Too many veterans

[Phineas 56]

Um, have you tried actually leaving the coast and playing a low pop server? o.O I haven't died from another player yet (heck I haven't seen one), and loot is actually rather plentiful for me. In fact too plentiful for a survival game. My character has so much food and water, lol. I just need to find an army base or something and I'll be good. I'll probably even move to a high pop server to make things more interesting when I get a better gun.

 

Also forums are extremely helpful to new players such as myself who haven't played the mod.

 

With all due respect, you reek of veteran.  I am a vet.  All this coast versus inland loot is not obvious to someone who just bought the game.

Here, I'm amazed at the additions, the buidings you can enter and the high rises nearn Cherno/Electro.  Sure it is Chernarous which is disappointing but has tons of enhancements.

[Illiad 22]

Bear in mind this is still derived from Arma II, and weirdo commands like c to run, x to crouch, z to go prone, etc are quite alien to newcomers.  Amra II has boot camp, maybe DayZ can have Nerf Camp, were zeds are slow, spawns are rich, and friendly fire is disabled?  Certainly boring to vets, but a nice intro to a difficult game for noobs?  Or do you just plunge them into the ArmA universe?

 

You do NOT want to alienate newcomers.  Frame that any way you want, say I'm against pvp if it makes you feel better, but the question is far more complex.  How do you give a first timer an experience that they will want to expand on, without frustrating them?

 

Call me crazy but DayZ SA should seriously address this.  Like a decaying startup, start with an AK but decay over plays to standard load out?

Are you all orthodox or what?

Wait, so you play with default controls?  lol.

[razmac19@hotmail.com 3]

@ OP

 

Addressing "Veterans and the general difficulty of the game"

The mod never really had the capacity or life to have the huge survival aspect that dean always talked about. It was pretty clear in the last year that there was going to be a huge survival aspect to the standalone and a fairly comprehensive health system which myself as someone with more than 1000 hours in the mod still had to work as hard as someone new to the game to figure out the health system etc. I think it doesn't matter as much as you think to be a "veteran" of the game. The major benefit of being a veteran is map knowledge but people who have real life skills/knowledge they are the ones who this game suits now in the early stage of the alpha. As far as struggling to find loot the answer is to leave the coast. Get out of there as fast as you can because it is just a team deathmatch.

 

At the end of the day we were all spawning in on the coast for the first time in the dark with a torch with absolutely no clue and had "veterans" killing us but we all managed to stick around and learn. It just doesn't happen overnight.

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

I guess you've never been to Balota.

[miniboss (DayZ) 7]

i started the dayz mod when it was in early alpha like this. it was horrible. i stayed.

i got wasted so often, at some point i lost count. i stayed.

i died a million times from blood loss with full military gear. i stayed.

 

instead of running away i tried to get better. learn the map/geography. think about how and why i got killed.

dayz is meant to cause frustration, rocket wanted it to be like this.

you are meant to have fear. you are meant to be pushed.

 

you are not supposed to find anything useful in the first house you enter.

its a constant fight for your life, against the zeds and the clock.

do i fight this zombie in the house and risk getting infected, to find some food that i need?

can i engage this player who has a rifle, or do i try to communicate?

 

this is early alpha. its not done. not for a long time.

you can move you character, put on some gear that sometimes doesnt even have its descripton done, and use some basic stuff.

you cannot expect it to work perfectly, and that has also been said/written on numerous occasions, in blogs, reviews, and the store page on steam.

 

comparing it with epoch? please.

epoch is the most casual, instant gratification newbiefriendly mod of all the mods out there.

its no longer an apocalypse game, its a zombie pvp themepark.

trading, gold currency, safe bases, buildings, gazillion vehicles with almost free parts lying around everywhere?

its NOT DAYZ as it was intended.

 

tl;dr

instead of complaining, change your mindset from demanding to learning.

use the opportunity to get better and learn the game now, while there are less zombies and less dangers.

learn how to avoid players and how to survive.

then you will be the vet on full release.

[-Gews- 7443]

nerfed environment

start with an AK

friendly fire is disabled

 

Nerfed environment. Spawn with AK. Loot everywhere. No PvP.

[Swarzey 12]

Lone Wolfs are newcomers? I guess my time in both the Arma 2 mod and over the past month, Breaking Point on Arma 3 mean jack all. 

