Ammo Calibration : Poll & Discussion

[gibonez 3633]

I understand people who just don't care, but why would anyone actively oppose this? Having wrong calibers does not make any sense. Why have wrong calibers when we can have right ones

 

Because it is yet another step that slows down their coastal pvp.

[coalminer 43]

Because it is yet another step that slows down their coastal pvp.

It wouldn't even mess with coastal pvp if done properly. All it takes is smart set up of loot spawns.

[frozenjaws 69]

I understand people who just don't care, but why would anyone actively oppose this? Having wrong calibers does not make any sense. Why have wrong calibers when we can have right ones

Its not a matter of changing a couple numbers, if that was all then it would have no effect either way. But your introducing 2-4 new calibers into a system with relatively little weaponry to support it.

Its changing rarity and effectiveness of firearms, into a loot table already fed with so many trash items. Its not that people dont want "right" calibers its that they dont want MORE calibers for no apparent reasoning at all. Except " ROCKET GIFF RIGHT CALIBERS, REALISM!"

[gibonez 3633]

Its not a matter of changing a couple numbers, if that was all then it would have no effect either way. But your introducing 2-4 new calibers into a system with relatively little weaponry to support it.

Its changing rarity and effectiveness of firearms, into a loot table already fed with so many trash items. Its not that people dont want "right" calibers its that they dont want MORE calibers for no apparent reasoning at all. Except " ROCKET GIFF RIGHT CALIBERS, REALISM!"

 

As people have explained countless times in this thread and elsewhere it has a very important reason and it is not just realism.

 

The reason to add the correct calibers is to ensure that finding ammo for weapons is that tiny bit harder.Realism is just a bonus.

[frozenjaws 69]

As people have explained countless times in this thread and elsewhere it has a very important reason and it is not just realism.

 

The reason to add the correct calibers is to ensure that finding ammo for weapons is that tiny bit harder.Realism is just a bonus.

So wait for loot economy? if all you care about is rarity, why not make that point instead? The only reason ammo, and everything else, is so plentiful at the moment is because no actual balancing has begun. that's the thing though, it doesn't have a very good reason.. and if it did its not coming across in this thread, or any other ive read, and ive read plenty. 

Edited July 1, 2014 by Frozenjaws

[Daemonkid 493]

So wait for loot economy? if all you care about is rarity, why not make that point instead? The only reason ammo, and everything else, is so plentiful at the moment is because no actual balancing has begun. 

No, you don't seem to understand what he means. If there is only 5 calibers in the game, only those 5 calibers can spawn, and if each mil spawn has say 6 spawn points, all 5 of those calibers can spawn within those 6 points, 1 type of each caliber. Now say we have 10 calibers, and only 6 spawn points, that leaves 4 calibers out of the spawn equation. Thus decreasing the likelihood of finding the caliber you are looking for.

 

Also loot economy isn't going to work they way you think it does. It's going to be used to control loot across ALL servers, so talking high end stuff such as NVG's or say a rare high powered sniper rifle.

Ammo is not going to be effected by the economy.

Edited July 1, 2014 by Daemonkid

[UltimateGentleman 355]

Unless you provide some hard number, you seem to be member of even smaller minority.

If you dislike realistic games I assure you, you can have your fun elsewhere.

DayZ SA does not need to be ruined nor needlessly streamlined to be success! Which it already kinda has been btw.

 

What are you even talking about?

 

Do you think 91 people is a lot compared to how many people have the game? It's nothing, not even 1% of the players.

There have been over 2 million copies of the game sold so far and at the time I said that 91 had voted now 98 have.

 

Please tell me how I'm in the minority, the fact that only 75 of that 98 voted for it also points to it being not that many else people would flock to this forum and that number would be hitting the thousands.

 

 

I still find it hilarious how people treat this as an ultra realistic hardcore game. It is a game, there aren't realistic calibres in it, get over it.

There are more than most games anyway, typically in like an FPS you just get "assault rifle ammo" or "shotgun ammo" that fits in every one of those types. You get more than that so you have to right to complain that it's "casual" compared to games like that because you want 100% realism when it's impossible with the current technology.

 

There's a simulator where you can be a goat, and even one where you're a rock I'm very confident there'll be a gun simulator with all the calibres you can imagine, go play that or shoot real guns, whatever.

