Pending Update: Build 1.7.2

[djshauny1 222]

http://dayzmod.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=22504&pid=199616#pid199616

[ukko (DayZ) 5]

Yeah like mentioned, zombies seem to have better senses than humans. I was scoping bunch of zombies wandering around the shore when I heared remote enfield shot somewhere another side of the town. I was amused when beach zombies seemed to know exact adress where that came from and rushed there like mad. But zombies searching and stuff seems great allready. Keep up the good work. Cant wait next version.

edit: all for zombies running inside when they are bit more human like tracking you. Thought zs are diseased people afterall on this mod.

[Hendrix (DayZ) 14]

Chard' pid='199602' dateline='1340761197']

Zombies Running Indoors???

Rocket' date=' personally I hope they don't... and here's why...

I know you're tweaking and testing all the variables to get just the right feel for how the game mechanics work. That's what this alpha is all about.

I like where much of the zombie improvements have been going, but there's going to be a point were the zombies just too dangerous for fun gameplay. Realism aside, it is still just a game.

Not everyone wants to play in groups... Solo playing this game really brings home the solitude and apocolyptic feeling of this game. No one to save you. No laughing on comms. Just paranoia and fear. There's never been another game like this one....

As you may have guessed, I usually play solo and always do max stealth anywhere near zombies... Having survived over 30 days, I've gotten pretty good at sneaking. On the rare occassion that I do aggro one however, I can try to shoot it, but unless I have a silenced weapon, then odds are that the horde will awaken and I'll be force to flee for cover or die. There's absolutely no way that anyone would be able to solo the game if we couldn't count on them slowing down indoors, having some advantage... Even then, you have to pray that you have enough ammo to take care of the dozens of zombies that will be attracted to the gunfire... We've all had to pick our way over dozens of bodies to get out of building after being swarmed, and that's by zombies walking indoors. If they moved fast, then it would be game over... There would be no way to lose them... It almost defeats the purpose of the LOS improvements you've already made.

I don't mind the zombies being tougher. By all means go for it. Make their sense as realistic as you think they should be, but making them into player killing homing missles is cold man.. Really cold.

The alternative for a solo player is sticking to the wilderness and raiding deerstands because the towns are too dangerous to go near, and that get's boring pretty quick.

And as far as the updates go, take your time, work through the issues, test thoroughly and relase them when you're ready. I've seen too many annoying posts from people demanding you work faster.. Great game.

Rocket for President of Chernarus 2013!!!!!

[/quote']

I agree zombies indoors is already a bad mechanic as they spawn on loot before some peopel even have a gun and even when you get said gun you can't shoot them lest you be attacked by an infinite horde so then you gotta use an axe on it and basically play russian roulete "will it die in one blow or 15 no one knows for shure ,maybe it will break your legs give you shock and bleed you out lets find out....,spin"

That said...if they fix the melee selection, the sound design for zombies and their spawn paterns and rates ect., they might need to find a way for zombies to be more deadly.

To me it is more an issue of getting the quality of life things done before making it harder for the leet people playing in teams. If they break the game for single players before they can even learn spawn points they will be too frsutrated to continue learning.

I don't want Dark Souls in shooter form I want a fun game. They are going to eventually decide what market they are going for and figure out if certain items need increased spawn rates so that noobs can figure out the game easier like maps matchboxes vehicles and tents...

I think they should do quality of life and add more end game style things like predatory animals in the wild and a hunting mechanic,crafting, bartering,minigames like hunting contests ect tracked on forums, fishing, clothing customization tool building ect. and let the players stay the main threat for each other and drive the game more then the artificial mechanics. Then they can determine how much harder to make zombies after we got new tools to trap them fortify towns and items to play with that make the game more interesting outside of take a gun and shoot a person, zombie or goat....

[Kageru 18]

Every notch by which you increase zombie danger increases the PvP/PK penalty (it's much harder to re-gear) and the new player retention rate (it's much harder to survive) if the threat is not graduated. If zombies on a non-enterable, non-loot spawning beach front house are as tough as those at the air-ports you are challenging your new players far more than the armed and organised veterans and that will cost you retention.

If you think new players are going to form organized groups in response, when there is no in-game mechanic to encourage that (like a safe starting point, communication or temporary PK protection), when most don't have out of game social groups, and when actally meeting allies is a matter of luck and substantial time you are probably being too optimistic. Most will just die repeatedly and stop playing.

In other words I hope zombie challenge is being considered as part of the global mechanics and how the game is functioning now (a hard core PvP game). Harder isn't always better, especially if it's applied universally.

