Why DayZ is no survival game

[Wayze 549]

Oh I was asking drugarunda what he meant by it.

Yes I know, (he meant what I meant, because IT IS WHAT IT MEANS IN DAYZ) but I still want to know what you mean by:

 

I would rather you no call me stupid. Although I find it a little amusing that in the same paragraph you ask for my assistance.

So here is one example, the basis of your whole post.

note: I posted this earlier but you choose to ignore it ???

I never called you stupid. Read with attention please. I asked for your assistance because I am stupid, not YOU.

And no, I did not choose to ignore it. I just don't get what you mean by that. You say "deathmatching is that and that" (which is not true because it is by DayZ definition exactly what I describes, just you being new to the game doesn't mean you know everything), and say that based on that fact my whole post is bullshit. But you actually know exactly what I meant by "deathmatching", which leaves the question why the post is bullshit?

 

Actually, YOU are the one who ignores me. You are the one who skips EVERY single of the points I brought.

 

 

 

I was just trying to figure out where you're going with this

 

But seeing as you are already so defensive about everything, I guess that answer was to be expected.

 

Someone called the newest Tomb Raider game a survival game. Well maybe, but that does have a story, and isn't really comparable.

Maybe Minecraft is some form of a survival game, but it does have some of the same problem you've already mentioned.

What do you mean by "where I am going"? There is a whole thread about "where I am going" with this. What have other games to do with it? Ok, but if you want:

I don't give a f*ck about other games including survival aspects. I give a f*ck about DayZ. DayZ has VERY realistic survival aspects, but there is no point in surviving at all.

 

You know?

Edited February 6, 2014 by Wayze

[skyline-gtr 130]

hmmm

deathmatching in your DayZ sense means shooting each other for fun.

 

Ill tell you what.

If you can, Sum up your issue, keep it clear and concise, and we can move on from there.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Skyline-GTR

[Daz3kPvP 4]

Yes I know, (he meant what I meant, because IT IS WHAT IT MEANS IN DAYZ) but I still want to know what you mean by:

 

I never called you stupid. Read with attention please. I asked for your assistance because I am stupid, not YOU.

And no, I did not choose to ignore it. I just don't get what you mean by that. You say "deathmatching is that and that" (which is not true because it is by DayZ definition exactly what I describes, just you being new to the game doesn't mean you know everything), and say that based on that fact my whole post is bullshit. But you actually know exactly what I meant by "deathmatching", which leaves the question why the post is bullshit?

 

Actually, YOU are the one who ignores me. You are the one who skips EVERY single of the points I brought.

 

 

 

What do you mean by "where I am going"? There is a whole thread about "where I am going" with this. What have other games to do with it? Ok, but if you want:

I don't give a f*ck about other games including survival aspects. I give a f*ck about DayZ. DayZ has VERY realistic survival aspects, but there is no point in surviving at all.

 

You know?

 

So you care about DayZ, but yet don't care about DayZ, but you somehow still care about DayZ?

Edited February 6, 2014 by Daz3kPvP

[Wayze 549]

hmmm

deathmatching in a DayZ sense means shooting each other for fun.

So where does bandits and heros come into this ?

 

Ill tell you what.

If you can, Sum up your issue, keep it clear and concise, and we can move on from there.

The issue is that the game is so boring after you found gear and vehicles, that players go out there and hunt other players for fun. They don't do it for gear. They don't do it to get better. They do it simply to have fun.

This is the issue. There is simple nothing else to do once you have reached your "gear" and "vehicle" goals, but shooting each other. As DayZ is supposed to be a survival game (you know, about SURVIVING, not simulating call of duty), it just doesn't fit at all in the game.

 

The next issue is:

If you want to play the game as a survivor, it is just f*cking boring. Let's be honest, if you were a survivor you would never run around the airfield or populated areas. You would just try to survive. This is how real life works. In real life you have your life that is very valuable. But in DayZ? What do you have? Gear is just gear, it is something you USE to survive, not something you should survive FOR. If you are a survivor there is nothing to do. You can survive for 500 hours and you will have NOTHING out of it. Your character will be still as valuable as a freshspawn. This is the problem. People who want to play the game how it was intended to (as a SURVIVAL game) will not enjoy it, because there is no POINT in survivng. There is just gear that you collect. Gear that you can store. And most importantly, the most valuable gear you can find is supposed to KILL other players. So issue 1 again, once you have found the best gear, there is nothing else to do than shooting each other (what would you collect the gear for, if not using it?).