I'm sure the people who don't really give a shit would appreciate it if the others didn't annoy the devs about it all the time, they have the power here.

 

As I said before you get what you get, if they don't add any more calibres in then boo hoo the game is ruined for you.

[frozenjaws 69]

No, you don't seem to understand what he means. If there is only 5 calibers in the game, only those 5 calibers can spawn, and if each mil spawn has say 6 spawn points, all 5 of those calibers can spawn within those 6 points, 1 type of each caliber. Now say we have 10 calibers, and only 6 spawn points, that leaves 4 calibers out of the spawn equation. Thus decreasing the likelihood of finding the caliber you are looking for.

 

Also loot economy isn't going to work they way you think it does. It's going to be used to control loot across ALL servers, so talking high end stuff such as NVG's or say a rare high powered sniper rifle.

Ammo is not going to be effected by the economy.

ok... thx for the lesson in 2nd degree math but.. you fail to make your point. Loot economy is also about adjusting the number of spawns and the likelyhood of items even spawning, right now loot spawns almost everywhere and in excess but that is in no way an inclination of the future. A building is not always going to spawn stuff and most likely will never be filled to the brim like most houses are now. or military loot locations for that matter. Your point is moot. its all included in loot economy and balancing.

Oh and btw. Im in no way saying "dont ever add new calibers" and the dev team has specifically already said that they WILL add more specialty ammo for those rarer, hard to get weapons. I just dont see why we would take a step backwards and add more identical calibers for issues that can easily be addressed in other ways.

[Daemonkid 493]

What are you even talking about?

 

Do you think 91 people is a lot compared to how many people have the game? It's nothing, not even 1% of the players.

There have been over 2 million copies of the game sold so far and at the time I said that 91 had voted now 98 have.

 

Please tell me how I'm in the minority, the fact that only 75 of that 98 voted for it also points to it being not that many else people would flock to this forum and that number would be hitting the thousands.

 

 

I still find it hilarious how people treat this as an ultra realistic hardcore game. It is a game, there aren't realistic calibres in it, get over it.

There are more than most games anyway, typically in like an FPS you just get "assault rifle ammo" or "shotgun ammo" that fits in every one of those types. You get more than that so you have to right to complain that it's "casual" compared to games like that because you want 100% realism when it's impossible with the current technology.

 

There's a simulator where you can be a goat, and even one where you're a rock I'm very confident there'll be a gun simulator with all the calibres you can imagine, go play that or shoot real guns, whatever.

I'm sure the people who don't really give a shit would appreciate it if the others didn't annoy the devs about it all the time, they have the power here.

 

As I said before you get what you get, if they don't add any more calibres in then boo hoo the game is ruined for you.

No. You are in the minority. I'm going to ask, did you play the mod? Because that makes a huge difference in the validity of your opinion. The answer is more than likely no and i'm going out on a limb and saying that. People don't FUCKING WANT REALISTIC CALIBERS FOR REALISM REASONS. THIS HAS BEEN STATED MANY TIMES. YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS. THIS IS A GAMEPLAY/LOOT DISCUSSION AND THE RAMIFICATIONS OF STREAMLINING THAT SHIT. Caps for emphasis. Streamlining calibers is bad for the game, people like you who want don't want the game to be difficult annoy the shit out of many people on this forum, because that was never what DayZ was supposed to be about. We were supposed to get a challenging, unforgiving and authentic world. One where you can feel immersed. Little things such as this count in a game like DayZ. 

 

Have you ever heard of roguelike? Have you ever played one? Have you ever played Dwarf-fortress. The complexity of that game would blow your face off, yet the game has a huge cult following because the devs (2 GUYS) care so much about their project. They don't streamline anything or make things easier for new players. The term LOSING IS FUN originates from that game. It's what makes it fun, getting your ass kicked 2 days from sunday, yet you go back in for more, because you actually strive to be successful. 

 

Now this whole topic about ammunition is not about REALISM, like you ignorant's think it is, whenever others and myself have stated as such, you ALWAYS revert to the REALISM argument. 