[sbats 3]

Rocket' date=' instead of adding a little more content while the latest patch is in testing, how about you fix more bugs instead. Preferably the zombies walking through walls/doors/fences bug.

Save the content for later, these gamebreaking bugs have to be ironed out yesterday

[/quote']

It's a mod in alpha stage. Zombies walking through walls/doors/fences is judging from how things are going not gamebreaking and most likely engine related.

Oh and where is it written that zombies can't open doors? In the made up book of rules about fictional monsters? Or are you one of those guys that will scream "IMPOSSIBLE" moments before a zombie rips you open after it opened the door you're hiding behind, you know...when something like a zombie apocalypse should actually ever see the light of the day?

Does the virus maintain the intelligence of the zombie? If not, one would imagine accurately that the deterioration of the zombies mind would render them useless to being the one to open the door for the hoard. Again without a functioning brain, you tend to forget things, like how to cook food, so you eat it raw.

[combatcomm1 234]

I feel like asking without being drmatic or trolling as you all call it gets no response from the devs.

Its like they would rather answer people who complain or feel entitled get answers or at least a comment.

Rocket please fix server hopping.

I was server hopped yestrday. 4 days worth of character play lost to a bandit who shot at me from a building in front of me. I advanced on his building and he spawned behind me and killed me. Rediculous.

I know it sounds extreme but please limit characters to 1 server every 30 minutes or something. Or 1 server per life would be better. Fortifications are also useless if this is not fixed.

You said This is an anti game. Lets make it that. Fix server hopping

PLEEEEEEEEASE!?

[Katana67 2907]

I think Rocket needs to put out a solid Day Z lore, so that we can properly judge what behaviors zombies should and shouldn't have. As well as what properties are reasonable with Chernarus.

[combatcomm1 234]

Every notch by which you increase zombie danger increases the PvP/PK penalty (it's much harder to re-gear) and the new player retention rate (it's much harder to survive) if the threat is not graduated. If zombies on a non-enterable' date=' non-loot spawning beach front house are as tough as those at the air-ports you are challenging your new players far more than the armed and organised veterans and that will cost you retention.

If you think new players are going to form organized groups in response, when there is no in-game mechanic to encourage that (like a safe starting point, communication or temporary PK protection), when most don't have out of game social groups, and when actally meeting allies is a matter of luck and substantial time you are probably being too optimistic. Most will just die repeatedly and stop playing.

In other words I hope zombie challenge is being considered as part of the global mechanics and how the game is functioning now (a hard core PvP game). Harder isn't always better, especially if it's applied universally.

[/quote']

READ AND HEED ROCKET!! DUDE, YOU NEED TO STOP MAKING THE ZOMBIES EASIER. STOP WORRYING ABOUT THE CASUALS SO DANM MUCH.

THE HARDER THE ZOMBIES! THE LESS PVP. PEOPLE WILL THINK TWICE BEFORE POPPING SHOTS OF FOR A CAN OF BEANS.

PLEASE!

[Kageru 18]

.... uh. Not sure if serious.

[sbats 3]

Every notch by which you increase zombie danger increases the PvP/PK penalty (it's much harder to re-gear) and the new player retention rate (it's much harder to survive) if the threat is not graduated. If zombies on a non-enterable' date=' non-loot spawning beach front house are as tough as those at the air-ports you are challenging your new players far more than the armed and organised veterans and that will cost you retention.

If you think new players are going to form organized groups in response, when there is no in-game mechanic to encourage that (like a safe starting point, communication or temporary PK protection), when most don't have out of game social groups, and when actally meeting allies is a matter of luck and substantial time you are probably being too optimistic. Most will just die repeatedly and stop playing.

In other words I hope zombie challenge is being considered as part of the global mechanics and how the game is functioning now (a hard core PvP game). Harder isn't always better, especially if it's applied universally.

[/quote']

READ AND HEED ROCKET!! DUDE, YOU NEED TO STOP MAKING THE ZOMBIES EASIER. STOP WORRYING ABOUT THE CASUALS SO DANM MUCH.

THE HARDER THE ZOMBIES! THE LESS PVP. PEOPLE WILL THINK TWICE BEFORE POPPING SHOTS OF FOR A CAN OF BEANS.

PLEASE!

It's all about the balance, and quite frankly if this balance isn't met and players stop flowing to this total conversion of Arma 2, Rocket will perhaps be out of a job.

Lets take a step back and look at how many copies of Arma 2 were purchased due to his mod, ridiculous amounts. You'd want to keep the popularity up of the mod during its ascension into a full game, by keeping its gameplay balanced. Make the zombies to hard so 'casuals' will think they wasted their money, isn't good for word of mouth, sales. I've been playing since OFP and am always for harder gameplay, but you have to think outside your box buddy.

