after death run back to storage ?

[ZomboWTF 527]

what the heck people, this was in the mod for a LONG time and added to the game quite substantially

 

if you are saying that it is "unrealistic" and therefore shouldn't be, how about having cars and helos also delete once you die?

why not force you to be banned from the server, also known as permadeath?

or even better, just never respawn, you die, buy the game new

 

there is a balance needed between realism and fun in the game

if you can find a place where a camp won't be found after a day, you deserve to get your stuff in the tent when you died

also it's fun to run around in the woods busting camps, stealing cars etc.

 

i don't know what you people are asking for, this is a standalone game coming from the mod dayz, if you guys think they are gonna flip over all things that were in the mod, you might as well just go play whatever SOE is developing atm...

[Wint3rZ 1]

deleting a players storage is not screwing anyone over, the player died, so  its game over, if they want kit, they should have stayed alive

if you see loosing your kit after dying as being penalised, then thats what im talking about as "players wanting easy mode" cause i dotn see it as penalising , i see retaining loot after death as easy mode, and making game pointless.

 

 

 

 

I completely agree with this, if the player dies, then they're tents/stash should get deleted..... This game is supposed to be a survival game afterall and what Qww said fits it perfectly.

Edited May 22, 2014 by Wint3rZ

[qww 287]

what the heck people, this was in the mod for a LONG time and added to the game quite substantially

 

if you are saying that it is "unrealistic" and therefore shouldn't be, how about having cars and helos also delete once you die?

why not force you to be banned from the server, also known as permadeath?

or even better, just never respawn, you die, buy the game new

 

there is a balance needed between realism and fun in the game

if you can find a place where a camp won't be found after a day, you deserve to get your stuff in the tent when you died

also it's fun to run around in the woods busting camps, stealing cars etc.

 

i don't know what you people are asking for, this is a standalone game coming from the mod dayz, if you guys think they are gonna flip over all things that were in the mod, you might as well just go play whatever SOE is developing atm...

im not asking for anything, i have typed loads tho, about my thoughts on the subject here, read it of you want, you might realise that what you typed isnt really related to my view, and kind goes off topic, its ok anyway, im not trying to make anyone think like me, just stating an opinion on running back to get gear  from persistent storage after you die.

 

because i and others want a more diffcult game does not mean we should check out any other game. dayz  is already the pc game yet, as a lot of us will agree..

zombo are you playing pvp only in dayz? is that why you care about persistent loot? im interested why people want it.

[KingOfTime 267]

Problems with this:

 

1. Shoot someone at their camp -get nothing

 

2. Store your stuff in someone else's tent -lose everything.

 

3. Find some one's camp and they die halfway across the map -get nothing

 

4. Shoot someone out of their car -get nothing(after all, cars can be used to store things)

 

5. No incentive for bases to be built/camps to be made, especially for pvp type clans, who would have the most to gain/lose by building camps

 

6. IT'S "LOSE" NOT "LOOSE"! THIS FORUM NEEDS TO LEARN HOW TO SPELL THIS WORD!!!!!!!!!

 

7. It ruins my dream of running a book store....a VERY high risk occupation in Chernarus.

[boneboys 7988]

I don't often jump in on these game breaking / balance discussions because people often think I'm FanboyZ, not Boneboys but I do have opinions and on this one.

 

I play with a small but tight group of people, we like to make relay / supply camps across Chernarus, we are always on the move so these serve their purpose as intended.

 

If I am killed in battle, a tent that I pitched and we all helped supply will disappear, this punishes the other people in the group, which defeats the object of group play to a certain extent.

 

I do however agree that if I play as a lonewolf it should not be possible to run back to my "dead mans" tent and gear up.

 

I suggested to the Devs in the past that a lonewolfs tent be randomly re-positioned somewhere else on the map, unfortunately there were reasons that this would not work (think tent pitching in the mod and the problems that existed at the time).

 

The fact remains that dead is dead and a new spawn should not be able to run back to his previous characters tent.

 

Back to the (my) question in hand, tent + group play.

