Torture in DayZ SA?

[oanj 28]

If it has its place anywhere, it's here. But are you worrying about how it is right now or how it might evolve?

If they would ask the players if they should add rape and stuff I don't know how I would answer because I am the opinion that everything is ok in a game, I for example don't like some things (I remember the CoD mission at the airport, i felt sick, and had the urge to go on with the campagin to seek revenge). But these things still increase immersion, and if you want revenge because a stranger just impregnated you during rape, well atleast something to do...?

Edit: Cannibalism and the ability to dismember other players HAVE to be added anyway, too many good points and only the one, less severe point of moral against it.

Words fail me. You obviously have no idea what rape and torture etc does to someone. Video games and media have a huge influence on on the people that play/watch them. The guy who massacred those teenagers on that island was a huge CoD fan. 8 year olds probably play this game I don't think anyone at any age at all should be exposed to rape and torture in real life or virtualy. If you want sick things like this see a doctor or make a mod for yourself and rape and torture people.

Edited June 15, 2014 by OpTic_Polar

[pillock 850]

So, how would you expect this to work? If you restrain someone, you can middle-mouse on them and select the "rape" option? Then there's a pre-rendered animation that the devs have created?

 

If anyone seriously thinks that idea will or should get anywhere near this or any other game, then they are stupider than pigshit.

 

Children won't make it into the game in any form, because there's just no logical reason to include them - therefore it avoids any related "decency" issues.

 

As for cannibalism, you could argue a case for that, given the scenario. But dismembering corpses? A little pointless, really. I'd have thought you'd collect meat 'cuts' in the same way you currently do from animal carasses - there's no dismembering of animals in the game, so why should players be able to do it to people?

 

If you can justify something for gameplay purposes, then fair enough. But gratuity for gratuity's sake is childish and pathetic.

[oanj 28]

Rape, sex, torture and cannibalism I'm all in(exclude children, that would be too sick, even for me :P ). Movies have these things, so why can't videogames?. Looks even worse on movies because its not pixels but actual filmed scenes..

I hope you get raped and tortured then you will realise it's not something that should implemented in anything let alone a game.

[hal269091 1]

@Tobias Winfro: You probably got something down the wrong pipe.

I myself will not buy the game, because EVEN the opportunity to torture other players like it is possible now, is something I don't want to have in a game I support by buying it - not to mention all the other things I listed.

BUT - and its a big BUT - what you write in your last sentence does proof your own moral at least questionable.

We live in a world of free expression. And what I did was by no means 'suggest' to have that built in, or even promote such things in any way - I think anyone who can read could take that information from what I wrote, and how I wrote it. Its just an atrocity that does happen in real life, as you have stated, and so - for the sake of an ill going realism - could be built in. Honestly, I have as much sympathy for a raped women or a tortured, helpless prisoner, as I have for an abused child - I don't differentiate as much as you seem to do.

For me none of the above is acceptable (not even in a game) - and wanting someone to punch in the face is neither. Violence, my friend, does start in our daily life, for example by punching someone in the face for something he says....

---------------------------------------------------------------
@BigMike, @Kaboki, @Sovetsky

First - of course I anticipated the 'not real' argument to come, as stated in my first post.

But think about this: DayZ is game, that is capable of creating real emotions in a player, like guilt for having killed someone and others. IS it SO unreal? Of course, nobody will get physically hurt, but I doubt that we really are so cool and distanced, as the conciousness about all that being just pixels might suggest. Also one you did mention, that scenes like that do tell facts about the people who commit such atrocities - how can that be true, if it's all so unreal? If there is NO connection between an avatars actions and the players character?

Also, most of you DO in fact draw a line, where ever it might be located. Why do you think so, if it's just pixels?

I think, if it REALLY was just pixels, no emotions included, no connection to reality, there would be no need for a limit. That lets me suppose that it is in fact NOT just pixels.

Also - why would you bother getting tortured, preferring to die by logging out, if it was just Pixels - just the loss of a few minutes of time? I doubt it.