Don't make it to extreme for new players, create a balance, keep everyone happy, and let the non-casuals who believe the game should be made to their standards only boil in their own piss for being greedy.

I love you.

[lockie1976 39]

READ AND HEED ROCKET!! DUDE' date=' YOU NEED TO STOP MAKING THE ZOMBIES EASIER. STOP WORRYING ABOUT THE CASUALS SO DANM MUCH.

THE HARDER THE ZOMBIES! THE LESS PVP. PEOPLE WILL THINK TWICE BEFORE POPPING SHOTS OF FOR A CAN OF BEANS.

PLEASE!

[/quote']

Harder zombies makes it much easier for me to murder survivors...

[Kageru 18]

I assumed he was being sarcastic...

Harder zombies will encourage PK. It upsets the victim more since it is harder for them to re-gear, it removes a potential threat for longer while they re-gear and it makes the value of the gear sitting on their cooling corpse more valuable.

[SgtHydra 0]

You hardcore guys got it all wrong.

Don't make zombies more difficult to fight.

Make them more interesting to fight.

I don't want this to be Left 4 Dead anymore than anyone else, but the addition of some "special" zombies would not hurt.

Look, if I can't raid a single barn cause the walkers around there are OP as hell, that's bad. But if that barn is guarded by some novel sort of zombie, one that hunts or acts in a way different from normal zombies, then that's fun.

The sort of stuff I'm thinking of is like this: a roamer zombie that spawns alone out in the woods, making sure no players (especially ones on low pop servers) are running around carefree when its supposed to be a zombie apocalypse; a spotter zombie that is completely deaf and relies on eyesight - it would have big red glowing eyes that shine like spotlights (like this, but, you know, a zombie) and, when it spots you, it beelines right for you in a tackle attack that knocks you to the ground (regular attack afterwards, tho); or a zombie that relies solely on sound and is quite easy to distract with bottles - but even a silenced weapon is like a dinner bell to them.

I know what you're thinking. Too Left 4 Dead. We don't need this. The regular zombies are fine.

But I'm sure it's not just me who tires of the "sneak, headshot, mop up" routine?

Heck, I hardly fight zombies anymore. And with the normal walker sort, that's okay. They're boring. I'd like to have a boss zombie that I'd have to take out before daring to attempt sneaking in - or alternatively, make sneaking in more than just "go prone and stay prone."

The pvp is great, but the pve has gotten stale. Needs spice, regardless of what ideas are implemented. I'm just giving examples of what I thought up.

We certainly don't need exploding zombies or tank zombies or jumping zombies, but we do need zombies that have unique interactions with the player.

[Hendrix (DayZ) 14]

Every notch by which you increase zombie danger increases the PvP/PK penalty (it's much harder to re-gear) and the new player retention rate (it's much harder to survive) if the threat is not graduated. If zombies on a non-enterable' date=' non-loot spawning beach front house are as tough as those at the air-ports you are challenging your new players far more than the armed and organised veterans and that will cost you retention.

If you think new players are going to form organized groups in response, when there is no in-game mechanic to encourage that (like a safe starting point, communication or temporary PK protection), when most don't have out of game social groups, and when actally meeting allies is a matter of luck and substantial time you are probably being too optimistic. Most will just die repeatedly and stop playing.

In other words I hope zombie challenge is being considered as part of the global mechanics and how the game is functioning now (a hard core PvP game). Harder isn't always better, especially if it's applied universally.

[/quote']

I think this is a key part of the difficulty when balancing this game. the game was largely created into this beast by the hardcore then all the new players that may or may not stay around longterm have influxed in and made it a bit of a cultural phenomenon so as a game designer the question is who do you please first the hardcore guys who made you or the newer players that need care bearing.

I don't envy rockets dilema but I understand it needs to be a little of both. From my personal experiences in the game. When I started playing it was post the 1.7.1.5 so I had only heard about starting with a gun and beans and it was brutally hard for me. I never played arma 2 and didn't know the maps, I am a grown man and don't really know any teens boys to party with...because that would be odd... and had never watched any youtube demo's or looked at any map's with the loot tables on them.

Since then I just briefly looked at the wiki and mostly just so I could figure out game systems like cooking and hinting and also what buildings have doors to enter and which are just window dressing and where the good spawns are. I still havn't gotten down routes for the deer stands or vehicles or even found a tent spawn that wasn't bugged out...sigh...(yay I found a tent bag....boo I can't pick it up)

but now I have figured out spawn routes through at least one of the major costal cities that will net me a gun,axe,hunting knife,canteen matchbook,medical supplies and probably a backpack in about 20-40 minutes or less depending on where I spawn.