 

A loot system that is the only way to make progress in a game is FORCING players to kill other for fun. You don't use weapons to defend yourself, oh maybe you do, but most people do it to have fun. Think about it. The only thing that you can reach is getting a better weapon. Once you have the weapon, you are forced to use it, because you can lose it at any point. If you don't use it and have some fun with it, all the progress was useless.

 

This is what most players in DayZ think. This is the reason why the mod and the alpha are deathmatches (you know what I mean). This is the reason why nobody is surviving, but doing exciting sh*t.

 

 

 

So you care about DayZ, but yet don't care about DayZ, but you somehow still care about DayZ?

I think some people in this forum need to learn to read with attention. Just read it again. Maybe you will understand.

 

Oh, my mistake I think. (sorry ^^)

I use "I give a f*ck about something" to express that I actually care about it.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Wayze

[skyline-gtr 130]

If you find it boring, it doesnt mean everyone does.

Also I know alot of people who do not go around shooting the place up.

It is totally up to the player to decide what to do in this survival situation. The same as real life, people have choices.

 

Again your opinion that playing as a survivor is boring.

The game was intended to be fun, using survival as the theme.

The point of surviving is to live for as long as possible just like in real life.

There is no force to make you kill other players.

 

This game is certainly no deathmatch. Everyone does not go around killing each other.

 

Again your post is so full of logical jumps man. I tried to explain some of them but your second paragraph was far from clear and consice so it was difficult to make out what you meant really.

[Wayze 549]

If you find it boring, it doesnt mean everyone does.

Also I know alot of people who do not go around shooting the place up.

It is totally up to the player to decide what to do in this survival situation. The same as real life, people have choices.

 

Again your opinion that playing as a survivor is boring.

The game was intended to be fun, using survival as the theme.

The point of surviving is to live for as long as possible just like in real life.

There is no force to make you kill other players.

 

This game is certainly no deathmatch. Everyone does not go around killing each other.

 

Again your post is so full of logical jumps man. I tried to explain some of them but your second paragraph was far from clear and consice so it was difficult to make out what you meant really.

Poll needed.

[GeoBrau 0]

First post, but VERY interesting topic. I've never played the mod-game and only started playing standalone just after the new year. It is most definitely an alpha, and I get that. But, I will say that a few of the ideas floated here would be very interesting.

 

I think a death lockout would be good. But maybe the lockout actually gets longer (up to a max) the longer you live. This wouldn't frustrate the noobs (like myself) and would actually reinforce the sense of dread you might feel by having a character, you've spent hours/days building, die. I certainly wouldn't implement this NOW, because alpha.

 

But once things stabilize...

 

Additionally, I like the idea of a timer (Alive for XX days) on login, just reinforcing how much work you've put into a character.

 

Finally, maybe you can simply earn personal achievements, instilling a further sense of pride in your ability to stay alive.

 

[skyline-gtr 130]

Basically, I think you are taking your own personal experience with the game too far.

Perhaps do some reading of other peoples experience, look at some youtube vids etc.

I might also remind you that the game is still in alpha, so they probably do intent to add more survival elements into it.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Skyline-GTR

[Wayze 549]

Basically, I think you are taking your own personal experience with the game too far.

Perhaps do some reading of other peoples experience, look at some youtube vids etc.

http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/171845-do-we-want-a-reward-for-surviving/

 

Time will tell.

[skyline-gtr 130]

I do see a problem with your poll tho.

It is so vague...

I can take a wild guess that you will get a Yes vote, given that greed is human nature.

The question could be anything, with the poll being do you want reward or no, you would still get a yes vote in most cases.

[drewsta 74]

Wow these forums are good for a laugh sometimes and I enjoy reading them when I can.

 

Folks are we deliberately just skipping over the fact that this game is barely on it's feet or is that point completely mute now?  The need to voice your opinions and maintain that they are right seems excessive at times considering the development stage of the game.  

 

Some posts actually start with acknowledging that fact. "Now before you are scream at me, I know this is an ALPHA"  sounds no different than "Now before you all tell me I'll get electrocuted if I stick a knife in this wall socket, what's with all the zapping!". 

 

My 4 cents no one asked for.

Cheers

Edited February 7, 2014 by Drewsta

[Irenicus (DayZ) 289]

Great thread.

 

I have had similar thoughts myself.

