Inventory needs to have way more slots. Items need to have both weight and volume values. (Long post)

[St. Jimmy 1631]

I remember Rocket saying that the inventory would need to be worked again to come around some problems. I think the biggest problem is that there aren't enough slots in the inventory. Those slots limits too much small items like papers, pens, compass, maps, separate bullets etc. so you really don't want to carry those around even though those wouldn't take much space in your backpack. They need to come some way either expand slots in inventory like we can collapse and expand backpack inventory for example or some other way so all the inventories are "limitless" until the items in that inventory reach certain volume. Devs wouldn't really need to think about balancing how many slots a small item takes if you compare it to a bigger item because the item volume takes care of that. Only reason why items would have slots is just to see better what item it is and organize items in invetory. Containers/backpacks/clothes and Items could have close real life volumes without thinking too much because weight system takes care of that.

 

Let's have an example:

 

I have mountain backpack. Currently it has 35 slots so I can fit only 35 pens in it. Doesn't sound right when I can fit FNX45, sawed off shotgun, ammobox and some other stuff in it.

 

If items and inventories would have volumes we could make this more realistic. Mountain backpack could have inventory of 80dm³. Let's say that one pen is 0,015dm³. I could have 5300 pens in our mountain backpack if I just want that. Probably not necessary go this crazy with the inventory slots but I think there are solutions so even that could be possible. I've been thinking something so inventories would be bigger.

 

 

 

Packing effectively is one key for survival because if you don't pack enough well you don't find things what you're looking for quickly. Inventory management is big thing currently but it could be expanded a lot not just to bring bit more challenge but open up the game for more hardcore survival features like item weight and just how quickly you can find stuff in your backpack ;)

I suggest that backpacks would've different layers that you can expand just like you currently expand the whole backpack. Let's say that backpacks have 12 expandable layers that have 50 slots each so we could fit 600 one slot items in one backpack IF their volume don't exceed the capacity value of the backpack. This way we could have 600 pens in a backpack because they take one slot but we couldn't have 50 M4s in a backpack because the volume of the M4 exceeds the amount of the backpack can have. Then clothing items could have different amount of pockets and those pockets have different capacities.

 

To see how much capacity is left for example in jeans there would be capacity bars like in Arma 3 clothing items for every pocket. Also there could be a bar of the total capacity that is sum of every pockets capacity. Backpack would naturally need a total capacity bar. Then we need to see the total weight we have with us naturally which can be only a number somewhere. Not that big deal. Bigger deal is how much weight affects our movement and stamina but I won't talk about that here.

 

 

 

Some clothes and item examples how I think this could be handled. This way there could be realistic amount of pockets if wanted or just some expandable "pockets"/layers/whatever:

Mountain backpack

- 12 layers

- Capacity 80dm³. Counts capacity from every layer so you can fit that 100 amount of stuff even in one layer.

- Volume 15,6dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1,9kg

 

Jeans

- 4 pockets

- Capacity 0,5dm³ per pocket.

- Volume 2,2dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 0,8kg

 

Army trousers

- 6 pockets

- Capacity 0,7dm³ per pocket

- Volume 2,8dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1kg

 

Hoodie

- 1 pocket

- Capacity 1,3dm³

- Volume 2,5dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1kg

 

Jacket

- 4 pockets

- Capacity 0,5dm³ per pocket

- Volume 3,2dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1,5kg

 

Pen

- Volume 0,015dm³

- Weight 0,010kg

- 1 slot

 

M4

- Base weight around 2,5kg. Weight depends on attachments.

- Base volume around 20dm³. Volume depends on attachments but those won't increase much of it.

- 6 slots (2x3)

- I'm pretty sure that it would needed to do this way with items that can have attachments.

 

Can of beans

- Volume 1,7dm³

- Weight 0,45kg

- 1 slot

 

Book

- Volume 0,7dm³

- Weight 0,5kg

- 1 slot

These numbers are just examples and naturally can be tweaked easily. They're based close to the real life values but some items like guns need to be balanced because their shape isn't even and you can't put those kind of items every way you want to in backpack.

Layers and pockets should have many slots so we can fit enough multiple slot stuff in them.

Capacity means how much the item can take items

Volume means how much it takes capacity. Also you can't pack for example jeans in a backpack unless you've folded them. You can only fold when jeans don't have any items in them. Logically same applies for carrying a backpack in a backpack. So clothes that can carry something act as containers when not folded but when folded they're just items.