What I would like to see is a grouping system that allows a small amount of people (6 max) to team up, it would be recognised by the game, allowing (my) tents to be kept by the alive members of the group.

A new spawned member, being a part of the group would no doubt be given the position of the tent(s), therefore validating the known position of the supply points to the newly spawned.

 

Non grouped players would have their tents deleted or re-positioned.

The risks remain the same, other players will stumble across camps, no matter where or how well hidden they are placed.

 

There has been mentioned the possibility of some form of grouping system in the past by the Devs, lets hope it is still on the to do list and it can be coupled with the perma storage question that we be a never ending debate and that my suggestion is most surely not the answer.

 

Have fun with that peeps !

[brumey 116]

i have a solution for lonewolf's dieing

 

 

if u have a storage somewhere, but u dont belong to a Group, and u die.    

 

your new freshspawn could spawn with a Little map in his pocket revealing the new Location of the repositioned crate!

 

how does that Sound ?

[Bororm 1156]

I don't often jump in on these game breaking / balance discussions because people often think I'm FanboyZ, not Boneboys but I do have opinions and on this one.

 

I play with a small but tight group of people, we like to make relay / supply camps across Chernarus, we are always on the move so these serve their purpose as intended.

 

If I am killed in battle, a tent that I pitched and we all helped supply will disappear, this punishes the other people in the group, which defeats the object of group play to a certain extent.

 

I do however agree that if I play as a lonewolf it should not be possible to run back to my "dead mans" tent and gear up.

 

I suggested to the Devs in the past that a lonewolfs tent be randomly re-positioned somewhere else on the map, unfortunately there were reasons that this would not work (think tent pitching in the mod and the problems that existed at the time).

 

The fact remains that dead is dead and a new spawn should not be able to run back to his previous characters tent.

 

Back to the (my) question in hand, tent + group play.

What I would like to see is a grouping system that allows a small amount of people (6 max) to team up, it would be recognised by the game, allowing (my) tents to be kept by the alive members of the group.

A new spawned member, being a part of the group would no doubt be given the position of the tent(s), therefore validating the known position of the supply points to the newly spawned.

 

Non grouped players would have their tents deleted or re-positioned.

The risks remain the same, other players will stumble across camps, no matter where or how well hidden they are placed.

 

There has been mentioned the possibility of some form of grouping system in the past by the Devs, lets hope it is still on the to do list and it can be coupled with the perma storage question that we be a never ending debate and that my suggestion is most surely not the answer.

 

Have fun with that peeps !

 

The problem with this is, assuming you can't put items into the tents of "strangers," surely you can still take them out.  So what is to stop my group of say 12, from just setting up their tents so that the other 6 can take stuff out and vis versa.  Regrouping people as they respawn.  If you can't regroup people to preserve the same tents, then a group of 6 now has a clear advantage over say a group of 3, as they've got 3 more lives to keep it going.

 

Another thing to consider with the idea of tents being persistent till death, people will buy extra copies of the game, set up a tent and then just not play that character thus bypassing the system.  In the above scenario, one of the 6 players in a group could just be a dummy account, that the other 5 pitched in to buy.  This is common in games that have things tied to an account, and I've seen it in numerous mmos.  You can say, well they have to pay for another copy, that's their deal, but that's a pretty distinct advantage and essentially a version of "pay to win."

 

Another thing to consider is how many bugs and also occasional character wipes that may occur.  DayZ is not a game without random deaths.

 

 

 

i have a solution for lonewolf's dieing

 

 

if u have a storage somewhere, but u dont belong to a Group, and u die.    

 

your new freshspawn could spawn with a Little map in his pocket revealing the new Location of the repositioned crate!

 

how does that Sound ?

 

So then what's the purpose if you're told where it is?  I thought the purpose of repositioning it is to keep the items in play while trying to simulate you "forgetting" where it is.