I don't care if they add fucking fictional calibers and fictional guns. As long as the fictional calibers go into their correct fictional weapon, and those fictional calibers bloat the lootspawns so instead of always finding what i'm looking for with 0 trouble involved, basically guaranteeing the next mil spawn I check is going to have ammo I will need. It's not hard at all to find the ammo you're looking for in the game right now. Because there simply isn't enough different ammunition to bloat the loot tables with.

[Daemonkid 493]

ok... thx for the lesson in 2nd degree math but.. you fail to make your point. Loot economy is also about adjusting the number of spawns and the likelyhood of items even spawning, right now loot spawns almost everywhere and in excess but that is in no way an inclination of the future. A building is not always going to spawn stuff and most likely will never be filled to the brim like most houses are now. or military loot locations for that matter. Your point is moot. its all included in loot economy and balancing.

Oh and btw. Im in no way saying "dont ever add new calibers" and the dev team has specifically already said that they WILL add more specialty ammo for those rarer, hard to get weapons. I just dont see why we would take a step backwards and add more identical calibers for issues that can easily be addressed in other ways.

Loot economy isn't going to handle things such as ammunition, food or drink. The loot economy is handling specific items that can possibly spawn across ALL servers. 

[igor-vk 909]

This game is too complicated as it is. Why we have 8 different calibers? There should be only 3: pistol ammo, rifle ammo and shotgun ammo. Why do we need to stop, take out bandage and manualy bandage?? Why are there no instant medkits? Why do we even need to stand and search dead players inventory? You just walk over his corpse and automaticly pick up all you need. Why are there no nametags over players so we know who is in what team? Why is there no minimap? Why we cant jump out of F-22 directly in M1 Abrams and be both driver and guner at same time?

 

Maybe because its a diferent type of game? Maybe its ment to be complicated. Maybe its not 100% realistic, but it folows its original idea.

 

btw, let them try loading 7,62x51 in Mosin and fire it.

[coalminer 43]

Do you think 91 people is a lot compared to how many people have the game? It's nothing, not even 1% of the players.

There have been over 2 million copies of the game sold so far and at the time I said that 91 had voted now 98 have.

 

Please tell me how I'm in the minority, the fact that only 75 of that 98 voted for it also points to it being not that many else people would flock to this forum and that number would be hitting the thousands.

Are you saying that 75 people voted for correct ammo and 2000000 people own DayZ, therefore only 75 of two million people want correct ammo? Wow... just wow. The things we're having to deal with here...

[frozenjaws 69]

No. You are in the minority. I'm going to ask, did you play the mod? Because that makes a huge difference in the validity of your opinion. The answer is more than likely no and i'm going out on a limb and saying that. People don't FUCKING WANT REALISTIC CALIBERS FOR REALISM REASONS. THIS HAS BEEN STATED MANY TIMES. YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS. THIS IS A GAMEPLAY/LOOT DISCUSSION AND THE RAMIFICATIONS OF STREAMLINING THAT SHIT. Caps for emphasis. Streamlining calibers is bad for the game, people like you who want don't want the game to be difficult annoy the shit out of many people on this forum, because that was never what DayZ was supposed to be about. We were supposed to get a challenging, unforgiving and authentic world. One where you can feel immersed. Little things such as this count in a game like DayZ. 

 

Have you ever heard of roguelike? Have you ever played one? Have you ever played Dwarf-fortress. The complexity of that game would blow your face off, yet the game has a huge cult following because the devs (2 GUYS) care so much about their project. They don't streamline anything or make things easier for new players. The term LOSING IS FUN originates from that game. It's what makes it fun, getting your ass kicked 2 days from sunday, yet you go back in for more, because you actually strive to be successful. 

 

Now this whole topic about ammunition is not about REALISM, like you ignorant's think it is, whenever others and myself have stated as such, you ALWAYS revert to the REALISM argument. 

I don't care if they add fucking fictional calibers and fictional guns. As long as the fictional calibers go into their correct fictional weapon, and those fictional calibers bloat the lootspawns so instead of always finding what i'm looking for with 0 trouble involved, basically guaranteeing the next mil spawn I check is going to have ammo I will need. It's not hard at all to find the ammo you're looking for in the game right now. Because there simply isn't enough different ammunition to bloat the loot tables with.

Statistically people who played the mod, compared to people who play the standalone is in minority.. Just saying. Check dayz mods number of unique players compared to copies of SA sold.