Slots are just there so you can easily find bigger slot items from inventory but big items don't take too much of a space either so you can fit much stuff in. Easier to recognize some items when they're bigger.

 

Some of you might think if different backpacks for example could take only certain amount of weight in them. I think that's not needed because their capacity pretty much takes care of that and if/when stamina system is added you won't really care about that anymore... I added them there to see some reference. Arma 3 balances between weight and volume with how much character can take stuff in a backpack but I think that in DayZ that isn't enough.

 

 

 

With this kind of system I think we could see some traders around in Chernarus who have all kinds of small stuff with them and they're ready to exchange them. Adds huge amount of potential role play because you can't be a mechanic, gun guy, light weight boxer and marathonist at the same time. Like I said in the beginning this would introduce us even "inventory simulation" where you really want to think what item you put where. Easier to find stuff from jeans because it can only take small amount of small stuff than from a backpack that can have huge amount of different stuff.

 

One handy addition to ease up crafting and inventory would be crafting table, workbench or some kind of a similar thing. Some kind of an simple UI where you can drag items and combine them there because even currently sometimes items are far away from each other and if the inventory will be expanded at some point "crafting table" is what we need.

 

Too bad that I'm not a good artist that could draw some concepts but I think/hope you get the idea. The UI would need some work also and the inventory needs to be wider.

 

TL;DR: Current inventory system is too limited for game like DayZ. We need more slots and to limit players other way.

Edited May 11, 2014 by St. Jimmy

[sabre05 351]

TL:DR. However I'm pretty sure Rocket has said something about re-jigging the inventory system and adding a fatigue thing at some time or another.

[DemonGroover 8836]

Should be able to stack a lot more items - pens should stack to 20 or so for example.

[qww 287]

yeah i didnt read all post, but the idea of making weight matter like stalker would be good, also as someone else suggested in another topic, flipping items sideways to fit, and id be hapy to see clothing pockets split up where realistic too, (jeans etc)

i do imagine we will see inventory changes in future

[elLoCo 154]

More item Tetris plz!

 

Really you shuold be able to sort your stuff in a way you are able to organize your stuff like in rl!

 

I can put some stuff in my bag, if I'm going for a short walk and it can be a 'mess' inside the bag.

But, if I want to go on a hike, I need to organize my backpack quite well in order to get all the stuff in it.

 

Imagine a backpack, like you use it to go to work or school.

In reality it would be three dimensional.

In games they are always flat, but that's o.k., because you need to abstract it to k.i.s.s.

 

So It has a shape like this, ingame:

 

    OOO

  OOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

 

O.k., so all the 'O' are free slots and you can put items 'X' in it.

 

I guess an M4 would fit in it and it has a shape like this:

 

XXXXXXXXX

XXX

without mag.

 

and like this:

 

XXXXXXXXX

XXX X

with mag attached.

 

A can of :emptycan: , would be this:

 

XX

 

or

 

X

X

 

You can flip and mirror the direction of the item.

M4 with mag like this:

 

X

X

X

XX

X

XX

XX

XX

 

In the backpack, it would look like this:

 

     XOO

  OXOOO

OOXOOOO

OOXOOOO

OXXOOOO

OOXOOOO

OXXOOOO

OXXOOOO

OXXOOOO

 

In case of programming, you would create a class 'shape' which is the entity for all items that you can pick up.

It is a matrix, which defines the space for any items.

Certain items can be put into other items hierarchicly. You can't put a backpack into engineparts, even though they got the same volume. Which is logical ;)

But you can put a battery into an electric device how it is already.

 

The weight anyhow is calculated seperately.

There are small items which are extremely heavy like electric coils.

 

I think they could give this a go, what do you mean?

 

Tl;dr: a system for an advanced item Tetris

 

 

 

[Deadly Virus 1]

More item Tetris plz!

 

Really you shuold be able to sort your stuff in a way you are able to organize your stuff like in rl!

 

I can put some stuff in my bag, if I'm going for a short walk and it can be a 'mess' inside the bag.

But, if I want to go on a hike, I need to organize my backpack quite well in order to get all the stuff in it.

 

Imagine a backpack, like you use it to go to work or school.

In reality it would be three dimensional.

In games they are always flat, but that's o.k., because you need to abstract it to k.i.s.s.

 

So It has a shape like this, ingame:

 

    OOO

  OOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

OOOOOOO

 

O.k., so all the 'O' are free slots and you can put items 'X' in it.

 

I guess an M4 would fit in it and it has a shape like this:

 

XXXXXXXXX

XXX

without mag.