Let's pretend for a moment the majority of people have tents (unlikely but entertain the thought as the potential is there).  Considering how often people die, imagine how randomized tents would be.  They'd constantly be switching positions over the map.  There would become a decent likelihood of a tent popping up in some "unwanted" position.  What if by chance a tent spawns on a position a player logged out?  What if one spawns right outside some one's base, or next to a spawn point?  What about running through an area just to see a tent pop into existence in front of you?  I know it's generally frowned upon but it's common practice, what of people suiciding for spawns?  Their tent will be ping ponging around the map.

 

 

The safeguard against people storing tons of items, is the ability to loot and destroy other players' tents.  In the mod, on a healthy populated server, unless glitched, a tent did not last terribly long.  We don't know what form persistent storage will take in the SA, so it is hard to speculate at this point how easy it will be to hide your loot.  That is something that should be considered upon creation of whatever they have in mind, and is important to balance.

Edited May 22, 2014 by Bororm

[gorvi 189]

The main problem with this thread is too many people are trying to find flaws rather than solutions.

 

If a player dies any items that character stashed should take a massive durability loss.

 

If possible, also switching the stashes(s) location would be ideal.

 

I don't like the idea of a group/gang/community storage box unless it involves only being static and in a player occupied/built structure.  Any items put into this wouldn't degrade, but suffer the constant risk of being pillaged.

Edited May 22, 2014 by Gorvi

[agentneo 337]

its no where near as bad as you say it. You have to remember this is DayZ community and where nearly everyone is a thief, murderer or bandit. Most people's tents will get burned down  or ran over quickly. Other players will steal the loot or destroy them.

[brumey 116]

why should the devs make countermeasures so that People dont hoard a ton of items!

 

looting and further hoarding should be integral part of gameplay!

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

I don't often jump in on these game breaking / balance discussions because people often think I'm FanboyZ, not Boneboys but I do have opinions and on this one.

 

I play with a small but tight group of people, we like to make relay / supply camps across Chernarus, we are always on the move so these serve their purpose as intended.

 

If I am killed in battle, a tent that I pitched and we all helped supply will disappear, this punishes the other people in the group, which defeats the object of group play to a certain extent.

 

I do however agree that if I play as a lonewolf it should not be possible to run back to my "dead mans" tent and gear up.

 

I suggested to the Devs in the past that a lonewolfs tent be randomly re-positioned somewhere else on the map, unfortunately there were reasons that this would not work (think tent pitching in the mod and the problems that existed at the time).

 

The fact remains that dead is dead and a new spawn should not be able to run back to his previous characters tent.

 

Back to the (my) question in hand, tent + group play.

What I would like to see is a grouping system that allows a small amount of people (6 max) to team up, it would be recognised by the game, allowing (my) tents to be kept by the alive members of the group.

A new spawned member, being a part of the group would no doubt be given the position of the tent(s), therefore validating the known position of the supply points to the newly spawned.

 

Non grouped players would have their tents deleted or re-positioned.

The risks remain the same, other players will stumble across camps, no matter where or how well hidden they are placed.

 

There has been mentioned the possibility of some form of grouping system in the past by the Devs, lets hope it is still on the to do list and it can be coupled with the perma storage question that we be a never ending debate and that my suggestion is most surely not the answer.

 

Have fun with that peeps !

Heh, that's why I think a 30 min no loot timer for the dead person would work.  Nothing actually disappears but the dead players items are not able to be interacted with by the dead person for 30 mins.  Doesn't remove perma-death and it still allows the dead persons friends to at least acquire the items and tote them around until the timer is up.  It still prevents corpse running temporary so it kind of feels like perma-death

[Nesuma (DayZ) 108]

If there would be enough decent official servers they could just "ban" you for some hours after your death (would be good anyway). You could still wait the hours but if you want to play right now you would have to regear. And it's not that difficult to ask your mates to switch server with you... aslong as there are enough.

[ZomboWTF 527]

zombo are you playing pvp only in dayz? is that why you care about persistent loot? im interested why people want it.