About the Movies: Thats a comparison which does often come up - but theres a difference. In almost any movie (as well as in story driven computer games), atrocities appear within an ethical context. Please note that I wrote 'almost'  - there might be a few exceptions, I am aware of that, but for the vast majority its true what I say. Such atrocities are almost every time being committed by evil persons, or mentally ill persons, and quite often they get their 'deserved' punishment. In all those cases that context is implemented in the media itself. So theres mostly a message connected to the images shown.

And that is the difference to DayZ, where the story is written by the players, and where 'evil' characters easily can get away.

---------------------------------------------------------------
What you, Sovetsky, write about anti censorship is a huge topic to touch. I would not want to start a discussion about that, just so much:
I come from Germany, a country where 75 years ago some the most disgusting atrocities ever have been committed, not just, but also in the name of science. So you might be able to empathize that I see that matter from different side. At least the discussion about control and morale may not stop ever, not in science, not in the media and not in politics.

Seen, that we started with a somewhat trivial videogame we have come to quite important and serious topics. Maybe afterall its not that trivial asking the question what should be allowed to do in a game, and what not...

[Deathlove 2286]

I hope you get raped and tortured then you will realise it's not something that should implemented in anything let alone a game.

Your literally no better than a rapist when you say that stuff. XD

[Kaboki 62]

Words fail me. You obviously have no idea what rape and torture etc does to someone. Video games and media have a huge influence on on the people that play/watch them. The guy who massacred those teenagers on that island was a huge CoD fan. 8 year olds probably play this game I don't think anyone at any age at all should be exposed to rape and torture in real life or virtualy. If you want sick things like this see a doctor or make a mod for yourself and rape and torture people.

 

If your talking about that idiot Anders Behring Breivik, he didn't get inspired by COD, he got inspired by right wing politicians around Europe like Geert Wilders and others. He just used COD, cocaine and anobolic steroids for 'training' for the act after he got inspired by those disgusting politicians.... There is no fucking way you can blame COD for what happend or any other video game....Heck he would even be better off using Arma because of the more realistic approach to military training...

 

 

I myself will not buy the game, because EVEN the opportunity to torture other players like it is possible now, is something I don't want to have in a game I support by buying it - not to mention all the other things I listed.

 

But killing countless of people in video games is fine? Is it worse too rape someone than too kill them??

Edited June 15, 2014 by Kaboki

[Deathlove 2286]

But killing countless of people in video games is fine? Is it worse too rape someone than too kill them??

Yes its ok to kill ppl in a video game. If that were the case MANY of us would be arrested a LONG time ago for running over ppl in GTA games. Than there would be no one left to arrest..... XD

[hal269091 1]

But killing countless of people in video games is fine? Is it worse too rape someone than too kill them??

 

Did you even bother to read my posts?

 

We all got used to kill other players in online games. Of course, from an ethic point of view that's questionable, too. But on one side in that case chances are more often kinda equal than not (probably most people will agree that killing unarmed freshspawns is not something to be proud of, as it does not require much skill). On the other side a game that wouldn't offer that chance to compete with other players would be pretty boring.

 

Everyone would have to decide where to draw his personal border he doesn't want to cross, be it in his playstyle or be it in his decision to buy or not to buy a game.

 

In addition - don't you see a difference between a competition with more or less equal chances and killing or abusing someone who is defenceless, even in a game?

[Kaboki 62]

Did you even bother to read my posts?

Nope:p, sorry, I should maybe quoted someone else that is against rape or  sex in video games...

,

Everyone would have to decide where to draw his personal border he doesn't want to cross, be it in his playstyle or be it in his decision to buy or not to buy a game.

 

In addition - don't you see a difference between a competition with more or less equal chances and killing or abusing someone who is defenceless, even in a game?

 

I don't see killing people more morally justified than raping people(in a video game), atleast with a rape the player can walk off only feeling shameful afterwords but he will keep he's life...

I have been abused alot in dayz and raped 'verbally', by other players, if I could be raped 'visually 'by them too it would just be even more immersive and then I would really have to fear other players.