 

Newcomers will adjust. They'll learn. That's just what happens in these games. You sucked, I sucked, the guy above me sucked when we started, it happens, but we learn and so will they. If they have a whinge and quit well then no big loss, I wouldn't even be surprised if they came here to rant about how "broken" the game is. The best way to learn the game through the Alpha is firstly understanding what an Early Access Alpha is in the first place, is to select a server that has only a few people. PvP isn't something you'll learn by yourself, but learning the mechanics and the basics of the game is. 

 

Also, understand that this isn't the same engine they worked with on the mod. You can't simply cut and paste content over without some editing, coding can be rather complex when it comes to that because you want to maintain as much as possible. All the content we have in the mod? The "poor loot tables"? They're coming in the next few weeks. They're actually decent when it comes to our capabilities as players. I can guarantee you I can be stacked with food, water, a weapon, ammo and medical supplies along with a six slot Press vest, pants and coat in about three hours. Even if the server has been up for an hour or so, if you're wise, you would go to the corners of the map and loot places there.

[Claw 26]

As mentioned this could relate to any game- Just put your time in and learn from your mistakes <  there is probally enough user guides to dayz arma on thenet already. The guns in SA dont really relate to the behaviour of the wepaons in A2 ( yet ) so i dont think a vet as the OP put it has this as an advantage. Map knowledge yeah but it dont take long to learn.

 

 Just put your time in and learn from your mistakes.

[denkart 198]

Pride, I think.  Hurbris?  Scads of justification for loving what was made.

Let me put it this way, to borrow from reddit:

Explain the DayZ SA to me like I am a 5 year old.

Emphasize how veterans will shoot me on sight.

 

You're getting a lot of hate because what you're talking about here isn't really a problem.  I mean, have you ever played an online multiplayer game before?  From the way you're posting it seems like you haven't.  Every game will have vets that are better.  New people will always suck.  It's like that in every single game.  Will new people get killed by vets?  Yes, of course.  That's how things work.  Will new people get killed a lot while first starting out?  Yes, of course.  What do you suggest?  Do you think DayZ should be dumbed down to the point where any new player can pick up a gun and go on a killing spree within 5 minutes of starting out?  No.  They have to put in their time.  They have to learn the ropes.  They have to get better, just like everyone else.  Will some people quit?  Yes, but some will stay.  Just like with any other game.

[subliminal_city 27]

There is a difference between a game being hard and being slaughtered by players who has already gathered firearms and enough ammunition to actually waste it without getting anything back from it (because you don't get anything back from it, except perhaps a battery).

 

Got to love the "run to X, it has a lot of stuff", yeah you'd know that by having played the game and managed to explore and chances are, if the server isn't empty it's going to be ransacked anyway. I've never played the ArmA mod, so I'm completely new to the game with about 15 hours invested in it. I don't mind being killed, well I do (not really minding it but it sucks - but everyone thinks so anyway) but it's not like I'm to whine about it - however, adopting the KoS policy that a lot of people seem to have will only harm the community in the long run, at least when it comes to the intake of new players. The argument "get a group" falls kind of flat, getting or finding a group when pretty much everyone is running a KoS policy is sort of impossible. Or "play on an empty server" how is playing on an empty server, when you know where to acquire assault rifles, ammunition, backpacks, food not the same as already getting them for free when you start the game? Oh right it's not... the only difference is a delay of a couple of minutes so they might just as well implement a 10 minute delay from character creation to spawning and arm everyone to the teeth (not really, but you can't say anything about free stuff if what you do is find an empty server run to wherever the goodies are, loot and then log off only to log on to some other server a couple of minutes later), cause zombies aren't really difficult to fight off if you just circle strafe. Personally I would have preferred to see that it wasn't possible to server hop but rather 1 character per server, but that's not going to happen with games such as these.