 

actually i am the player that tries to avoid people if playing solo survival, and maybe help out one or the other

(dont ever meet my squad though, thats only KoS because of my mates)

 

i just want the game to be like the mod, and tents were a big part of that

you can't completely delete the unrealistic parts of dayz, like retrieving your dead body

or running right to the position where you died to maybe get revenge and stuff like that

 

without any way to store stuff, there is very little room for collecting and hoarding,

the only stuff you can have is what fits into your backpack

it limits the endgame quite substantially

 

in real life you could just bury some stuff you dont want to carry with you, but will need later(food in cans for example),

in dayz you cant do that because of server restarts deleting the items that are laying around,

except for the stuff that is in tents or in the hideaways from the mod

 

and eve if you would never introduce tents, people would just misuse cars as tents by shooting the tires and hiding it away in some forest

 

i can't see any big problem with tents, you can't lock them, and if your tent location is compromised, you lose everything

it is a high risk - high reward stash if you want to call it that, and searching for tents was something i really enjoyed in the game and don't want to miss in the standalone

 

sure, people run to them when they die, but thats at least something you can be happy about when you died, and you still have to collect the stuff anyway

 

if you think wanting tents means hardcore KoS player, go play the mod ffs

Edited May 22, 2014 by Zombo

[Ramblin Hans 118]

Agreed.

 

That and people act like re-gearing is ALWAYS easy, and ALWAYS inconsequential. Getting geared TWICE over in one life is often times an insanely risky prospect.

 

EDIT - @Tenebrous, I do agree with you as well. However, there is an issue in folks [at least with public hive] putting their persistent storage on an empty server, and then swapping to that server to re-gear. So in some instances, it can have the opposite effect.

 

True enough! I never played a private hive in the mod, but I think I'd like to when it is available in SA. I'd like to know that guy that logged out in a building after taking fire...he isn't going anywhere else. He can either come back later on or go play another hive, but his character isn't hopping around servers to get a position advantage, to regear, to get gear out of a stash.

[xalienax 621]

i dont keep up with all the dev blogs and that, i just play the game. and read forum. so actually im a bit  suprised to read in forums today, it looks like in future , we will be able to die, and then run back to any location to get the storage container we saved before we died,

 

i thought dayz was a survival game, and i cant see how this fits into dayz sa concept.  because it destroys the value of a characters life, it makes it arcade style so you can just carry on with good kit.

i was hoping that as time goes on with the standalone , item spawning will be reduced, so its more difficult to stay alive, and items will have increased value because of this. so maybe it would make sense to be able to store items(while alive).

 

having said that, storage of items, that continues after you die, so you can just carry on the same life essentially, is not why i am playing dayz.

 

i dont fully dislike being able to store items, id store a different rifle and meds etc, it would be useful . although if i die, i think that my storage should disappear from the game too, to simulate me being a new character, and not knowing where some dead guy left his kit.

 

when you die you should start new, no storage container, no easy mode. just death, and new spawn. this would favour players who game with others, as the new spawn can get spare kit from the alive players storage, 

because of this, maybe the whole concept of item storage may not be good for the game, in my view.

 

i guess some people will hate what im saying, but i reckon some of the more simulator or "difficulty fan" players may know what i mean, or am i alone in wanting realism/authentic and difficulty on this storage subject? thanks for any constructive reply

This creates a problem tho in the form of sharing storage with group members. one issue for clans in the vanilla mod was the tents being deleted 7days after the "owners" death. it means that someone (who may not have died) also looses thier stuff stored in said tent/container. in bigger comunties with people playing on all diferent timezones; keeping upw ith who did or didnt die and who owns what tent in a "tent city" was a real problem.

 

this is one of those hot button fine line issues. In real life a box of stuff you left at your camp wouldnt just go poof when you die somewheres. so realism isnt really a factor here. on the other hand, once the human player knows the location there is nothing stopping him or her from using it as a re-gear point. your Poin't of view would definately make sense if we were all entering this world as singular lone wolves, but i dont think you can make insta-deleting containers without acknoleding its severe detriment to comunity play.

 

Persistent storage is in almost every version of the mod- a considerable amount of DayZ players do so with either friends or clans whom with the orginaze over skype, ts3, etc. removal of persistent storage or sharing use of a container would be completely detrimental to group play. it's going to have to be an accepted evil that many players will run back to a known stash to insta re-gear and continue roaming the north fightign other squads.