 

and like this:

 

XXXXXXXXX

XXX X

with mag attached.

 

A can of :emptycan: , would be this:

 

XX

 

or

 

X

X

 

You can flip and mirror the direction of the item.

M4 with mag like this:

 

X

X

X

XX

X

XX

XX

XX

 

In the backpack, it would look like this:

 

     XOO

  OXOOO

OOXOOOO

OOXOOOO

OXXOOOO

OOXOOOO

OXXOOOO

OXXOOOO

OXXOOOO

 

In case of programming, you would create a class 'shape' which is the entity for all items that you can pick up.

It is a matrix, which defines the space for any items.

Certain items can be put into other items hierarchicly. You can't put a backpack into engineparts, even though they got the same volume. Which is logical ;)

But you can put a battery into an electric device how it is already.

 

The weight anyhow is calculated seperately.

There are small items which are extremely heavy like electric coils.

 

I think they could give this a go, what do you mean?

 

Tl;dr: a system for an advanced item Tetris

It seems you've been thinking about this for a while!

[St. Jimmy 1631]

More item Tetris plz!

 

Text.

 

Should be able to stack a lot more items - pens should stack to 20 or so for example.

Yep tetris would be another solution but not really the best one. Then we would need stacks like DemonGroover said, because small items would need to take one slot and the slots can't be too small so you can even recognize what the item is. The biggest thing is to decide how many items yo can stack until you need to make another stack with small items. And the minus side is that you can't have various small items in your backpack because one item takes one slot. But one solution for that could be that you can make every slot separate as "a bag" where you can collect smaller items like bullets, mushrooms and pens under one slot. You would need to right click to open the bag.

 

The thing is how the item damage would be handled with items that are stacked? You can already see that there's a problem with ammo stacks. Stacks maybe could be expandable like inventories currently and that way every item has their own condition.

 

I forgot to mention that crafting table, workbench or some kind of a similar thing would be welcome. Some kind of an UI where you can drag items and combine them there because even currently sometimes items are far away from each other and if the inventory will be expanded at some point "crafting table" is what we need.

Edited May 11, 2014 by St. Jimmy

[elLoCo 154]

It seems you've been thinking about this for a while!

 

Honestly It came to my mind after being awake for nearly 24 hours and after work i wasn't sleepy so I rolled a spliff and read through the forums. ^^

[antoha1 4]

Sounds like arma 3 system

[St. Jimmy 1631]

Sounds like arma 3 system

Yep I like how BIS has done inventory in Arma 3. Though if I remember right in Arma 3 items don't have separate volume and weight values so they have to fight between balance of the size and weight of an item. I like how Arma 3 inventory is basically slotless and that's what DayZ would also benefit.

Edited May 11, 2014 by St. Jimmy

[gannon46 788]

I remember Rocket saying that the inventory would need to be worked again to come around some problems. I think the biggest problem is that there aren't enough slots in the inventory. Those slots limits too much small items like papers, pens, compass, maps, separate bullets etc. so you really don't want to carry those around even though those wouldn't take much space in your backpack. They need to come some way either expand slots in inventory like we can collapse and expand backpack inventory for example or some other way so all the inventories are "limitless" until the items in that inventory reach certain volume. Devs wouldn't really need to think about balancing how many slots a small item takes if you compare it to a bigger item because the item volume takes care of that. Only reason why items would have slots is just to see better what item it is and organize items in invetory. Containers/backpacks/clothes and Items could have close real life volumes without thinking too much because weight system takes care of that.

 

Let's have an example:

 

I have mountain backpack. Currently it has 35 slots so I can fit only 35 pens in it. Doesn't sound right when I can fit FNX45, sawed off shotgun, ammobox and some other stuff in it.

 

If items and inventories would have volumes we could make this more realistic. Mountain backpack could have inventory of 80dm³. Let's say that one pen is 0,015dm³. I could have 5300 pens in our mountain backpack if I just want that. Probably not necessary go this crazy with the inventory slots but I think there are solutions so even that could be possible. I've been thinking something so inventories would be bigger.

 

 

 

Packing effectively is one key for survival because if you don't pack enough well you don't find things what you're looking for quickly. Inventory management is big thing currently but it could be expanded a lot not just to bring bit more challenge but open up the game for more hardcore survival features like item weight and just how quickly you can find stuff in your backpack ;)

I suggest that backpacks would've different layers that you can expand just like you currently expand the whole backpack. Let's say that backpacks have 12 expandable layers that have 50 slots each so we could fit 600 one slot items in one backpack IF their volume don't exceed the capacity value of the backpack. This way we could have 600 pens in a backpack because they take one slot but we couldn't have 50 M4s in a backpack because the volume of the M4 exceeds the amount of the backpack can have. Then clothing items could have different amount of pockets and those pockets have different capacities.