Some obvious thoughts: Stamina: Right now we can run forever, but with a stamina system, perhaps some kind of "fitness" and "endurance" could be implemented. Over time your ability to run further would increase.

Encumbrance: Ability to carry more over time due to lugging around beans on your back every day :)

Speed: Faster sprint

Faster ladder climbing.

Larger stomach capacity or reduced need for water and food depending on situation.

Ability to squeeze more items into your clothes/backpack due to becoming an expert at Infantry Tetris (well...packing a backpack irl is actually somewhat an art).

 

I'm sure there are many more things that could be mentioned but those are my thoughts for now.

[Irenicus (DayZ) 289]

This game is certainly no deathmatch. Everyone does not go around killing each other.

 

 

Hahahaha.....Oh Skyline. You still funny man :D

[paulusrojo 25]

 

What do you mean by "where I am going"? There is a whole thread about "where I am going" with this. What have other games to do with it? Ok, but if you want:

I don't give a f*ck about other games including survival aspects. I give a f*ck about DayZ. DayZ has VERY realistic survival aspects, but there is no point in surviving at all.

 

You know?

 

Actually I don't know. And I sure as hell don't like your tone young man.

 

If you're unable to compare to anything, it's very hard to grasp your full vision. And saying there's no point in surviving is meaningless. I don't want to get too philosophical, but life itself is a damn good reason to survive. And if you cant understand that, I don't think ANY survival game is for you. If you desperately need something to hang on to, I'd recommend you to start roleplaying in game or something.

 

And while I do understand your point, and I even understand that some people want "more" out of the game, I personally don't feel like a "skill-system" is the way to go. And if you're so interested in statistics, why don't you just start to log them yourself? To be honest, I think the dev's are feeling the same way, but it's only alpha, and only time will tell.

[Hrki 94]

1. i think you are just mad because you die alot

2. remember this is alpha and later ther will be many difficults of server to choose (for your playstyle)

3. remember this is only a game

4. if u want your post to live go email bear grils i think he can manage to pleased all your requests

[Shortbus (DayZ) 2]

No to skills

No to rewards

 

im not sure many of you understand what a sandbox is.

[GarethAUS 20]

First of all I wouldn't be communicating with people 10km away. Secondly, if I wanted to go 10km, I would just run there because survival is what I'm looking for in my DayZ time. I'm not looking for a quick fix, I'm not looking to maximize my fun. I'm not looking to work the system to make my time more useful. I'm looking to put myself to the test in the environment Rocket has outlined for us.

 

If you can't find the point in running 10km, what's the point in even playing DayZ? What's the point in playing any video game? It's all just meaningless 1's and 0's painting pixels on your screen. You gain nothing, your time is always wasted.

That was without a doubt one of the dumbest things I have ever read... I want to maximize my fun in a game not spending and hour with my finger on the w key running...and I don't think that that could even be classed as "Putting my self to the test in the environment Rocket has outlined"

[Wayze 549]

Actually I don't know. And I sure as hell don't like your tone young man.

My tone? My tone depends on how your read my text. I didn't intend to sound offensive. And "giving a f*ck", is just a way how I express something. Has nothing to do with you or the situation. It's how I use the english language, young woman.

 

No to skills

No to rewards

 

im not sure many of you understand what a sandbox is.

What is the difference between loot, that restricts playstyle and simple skills, that do not restrict playstyle at all? And no, DayZ is no sandbox game. It always tried to be a survival game.

Edited February 7, 2014 by Wayze

[patrick_insanity@hotmail.com 111]

I somewhat hastefully went through the thread reading people's arguments and responses.. and all I could think about was;

 

potato

[GodOfGrain 191]

See this link for a system of microskills to increase value of life:

http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/158609-sa-suggestion-introduction-of-microskills/

[PepeLumpardo 1]

Progression Progression....what about "real" Progression?!

 

to stay alive as long as possible would be rewarding IF:

 

the longer your character lives the harder the game should be!

 

Why?

 

let´s take a broken leg, you can stop the pain using morphine,

or you use a splint so you still can walk/run trough the wilderness

 

but honestly we have no medical care here in our wasteland, so if

there is progress then why not adding all injuries you had in the

life of your toon, and the more injuries you had the more slower you

are able to run(shacking when aming/need more food to stay healthy),

so it would become more and more challenging to

get on the top of the list of survivors in terms of time survived.