 

Now I'm having a lot of fun in the game, I've died a total of six times during the 15 hours, 2 times by other players, 2 times from starvation, 1 time from falling down (from a shack with the same height as myself - well, I broke my leg I think, which is kind of BS, I doubt you'd get any serious injury even if you jump down that height with your hands tied behind your back) and 1 time from a zombie. However, depending on how the community turns out - I'm not sure if I would actually recommend it to anyone. I don't mind dying as I said and I don't mind PvP/PK but in a game that lives (correct me if I'm wrong but DayZ seems to be this type of game) or dies with its community, having some thought behind who you kill and why - other than "hurr durr realism lul" (engaging combat and calling it realism is about as flat as you can get when it comes to arguments or reasons), servers everyone. I don't think giving people firearms to begin with is the way to go, however... perhaps not starting the game as thirsty might be a good thing and wouldn't impact the longevity (sure that won't protect you from players being asshats) of the game, nor would it cause an inflation of for instance bottles. Mainly it's a community problem and you can't really adress that with softare adjustments other than perhaps causing side effects for killing a certain amount of people within a given time frame (since a lot of people seem to, not in this thread but other ones, use stress and fear as excuses for some behaviour, why not add stress, fear, paranoia as psychological side effects, much like hunger, thirst, injuries, blood loss) induced by killing.

 

 

The following has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

I haven't quite grasped the backstory of the game though. Do you just wake up in this area without having lived there before or what's the deal?

Cause as it stands now, a new player has absolutely no idea where things are. However, if the same thing were to occur where I'm living I know where the hunting, survival and fishing stores are, I know where there are cities or towns, I know where the stores are in a general sense even in towns I've never visited due to they've been built and so on and so forth and I bet you know the same about your area. I don't know if there's anything like it in game, but at least add some damn tourist information plaques (I know there are maps, although I've never found one myself), there are some in most cities. How come it's not possible to pick apples from trees? Or pumpkins. That's just silly.

 

TLDR; tough luck - reading is difficult.

Edited December 20, 2013 by subliminal_city

[madmaxm 26]

Bear in mind this is still derived from Arma II, and weirdo commands like c to run, x to crouch, z to go prone, etc are quite alien to newcomers.  Amra II has boot camp, maybe DayZ can have Nerf Camp, were zeds are slow, spawns are rich, and friendly fire is disabled?  Certainly boring to vets, but a nice intro to a difficult game for noobs?  Or do you just plunge them into the ArmA universe?

 

You do NOT want to alienate newcomers.  Frame that any way you want, say I'm against pvp if it makes you feel better, but the question is far more complex.  How do you give a first timer an experience that they will want to expand on, without frustrating them?

 

Call me crazy but DayZ SA should seriously address this.  Like a decaying startup, start with an AK but decay over plays to standard load out?

Are you all orthodox or what?

 

 

 

 This will never happen. Rocket would probaly skin you alive on hes twitch in front of 15k~ people. Becouse your going against Rocket "dream" and dayz mod from Arma 2.

 

 As for noobs and cod kiddos coming to dayz. Time to grow up :)

 

 Edit: Ye i am a vet. and noobs like you i would happly harras 24 hours (f*** the sleep).

Edited December 20, 2013 by metalica24

[Claw 26]

I remember when i first started playing bf2 - after a few times of taking a flag and then getting cained by arty or aircraft i learnt to take the flag and find cover or move out, or to take the flag in half and then move to next so teammates behind can fully capture the one i have taken down.

 

Learn from your mistakes and never comprmise unless you have to.

[denkart 198]

There is a difference between a game being hard and being slaughtered by players who has already gathered firearms and enough ammunition to actually waste it without getting anything back from it (because you don't get anything back from it, except perhaps a battery).

 

Got to love the "run to X, it has a lot of stuff", yeah you'd know that by having played the game and managed to explore and chances are, if the server isn't empty it's going to be ransacked anyway. I've never played the ArmA mod, so I'm completely new to the game with about 15 hours invested in it. I don't mind being killed, well I do (not really minding it but it sucks - but everyone thinks so anyway) but it's not like I'm to whine about it - however, adopting the KoS policy that a lot of people seem to have will only harm the community in the long run, at least when it comes to the intake of new players. The argument "get a group" falls kind of flat, getting or finding a group when pretty much everyone is running a KoS policy is sort of impossible. Or "play on an empty server" how is playing on an empty server, when you know where to acquire assault rifles, ammunition, backpacks, food not the same as already getting them for free when you start the game? Oh right it's not... the only difference is a delay of a couple of minutes so they might just as well implement a 10 minute delay from character creation to spawning and arm everyone to the teeth (not really, but you can't say anything about free stuff if what you do is find an empty server run to wherever the goodies are, loot and then log off only to log on to some other server a couple of minutes later), cause zombies aren't really difficult to fight off if you just circle strafe. Personally I would have preferred to see that it wasn't possible to server hop but rather 1 character per server, but that's not going to happen with games such as these.