So you NEED more calibers for this game to be hard? Is it that unthinkably difficult for you to remember 10-15 calibers and their respective weapons? Why not actually focus on decease or environment to make the game hard. I understand your point, but this is not the solution. Your misguided fight for realistic calibers is nothing more than a witch hunt for "casuals" who havent played the mod and dont understand what Dayz is all about. 

 

And yes ofcourse loot economy will balance out the spawns of ammo, and food and every other item in the game, it is literally its only purpose. Exactly what it is designed to do, now rarer items will have more specific and unique parameters to the amount of these items, but why would you think trash items or ammo wouldnt be affected and balanced as well?

[pilgrim* 3514]

You gun-realism people... oh dear oh dear oh dear

 

You don't have much respect for players who do not share your weapons obsession.

You use this term "casual" like in the middle ages ignorant folk said "unclean"

You don't have much respect for the devs either.

In truth you are BLIND to the game, blind the game structure, blind to what the GAME is about

and deliberately deaf to the developers' explanations

I don't understand what kick you get out of doing this..maybe it's stronger than you are and you don't know yourselves ?

Are you afraid to be mistaken for "casuals?"

I'm speaking as someone who has played 550 hours DayZ, but I don't think that makes me "hardcore" - I'm not impressed by "hardcore".

 

Do you REALLY think this game is about REALISM ??

You don't notice other gameplay that is slightly NOT-Realistic

Here is a game element that ain't about "guns" so I predict you don't care - and if you don't care, my god, you must be ... casual gamers.

 

The Fishing and the Fishing Equipment in DayZ is less REALISTIC than in a Donald Duck Cartoon

Maybe you didn't notice ?

So show us how much you care about realism

Plenty of stuff in this game is NOT VERY realistic and it is STILL COOL

I dont WANT fishing to be 100% realistic, that would be stupid.. like gun realism.

Perhaps you would like guns to be on the same level as fishing, to fit into the game better ?

Or should we improve the REST of the game ?

 

Moral - Please don't pretend that your long and repetitious arguments are really about realism in the game

You can't play without "realism" ? -  cut the fake tears, the insults and fake arguments, you sound like children.

 

You 'gun people' have had an easy life to now, but my god you complain like kicked dogs.

Let's deal with other areas of the game. There is plenty of work to be done.

 

If you don't care about the rest of this game, go play ArmA2 Boot Camp. They have plenty guns.

 

xx

 

[edited]

Edited July 2, 2014 by pilgrim

[Daemonkid 493]

 

 

And yes ofcourse loot economy will balance out the spawns of ammo, and food and every other item in the game, it is literally its only purpose. Exactly what it is designed to do, now rarer items will have more specific and unique parameters to the amount of these items, but why would you think trash items or ammo wouldnt be affected and balanced as well?

Because ammo, food and drink are all server side spawns. Loot economy is a way of limiting the spawns of select items across ALL servers. Ammo food and drink will still be controlled directly from the server it's on. The game can't say well, only spawn 1000 9mm ammo across all servers. It won't work and it's not an effective way to handle that(That's an incredible processing load.)  Instead, like it has been posted, it will handle say, only 100 NVG's can possibly spawn across all the servers. Or only 1000 AKM's can spawn across all servers. Handling any of the smaller items would not be feasible. 

[Daemonkid 493]

You gun-realism people... oh dear oh dear oh dear

 

Your arguments are transparent. You do not care in the least about the level of realism in the game. I wish you could put up better arguments for your obsession, so that your general indifference to the whole game itself would be less obvious.

 

.

 

Do you REALLY want REALISM ?? .. OK, dides, start doing something about THIS example here:

Here is a game element that ain't about "guns" so I predict you don't care - and if you don't care, my god, you must be casual gamers.

Prove me wrong.. complain about this, shout about this, prove that you care about gameplay

 

The Fishing and the Fishing Equipment in DayZ is less REALISTIC than in a Donald Duck Cartoon

 

 

xx

You already tried that shit with me and I shut you up. Add different fishing rods, for fly fishing, for river fishing, for open sea fishing, trolling rods, correct bait required to catch specific fish. Hell, even add different quality rods that increase ones chances of catching a type of fish, or less chance of snapping the line, or damaging the rod. 

