render a player model for the player. I assume when you said counter strike you meant Source or GO in which case I don't know. 1.6 on the other hand rendered hands/arms and a gun on your screen allowing more space/processing for the other character models on screen.

Also they are fully marketed as first person games. Quiet a few other first person shooters have incorporated third person cameras for certain situations rainbow 6 Vegas did so when taking cover it snapped to first person when you did anything but blind fire.

Back to your point though Battlefield disables third person vehicle Cameras for Hardcore servers. Currently the only thing about hardcore servers on SA is the fact third person is disabled. See my previous post about "hardcore" modes in most other games.

Is there a slight tactical advantage to it? Yes, do I use lean instead of 3pp yes. The third person camera is clunky at the moment. The current end game isn't survival either, it's gear up, hit up a high traffic area kill or be killed, wash rinse repeat as necessary.

As the focus shifts to survival over kill everything play styles will shift with it. When the cameras are tweaked play styles will change. When hardcore servers are a bit more "hardcore" more people will play until then it's simply a matter of the ability to have 3rd person or not

[WrecklessMEDIC 129]

Hardcore is balanced, Regular is not. That's why people don't play Hardcore.

Sitting in a building around a corner knowing exactly when someone is coming thus being able to time their demise perfectly is not balanced.

Sitting on top of a ledge watching someone below over the crest being able to position yourself perfectly for a kill without risking being spotted is not balanced.

You can't use the argument "everyone can do it" because whoever has the high ground or is closest to a wall has a 100% advantage over the other person. That is not balance.

Hardcore is the only truly balanced way to play DayZ. If you want to garner information about your surroundings, you have to take risks and expose yourself.

People use all kinds of excuses as to why they don't play Hardcore, but it ultimately boils down to people wanting whatever advantage possible when they play a game.

3rd person view was the biggest mistake Bohemia ever made. It's a fucking military simulator, yet it's the only mainstream shooter with 3rd person view. Even COUNTER-STRIKE forces 1st person view; 3rd person can only be enabled when you set sv_cheats to "1". I wonder why...?

Most missions in ARMA are easy mode even on more difficult settings simply because you can gather information over hills and around corners without exposing yourself. DayZ is advertised as a realistic/authentic survival horror title, yet it incorporates a camera view that even Bioshock doesn't.

My favorite part is when people tell me they're good at DayZ when they've only played Regular. Then we group up to play Hardcore and 99% of their "tactics" go out the window, resulting in them camping a spot when shit hits the fan because they have no idea how to play DayZ when the playing field is level.

Enjoy your Tomb Raider Z.

Hardcore isn't "balanced" as you say then either. You could just as easily have a visual advantage over your opponent in first person too.

Just because 1 guy can see the other guy first doesn't make it unfair.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Hardcore isn't "balanced" as you say then either. You could just as easily have a visual advantage over your opponent in first person too.

Just because 1 guy can see the other guy first doesn't make it unfair.

Wow, dumbest post I've read so far. You could have a positional advantage in 1st person, but you'd actually have to physically PEEK to take advantage of it. In so doing, you could potentially be shot each time you take a peek to gain information pertaining to your target's whereabouts.

In 3rd person you can physically peek OVER the wall/ledge without exposing yourself. That equals zero risk, which is completely different than 1st person's having to take risks to gain information.

People defending this blow my mind. I guess I have to consider the gap in experience between people on the internet. Some people just wouldn't know any better.

[leviathanapsu 94]

I personally loath first person perspective outside of aiming in this game. For me, it lowers my immersion. That sounds stupid and insane of course, but bear with me a moment. In the real world, I have a number of senses. In the game, I have two. I can see things and I can hear (somewhat) things. I can't feel when I am cut in the game, I can't smell the scent of sweat from the guy who was running through the area just a moment before me. I can't even really tell where sounds are coming from in the game all the time since half the time a guy running over gravel only makes a faint sound, but I can hear a clip reload several buildings away.