None of the original difficulty I had exists now. Except with learning to stop running to shoot but soon enough I'll do that second nature too. Basically once you get an axe, knife, and matchbook and a canteen you have nothing to fear from dying in the wild, you can cook food infinitely and refill water at wells ponds and lakes...so then what? Live in the forest like survivor man next to a pond hunting cows for the 8 steaks they drop hoping noone spawns in next to you and shoots you so you can climb the all time ladder, every now and then refilling your canteen when you run dry? ....

With no endgame figuring out that stuff "is the game" Most of what I have discovered has been in game and I like it that way I avoid the full scale online treasure maps and such so that I can discover vehicle spawns and go on a treak and find out what is actually at devil's castle when I get a map...that is what makes the game for players like me; but the the issue is what about the people playing in teams that probably youtube everything and play this using all the outside sources of info or who may have played arma 2 before and are intimately familiar with this map who largely have zero challenge even from zombies?

Also what about people that had a rough start like I did, but have less patience ...because make no mistake I died alot untill I got mechanic's down and even had about 3 days where I was gonna drop the game entirely untill I started figuring out routes and spawn locations for some key stuff and the infinite food and drink loop mechanic was revealed in my reading of the wiki....thats when the game opened up...that and when I first saw a map in game and figured out how big it really was...and all I hadn't yet discovered.

So the question is how to balance both ends...end game content and quality of life. I believe quality of life should take precident but I also recognize end game needs bumps as well. I think things that encourage community though would be better then a difficulty spike.

A crafting system that would allow for specialization in only one route would be nice....like if you work tirelessly on medical stuff you can become a medic with certain medical bonus abilities or a hunter could learn to craft clothing, tools,traps(for zombies or players) or weapons out of animal parts and salvaged scrap or engineers could make improvised attachements or mod weapons like sawing off a shotty to put it in your handgun slot or moding your rifle so that it could have a flshlight on it things like that would make you want to specialize and make people need each other as they need you alive to do what they can't opposed to want to kill each other, then they can add minigames and contests like fishing...hunting....zombie killing ect and post stats for them and in game prizes like special tents or clothing items ....that's my two cents anyway...

[Cormac McCarthy 15]

all i can say is, never make it so that by playing solo you are unable to go certain pleas, i will never want to team up, i work all day, and stay up late playing this game, i have to be quiet to not wake my wife so i cant use a mic. i love going solo, dont make me work with a team.

[SgtHydra 0]

all i can say is' date=' never make it so that by playing solo you are unable to go certain pleas, i will never want to team up, i work all day, and stay up late playing this game, i have to be quiet to not wake my wife so i cant use a mic. i love going solo, dont make me work with a team.

[/quote']

And there's also the issue of a fully equipment team being unable to win against a horde.

That's happened so often, I never even bother running with those sorts of "spec ops" groups. Way too cocky, way too easy to overrun.

[Luieburger 15]

Don't make zombies more difficult to fight.

Make them more interesting to fight.

Exactly. Don't make them easier or harder. Make them more complex and realistic within the context of a zombie survival scenario.

You can keep the difficulty the same, eliminate the annoyance, and make zombie combat more interesting. I suggest the following:

-Slower Zombies

-More Zombies

-More shots to the body required to kill

[Kobra (DayZ) 0]

Don't make zombies more difficult to fight.

Make them more interesting to fight.

Exactly. Don't make them easier or harder. Make them more complex and realistic within the context of a zombie survival scenario.

You can keep the difficulty the same' date=' eliminate the annoyance, and make zombie combat more interesting. I suggest the following:

-Slower Zombies

-More Zombies

-More shots to the body required to kill

[/quote']

EXACTLY why the hell are the zombies skinny and freaking sprinters, they are faster than pro athletes, ok some ziombies can be like that but most zombies would be fat cuz you know everyones got some extra weight and n top of that none ofthem take more than 3 shots to kill

[LastManOnEarth 14]

all i can say is' date=' never make it so that by playing solo you are unable to go certain pleas, i will never want to team up, i work all day, and stay up late playing this game, i have to be quiet to not wake my wife so i cant use a mic. i love going solo, dont make me work with a team.

[/quote']

Pretty much the same situation with me and I totally agree. The team-up stuff should never actually be forced upon you. All play styles and gaming preferences (like if you simply don't want to voice chat and/or play with complete strangers by choice) should be supported and viable. If it ever becomes mandatory to team with strangers (where you have no choice), I'm done with the game.

[bonesnap 75]

It feels like the vehicle spawn needs to be tripled or even quadrupled.