 

To see how much capacity is left for example in jeans there would be capacity bars like in Arma 3 clothing items for every pocket. Also there could be a bar of the total capacity that is sum of every pockets capacity. Backpack would naturally need a total capacity bar. Then we need to see the total weight we have with us naturally which can be only a number somewhere. Not that big deal. Bigger deal is how much weight affects our movement and stamina but I won't talk about that here.

 

 

 

Some clothes and item examples how I think this could be handled. This way there could be realistic amount of pockets if wanted or just some expandable "pockets"/layers/whatever:

Mountain backpack

- 12 layers

- Capacity 80dm³. Counts capacity from every layer so you can fit that 100 amount of stuff even in one layer.

- Volume 15,6dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1,9kg

 

Jeans

- 4 pockets

- Capacity 0,5dm³ per pocket.

- Volume 2,2dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 0,8kg

 

Army trousers

- 6 pockets

- Capacity 0,7dm³ per pocket

- Volume 2,8dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1kg

 

Hoodie

- 1 pocket

- Capacity 1,3dm³

- Volume 2,5dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1kg

 

Jacket

- 4 pockets

- Capacity 0,5dm³ per pocket

- Volume 3,2dm³

- 4 slots (2x2)

- Weight 1,5kg

 

Pen

- Volume 0,015dm³

- Weight 0,010kg

- 1 slot

 

M4

- Base weight around 2,5kg. Weight depends on attachments.

- Base volume around 20dm³. Volume depends on attachments but those won't increase much of it.

- 6 slots (2x3)

- I'm pretty sure that it would needed to do this way with items that can have attachments.

 

Can of beans

- Volume 1,7dm³

- Weight 0,45kg

- 1 slot

 

Book

- Volume 0,7dm³

- Weight 0,5kg

- 1 slot

These numbers are just examples and naturally can be tweaked easily. They're based close to the real life values but some items like guns need to be balanced because their shape isn't even and you can't put those kind of items every way you want to in backpack.

Layers and pockets should have many slots so we can fit enough multiple slot stuff in them.

Capacity means how much the item can take items

Volume means how much it takes capacity. Also you can't pack for example jeans in a backpack unless you've folded them. You can only fold when jeans don't have any items in them. Logically same applies for carrying a backpack in a backpack. So clothes that can carry something act as containers when not folded but when folded they're just items.

Slots are just there so you can easily find bigger slot items from inventory but big items don't take too much of a space either so you can fit much stuff in. Easier to recognize some items when they're bigger.

 

Some of you might think if different backpacks for example could take only certain amount of weight in them. I think that's not needed because their capacity pretty much takes care of that and if/when stamina system is added you won't really care about that anymore... I added them there to see some reference. Arma 3 balances between weight and volume with how much character can take stuff in a backpack but I think that in DayZ that isn't enough.

 

 

 

With this kind of system I think we could see some traders around in Chernarus who have all kinds of small stuff with them and they're ready to exchange them. Adds huge amount of potential role play because you can't be a mechanic, gun guy, light weight boxer and marathonist at the same time. Like I said in the beginning this would introduce us even "inventory simulation" where you really want to think what item you put where. Easier to find stuff from jeans because it can only take small amount of small stuff than from a backpack that can have huge amount of different stuff.

 

One handy addition to ease up crafting and inventory would be crafting table, workbench or some kind of a similar thing. Some kind of an simple UI where you can drag items and combine them there because even currently sometimes items are far away from each other and if the inventory will be expanded at some point "crafting table" is what we need.

 

Too bad that I'm not a good artist that could draw some concepts but I think/hope you get the idea. The UI would need some work also and the inventory needs to be wider.

 

TL;DR: Current inventory system is too limited for game like DayZ. We need more slots and to limit players other way.

good idea. I personally think the stamina/weight issue would change the name of the game so to speak.

[a_ruttle 199]

a cross between ACE mods volume/weight system and dayzs slot system, perfect.

[ColonelBurton 145]

Inventory

I think the inventory system needs to be thought out new. At this point, a can of soda or food takes up as much space as a pack of coal tablets or matches. This is not only unrealistic but a pretty damn nuisance. I really feel like the item slots ought to be quartered and then redeveloped (can = 4x4, matches = 1x1, coal tablets = 1x2, swiss army knife = 1x2, combat knife = 2x5)

I also don't want to get into how much more stuff will fit into a backpack. If I take my personal GOOD-bag it's enough stuff to fill about 10 DayZ mountain packs.