[gibonez 3633]

You already tried that shit with me and I shut you up. Add different fishing rods, for fly fishing, for river fishing, for open sea fishing, trolling rods, correct bait required to catch specific fish. Hell, even add different quality rods that increase ones chances of catching a type of fish, or less chance of snapping the line, or damaging the rod. 

 

 

Holy shit you can hmmm understand what he types ?

[frozenjaws 69]

Because ammo, food and drink are all server side spawns. Loot economy is a way of limiting the spawns of select items across ALL servers. Ammo food and drink will still be controlled directly from the server it's on. The game can't say well, only spawn 1000 9mm ammo across all servers. It won't work and it's not an effective way to handle that(That's an incredible processing load.)  Instead, like it has been posted, it will handle say, only 100 NVG's can possibly spawn across all the servers. Or only 1000 AKM's can spawn across all servers. Handling any of the smaller items would not be feasible. 

and they will be balanced accordingly, and if the game isnt up to snuff for im sure there will be plenty of mods that will be to your liking. I retire from this thread while i still have my sanity. carry on

[UltimateGentleman 355]

No. You are in the minority. I'm going to ask, did you play the mod? Because that makes a huge difference in the validity of your opinion. The answer is more than likely no and i'm going out on a limb and saying that. People don't FUCKING WANT REALISTIC CALIBERS FOR REALISM REASONS. THIS HAS BEEN STATED MANY TIMES. YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS. THIS IS A GAMEPLAY/LOOT DISCUSSION AND THE RAMIFICATIONS OF STREAMLINING THAT SHIT. Caps for emphasis. Streamlining calibers is bad for the game, people like you who want don't want the game to be difficult annoy the shit out of many people on this forum, because that was never what DayZ was supposed to be about. We were supposed to get a challenging, unforgiving and authentic world. One where you can feel immersed. Little things such as this count in a game like DayZ. 

 

Have you ever heard of roguelike? Have you ever played one? Have you ever played Dwarf-fortress. The complexity of that game would blow your face off, yet the game has a huge cult following because the devs (2 GUYS) care so much about their project. They don't streamline anything or make things easier for new players. The term LOSING IS FUN originates from that game. It's what makes it fun, getting your ass kicked 2 days from sunday, yet you go back in for more, because you actually strive to be successful. 

 

Now this whole topic about ammunition is not about REALISM, like you ignorant's think it is, whenever others and myself have stated as such, you ALWAYS revert to the REALISM argument. 

I don't care if they add fucking fictional calibers and fictional guns. As long as the fictional calibers go into their correct fictional weapon, and those fictional calibers bloat the lootspawns so instead of always finding what i'm looking for with 0 trouble involved, basically guaranteeing the next mil spawn I check is going to have ammo I will need. It's not hard at all to find the ammo you're looking for in the game right now. Because there simply isn't enough different ammunition to bloat the loot tables with.

 

No I'm not, I could possibly be but I'm not unless the over 2 million people that have the game except me and the others in this thread who don't care speak out and say it does matter then I am not in the minority.

I'm in the minority of the people that voted but given that it's not even hit 100 yet and there are like 200k members on this forum(depending on duplicates and spam accounts) who gives a shit.

 

You played the mod, good for you. If it had more ammo types then WONDERFUL...the mod still exists you know, if that has the variety you want...go play that.

 

More calibres is not the only way to make the game hard it just makes one aspect of an already easy game more complicated than the other aspects, what's the point. Make every ammo type rarer than it is currently, that's the way. I looked round a whole airfield earlier today and I seriously found like 40 boxes of ammo, it should be like half that, at least. And then it would be somewhat difficult.

Ammo types won't at all make this game challenging get your head out your ass.

 

That's not the only way to make the game difficult and it's not the way it should be made difficult, you act as though that's the ultimate answer. It doesn't matter if it's not about realism, why do you even want more ammo types if you don't care about realism? Making ammo scarce does EXACTLY THE SAME THING if you don't give a shit about realism then what does it matter?

Also what the fuck is the difference between realism and authenticity? Seriously.

 

All you people who talk about realism =/= authenticity please consult a dictionary they are basically the same thing.

 

 

 

Are you saying that 75 people voted for correct ammo and 2000000 people own DayZ, therefore only 75 of two million people want correct ammo? Wow... just wow. The things we're having to deal with here...