 

Now I'm having a lot of fun in the game, I've died a total of six times during the 15 hours, 2 times by other players, 2 times from starvation, 1 time from falling down (from a shack with the same height as myself - well, I broke my leg I think, which is kind of BS, I doubt you'd get any serious injury even if you jump down that height with your hands tied behind your back) and 1 time from a zombie. However, depending on how the community turns out - I'm not sure if I would actually recommend it to anyone. I don't mind dying as I said and I don't mind PvP/PK but in a game that lives (correct me if I'm wrong but DayZ seems to be this type of game) or dies with its community, having some thought behind who you kill and why - other than "hurr durr realism lul" (engaging combat and calling it realism is about as flat as you can get when it comes to arguments or reasons), servers everyone. I don't think giving people firearms to begin with is the way to go, however... perhaps not starting the game as thirsty might be a good thing and wouldn't impact the longevity (sure that won't protect you from players being asshats) of the game, nor would it cause an inflation of for instance bottles. Mainly it's a community problem and you can't really adress that with softare adjustments other than perhaps causing side effects for killing a certain amount of people within a given time frame (since a lot of people seem to, not in this thread but other ones, use stress and fear as excuses for some behaviour, why not add stress, fear, paranoia as psychological side effects, much like hunger, thirst, injuries, blood loss) induced by killing.

 

 

The following has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

I haven't quite grasped the backstory of the game though. Do you just wake up in this area without having lived there before or what's the deal?

Cause as it stands now, a new player has absolutely no idea where things are. However, if the same thing were to occur where I'm living I know where the hunting, survival and fishing stores are, I know where there are cities or towns, I know where the stores are in a general sense even in towns I've never visited due to they've been built and so on and so forth and I bet you know the same about your area. I don't know if there's anything like it in game, but at least add some damn tourist information plaques (I know there are maps, although I've never found one myself), there are some in most cities. How come it's not possible to pick apples from trees? Or pumpkins. That's just silly.

 

TLDR; tough luck - reading is difficult.

 

You're new so I'll just say this, every single point you've raised in your post has been discussed and argued over a million times over.  Anyways, the one thing that's for sure is that KoS, regardless of how you feel about it, simply isn't going any where any time soon.  You don't have to KoS if you don't want to, but you can't do anything to control the actions of others.  That said, I've had far more friendly encounters lately than I have hostile.

 

In regards to the backstory, the original back story for the mod was that you were on a ship at sea, something happened to said ship, then you washed up on the shore.  It may have changed since I've heard that, and I assume it has because there are now spawn points that are further inland.  Also, there actually are signs that tell you where they are, but they're in Russian since that's where this game takes place.  You'll have to find a way of translating them.

[quamtraxxx 2]

I'm not really a veteran, but i did play more than a year the mod and new maps, the thing is when i saw so many newbs that died in started towns cuz of hunger and thirst, i said to myself, i need to be a hero in this times, so i do most of the time ask players friendly? then if they need something, i do keep distance since the last experience i got was a duo, one was distracting me like he needs things other one was waiting with the axe to kill me, he did hit me once and i bleed then i said will you stop i offered you help and this is how you repay me? and still chasing me, so i needed to shot them so i could bandage after. So i think many veterans and skilled players should act more mature, try to contact the player, offer help or get some info from him, at least both partys with lowered guns and all can be resolved. I loved the german servers ( DE), the players are so helpful and i mean it, i was trying to wake up a player on ground in Zeleno, myself had gray screen so low blood and 3 players passed by in couple of minutes not attacking us but asking what is the problem, i just said i need blood and i never used in SA the blood trans. in end it worked, so i helped a stranger. It is more like, KARMA ... more you are bad, more bad will return, so why not bolish the shot on sight policy and i think many new players will enjoy more rather than ragequit after bein killed instantly. Peace

[eldritch (DayZ) 17]

I agree. The veterans are ruining the game for everyone else.

Anyone who has supported this game from the very beginning should be banned from ever playing dayz SO so that the nubs can safely run about smacking each other with fire axes on the coast.

[Inception. 9443]

I agree. The veterans are ruining the game for everyone else.

Anyone who has supported this game from the very beginning should be banned from ever playing dayz SO so that the nubs can safely run about smacking each other with fire axes on the coast.

 

^^

--

 

This game is meant to be difficult, for both new and old players alike. What exactly do you propose the developers do, OP?