 

When I am in first person in this game, I have the ability to see what is in front of me. I have to guess from what is happening there if I have been hit, if I am bleeding. I have to guess what condition my clothes are in if I am unable to risk going into my inventory. The gray screen effect does help somewhat for deciding my condition and if blood is spewing in the front, that is far more obvious. There are other issues as well. If I hide in the woods RL, I am supremely aware of my position in relation to a tree or bush. In first person, I can never tell if I am still under it or not since sometimes I am covered and sometimes I am sitting in a gap. The list goes on and on. Death is the end of your gear in both versions, so the only difference in them is the perspective.

 

I find myself more cautious when I know other people can be in third person. Yes, I can peak without exposing myself, but so can they. Any advantage I gained is also gained by my enemy. I am forced to be more aware of things while on the move. You don't have to like 3rd person perspective, but don't think that gives you the right to say no one should have it. They have two modes for a reason. Each can play as they like. 1st person perspective in this game ties my hands up in so many ways that they aren't in a real world setting and 3p gives me enough extra data to make up the difference in what I lose over real life.

 

I do get it. If you only look at it from an exposure/risk perspective, why would anyone play 3p unless they want a cheating style advantage. If you feel that way, awesome! Glad they have Hardcore for you to get away from the wall peekers. Just don't assume that all of us are looking for a way to cheat as being the only reason to prefer 3p.

[Irish. 4886]

Either mode is exactly the same to me.. literally the same. 

 

I dont notice any difference other than what backpack I carry on me in hardcore. 

[Evil Minion 943]

I mostly play hardcore because I hate playing in third person and the advantages it gives you. People peeking around corners or over walls while staying completely invisible themselves kills both immersion and fun for me. If they removed this particular advantage I would play regular as well - but still in 1st person most of the time.

 

In general I don't like 3rd person very much and believe most games make a mistake in providing it in the first place. Because it provides extra data to players that prevents adding depth to the game. The post above (leviathanapsu) summarizes this pretty well - and having all this artificial awareness is a very bad thing in my opinion.

[Lithium1056 45]

Either mode is exactly the same to me.. literally the same.

I dont notice any difference other than what backpack I carry on me in hardcore.

That is in fact because with the exception of camera options (3pp v no 3pp) they currently are the exact same. The "balance" that the other person spoke of is non-existent. Because all players on core fiction the same as the other and can all use the aforementioned 3rd person perspective to get a view over a wall or around a corner. And in hardcore you have to lean around a corner to see around a corner.

Other than that same settings across the board at the moment

[Shrub Rocketeer ™ 879]

ok here is situation of hadcore mode for me, I like the hardcore MORE THAN THE EASY ONE but i is prefer the busy server and also easy mode is less efforts need for look around see what is happen around me so when i am play with machete master and we have plan for long time session we finding maximum player hardcore server with best ping for us if i playing alone i using easy mode because if i am say honest i don't feel sad when easy mode character is die is like mess around casual practise time playing for fun

Edited July 20, 2014 by Shrub Rocketeer ™

[WrecklessMEDIC 129]

Wow, dumbest post I've read so far. You could have a positional advantage in 1st person, but you'd actually have to physically PEEK to take advantage of it. In so doing, you could potentially be shot each time you take a peek to gain information pertaining to your target's whereabouts.

In 3rd person you can physically peek OVER the wall/ledge without exposing yourself. That equals zero risk, which is completely different than 1st person's having to take risks to gain information.

People defending this blow my mind. I guess I have to consider the gap in experience between people on the internet. Some people just wouldn't know any better.

Look I get it. You like to pay video games as some uber hardcorz only dude. If it makes you feel cool and better than others then have at 'er.

[Lithium1056 45]

This really is entirely preference at the moment neither mode has anything different besides 3pp which isn't that much of an advantage ya know indoors or at a distance. The main gripe I see is peeking over walls or around corners. So if some one happens by in kill range I suppose that's an advantage outside. Other than that it doesn't help. I think the need to either implement an actual hardcore (which I assume is the plan) or just call "hardcore" first person mode.

[solodude23 649]

Look I get it. You like to pay video games as some uber hardcorz only dude. If it makes you feel cool and better than others then have at 'er.