 

Did I say that? No.

Maybe you should try reading, the 75 people who voted yes on this forum do not matter at all they will not change the game, if this was an issue you'd see it all over the internet, more than 75 people would have voted yes if this was considered a serious problem.

 

Do you want to know why the devs said people generally don't care?

.

.

.

.

.

Because they don't :lol:  sorry if I blew your mind and sorry if you do care but you're not making the game and it doesn't revolve around what you want, if the majority of players don't give a damn then it's probably going to stay the way it is :thumbsup:

As the saying goes "Don't fix what ain't broken"

[Daemonkid 493]

Holy shit you can hmmm understand what he types ?

I speak fluent troll.

[pilgrim* 3514]

You already tried that shit with me and I shut you up. 

 

= one million laughs, dude... thanx

[Daemonkid 493]

No I'm not, I could possibly be but I'm not unless the over 2 million people that have the game except me and the others in this thread who don't care speak out and say it does matter then I am not in the minority.

I'm in the minority of the people that voted but given that it's not even hit 100 yet and there are like 200k members on this forum(depending on duplicates and spam accounts) who gives a shit.

 

 

 

It doesn't matter if it's not about realism, why do you even want more ammo types if you don't care about realism? Making ammo scarce does EXACTLY THE SAME THING

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*GASP* I want both! Like I said, a game like DayZ the little things matter. I brought up the mod because guess what, we're the ones who fucking popularized the game. I told my friends about it, they told their friends about it. Next thing you know the game is incredibly popular. The game that was a huge niche, even though it was incredibly difficult for people to get into, people kept at it and enjoyed themselves. Then they told their friends about it and so on and so forth. A lot of people were waiting on the SA to release before they got into DayZ, then you add to the fact that people have been looking for a zombie SURVIVAL game explains why it took off the way it did. Then you have the new blood, the people who have only heard about and played the standalone. These people have no idea what DayZ was about. The game us mod veterans were promised, and why we supported the team like we have. We don't want them shooting themselves in the foot. Casuals come and go, but the fans stay to the end. If you want your true fans to stick around and not be disillusioned is to keep the promises that were made and not make concessions to a group of players who quite franky couldn't give a damn either way. 

Edited July 1, 2014 by Daemonkid

[Daemonkid 493]

= one million laughs, dude... thanx

Excellent retort. 

Got another?

[pilgrim* 3514]

..//..

More calibres is not the only way to make the game hard it just makes one aspect of an already easy game more complicated than the other aspects

..//..

 

I agree with all of this long post from UltimateGentleman

 

Good on ya mate. Anyone accusing you of being a troll yet ?

Don't let the minority of players here hammer you into the ground, friend.

Much of what they say is interesting ...

And it would be worth considering, I guess, but unfortunately they tend to quickly deride any different point of view and they like to stomp on other contributions. So most "balanced-weaponry" folk give up the debate pretty soon (or get real mad with them). And this debate is old and tired now.

 

They are the "gun people", so I think they have the right to shoot themselves in the foot if they want.

 

I respect their view and I respect their right to say it.

But I disagree strongly.

[frozenjaws 69]

*GASP* I want both! Like I said, a game like DayZ the little things matter. I brought up the mod because guess what, we're the ones who fucking popularized the game. I told my friends about it, they told their friends about it. Next thing you know the game is incredibly popular. The game that was a huge niche, even though it was incredibly difficult for people to get into, people kept at it and enjoyed themselves. Then they told their friends about it and so on and so forth. A lot of people were waiting on the SA to release before they got into DayZ, then you add to the fact that people have been looking for a zombie SURVIVAL game explains why it took off the way it did. Then you have the new blood, the people who have only heard about and played the standalone. These people have no idea what DayZ was about. The game us mod veterans were promised, and why we supported the team like we have. We don't want them shooting themselves in the foot. Casuals come and go, but the fans stay to the end. If you want your true fans to stick around and not be disillusioned is to keep the promises that were made and not make concessions to a group of players who quite franky couldn't give a damn either way. 

Ahhh this is all because you feel that dayz owes you? because your opinion is more important than the people you call casuals? that you are entitled to a higher standard? 

Also you seem to be very selective of the threads you respond to. Cant add anything to excellent points maybe?