[qww 287]

actually i am the player that tries to avoid people if playing solo survival, and maybe help out one or the other

(dont ever meet my squad though, thats only KoS because of my mates)

 

i just want the game to be like the mod, and tents were a big part of that

you can't completely delete the unrealistic parts of dayz, like retrieving your dead body

or running right to the position where you died to maybe get revenge and stuff like that

 

without any way to store stuff, there is very little room for collecting and hoarding,

the only stuff you can have is what fits into your backpack

it limits the endgame quite substantially

 

in real life you could just bury some stuff you dont want to carry with you, but will need later(food in cans for example),

in dayz you cant do that because of server restarts deleting the items that are laying around,

except for the stuff that is in tents or in the hideaways from the mod

 

and eve if you would never introduce tents, people would just misuse cars as tents by shooting the tires and hiding it away in some forest

 

i can't see any big problem with tents, you can't lock them, and if your tent location is compromised, you lose everything

it is a high risk - high reward stash if you want to call it that, and searching for tents was something i really enjoyed in the game and don't want to miss in the standalone

 

sure, people run to them when they die, but thats at least something you can be happy about when you died, and you still have to collect the stuff anyway

 

if you think wanting tents means hardcore KoS player, go play the mod ffs

 

you want the game to be like the mod, i want it to be more difficult than the mod, and i want death to actually mean something bad has happened.

 

i cant see any problem with storage, i just dotn want to be able to run back to it after i died,

no reason you couldnt find and search tents of live players

 

why should you be happy when you died? there shoudl be no reward, no run back to gear.

 

and again no, i stated loads of times here, i dont care about the rules of the old mod, i am discussing standalone

 

This creates a problem tho in the form of sharing storage with group members. one issue for clans in the vanilla mod was the tents being deleted 7days after the "owners" death. it means that someone (who may not have died) also looses thier stuff stored in said tent/container. in bigger comunties with people playing on all diferent timezones; keeping upw ith who did or didnt die and who owns what tent in a "tent city" was a real problem.

 

this is one of those hot button fine line issues. In real life a box of stuff you left at your camp wouldnt just go poof when you die somewheres. so realism isnt really a factor here. on the other hand, once the human player knows the location there is nothing stopping him or her from using it as a re-gear point. your Poin't of view would definately make sense if we were all entering this world as singular lone wolves, but i dont think you can make insta-deleting containers without acknoleding its severe detriment to comunity play.

 

Persistent storage is in almost every version of the mod- a considerable amount of DayZ players do so with either friends or clans whom with the orginaze over skype, ts3, etc. removal of persistent storage or sharing use of a container would be completely detrimental to group play. it's going to have to be an accepted evil that many players will run back to a known stash to insta re-gear and continue roaming the north fightign other squads.

 

 

the only problem is trusting someone enough that you think they will take enough care to stay alive, and store your stuff safely. store you own stuff, none to blame but yourself.

 

the whole point of what im talking about is simulating realism by a simple delete storage action, it doesnt affect anyone else, except the player who lost it and if you die why shouldnt there be something to lose?

why does what the mod was have to be what is standalone? i keep having to say this, because people keep saying "it was in the mod". dotn you see that dotn have to share someoen elses storage? or if you do

then make sure they dont die.

 

honestly every single point that people have made in defense of persistent storage holds no ground for me,

it seems everyoen wants to be able to regear and fight, but this is not the mod, if more  players could try playing a bit more realistically, more thoughtfully,  it means more skill, more immersion, more care and thought. more commitment to a characters life,

 

anyway i want the most diffuclt game possible, i already try to stay alive, as much as i can, while still making the game exciting, persistent loot after death will only decrease from teh difficulty level on dayz. i dotn see any argument to keep it, every point thats been made about clan  storage or whatever, it just doesnt cut it for me, you trusted a friend, they died, that shouldnd be another factor of the game too, or just dotn trust anyone.