Edited June 15, 2014 by Kaboki

[Nesuma (DayZ) 108]

Words fail me. You obviously have no idea what rape and torture etc does to someone. Video games and media have a huge influence on on the people that play/watch them. The guy who massacred those teenagers on that island was a huge CoD fan. 8 year olds probably play this game I don't think anyone at any age at all should be exposed to rape and torture in real life or virtualy. If you want sick things like this see a doctor or make a mod for yourself and rape and torture people.

Edit: Very first: Well, wars do bad things to people too, I still don't want to ban shooter games.

-First of all, are you seriously trying to say that media influences me in a way where I do the things in reality? Wow.

-Second, you mean Breivik? Well I don't think CoD was his only problem.

 

-Third, do you want the governments to ban rape and torture from everything? Even books and films? Do you realize that stories covering these things also teach persons the bad side of it? Because a book makes you actually feel bad or scared? There isn't only the offenders view, also the victims.

-Fourth, I thought that I made it clear that I think these things are bad and make me feel sick, but they still have their place in games like Dayz. Don't be so closeminded.

But atleast you only insulted me in a passive way :) thanks

[Nesuma (DayZ) 108]

sorry for failpost

Edited June 16, 2014 by Nesuma

[hal269091 1]

-Third, do you want the governments to ban rape and torture from everything? Even books and films? Do you realize that stories covering these things also teach persons the bad side of it? Because a book makes you actually feel bad or scared? There isn't only the offenders view, also the victims.

 

Indeed - and thats what games like DayZ lack!

[haknslash 763]

Geebus. I feel like I'm back in college. Lots of text here to digest.

I guess the torture aspect in this game doesn't bother me because frankly it's as soft as a bunny rabbit. There is no real extreme torture in this game. Calling it torture is probably giving it more weight than is really there. It's more or less trolling only instead of C4 and dip dip potato chips you have windex and rotten food. Oh and you can shoot someone to break their leg to make them crawl. If that is really chipping someone's moral fiber I can provide better examples. I welcome anyone to torture me. My body is ready and it will make for great video if they are creative. :D

OP should play The Forest :D. Deadly traps, AI caring for other AI, expressions, cannibalism, dismemberment, you name it lol. Seriously though if you get easily offended by violence then this game is not for you. Not even sure why this thread is here to begin with if you have no interest in buying it.

Edited June 15, 2014 by haknslash

[OrLoK 16186]

Hello there

 

Im very tempted to close this thread.

 

Rape is never something to make light of. It is a hideous thing.

 

It will not be a mechanic in game.

 

If you cant see why then you need to do some self analysis.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[TheCourierVX 40]

Hello there

 

Im very tempted to close this thread.

 

Rape is never something to make light of. It is a hideous thing.

 

It will not be a mechanic in game.

 

If you cant see why then you need to do some self analysis.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

^this

[Kaboki 62]

Hello there

 

Im very tempted to close this thread.

 

Rape is never something to make light of. It is a hideous thing.

Isn't killing a hideous thing too?

 

It will not be a mechanic in game.

I wasn't  expecting it either to make it into the game, the world isn't ready for it, and no game that has that content would ever be published in any country...

 

If you cant see why then you need to do some self analysis.

Maybe all people that kill in video games also should take a self analysis?

 

Rgds

 

LoK

Edited June 15, 2014 by Kaboki

[hal269091 1]

Rape is never something to make light of. It is a hideous thing.

 

Indeed - as is torture....

[hal269091 1]

Maybe all people that kill in video games also should take a self analysis?

 

What do you personally do? Not kill? Take self analysis? Or both?

 

I am not trying to insult you. I myself did not kill more than 5 players (in self defence) despite playing the mod for two years now. But that is not out of morale... it's just that is is not me, I don't have fun at it (at ruining another players game - if I just wanted to fight I could play games like BF...). I just didn't want to bring that into the discussion, as - in my opinion - it goes over the top to talk about fighting in games. Its not realistic and would make games boring, if there was no more competition. Here is the place where a player can make his own choice.