I personally think that the slots should be expanded and changed as mentioned above, but the physics of the backpack change depending on how many slots are filled (see below)

I maintain there should be an animation for taking something out of the backpack. Instead of packing every tactically critical item (pistols, sawed-off izzie) into your backpack, this would cause you to have to think hard about how to store your inventory. There should be more options for carrying concealed weapons though (belt holsters, customized trench coats etc., and the chest holster could also be put UNDERNEATH your jacket)

Crafting additional holsters out of leather should be possible, I've made two makeshift belt holsters myself in RL using only some leather, a sharp knife, a hand press, two rivets, some super glue (to reinforce the rivets) and a leather band (alternately thin rope could work)

Oh, yeah, the game needs belts in my opinion. This is also where you would carry a knife, not stab it into your shoulder as is the case now XoD

Also, I'd like to see more tactical gear to expand inventory, especially the tactical leg rig (enabling ammo pouch, gear pouch, holster). This should create more noise and slow down slightly though.

 

Backpack physics

Not carrying a large backpack should have some perks. For example, prone mobility should be way more advanced and faster. Enabling you to turn on your hip, turn further to lie on your butt sitting up halfway, then back on the other hip and then on your stomach turning 360° (see urban prone for example). You should get up from prone state much faster without a backpack. Turning and weaving should be harder when you wear a heavy one that is full to the brim with stuff.

I have a 60 pound GOOD-bag that I can jog with quite well, get prone and up again, but when I run zig-zag the thing develops a life of its' own. This will make people that horde loot think twice about starting a random firefight in the forest.

I do think that taking stuff out of your backpack should take a moment and have an animation BUT not dropping the backpack on the ground inventory style. I'd hate to have to do that to get a can of food out, and then desync and lose all my stuff.

[BeefBacon 1185]

How about a complete removal of the slots system and instead rely entirely on item weight? Each item capable of storing an item (assault vests, bags, trousers, etc) should be able to store a certain weight.

 

Could also be that you can store 10% more weight than the 'set amount' (so if you have an item that can store 10kg you can actually store 11kg) but by storing in this extra space, there's a massive stamina/speed/whatever penalty.

 

This means getting rid of the Tetris minigame that comes with the current implementation of inventory management which, frankly, I'm not a big fan of. I'd be less annoyed with it if it allowed the flipping of objects, of course.

 

Could be worth having an item limit, though, to prevent spamming. Don't much like the idea of finding an assault vest filled with 100 sheets of paper.

[ColonelBurton 145]

How about a complete removal of the slots system and instead rely entirely on item weight? Each item capable of storing an item (assault vests, bags, trousers, etc) should be able to store a certain weight.

 

Could also be that you can store 10% more weight than the 'set amount'

 

If you've ever packed a bug-out bag, you'd know that space is a bigger issue than weight. I do agree though that there should be a movement penalty for those that carry large backpacks that are full to the brim.

 

 

This means getting rid of the Tetris minigame that comes with the current implementation of inventory management which, frankly, I'm not a big fan of. I'd be less annoyed with it if it allowed the flipping of objects, of course.

 

 

Yes, the long items should definetely be turnable. But as concerns the tetris minigame, this is actually pretty true to life. In fact, in a real-life survival scenario, you're constantly unpacking and rearranging your back-pack even more so than in the game.

[St. Jimmy 1631]

How about a complete removal of the slots system and instead rely entirely on item weight? Each item capable of storing an item (assault vests, bags, trousers, etc) should be able to store a certain weight.

 

Could also be that you can store 10% more weight than the 'set amount' (so if you have an item that can store 10kg you can actually store 11kg) but by storing in this extra space, there's a massive stamina/speed/whatever penalty.

 

This means getting rid of the Tetris minigame that comes with the current implementation of inventory management which, frankly, I'm not a big fan of. I'd be less annoyed with it if it allowed the flipping of objects, of course.

 

Could be worth having an item limit, though, to prevent spamming. Don't much like the idea of finding an assault vest filled with 100 sheets of paper.

Yes that's also an option that I very much like. Bit like how Arma 3 does the inventory. Same kind of stuff stack. When you've stack you could open the stack and find there items that have different conditions. But I've no idea how they could handle the item damage when you get hit. The item condition is the thing that makes stacking hard to implement.