 

everyoen who thinks theyre hardcore dayz player should embrace the difficulty and challenge, not be happy that an instant  re-gear mechanic is brought back

 

everyone thats happy about persistent storage and running back to loot, good for you, youve got it, i was expecting more of a challenge from sa myself, not this (as i see it) arcade style persistent loot.

 

thanks everyone for the discussion on topic, although im suprised how many want the run back to gear, ist good to see what people think.

[Whyherro123 2283]

-snip-

The main point is, the deletion of someone's stashed supplies isn't all that realistic. At all.

[qww 287]

The main point is, the deletion of someone's stashed supplies isn't all that realistic. At all

the main point is, it more realistic to delete a loot store,(to simulate no knowledge) than to have a new character run back to a dead guys store .

 

edit: anyway i duno why i bothered to reply to that, im just repeating myself now, when people keep bringing up the same points., its all been covered already in topic

Edited May 22, 2014 by qww

[Whyherro123 2283]

No, it isn't. IRL, the stash would still be there. 

[qww 287]

No, it isn't. IRL, the stash would still be there. 

try reading teh whole topic, not repeating what others have already discussed

[moggzy 2]

Persistent storage idea......

 

It stays persistent whilst your alive.  BUT....

 

If you die, the container fires up flares every few minutes for say...  30 mins??  giving chance for folks to have a free for all loot/kill fest before a flare misfires after 30 mins and torches the camp/gear. 

(could you get more tension knowing your a fresh spawn trying to salvage that mess?)

 

 

<disclaimer>

This idea came into my head after a fair few beers

[squeeb 6]

I have noticed greedy weirdos that stash loot and care so much about it are the ones that have 0 human interaction. 

Personally I feel if they go the epoch route if allowed too it has been my best experience in Dayz thus far. When you are building a base on a server that your character persists on you have to make different types of choices knowing the community is not going to just change servers if you bandit \ kill them. It has been the biggest "walking dead community hugs and kisses love and rainbows that a lot of people are looking for in the game. As well as even more anger when someone kills you and you lose all your keys including the one to your base.

 

As far as bases go expanding on that I like the fact that if you have friends you can then craft keys to them to your base etc ...Otherwise when you die all your $hit is gone. 

 

I'm assuming that this is a server side issue to lower desync considering that is how arma 3 does it. 

Edited May 22, 2014 by squeeb

[blissandpanic 92]

the main point is, it more realistic to delete a loot store,(to simulate no knowledge) than to have a new character run back to a dead guys store .

 

edit: anyway i duno why i bothered to reply to that, im just repeating myself now, when people keep bringing up the same points., its all been covered already in topic

 

OP, you're beating a dead horse here; many people don't want to loose their precious loot. I would suggest you try the RP servers when they are implemented.

 

Going back to your dead body or camp to loot will not be allowed. If "immersion" is what you seek then you should def give the RP community a try.

 

I linked the one i roll with but there are a few more out there.. :thumbsup:

 

Good luck and live long

 

http://falcondayz.boards.net/

[KingOfTime 267]

I just dont see a clean/fair way to implement this. I agree that its completely unrealistic for someone to be able to just run back to camp and re-gear as a lone wolf, but at the same time its unrealistic for persistent items in game to just disappear, especially if multiple people are using the same storage. Under the proposed system, there would be no incentive to engage others at their camps, because all of their loot would vanish as you killed them off, and forcing a huge disincentive to raiding parties. Perhaps a better way to do it is not to delete the stash, but to force a map of the location of the players stash to spawn on their dead body. This wont completely eliminate running back to try and regear, but it will at least add some uncertainty and danger to it, as well as adding incentive to loot, not just kill from 800m away for no reason. On top of that, it will encourage even more players to traverse the map searching for these camps that are revealed on the map of the dead players body.

[pycco 38]

oh my i really hope this does not happen, then its only a step from infestation story store not even a location just buy what you want then its instantly in your inventory.... that would break the game for me and i would not play anymore and that would just suck big hairy monkey balls

Edited May 23, 2014 by pycco