 

Not at rape and / or torture.

 

Just my personal opinion, not more, not less.

Edited June 15, 2014 by hal269091

[p4triot 207]

Indeed - as is torture....

 

"torture" may have a purpose. I gain nothing from raping a handcuffed guy ingame, but if I handcuff you maybe I'll shoot you once or twice to make you lose blood, then bandage, force feed you rotten fruit and then release you. The reason I did so is to avoid immediate revenge, cuz you're now on blurry vision and got bigger problems right now. Even if you find a gun and ammo in the next 5 minutes you aint going against me, first you have to puke to heal food poisoning, and then find enough food/water to heal. ETA.. around 30 minuts I would say, more than enough for me to finish my business there and gtfo. How can I do this if shooting handcuffed isn't allowed?

 

So yeah, im torturing you technically, but it was just a mean to an end. And to be honest, the reason I did that was so I didnt have to kill you. Turns out im actually a good person :rolleyes:  (xD)

[OrLoK 16186]

Hello there

 

One can emulate "torture" in game but Torture proper will never be implemented as a mechanic per se

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[hal269091 1]

One can emulate "torture" in game but Torture proper will never be implemented as a mechanic per se

 

A very delicate distinction you make...

 

Put in other words: If game mechanincs not intended to be used for torture, can nevertheless be used for torture by players who are smart enough, it will be tolerated. But it's not the intention of the developers to implement torture. (correct me if I am wrong)

 

In case I am right with my assumption above - thats is exactly what I pictured to have happened.... and its also exatcly what I question.

[randomspawn 215]

Great thread. It allows people to see how others feel about games, and violence in general. I suspect it will be locked, but I don't think it should. If you don't have these types of conversations, then you can't really formulate what attitudes the players have. 

 

Just look at the movies, you can kill thousands and get a PG rating, but flash a boob and you risk NC17. It's a world of hypocrisy, and most people eventually conform their ideas to match that of society as a whole. This is the reason I don't think we will see this type of mechanic added to the game. The developers are here to make money, not friends. Making money means they have to keep the game available in the max amount of markets. If they do anything to piss off the Chinese, or the Albanians, they lose potential profits. That is what drives the game development, and most of the world for that matter.

[oanj 28]

Just close this thread rape = no torture = no, end of it's sick.

Edited June 15, 2014 by OpTic_Polar

[pillock 850]

A very delicate distinction you make...

 

Put in other words: If game mechanincs not intended to be used for torture, can nevertheless be used for torture by players who are smart enough, it will be tolerated. But it's not the intention of the developers to implement torture. (correct me if I am wrong)

 

In case I am right with my assumption above - thats is exactly what I pictured to have happened.... and its also exatcly what I question.

 

As I said earlier in the thread, the devs haven't implemented specific torture mechanics - they have implemented the ability to wound people (necessary for decent fighting mechanics), the ability to force feed (necessary for certain medical actions), and the ability to restrain (necessary for arresting and holding people up). There are good, solid, logical gameplay reasons for these things, and they're not terribly controversial in themselves, given the current state of our entertainment industry's morality-o-meter.

 

Things like rape have no place in the game for any reason - you cannot justify it for any gameplay reason whatsoever. Therefore, isn't analogous with the improvised 'torture' that players can attempt in DayZ.

 

But perhaps you're right: perhaps you shouldn't be able to force-feed conscious players (only to give food/water to revive people); perhaps you shouldn't even be able to restrain people. I'm not sure. I think the way the game is now is pretty harmless, but I see no reason for the devs to go any further with that sort of thing.

Edited June 15, 2014 by Pillock

[Kaboki 62]

What do you personally do? Not kill? Take self analysis? Or both?

 

 

Oh me, Yeah sure I kill in video games, so maybe I should take a self analysis....?? My point was, why should people that want rape/torture/cannibalism in video games take a self analysis, but people that kill in video games shouldn't or do booth parts need to do that really?? I just don't see the difference having rape/torture in a video to be anything more bad than kill a bunch of people in games, really I don't...