No need to be condescending. Grimey Rick stated what the real problem is with 3PP in an organized and thoughtful manner. It may be a small difference, but this small difference leads to a great disparity in gameplay that not only rewards camping (by way of proning on a roof or sitting behind a wall), but also hinders stealthy, tactical gameplay. It's not about playing "uber hardcorz", it's about having a balanced playing field where nobody has unrealistically advantageous positions.

 

What does this have to do with being "cool" or feeling better than others? Don't be childish. For me, playing on normal creates a sense of discomfort - knowing that at any moment someone could be looking over a wall or around a corner at me. It's funny too - because many people like 3PP because it gives them a "safety bubble" of sorts, but in my experience it makes you less safe because it's that much more easy for someone to see you around cover without exposing themselves.

 

 

@ OP: Hardcore till I die! 

Edited July 20, 2014 by solodude23

[rybec 339]

It doesn't alter your FOV, it just pulls the camera back a bit.

 

 

If you want something realistic, you probably shouldn't be looking at a  VIDEO GAME.

Nowhere in there did I say "FOV". That's how you read it. I said "being able to see more at once."

In third person you can see the left of your character, your right, your immediate behind, and directly ahead. All of this coming from an elevated viewpoint instead of first person at ground level.

[Ramblin Hans 118]

I play some of each, but primarily 3rd person. However, even on 3P servers I still use 1P view quite a lot.

 

Reason #1: 3P gives you a better movement experience, as if you had actual peripheral vision. The way this engine works, you get snagged on the environment alot, and in 1P you can't see whats blocking you. I'm sorry, it wouldn't take me 2 seconds to figure out why I can't move through a door or to figure out I'm stuck on a low log or fence. 3P I can see enough around my character to account for some of this clumsiness.

 

Reason #2: The sound is basically terrible. There is no other way to state it kindly. 3P gives me some perspective behind me since half the time you can't hear gunshots going off accurately not to mention charging footsteps. And when you do hear noises, 99% of the time they are just random sounds or rabbits, it allows me to filter some of that out by being more aware of my immediate area.

 

Reason #3: Motion nausea. I personally don't have a problem with it, but several friends I play with the head bob and everything in 1P bothers them. And these are players who have played many a 1P shooter, not sure what it is about DayZ's first person that does it.  

 

The main thing I DO like about hardcore is of course the fact people can't actually see where they shouldn't be able to. Over walls doesnt bug me as much as the laying down in the grass and you can see up around all over. 

[theirongiant 200]

Peeking only gives you an advantage if you have 3rd person while everyone else on the server is using 1st person. When everyone has the same ability it ceases to be an advantage. You can be peeked at just as much as you can peek at someone else. Stop stating it like it's a one way street.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Peeking only gives you an advantage if you have 3rd person while everyone else on the server is using 1st person. When everyone has the same ability it ceases to be an advantage. You can be peeked at just as much as you can peek at someone else. Stop stating it like it's a one way street.

 

:emptycan:

 

I wish I could TAKE beans from nonsensical posts. If you don't understand the game enough to realize how much of a tactical advantage 3rd person is when defending a position, you don't deserve them.

[theirongiant 200]

:emptycan:

 

I wish I could TAKE beans from nonsensical posts. If you don't understand the game enough to realize how much of a tactical advantage 3rd person is when defending a position, you don't deserve them.

 

I'll give you beans, that's a close as I can do. Sure  you can construct specific scenarios where it's an advantage to one player but over the course of weeks and months, sometimes you're the windscreen,sometimes you're the wasp. I'm just pointing out that if you're saying it's easymode for one side in a given situation then logically it's harder than hardcore when you're on the flipside of that same scenario.

[WrecklessMEDIC 129]

Peeking only gives you an advantage if you have 3rd person while everyone else on the server is using 1st person. When everyone has the same ability it ceases to be an advantage. You can be peeked at just as much as you can peek at someone else. Stop stating it like it's a one way street.

Couldn't have said it better myself. :)