[denkart 198]

^^

--

 

This game is meant to be difficult, for both new and old players alike. What exactly do you propose the developers do, OP?

 

I believe he was being sarcastic.  Doesn't work so well over text, haha.

[eldritch (DayZ) 17]

<the sarcasm>

 

<your head>

Edited December 20, 2013 by eldritch

[Inception. 9443]

I believe he was being sarcastic.  Doesn't work so well over text, haha.

 

 

<the sarcasm>

 

<your head>

 

Obviously it was sarcasm; I was agreeing with eldritch. My next comment was in regards to the OP, hence the "--" separating my "^^", and the mentioning of OP.

Edited December 20, 2013 by Inception.

[denkart 198]

Obviously it was sarcasm; I was agreeing with eldritch. My next comment was in regards to the OP, hence he "--" separating my "^^", and the mentioning of OP.

 

My apologies then.  I suppose I misread your post.

[eldritch (DayZ) 17]

Obviously it was sarcasm; I was agreeing with eldritch. My next comment was in regards to the OP, hence the "--" separating my "^^", and the mentioning of OP.

 

well dont i feel silly now.

[Inception. 9443]

My apologies then.  I suppose I misread your post.

 

No problem, lol.

 

 

well dont i feel silly now.

 

:D

Nice avatar, by the way. I used that here for a few months.

 

Anyway, back on topic.

Edited December 20, 2013 by Inception.

[SoulAssassin808 13]

I appreciate the feedback.  You, me, and everyone we know is passionate about the game.

My feedback is that, as of the SA, you are thrown into the fire.  Not even the DayZ mod did this, you could do the ArmaII boot camp and learn to shoot and fly a heli.  The SA has NONE of this.  It should have a nerfed environment to get people up to speed.

I am not butt hurt because I suck at DayZ.

I want to see it succeed.

Maybe because I want a bunch of sucky people to play, but that defines honor.

Anyone else feel me?

 

The challenge of DayZ should be that you get thrown in balls deep.  You die, learn from it and go at it again. If you are new to DayZ and you don't like that the game doesn't hold your hand, well you bought the wrong game.

The only thing newcomers are allowed to bitch about is the lack of loot and zombies on filled servers. Most other things require you to play the game for more then a day.

[ProfessorShanks (DayZ) 33]

First impression of SA:

  You'd better be adept at the ArmA II mod of DayZ or you will have a bad time.

Loot tables are awful.  Very difficult to find squat.

Lone wolf (aka new players) is nigh impossible.

Zombies move through buildings great, floors matter not.

Your best bet is a motorcycle helmet and a backpack.

After that, you are a target.

Contrast that with DayZ Epoch:

I have tents filled with swag.  TV guns (b&w bio scope, so cool)

Helis, and the admins added streetlights for night time.

 

I bought the SA and have had motorcycle helmets and map fragments, a chest holster and cans of food, but it is hard as heck staying fed and watered, not to mention the veterans with rifles that will kill you after spending a crazy amount of time acquiring a back pack and helmet, and you never saw a rifle or handgun.

 

I'd like to make this crystal clear:

Veterans are harming newcomers to the game, veterans are too good at it, and newbies will be discouraged.

Explosions of kudos if this is what you wanted, a narrow niche game for early adopters that guaranteed a narrow following.  A rain of Hell's firy boulders if you wanted newbies to yearn some fun but instead be schooled at every spawn.

 

Not withstanding that I knowingly bought the alpha, but as a veteran, the game really hates newcomers.

"You are unconscious" says my monitor.  This realistic put-off is pushing me to a game I can play.

 

Please, please, never forget, this is a game.  Frustrating players right away is not going to work.

Quit bitching. This is ALPHA. It's not that hard to be good at the game. Loot spawns arent even correct right now, and neither are zombie spawns. You know why? Cause its ALPHA. GET OVER IT.

[Alll420 14]

>loot tables are awful

*walks to balota*

*runs around tents*

*runs around barracks*

*biggest backpack, all scopes in backpack, got all clothes, tac vest, drinks, muchos tuna, ran past 6 m4s on the floor*

time taken from spawn: five minutes

.

Can one of you vets point me in the direction of the military areas I'm new, I don't have a problem with loot food or other players but I'm lost in the bush lol. I ran off to the right of all those big apartments

I am a Warz vet so I'm not concerned with other players I know how to kill em, just don't know where I'm goin

Edited December 20, 2013 by Alll420