Current Mosin "Inaccuracy" unrealistic.

[louist 163]

Harba: going by Rocket's stated desire to focus on civilian and lower/older military gear, than the mosin is meant to be one of those sniper rifles.

It is possible that weapons do have a condition rating, which is currently not displayed. That may account for the poor accuracy, and the different results people are having.

[louist 163]

Harba: going by Rocket's stated desire to focus on civilian and lower/older military gear, than the mosin is meant to be one of those sniper rifles.

It is possible that weapons do have a condition rating, which is currently not displayed. That may account for the poor accuracy, and the different results people are having.

[louist 163]

Sorry for the double post above. The mobile version of these forums won't let me edit that out :(

I like the idea of having some damage to a weapon give it particular quirks (so as always hitting to the left of centre, as mentioned above). It means that if you invested time and ammo into even a poor weapon, you could get to know it, and become competent with it.

[jBrick 116]

I've been distance shooting for a pretty good chunk of my life... and its not too often when I see a game that is overstating the ineffectiveness of a distance rifle.  Usually its the other way around (like the M98B in Battlefield 3).

[lucidr34ms 9]

Remember the character you are playing is just a civilian not a pro sniper from the army.

 

In any video game the character should be made as if he were the strongest/smartest/fastest person alive. That way you dont get skilled people playing having the game hold them back. Instead the game lets you feel how it would be to be perfect and thats how every game should be and IS. BF4,COD,DAYZ any game ever... BTW In a real ZA.. Most survivors would be military/cops and ex military/cops. So your point is absolutely wrong is what im getting at. I dont want a character that feels more sluggish then I do in RL LOL come on people use your heads thats just making the game no fun and harder all at the same time.

[gibonez 3633]

In any video game the character should be made as if he were the strongest/smartest/fastest person alive. That way you dont get skilled people playing having the game hold them back. Instead the game lets you feel how it would be to be perfect and thats how every game should be and IS. BF4,COD,DAYZ any game ever... BTW In a real ZA.. Most survivors would be military/cops and ex military/cops. So your point is absolutely wrong is what im getting at. I dont want a character that feels more sluggish then I do in RL LOL come on people use your heads thats just making the game no fun and harder all at the same time.

 

 

Most survivors in a post apocalyptic scenario would most certainly not be ex military or police.

 

Most would be ordinary civilians, from all walks of life, everything from doctors to nurses to construction workers and warehouse guys.

 

Some people really overestimate how prepared military and especially police would be for such a situation.

 

Military and police would usually be the first to be taken out since they would be thrown into the meat grinder to try to stop the world ending event.

[Mallow88 110]

There's a lot of people with military/police experience who aren't currently military/police. I think those people would excel in a post-apocalyptic environment. 

[-Gews- 7443]

Dispersion should be about the gun, not the player. New players will likely be worse shots than experienced players.

 

Anyways the Mosin currently shoots 8.6 MOA. 

 

AFAIK the points of impact are not completely random. Bipod reduces this a great deal.

 

 

 

 

Anyways I don't like this approach much... for game purposes it should have the same dispersion whether it's wearing a bipod or not. The bipod should just make it steadier, thus easier to hit with, like ACE.

 

The bipod isn't suddenly going to replace the old barrel with a shiny new one and tune everything up.

[louist 163]

Licidreams: sorry? In every game you play some epitome if a human? That's not even remotely true.

Additionally, "in the real Zombie Apocalypse" is a quick way to discredit whatever point you try to make.

[gibonez 3633]

There's a lot of people with military/police experience who aren't currently military/police. I think those people would excel in a post-apocalyptic environment. 

 

Of course they would but the vast vast vast vast majority of people are non military and police and would greatly outnumber them.

 

9/10 times a survivor you would encounter would be an average joe not some ex soldier or cop.

 

In the US for example in 2006, 800,000 people were employed as police at the local, state and federal level. As of right now there are 1,429,995 Active military personnel.

 

This leads us to a grand total of 2229995 military and police personnel of which the grand majority are in non combat support roles. This is out of a population of 317,314,000.

 

So if my math is right Military and police make up 0.45065613241142843 percent of the total population of the US. You telling me 0.450 percent of a population would make up the majority of survivors in a disaster event ?

 

I used the US btw since it is often considered a police state, we have more police and military per citizen than other nations.

 

Gews what does the average mosin get in moa in real life ?

Edited December 23, 2013 by gibonez

[mick18 4]

I had bullets going about a foot to the left at 600, with a bipod. I thought it was acceptable, but obviously people are getting different results. Is there firearm condition?

 

btw i have a badly damaged scope (800), but it looks fine, unlike a damaged regular scope.

[JarethJams 87]

Same problem here. Nasty spread the longer I go.