80+ hours and I've found one vehicle' date=' a tractor. And I definitely can't say the same for my friend who has logged about the same amount of time but has seen zero vehicles.

...

Obviously you have more pressing matters like performance tweaks and such that I too agree are of more concern, but when you have time, I'm sure a lot of players would appreciate some vehicle changes.

[/quote']

Really??

Why would we want any vehicles at all, not to even mention crap-loads of them?

I mean what does this mod have to do with vehicles?

Is that what we really want, some crazy environment full of cars, planes, wire fences, and anti-tank blockades??? A bunch of pick-ups running over hundreds of zombies with guys in the back shooting RPGs?? This reminds me of something already - the Middle East!

This mod is supposed to be about post apocalyptic environment and a struggle for survival by the few remaining people, not about hordes of machinery and advanced weaponry roaming around the map.

Play straight Arma 2 missions for that. I recommend Evolution or Domination.

I didn't want "craploads" of vehicles. I wanted to see another one again, preferably in this lifetime.

I don't play on select servers and from what I've seen from tens of servers, is next to no vehicles. Don't bring up planes, because to be honest I don't know why heli's are in this mod at all, air vehicles are way overkill and don't really have a place (they are definitely realistic but perhaps a tad overpowered maybe), but all vehicles in general should bring hordes running from the town over almost and it would be fine.

It would force players to have to park their vehicles far outside areas they would want to loot and have a chance to get their ride stolen! Rather than just parking right beside where they are looking for their next jerry can.. And that's -if- they even find a ride to begin with. It's so stupid rare right now doubling it won't help me see one this week still bro.

Increase the vehicle spawn by a ton, and tune up the noise on vehicles beyond 5 bars to something huge (just make it flash red to signal you are generating something in excess of 5).

If gasoline usage was tuned up too it would make us run on foot for supplies 24/7 anyways, there's tons of ways to balance out more vehicles if it ever became a problem, unfortunately right now its quite the opposite.

[Powell (DayZ) 734]

Don't make zombies more difficult to fight.

Make them more interesting to fight.

Exactly. Don't make them easier or harder. Make them more complex and realistic within the context of a zombie survival scenario.

You can keep the difficulty the same' date=' eliminate the annoyance, and make zombie combat more interesting. I suggest the following:

-Slower Zombies

-More Zombies

-More shots to the body required to kill

[/quote']

EXACTLY why the hell are the zombies skinny and freaking sprinters, they are faster than pro athletes, ok some ziombies can be like that but most zombies would be fat cuz you know everyones got some extra weight and n top of that none ofthem take more than 3 shots to kill

I completely agree. I say 30% of zombies should be like that, slow and headshot only.

(personally I say 100% but I know Rocket likes his sprinters)

[Farsight (DayZ) 314]

I think they should kinda like TWD zombies, really slow, but 1 hit kills. Maybe even tons more. That way it could be like an actual zombie apocalypse and not some PVP shoot out with kenyans on crack running at you from over 1000km away. And thats my 2 cents.

[uterusmaximus 7]

Don't make zombies more difficult to fight.

Make them more interesting to fight.

Exactly. Don't make them easier or harder. Make them more complex and realistic within the context of a zombie survival scenario.

You can keep the difficulty the same' date=' eliminate the annoyance, and make zombie combat more interesting. I suggest the following:

-Slower Zombies

-More Zombies

-More shots to the body required to kill

[/quote']

EXACTLY why the hell are the zombies skinny and freaking sprinters, they are faster than pro athletes, ok some ziombies can be like that but most zombies would be fat cuz you know everyones got some extra weight and n top of that none ofthem take more than 3 shots to kill

Same wish here

I think it was mr. Romero who said that zombies are slow because of the rotting, dead flesh. So i think more and slower zombies would be much better. And maybe they should be weaker (i am not complaining abou the difficukty of fighting them )

Where should the muscles cone from?

And i wish they should be only killed vy destroying the brain.. Yes i lnow, its tge typically zombie then but i would like it the most

[sbats 3]

I say we believe in Rocket and have full trust that the gangsta knows what he is doing. Because he does, wut wut!

[DAS1337 20]

Sprinters are fine.. just tone down the sprint speed. Some Zeds are so far above the player run speeds, and it's quite ridiculous. They can still be faster, but only by a slight margin. It would probably also make them look more realistic as well. Seriously, watch a zombie chase a player. They run in zig zags at super speeds. Their animations are so fast and jerky that it actually looks the opposite of real. It looks like a scooby doo cartoon or something. Lowering their speed may actually make them look somewhat real. Just a thought.