 

this also would reward playing as a team ´cause the longer you wander the

wilderness the more injuries add up the harder it gets, but with friends

you will be able to survive another day as they could give you medical treatment or

driving you around as you cannot move fast enough to outrun Zeds after

the 10th bullet passed through your leg.

 

everything degrades, so why should your toon prosper?

 

ok maybe a playerbuild homebase could reduce the effects a little, but not at all.

 

and it also would make bandits think twice about engaging someone as it is

harder for bandits to make friends to get medical treatment.

(sure there are also groups of bandits, and they should also get the benefit from working together,

but it would make it harder for our fellow BF4 Players to run around the map shooting everything

that moves)

 

so if someone gets to the top of a leaderboard (which you can look at but don`t have to if you don´t

care about) he can be sure he/she fought the harsh enviroment / 3-g brainers (yeah i talk about Zed´s...mmhh...do I? :D )

/ or human maniacs better then someone else.... thats something i could be proud of, as it is a survivalgame

and not a shooter, so the important thing is to survive not to add up kills, which will come along as you try to survive.

 

so back to work now :)

cya in chernarus

 

PepeLumpardo

[paulusrojo 25]

My tone? My tone depends on how your read my text. I didn't intend to sound offensive. And "giving a f*ck", is just a way how I express something. Has nothing to do with you or the situation. It's how I use the english language, young woman.

 

What is the difference between loot, that restricts playstyle and simple skills, that do not restrict playstyle at all? And no, DayZ is no sandbox game. It always tried to be a survival game.

So now you're calling me a woman. Classy. I sure hope every forum-member can be so classy when they're on the defense.

 

You sure have voiced your opinion, and it seems like the community is torn in the middle about these "rewards" you're talking about (although if that poll had been more accurate, and if something like 10% of total DayZ players had voted, I'm sure the results had been different). But that's neither here nor there. You have a different viewpoint on this matter, and I accept that. I think you're idea is somewhat meaningless, and your solutions are not compatible with the vision the Devs have when it comes to DayZ. As a community in the alpha stages of such a great game, these are only the first issues of many that will split us. Sometimes in half, other times it will not be even.

 

My point is, do not spend so much time dwelling about things, and please for he sake of Dean, do not behave like a little spoiled brat, calling names and being offensive. Save that for the Beta :)

[JoyEnergiser 11]

Agreed, make it semi RPG and add character progression that you loose upon death.

[drugarunda 1]

No real counter-arguments, other than just "No." and that this is a sandbox, it is also alpha, but this is a forum and we can discuss about what we would like this game to become ;) .

 

As it stands you can survive forever by choosing a low pop server, zombies are all dead once you have guns and some ammo, and that is that. Actually boring once you figure out the map. (an alternative here would be to make zombies seriously deadly, so actual survival vs NPC's would be a real challenge.

 

Next step is PvP (or DM), and this is where we are right now.

 

It is an interesting style of DM, due to the fact that you are not back to square one immediately like in a normal DM game. However in my view the game can be even more interesting, if there is more to lose by getting killed than is currently the case.

 

[pillock 850]

The focus of the game will surely change as it develops?

 

At the moment, it is not really a survival game: the focus is on tactical combat (understandable, considering where the mod came from). But the potential is there for deep and interesting survival mechanics and plenty of "things to do" besides pvp combat. (At the moment, they are not there, I agree.)

 

What's the point in having pristine clothes or shoes over damaged ones? None, at the moment, but body heat and feet condition could - and should in my opinion - be implemented in future.

 

Sickness, health status, physical fitness, fatigue, injury - it's all pretty bare-bones right now, and doesn't make a huge difference to how you play. But if it's expanded upon in time, it adds a huge amount of depth to the survival experience.

 

More interesting and varied gear will come: towns could be littered with loot - some of it useful, some of it craftable, some of it junk - the more the better! Potential for trade, etc.

 

Vehicles! After their implementation, it will be time to start punishing people with fatigue if they constantly run around for mile upon mile, hour after hour - if you want to get around quickly, you still could in a vehicle, but it's more risky.

 

Camps: take territory, control it, form a community, defend it, raid others. This gives you more objectives.

 

Hunting, (fishing?), foraging: once the beans run out, you look to the land for sustenance - this opens up new techniques to master, and gives more purpose to camps/bases.

 

More zombies! Creates fear, makes scavenging harder and riskier, creates atmosphere.

 

How long has SA been running? A few months? Of course it's limited to combat-focus right now - it's based on a military simulator! But there is massive potential to buff up the survival aspects as development progresses.