[slivniku@gmail.com 93]

All this talk about a 70 year old pristine ex sniper rifle, but nobody considered what effect ammo has on accuracy... Like you are going to get heaps of match grade 7.62R ammo in an eastern european country...

[-Gews- 7443]

Gews what does the average mosin get in moa in real life ?

 

Depends on the condition, range, sights, ammunition, number of rounds fired, and obviously the shooter so it could be all over the place. The fact it's a Mosin isn't nearly as important as the condition of individual rifle.

 

8.6 MOA still seems quite high. For game purposes... mmm. I'd put it at somewhere from 3-5 MOA.

[icefluid 8]

You mean your 70+year old rifle isn't hitting 1" groups at 500m? You're right so unrealistic.

[franzuu 211]

I can accept a larger wandering on a badly damaged gun. If you want to put the survivors health, stance and use of bi-pods into the equation then all of that should manifest itself as shaking, breathing sway, whatever.

 

Right now if you have a deployed bi-pod, attached bayonet or a suppressor it results in a larger dispersion. It shouldn't. With a bayonet and in a non prone unsupported position with the mosin you should sway more and shake more. It makes the gun heavier, front heavier and awkward to handle. Try using it in the small-ass houses of dayz, you'll get caught on everything. That should be the tradeoff, not some arbitrary number in a config file.

Edited December 23, 2013 by KeelPool

[franzuu 211]

All this talk about a 70 year old pristine ex sniper rifle, but nobody considered what effect ammo has on accuracy... Like you are going to get heaps of match grade 7.62R ammo in an eastern european country...

 

The description says pristine for both the rifle and ammo. I'd be fine if the ammo was weathered, dented, corroded, old etc. But that stuff isn't in and I haven't heard that it will be. If the pristine baseline is shit then wtf are you going to bother adding worse ammo grades into the game.

[slivniku@gmail.com 93]

You can have pristine steel jacketed ammo which still wont hit shit; guess what ammo is used most in the old mother russia and co? It was always about quantity over quality with them...

[louist 163]

Those are some great and totally factual generalizations.

[deebz1234 243]

really???

 

I was shooting last night 800 zero and hitting zombies from green mountin to that town.

 

pristing mosin & hunting rifle scope. No bipod or anything else.

 

gotta be weapon decay like Joj said.

Edited December 23, 2013 by deebz1234

[beelzebossi@hotmail.com 28]

This is my first shot with mosin and it seems pretty good with bipod.

 

[kydo 11]

OK, here we go:

 

1: there is a bug where if you're standing on a steep hill the bullet may land directly in-front of your barrel. Im not sure if there's a bug report on this yet, I'll be looking today and posting one if none exists. 

 

2: Weapons themselves have decay states. I've had a pistol go *click*click* when i pulled the trigger. I changed the ammo, changed the magazine, same thing. I found a new pistol, *bang*bang*. So, theres a good chance your ballistic deviation is a result of a rifle that is not pristine.

 

3: Last night I took my fist long rang shot in the SA; 800m almost exactly. dead center hit. Ill try some more today, but it definitely seems like the weapon state much more so then the weapon config stats.

 

4: the best way to find exact range atm is dayzdb.com or some other map with grid positions. know where you are, know where they are, find distance with the grid.

 

 

 

 

Dispersion should be about the gun, not the player. New players will likely be worse shots than experienced players.

 

Anyways the Mosin currently shoots 8.6 MOA. 

 

AFAIK the points of impact are not completely random. Bipod reduces this a great deal.

 

 

 

 

Anyways I don't like this approach much... for game purposes it should have the same dispersion whether it's wearing a bipod or not. The bipod should just make it steadier, thus easier to hit with, like ACE.

 

The bipod isn't suddenly going to replace the old barrel with a shiny new one and tune everything up.

 

 

I agree with this 110%

[mintypie007 57]

Mosins are ollllld. I have one that was from 1942. The 91/30 in the game is even OLDER than that. They were designed for volley fire. Accuracy was not important and only with work they ate accurate to 600 meters.

[franzuu 211]

I made a thread on the topic that covers this, I think its pretty indepth

 

Proposed changes to weapon handling, debuffs, accuracy, tradeoffs etc.

[strngplyr 26]

Well, its been 60+ years since Mosins have been new. That's a lot of years of corrosive ammo being shot through it to seriously ruin the bore. Lots of eastern bloc ammo has corrosive salts on the primer which if not cleaned properly and neutralized will eat the bore away.

But beyond all that its probably a play balance issue to prevent too much sniping in the Alpher.

 

Not sure if anyone has already pointed this out, but it's actually about 120 years since they've been new. The first Mosin was made in 1891 with a revision in 1931.